Stunted grow, green veins, burned tips: diagnose please?

[Mister Greengenes]

I am using 2 cobs on 80 cm height.
1. Optic 1 COB 54W LED 3500k
2. Citizen CLU048-1212 64W COB

Between keeping the cabinet temperature around 77 Fahrenheit, 60 percent RH and the cfls as well as feeding properly you should have healthy squat and very GREEN PLANTS. I have no experience with cobs but I always had trouble nursing seedlings with leds. Since switching techniques, 100 percent success.

 

[Chronic cultivator]

Emilya is right on the mark, drying out that rootball not only doesn’t cause any hermie problems it leads to explosive root growth. When the roots dry they send out hundreds of tiny feeler roots in search of water. These small feeders all become a solid mass of roots.

While I agree that bringing the plant to its driest point before watering is beneficial to the root system...I do not agree that taking them to the point of wilt...which is what I saw. I have seen first hand how stress in veg ( even when they recover quickly) causes deformaties later in bud...25 years of a perfect environment and quality equipment and studying and learning from problems of which I have had plenty and resolved..has taught me how to consistently get huge yields of high quality smoke...I work in a commercial setting...10 to 12 hours a day...I watch how every plant grows with the same intensity everyday...it is my life's passion. I have grown in every medium. I wouldn't want anyone to just take my advice on faith...Google....good luck.

 

[Nunyabiz]

Everytime I hear someone drying their soil out Sahara dry it just makes me cringe.
All that means is your growing medium doesn't get enough oxygen.
Your plants roots should never get dry as it can kill off root tips and hairs and stunt growth.
The key to good growth is oxygen, if the only way you can get that oxygen to your roots is for the soil to dry out then your problem is lack of proper aeration.
If people let soil dry out so far as to cause severe wilting then you're going to most likely create problems for yourself by killing off root tips, a very dry soil becomes hydrophobic, it also concentrates synthetic salt based nutrients which can burn roots.
Once hydrophobic you could end up with large dry pockets in your soil that will also kill roots because of extended time in bone dry soil.

This balance between wet and dry isn't quite as critical in a plastic pot with heavy non aerated potting soil, but if you're growing in Living Organic Soil and you have worms bugs etc then you're going to totally screw the whole system up, kill your worms your bugs will bail and microbes will not flourish.
Never ever allow your living soil to dry out

 

[ren7o]

Hey all! I have an update of my girls and sadly they are looking the same. I dried them as @Emilya wrote in hers watering tutorial but new growth still have the same symptoms on all my girls. It is more than week, should I have to wait longer?
I am really desperate, whatever I plant whatever I do the symptoms are still the same...

 

[Nunyabiz]

Id transplant into good properly aerated soil in the largest fabric pots your space and wallet can tolerate.
FILLED to the brim with a Clackamas Coots soil recipe and water the soil enough to keep it constantly moist.
Water with aloe vera to help the roots.

 

[ren7o]

Id transplant into good properly aerated soil in the largest fabric pots your space and wallet can tolerate.
FILLED to the brim with a Clackamas Coots soil recipe and water the soil enough to keep it constantly moist.
Water with aloe vera to help the roots.

Thanks for your response! First and the second seedling has 50/50% soil/perlite one is in BioBizz lightmix and second in Atami Bi growmix. Soil should be greatly aerated, I do not think the soil is the problem. The bigger ones was already transplanted 2 times, better to not stress them again.
Of course I will do that as my last try to fix it. I just prefer to be not so invasive at first.

 

[Purplehazer]

Hi Ren7o

here is a link for a page that might be useful for you....you're relying on the diagnosis of others and not getting anywhere!! and i think you might learn a awful lot by looking at this page!!

Plant Abuse Chart

Heat Stress : Look closely below, and you'll see the brown leaf edges that are indicative of heat stress. This damage looks alot like nutrient burn, except it occurs only at the tops of the plants closest to the lamps. There's only one cure for this...get the heat away from the plants, either...

www.420magazine.com

 

[ren7o]

Hi Ren7o

here is a link for a page that might be useful for you....you're relying on the diagnosis of others and not getting anywhere!! and i think you might learn a awful lot by looking at this page!!

Plant Abuse Chart

Heat Stress : Look closely below, and you'll see the brown leaf edges that are indicative of heat stress. This damage looks alot like nutrient burn, except it occurs only at the tops of the plants closest to the lamps. There's only one cure for this...get the heat away from the plants, either...

www.420magazine.com

Thanks! Going to study it right now!

 

[Emilya Green]

with each completed wet/dry cycle the roots will get stronger and stronger and able to pull up the nutrients the plant needs. Nothing happens instantly, just keep doing what you are doing and the color will come back

 

[ren7o]

with each completed wet/dry cycle the roots will get stronger and stronger and able to pull up the nutrients the plant needs. Nothing happens instantly, just keep doing what you are doing and the color will come back

Thank you for calming me @Emilya ! How long it takes approx??

