The Gee Spot - You Finally Found It

[Gee64]

When you regrow your old plant, do you get less yield than the original grow and how much less? And how long from harvest to harvest with the same plant?

I have never reflowered a revegged plant, I only do it to get a clone. I'm not sure how the yield would be. It takes quite awhile in reveg for the plant to convert back to veg, then get back to growing proper leaves, so I can see why it's not popular. It would be quicker to start a new seed.

Also, growing organically, I would have to repot from the 10gal pot to something bigger for round 2, to ensure making it to harvest. The plant is already 3 feet tall, so taking it to flower again would make it too tall to manage.

I am starting to see new green specks appearing deep in the reveg buds, so it's starting.

I have been distracted all week with Xmas/family but I will get back to spamming you all with too many pictures.

Revegging is a great tool to have for every now and then when you need it, so I will keep you posted on how it goes.

I don't have any formal training/theorom on it, only what I have figured out from trial and observation, so if anyone sees me doing something wrong, or is just curious as to the "why" about it, please speak up.

I can't guarantee I can give you a solid scientific answer, but how I do it is the only way I have tried so far that works, so it's the method I use.

100% stoner logic from my 100% stoner buddy who grows and has grown non stop since the 80's, on a large scale.

So it's free, and this is how he does it, so it's how I learned.

Pretty simple really, just leave lots of bottom larf buds, and toss her into the veg tent, get humidity over 60%, 18 hours of light/day minimum, and be patient.

She doesn't move a lot of water so patience is key. Small doses of fish water, regular water, and ewc, and then wait and don't overwater.

I like to mist them a bit too. Not until they are dripping wet, just a nice misting like they walked by the veggie aisle and got dusted by a mister. Spring-like conditions. Treat her like a 3ft tall seedling.

Today is Day 14 and 15 for the 2 reveggers, and they are just starting to show the 1st signs of revegging.

So at least 2 more weeks to get some branching started, then 2 more weeks to get them healthy and cloneable, then 2 weeks of rooting the cuttings, then at least 2 weeks of vegging before they can be flipped, so it's at least 10 weeks from harvest to starting into flower.

It would have been quicker and easier to start another seed but I want a copy of these 2 phenos, and the Macehead pheno in particular, so it's worth it to me.

 

[Gee64]

TMSC - Day 15.

I finally have a plan. I am going to grow 5 plants in 1 40gal pot.

Clockwise from the top right we Have Iklwa, LC-18, RVDV 2.0 and RVDV 1.0. They have all been topped except RVDV 2. She will get it tomorrow when they all get planted.

In the middle I will plant Wild Lady 1.0. The 2 branches circled in blue will get cut off for cloning, leaving 4 mains that will get stretched out at 3,6,9, and 12-o-clock.

Each branch will be allowed to have 2 main tops, and the other 4 plants in the corners will each get manifolded to 8 tops each, giving me a total of 40 colas.

If it gets too mangy I can always prune out a few runts.

I am putting some clones into the KloneKing cloner and some into soil cups. The mix is 50-50 coco-perlite.It's all wetted out and tomorrow it will get used. Wild Lady 1.0 will supply the cuts for both. I dampen it to exactly where I like it, which is damp enough that if you squeeze a handful tightly a drip won't start dripping for about 4-5 seconds. The water stick agrees.

Cover crop, a blend of lettuces, spinach, and kale, is sprouting all over.

RVDV 1.0. She is one tough cookie. She gets topped above the 3rd node tomorrow.

RVDV 2.0 topped above the 3rd node.

LC-18 topped above the 3rd node.

Iklwa topped above the 3rd node.

 

[Thirvnrob]

I'm behind on all of the journals I follow so if you've already answered this question, my apologies, but what do you use for mulch?
I'll have another question for you tomorrow 10 hours after the lights come on...

 

[Gee64]

I'm behind on all of the journals I follow so if you've already answered this question, my apologies, but what do you use for mulch?
I'll have another question for you tomorrow 10 hours after the lights come on...

Hey Rob.

Currently I am using a product called Seasoil.

Prior to that I mainly used Douglas Fir bark mulch. Seasoil is DF bark mulch with wild salmon guts composted in. Fir bark is excellent carbon.

See you at lights on +10

 

[Thirvnrob]

Hey Rob.

Currently I am using a product called Seasoil.

Prior to that I mainly used Douglas Fir bark mulch. Seasoil is DF bark mulch with wild salmon guts composted in. Fir bark is excellent carbon.

See you at lights on +10

My eyes may be puffy, but I'll be there at 4:00 pm CST!

 

[Thirvnrob]

Hey Rob.

Currently I am using a product called Seasoil.

Prior to that I mainly used Douglas Fir bark mulch. Seasoil is DF bark mulch with wild salmon guts composted in. Fir bark is excellent carbon.

See you at lights on +10

In the past I've used my leaf trimmings at a 4/1 ratio with coir. Will that work in a pinch? Is chop & drop a good practice?

