The Gee Spot - You Finally Found It

Carmen Ray said:
I want to make myself an earth worm farm. I get heavy winter rainfall and temps get down to about 5 C at coldest and usually sit at about 10 to 15 C. I don't have any cover for the farm. Gee, do you have any suggestions for how I could construct one and what materials I could use?
Click to expand...
Mine was given to me as a gift. I have never built one before but @Azimuth makes his own I do believe. He likely has some really good input on this.
 
I have been putting a lot of thought into the huge onslaught of Magnesium deficiencies going on lately and this is what I'm thinking, but its just my brain, not proven science so if you guys think I'm on the wrong track please stop me.

Here is my theory:

When your plant is young and in Living Organic Soil, it doesn't yet have any excess sugars to allow fungus to do its bribing, it has to trust the system until it matures to the point where it starts to turn a sugar profit, at which point it can buy what it needs, but the system really wants the plant to get there so it gives the plant what it requires, and as its feeding the plant, its getting the next meal ready. The supply chain.

When you suddenly take that young plant and toss it under a big LED, or turn up the volume on your big LED, the system isn't ready for the huge upswing in photosynthetic activity and the supply chain fails until it adjusts.

As we coddle the plant and the supply chain adjusts the deficiency seems to correct itself, but not come back. Thats the weird part. If the soil was deficient it would immediately come back.

I think if you were patient and dilligent with slowly adding light the Mag issue likely wouldn't arise.

So lets find out.

The plant I cut my clones from was butchered back severely and the leaves now left haven't been in the light for weeks, as they were well under the canopy.

Now they are in the light and should be demanding more Mag.

Lets see if a deficiency pops up and if it does I won't change anything in my regiment. In theory if this happens then in about 7-10 days, without adding more light, the supply chain should adjust and it should go away.

The only negative that I can see is that my soil is well matured and very balanced and may be able to adjust quickly, but I think (hope) this might do it.

If its going to happen I should be starting to see it any day now.
 
With the Kloneking clones I'm hoping at least 1 gets a very long tap root on it so I can bury it deep into a 10gal swicky-pot to see if it starts to immediately adjust to bottom watering.

I think I will prebuild a pot with a dowel in the center and pull the dowel, lower the roots in, and back fill the hole.

The gradient should be plenty wet down deep so hopefully the clone won't wilt.

Has anyone tried or perfected this? What do you SIP guys do to lessen the shock and adjustment times on clones in SIP's?
 
Carmen Ray said:
I want to make myself an earth worm farm.
Click to expand...
Here is a couple of spots.....https://www.420magazine.com/community/threads/question-for-you-vermicomposters.461169/

Worms in soil from castings?

I am in mid-week #8 and just flushed my 3 plants. While dumping the run-off, I noticed what looked like 2 dead small worms (could have sworn 1 moved). I have been using worm castings as a top dressing and wondering if there could be eggs that developed into worms within my soil. I purchased the...
www.420magazine.com
 
Gee64 said:
I have been putting a lot of thought into the huge onslaught of Magnesium deficiencies going on lately and this is what I'm thinking, but its just my brain, not proven science so if you guys think I'm on the wrong track please stop me.

Here is my theory:

When your plant is young and in Living Organic Soil, it doesn't yet have any excess sugars to allow fungus to do its bribing, it has to trust the system until it matures to the point where it starts to turn a sugar profit, at which point it can buy what it needs, but the system really wants the plant to get there so it gives the plant what it requires, and as its feeding the plant, its getting the next meal ready. The supply chain.

When you suddenly take that young plant and toss it under a big LED, or turn up the volume on your big LED, the system isn't ready for the huge upswing in photosynthetic activity and the supply chain fails until it adjusts.

As we coddle the plant and the supply chain adjusts the deficiency seems to correct itself, but not come back. Thats the weird part. If the soil was deficient it would immediately come back.

I think if you were patient and dilligent with slowly adding light the Mag issue likely wouldn't arise.

So lets find out.

The plant I cut my clones from was butchered back severely and the leaves now left haven't been in the light for weeks, as they were well under the canopy.

Now they are in the light and should be demanding more Mag.

Lets see if a deficiency pops up and if it does I won't change anything in my regiment. In theory if this happens then in about 7-10 days, without adding more light, the supply chain should adjust and it should go away.

The only negative that I can see is that my soil is well matured and very balanced and may be able to adjust quickly, but I think (hope) this might do it.

If its going to happen I should be starting to see it any day now.
Click to expand...

This is assuming there are proper amounts of Mg in the soil to begin with. My personal Mg issue was directly related to the non existent levels in the beginning. The light and its intensity were all the same from the start up through the issue.

Dr Bugbee himself has said and shown that cannabis can handle multiple levels greater PPFD over a short time frame. I.e. going from 250 to 500 in 1-2 days, 600 to 1200 etc. hardening off is simply not required. This tells us a whole lot.

Once we’re talking about a medium with appropriate levels of Mg then it’s on to the plant itself.