 

[Buds Buddy]

I don't know much about the soil you are using or if it has nutes or not. I think the watering situation is close to being fixed with a couple proper watering's. But what I'm also seeing is a hungry plant that is low on N & is eating itself to get nutes. I'm no pro at this so I'll ask @Emilya to confirm what I'm thinking. She's been my teacher for 4 years so I trust her advice.
The other thing I noticed was in the 1st pic. I see a hole in the leaf. You need to check those plants with a loupe or microscope. I've heard you can hold a flashlight to a leaf in a dark room & see bugs through the leaf. Never had a bug so haven't tried it.

 

[Emilya Green]

Thank you for calming me @Emilya ! How long it takes approx??

to clear most problems, 3 complete wet/dry cycles... approximately 10 days.

 

[ren7o]

to clear most problems, 3 complete wet/dry cycles... approximately 10 days.

Thank you! They are growing but very slowly I hope I am watering it right. I am giving them a little of water approx 100ml to be sure the water will not stay on roots for too long to avoid the rot problem. This is my first watering today I hope they will fully recover soon. I will keep you updated.

 

[ren7o]

I don't know much about the soil you are using or if it has nutes or not. I think the watering situation is close to being fixed with a couple proper watering's. But what I'm also seeing is a hungry plant that is low on N & is eating itself to get nutes. I'm no pro at this so I'll ask @Emilya to confirm what I'm thinking. She's been my teacher for 4 years so I trust her advice.
The other thing I noticed was in the 1st pic. I see a hole in the leaf. You need to check those plants with a loupe or microscope. I've heard you can hold a flashlight to a leaf in a dark room & see bugs through the leaf. Never had a bug so haven't tried it.

Thanks. Soils has low and medium feed + 50% perlite added.

BioBizz Light Mix
pH = 6,2 EC = 1,2
NPK: 133 - 201 - 365 (mg/l)
and
Atami Bi-Grow Mix
NPK 12-14-24, 700 grams per cubic meter ) EC < 1750 µS/cm

For now I am preferably staying with @Emilya solution. Seems it is doing something, at least they are growing slowly tho.

 

[Emilya Green]

Thank you! They are growing but very slowly I hope I am watering it right. I am giving them a little of water approx 100ml to be sure the water will not stay on roots for too long to avoid the rot problem. This is my first watering today I hope they will fully recover soon. I will keep you updated.

You are overthinking this and making mistakes due to your assumptions. When you water with a small set amount like that, without saturating the medium to the point of runoff, here is what happens. Gravity.

When you water with that small amount of water, it immediately falls down to the bottom of the container. The top spreader roots get a momentary drink, but then the water moves past them, the top dries out and the only place wet in that container is the very bottom... the place you were trying to avoid this problem!

It is best to fully saturate the soil, from top to bottom, treating the soil as if it were a sponge, and you are trying to fill it up with the very most water it can hold before it flows out of the bottom as runoff. When you do this, every region is the container is wet and ALL the roots from top to bottom are getting benefit. This is way more healthy for the overall plant than what you are doing, only sending water to the very bottom roots. Always water with gusto, watering to runoff... and then patiently wait for the plant to use ALL of that water, all the way down to the bottom. That is how you avoid root rot, by allowing the bottom to dry out BETWEEN waterings.

 

[ren7o]

You are overthinking this and making mistakes due to your assumptions. When you water with a small set amount like that, without saturating the medium to the point of runoff, here is what happens. Gravity.

When you water with that small amount of water, it immediately falls down to the bottom of the container. The top spreader roots get a momentary drink, but then the water moves past them, the top dries out and the only place wet in that container is the very bottom... the place you were trying to avoid this problem!

It is best to fully saturate the soil, from top to bottom, treating the soil as if it were a sponge, and you are trying to fill it up with the very most water it can hold before it flows out of the bottom as runoff. When you do this, every region is the container is wet and ALL the roots from top to bottom are getting benefit. This is way more healthy for the overall plant than what you are doing, only sending water to the very bottom roots. Always water with gusto, watering to runoff... and then patiently wait for the plant to use ALL of that water, all the way down to the bottom. That is how you avoid root rot, by allowing the bottom to dry out BETWEEN waterings.

Oh, ok, Thank you @Emilya! I have fixed it already. Now I am going to wait and watch patiently.

 

[Buds Buddy]

Thanks. Soils has low and medium feed + 50% perlite added.

BioBizz Light Mix
pH = 6,2 EC = 1,2
NPK: 133 - 201 - 365 (mg/l)
and
Atami Bi-Grow Mix
NPK 12-14-24, 700 grams per cubic meter ) EC < 1750 µS/cm

For now I am preferably staying with @Emilya solution. Seems it is doing something, at least they are growing slowly tho.

I would do the same. But like I said, she's been my teacher for 4 years now so I'd like to know if my assumption is correct or if I'm way off base. I'll never know, if I don't ask.

 

[ren7o]

Just posting an update. It seem the older leaves still dying and the new growths are replacing them so the girls are not growing globally.

 

[Emilya Green]

Don't abandon ship yet... she is trying. Those roots must have been terribly damaged. Keep working her, but understand that she can only uptake so much at the moment and that is it... give her time to repair.

 

[ren7o]

Don't abandon ship yet... she is trying. Those roots must have been terribly damaged. Keep working her, but understand that she can only uptake so much at the moment and that is it... give her time to repair.

@Emilya you are the only who is giving me the patience... Thank you again for great explanation and for calming me as well.