 

[Gee64]

In the past I've used my leaf trimmings at a 4/1 ratio with coir. Will that work in a pinch? Is chop & drop a good practice?

I have done it in the past. I put my leaves in my worm farm now, but mulching them works too. I used to use coco but I found that roots prefer bark nuggets over coco, so I switched.

 

[Gee64]

The final tallies are in.

Shorty 1 - 183g
Shorty 2 - 178g
Pinky - 198g
Macehead - 210g
Total - 769g or 27.46 ounces. 1 lb 11.5 oz.

There was also approximately .5oz of tester buds that weren't weighed in, so I'm going with 1.75 lbs. Thats a 7oz/plant average, which is fantastic considering it was only top colas without any larf.

With the wider footprint of this new light I could have squeezed a 5th plant in, and I had headroom left too, so next grow I will add a 5th plant and veg a couple days longer to add a node to the canopy.

I'm dying to try a SOG of Maceheads. All single colas. I want to try backbuilding on that pheno. Come on reveg!

But 1st.... lets grow some TMSC strains and get them safely into some jars.

I think next grow will be a clone grow of the 4 TMSC's and the 2 Durbans. If any/some/all grow nicely from clone, I will keep a motherplant or 2 or 3.

I want to get as many rootballs as I can through this 40 gallon pot as quickly as I can to get it full of root carbon.

 

[StoneOtter]

Nice yield Gee! Your 8 cola theme did well!

 

[Gee64]

Nice yield Gee! Your 8 cola theme did well!

It did. It was all easy trimming, thats what counts

 

[Gee64]

TMSC - Day 16.

Clone cutting, uppotting day.

Wild Lady 1.0 with her 2 extra clone branches.

Here is the top off the 1st clone branch.

Under the node I cut the clone at was a whorled phyllotaxy node, so I figured why not, lets see if we can clone it too, so into the cloner it goes.

Here is the top of the 2nd clone branch.

and under that cut was 2 branches that could be clones on their own, but I thought why not, lets see if we can clone it too, so into the cloner it goes.

All loaded up. The cloner is on a heat mat. The heat mat is plugged into a controller. The temperature probe for the controller is in the bottom left neoprene puck, poking into the spray like a clone. Its all set at 78F for now. It works really well if you deal with cooler winter temps.

Here is WL v1.0, all trimmed up.

She looks angry. I had to dig her out of the 10gal bag to transplant her.

I was gentle, but I pretty much bared all her roots and replanted her as quickly as possible. We shall see I guess, but it was ugly.

On a bright note, all her roots have fresh myco on them.

I think she will be fine, but if she tanks it won't surprise me.

 

[Gee64]

Here's the layout. 8 colas per plant. From the top right going clockwise we have RVDV 2.0, RVDV 1.0, Iklwa, and LC-18. Wild Lady in the middle.

Hopefully this works out.

LC-18.

RVDV2

Iklwa.

RVDV1.

 

[Gee64]

Wet trimmed harvest weight total was 4197g. Final jarred total was 769g. Final weight was 18.3% of wet trim harvest weight.

 

[Thirvnrob]

Hey Rob.

Currently I am using a product called Seasoil.

Prior to that I mainly used Douglas Fir bark mulch. Seasoil is DF bark mulch with wild salmon guts composted in. Fir bark is excellent carbon.

See you at lights on +10

Here’s my question. Considering only the ambient temp & RH in the room, I’m in or near the vpd sweet spot, but when I try figuring it out with my infrared thermometer I get lost. You explained it before, but I can’t find that post. Can you direct me to the post or explain it again?

I think I need to make an adjustment, but I’m not sure what that may be.
I’ll make some coffee…

 

[Absorber]

Here’s my question. Considering only the ambient temp & RH in the room, I’m in or near the vpd sweet spot, but when I try figuring it out with my infrared thermometer I get lost. You explained it before, but I can’t find that post. Can you direct me to the post or explain it again?

I think I need to make an adjustment, but I’m not sure what that may be.
I’ll make some coffee…

Here's an app

VPD Calculator - Vapor Pressur - Apps on Google Play

Simple calculator to generate VPD based on Air/Surface Temps and Humidity.

play.google.com

 

[Gee64]

Here’s my question. Considering only the ambient temp & RH in the room, I’m in or near the vpd sweet spot, but when I try figuring it out with my infrared thermometer I get lost. You explained it before, but I can’t find that post. Can you direct me to the post or explain it again?

I think I need to make an adjustment, but I’m not sure what that may be…

Here is a screenshot of the parameters you need. I use an android app calked VPD Calculator.

1.You enter your room temp in the "air temp" section (hang your thermometer/humidity probes as close to the canopy as possible). So 81F

2. You use that IR gun to check leaf temp on the newest fully open leaves and enter in "Leaf surface temperature" section. So 78F.