You said it in my first journal.. it’s all relative to the root ball, especially with Mg. The plant simply doesn’t have the capacity to process, nor signal for its required levels. This is why foliars work so well. It’s also why it balances out so quickly. It doesn’t take long for the plant to grow large enough, and it also recognizes its dire need, likely making Mg the first element it calls for once established.

So we take what Dr Bugbee has found to be true and look at the issue. Quite simply, peoples environments are not dialed in well enough to accommodate jumps in light. Or they’re taking a plant whose rootball is not ready to handle the increased activity. Again assuming there are appropriate Mg levels in the soil.

A perfect example of this is my current grow. I jumped to 50% and the plants despised this. I brought it back down to 25% while they grew a little larger. Once they were a bit bigger I jumped back up to 50% and the plants took it perfectly, and actually seemed to prefer the greater intensity. Nothing was changed. I didn’t increase nutrients, adjust watering, nothing. I just waited 3-5 days and they were ready once their rootballs could access and produce the requirements.

I think what we’re seeing a lot of lately is people pushing plants harder than the roots can handle. If you’re not growing with chelated nutrients or synthetics you’re really depending on the rootball and the plant to do the work, and when you push it harder than it can handle you see these deficiencies. It’s also why they seem to balance out so quickly. It’s not that the light is too intense too quick, it’s that the roots just aren’t there yet.
 
Keffka said:
This is assuming there are proper amounts of Mg in the soil to begin with. My personal Mg issue was directly related to the non existent levels in the beginning. The light and its intensity were all the same from the start up through the issue.

Dr Bugbee himself has said and shown that cannabis can handle multiple levels greater PPFD over a short time frame. I.e. going from 250 to 500 in 1-2 days, 600 to 1200 etc. hardening off is simply not required. This tells us a whole lot.

Once we’re talking about a medium with appropriate levels of Mg then it’s on to the plant itself.

You said it in my first journal.. it’s all relative to the root ball, especially with Mg. The plant simply doesn’t have the capacity to process, nor signal for its required levels. This is why foliars work so well. It’s also why it balances out so quickly. It doesn’t take long for the plant to grow large enough, and it also recognizes its dire need, likely making Mg the first element it calls for once established.

So we take what Dr Bugbee has found to be true and look at the issue. Quite simply, peoples environments are not dialed in well enough to accommodate jumps in light. Or they’re taking a plant whose rootball is not ready to handle the increased activity. Again assuming there are appropriate Mg levels in the soil.

A perfect example of this is my current grow. I jumped to 50% and the plants despised this. I brought it back down to 25% while they grew a little larger. Once they were a bit bigger I jumped back up to 50% and the plants took it perfectly, and actually seemed to prefer the greater intensity. Nothing was changed. I didn’t increase nutrients, adjust watering, nothing. I just waited 3-5 days and they were ready once their rootballs could access and produce the requirements.

I think what we’re seeing a lot of lately is people pushing plants harder than the roots can handle. If you’re not growing with chelated nutrients or synthetics you’re really depending on the rootball and the plant to do the work, and when you push it harder than it can handle you see these deficiencies. It’s also why they seem to balance out so quickly. It’s not that the light is too intense too quick, it’s that the roots just aren’t there yet.
Click to expand...
Exactly. It takes the plant a bit to catch up. Does Bugbee grow with organics or synthetics?
 
Gee64 said:
Exactly. It takes the plant a bit to catch up. Does Bugbee grow with organics or synthetics?
Click to expand...

I believe synthetics, which is why it’s even more important for us as LOS growers to make sure our rootballs are large enough to handle the jump. We can’t prop the plant up in the same manner as a synthetic grower can. I sort of alluded to that with the chelated nutrients. If you’re running recharge and a bunch of organic acids then you’d likely be okay like a synthetic grower since you’re doing the heavy lifting anyway.
 
Screenshot_20230207_123410_EZVIZ.jpg


I logged in to see things while I was gone from home. Guess what I just found? That happened quick.

Screenshot_20230207_123504_Gallery.jpg


Heres a zoom-in. Mag def begins. Lets see where it goes...

This 10gal pot is loaded top to bottom with roots. Turns out its not the rootball size, its a lag in the supply chain.

Or something else.
 
Gee64 said:
Screenshot_20230207_123410_EZVIZ.jpg


I logged in to see things while I was gone from home. Guess what I just found? That happened quick.

Screenshot_20230207_123504_Gallery.jpg


Heres a zoom-in. Mag def begins. Lets see where it goes...

This 10gal pot is loaded top to bottom with roots. Turns out its not the rootball size, its a lag in the supply chain.

Or something else.
Click to expand...

Eh.. I can’t agree that it’s definitely not the rootball. You decimated that plant and a large portion of its roots have likely died/gone offline. Especially if it’s been in low light for a while.

On top of that, you’ve got very few leaves that have likely been receiving much much less light attempting to photosynthesize. You’re gonna need to measure the light level difference as well to be able to rule out roots. Doubling the light is one thing but quadrupling it is another.
 
Keffka said:
This is assuming there are proper amounts of Mg in the soil to begin with. My personal Mg issue was directly related to the non existent levels in the beginning. The light and its intensity were all the same from the start up through the issue.