3. Enter humidity, so 65%.

Your VPD is 0.93 kPa which is ideal for late veg/early flower. (If your thermometer/RH probe is at canopy level, if not there could be fairly large discrepancies.

Hopefully I answered what you were asking, but if not please ask more.

 

[Gee64]

Here’s my question. Considering only the ambient temp & RH in the room, I’m in or near the vpd sweet spot, but when I try figuring it out with my infrared thermometer I get lost. You explained it before, but I can’t find that post. Can you direct me to the post or explain it again?

I think I need to make an adjustment, but I’m not sure what that may be.
I’ll make some coffee…

Is that a VPD controller or an IR gun? How does it know the RH?

 

[Thirvnrob]

Is that a VPD controller or an IR gun? How does it know the RH?

Maybe I need a different gun. I don't see how it could measure RH...

 

[Thirvnrob]

Here is a screenshot of the parameters you need. I use an android app calked VPD Calculator.

1.You enter your room temp in the "air temp" section (hang your thermometer/humidity probes as close to the canopy as possible). So 81F

2. You use that IR gun to check leaf temp on the newest fully open leaves and enter in "Leaf surface temperature" section. So 78F.

3. Enter humidity, so 65%.

Your VPD is 0.93 kPa which is ideal for late veg/early flower. (If your thermometer/RH probe is at canopy level, if not there could be fairly large discrepancies.

Hopefully I answered what you were asking, but if not please ask more.

Thank You!
You also mentioned in a previous post something about vpd & how it relates to light intensity. Do you mind?

 

[Gee64]

Thank You!
You also mentioned in a previous post something about vpd & how it relates to light intensity. Do you mind?

I don't mind at all, go grab a coffee

VPD works best when leaf temp is 2 degrees cooler than the air. Thats the temp differential that transpiration transpires best at. Vpd should also never be run higher than the stage the plant is at. The stage the plant is at is dictated primarily by how well the rootball can supply the plant with food and water.

So when you adjust vpd, never run it high enough to cause the plant to run faster than the rootball can handle. That part is on you to determine, so slow and steady until you start to reach a limit is best. Big adjustments will bite you.

If you go faster than the rootball can handle you get an instant deficiency because you are photosynthesizing faster than the rootball can provide the photosynthesis department, so the photosynthesis department, instead of slowing down, starts drawing nutes from the leaves. Fry them and the grow is in trouble.

I give you all this warning 1st because light is what primarily determines the difference in temp between the leaves and the air. You DO NOT want to give your plant too much light ever, unless you are in the last 2 weeks of the grow where hermies can't hurt you. Light is the easiest tool to use to cause hermies.

So for you at 81F air, 78F leaf, and 65%RH, the easiest way to raise vpd is to lower humidity but..... A 2 degree difference would be nice too. So if your plants are still getting taller I would live with the 3 degree difference and the plant will grow into the light and it will move to a 2 degree gap. After that you may have to either raise the light or turn it down a bit.

If stretch is over I would turn up the light a little bit. Sometimes 50ppfd more is enough. Then wait until 10 hours of lights on tomorrow to assess the adjustment and react to that. Not before unless you see danger.

Then once the 2 degree dif is established I would lower RH to increase vpd and as flower progresses I would lower the air temp as well, all slowly and incrementally to make sure you never run the plant too fast for the rootball. I try never to go over 1.45, even in deep flower. One glitch and it could over rev and fry leaves or cause hermies.

If you get to 76F air, 74F leaf temp, and 48RH, your vpd is 1.4 which is perfect, and you aren't at risk of mildews and rot.

Check vpd any time you like, but never adjust unless the lights have been on for 9 or 10 hours. You want to know how fast they are running when going top speed.

If you speed them up in the morning, they may over rev in the afternoon.

Checking vpd at various times of day is pretty cool. You see what happens when you water. You see what state they are in when they 1st wake up. You see what state they are in when they are thirsty.

If your leaves mysteriously get hot, she probably needs a drink. Check that before you turn the lights down. If she is running slow chances are you just finished watering, that sort of thing.

Then when you learn the plants cycles you see advantageous and disadvantageous times of day to give water, or to prune.

Why water or prune when she's running hard. Why not water or prune when she's running slow in the morning.

Now when you have her running properly AND your not interupting her during peak work hours, she can photosynthesize more in a day. That right there is your target.

So if you make an adjustment and she stresses, you have reached a limit. You need to wait for the rootball to catch up, or you have simply found the genetic limits.

Please try not to run her right on the edge. You only need to be in the ballpark. If you can keep her in the ballpark for the entire duration of flower, you will have amazing colas. If you over rev her once you will lose far more than that little extra you were trying to squeeze out.

The state of your rootball just got more valuable. You can't use more light if the rootball can't supply. Make sure it's NEVER the weakest link and you will need extra jars for harvest.

Are you in flower? If so, how far in? Got some pics?