Dr Bugbee himself has said and shown that cannabis can handle multiple levels greater PPFD over a short time frame. I.e. going from 250 to 500 in 1-2 days, 600 to 1200 etc. hardening off is simply not required. This tells us a whole lot.

Once we’re talking about a medium with appropriate levels of Mg then it’s on to the plant itself.

You said it in my first journal.. it’s all relative to the root ball, especially with Mg. The plant simply doesn’t have the capacity to process, nor signal for its required levels. This is why foliars work so well. It’s also why it balances out so quickly. It doesn’t take long for the plant to grow large enough, and it also recognizes its dire need, likely making Mg the first element it calls for once established.

So we take what Dr Bugbee has found to be true and look at the issue. Quite simply, peoples environments are not dialed in well enough to accommodate jumps in light. Or they’re taking a plant whose rootball is not ready to handle the increased activity. Again assuming there are appropriate Mg levels in the soil.

A perfect example of this is my current grow. I jumped to 50% and the plants despised this. I brought it back down to 25% while they grew a little larger. Once they were a bit bigger I jumped back up to 50% and the plants took it perfectly, and actually seemed to prefer the greater intensity. Nothing was changed. I didn’t increase nutrients, adjust watering, nothing. I just waited 3-5 days and they were ready once their rootballs could access and produce the requirements.

I think what we’re seeing a lot of lately is people pushing plants harder than the roots can handle. If you’re not growing with chelated nutrients or synthetics you’re really depending on the rootball and the plant to do the work, and when you push it harder than it can handle you see these deficiencies. It’s also why they seem to balance out so quickly. It’s not that the light is too intense too quick, it’s that the roots just aren’t there yet.
Click to expand...
I wonder if toggling more light on and off at set intervals, say 1 hr at 50%, then back to 25, or wherever you started for a couple hours, repeat, repeat.... may stimulate the rootball to grow faster.
 
Carmen Ray said:
I want to make myself an earth worm farm. I get heavy winter rainfall and temps get down to about 5 C at coldest and usually sit at about 10 to 15 C. I don't have any cover for the farm. Gee, do you have any suggestions for how I could construct one and what materials I could use?
Click to expand...
Those temps sound perfectly fine to keep a worm farm Carmen. 1 of mine is a 3 tier shop bought one, the other is a repurposed compost tumbler. I have seen some folk using polystyrene boxes with drainage holes for the 'worm wee' to drain out. These days I keep a layer of wetted cardboard on the top which they eat up too. My original worms came out of a bag of worm castings I bought, so I never bothered buying any. I think in 1 week, a mature worm can produce 10 more worms, so all going well they will rapidly increase in numbers. Yes I would say do it! :)
 
Gee64 said:
It actually is Earth Worm Castings, I was just trying to fit in with some cool South African Slang...you know... when in South Africa do as Carmen does... speak as Carmen speaks...🤣🤣🤣
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Acronyms... yeah I sometimes get them a bit mixed up and you're right we do indeed call it worm compost here and I have every intention of making that composting bin. I also want to reintroduce bokashi, I don't know it's uses for gardening, but it tends to prevent the smell of meat decomposing and I need somewhere to chuck my organic waste. If I can find something useful to do with it I will follow that track too, but one thing at a time ;)
greenjeans said:
Here is a couple of spots.....https://www.420magazine.com/community/threads/question-for-you-vermicomposters.461169/

Worms in soil from castings?

I am in mid-week #8 and just flushed my 3 plants. While dumping the run-off, I noticed what looked like 2 dead small worms (could have sworn 1 moved). I have been using worm castings as a top dressing and wondering if there could be eggs that developed into worms within my soil. I purchased the...
www.420magazine.com
Click to expand...
Thanks GJ, this is going to be handy to brush up on basics as I have never kept worms before.
Stunger said:
Those temps sound perfectly fine to keep a worm farm Carmen. 1 of mine is a 3 tier shop bought one, the other is a repurposed compost tumbler. I have seen some folk using polystyrene boxes with drainage holes for the 'worm wee' to drain out. These days I keep a layer of wetted cardboard on the top which they eat up too. My original worms came out of a bag of worm castings I bought, so I never bothered buying any. I think in 1 week, a mature worm can produce 10 more worms, so all going well they will rapidly increase in numbers. Yes I would say do it! :)
Click to expand...
That's helpful Stunger. The polystyrene could work if I weight it down but wind is high here so it would have to weigh heavy. I must play around with some ideas. I need to find a design but I am sure Google can help with that if I can't find something onsite.
 
I'm still not home but I did make one change remotely. I raised my RH from 60 to 65 in hopes that slowing the plant down a bit will allow the supply chain to catch up on magnesium production.

This will be an interesting flower if it makes it that far.

This poor plant has been hit by a weed eater and then left in the bright sun to struggle.

The clones will get a better life than Mom.

Mom may end up in a worm bin sooner than later.

She's got roots tho so its not over yet.

I really want to dissect her rootball, really badly do..yup.

Gotta give her 2 more weeks tho. Then decide.
 
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