Stevehman's Advanced LED 360 vs. 180 - Multiple Strains - NFT Grow 4.0

OK, I'm back from my week away from the garden. Glad to be back in Southern California, just in time for summer to show up and the temps are starting to rise outside.

Well the system worked flawlessly while I was away. A full week with no hands-on and I came back to find all of the plants still alive. In fact, the Twilight had taken over two of the three grow areas. Under the 180 and 200 they stretched all the way to the lights, that is more than 18 inches of growth in 6 days. The ones under the 360 didn't do any stretching at all. Now, the $64k question--did the Twilight start to bud? NO!, They are officially out of the comparison. I will continue to see if they start to flower, but I am on day 34 and the P-chunk and Gigabuds are about 1/2 way through with their flowering cycle.

These Twilights have me utterly perplexed. All from the same mom, all cloned from cutting in about the same location and they are all looking like different phenotypes. All based on th elighting.

Here is what I found under the 180 when I got back:
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Under the 200:
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Under the 360:
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And for comparison, the extra clone that's been vegging under the T5HO:
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I know that you aren't supposed to do any trimming once they are in flower, but I hacked the crap out of the ones under the 180 and 200. They were crowding out all of the other plants, and since they aren't showing any signs of flowering I have nothing to lose.

The P-chunks are looking like they will be a great producer. I think in a SOG setup these would be great, just a single main cola in small hempies (ala 420fied style).

The Gigabuds are looking great too. Although due to their smaller stature, I would not recommend growing them with plants that tend to get taller. I think they would be very well suited to stealth cabinets, or a SOG as well.

Here are a few pics of the girls, after I trimmed away the Twilight to get a good shot.
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I wish the Twilight's were doing better, they really got thick while I was gone, and the stalks are about the diameter of my thumb, with huge knuckles at the branches (getting ready for a huge yield). I have the mom and one clone under T5HO's, I will put the mom into a separate tent to flower out towards the end of the month, very curious to see how big it will get after it has room to stretch and what the yield will be (if it ever flowers).
 
Maer said:
So what is your plan for moving the lights? it doesn't look like you have any more headroom.
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The lights are at a set height. That is why I use clones that are 6-8 inches tall so when they are finished stretching they will be 18 inches from the lights. This is more-or-less a stealth grow setup, although not intended to be or needed--just space constraints make it one.

All of the other plants have finished their stretch and I have the recommended distance from the lights on them, just those f'ing Twilights that won't cooperate (except the ones under the 360, no stretch on them).

I will be getting a tent later this summer that will give me more height for future grows.
 
Hey Steve. Just got caught up on your grow. I'm interested to see the yield from those LEDs. I'm curious, what are the lumen output of the different lights? I saw where you listed the wattage for each one but not the output.

Looking really good so far. Would you recommend a Sea of Green for the LEDs or could a full grow be done with one?
 
Looking good Steve, my friend. Great job on the week away, I am having to do that every week for the next couple months. My wife helping best she can, lol....
 
Crower619 said:
Ladies are looking great as always minus the twilight's Ive ran into the same problems Steve, you plan on letting her keep growing or what do you plan on doing with her?
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Hi Crower. :)

I'm germing a Twilight right now. Steve asked me to do one to see if I have the same problems. Wonder if it's some junk strain they named after the movies? :)
 
Propa Gator said:
McBudz grew some hermaphrodite Twilights briefly, couple years back.
He righteously executed those twinks, when they showed their junk off.

Nice description in the catalogue, I wish you luck with them.
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Dude, I snorted Monster out of my nose when I read that!
 
Crower619 said:
Ladies are looking great as always minus the twilight's Ive ran into the same problems Steve, you plan on letting her keep growing or what do you plan on doing with her?
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It's a tough call. If they aren't showing signs of budding by the end of next week. I will pull them out of the box. They're just taking up space, light and nutes at that point. They are looking healthy though, so it is frustrating.

MacMota said:
Hey Steve. Just got caught up on your grow. I'm interested to see the yield from those LEDs. I'm curious, what are the lumen output of the different lights? I saw where you listed the wattage for each one but not the output.

Looking really good so far. Would you recommend a Sea of Green for the LEDs or could a full grow be done with one?
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Not too sure on the Lumen output, I think with LEDs PAR is much more important since they have a very focused light spectrum. I think giving the folks at Advanced will be a better source for technical data

I've been doing SOG and SCROG type grows because of height limitations, I think they would be capable of doing a full grow though, these things really put out some light. Go with teh 360 model or higher though so you have the full penetration.

surfinstoned said:
The ladies are looking great Steve! Glad to see there were no issues with the system on auto pilot for a week. That really does suck about the twilight not budding yet that would really frustrate me as well.
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I am really pleased with how the setup is performing, I am gone about 2-3 days a week and a few weeks out of every quarter, so having a little peace-of-mind is great.


GodsTrichome said:
Looking good Steve, my friend. Great job on the week away, I am having to do that every week for the next couple months. My wife helping best she can, lol....
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My wife was with me out of town, but even if she was here, she prefers to not contribute to my delinquent behavior ;)


OldMedMan said:
Hi Crower. :)

I'm germing a Twilight right now. Steve asked me to do one to see if I have the same problems. Wonder if it's some junk strain they named after the movies? :)
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Thanks for doing that OMM, I am wondering if they are just an outside strain that needs to go the full term under the sun? These are from Dutch Passion and I haven't had any experience with them so I am curious. I have a few more packs of other strains from them, so I am hoping this one is an isolated incident (I still have 4 more Twilight seeds, so it may be a bad pheno in this particular one).


Propa Gator said:
McBudz grew some hermaphrodite Twilights briefly, couple years back.
He righteously executed those twinks, when they showed their junk off.

Nice description in the catalogue, I wish you luck with them.
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At this point I would not be surprised if they were shims.

The catalog description makes them sound awesome, although it's all marketing and can only be accepted at face-value.


Jozo-sha said:
Dude, I snorted Monster out of my nose when I read that!
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Looks like Propa Gator owes you a new keyboard.
 
Day 36 update:

I haven't taken readings since the other day, I am doing my res change later this afternoon and will post the before/after readings then.

So, 5 weeks into flower and the Twilights are still only showing pre-flowers, definitely looking more sativa than indica at this point. They are a cross between Pure Brazilian and KC 606 (wtf is KC 606?). They are supposed to produce "striking purple plants with high yields of quality marijuana with a slightly Afghan taste." I don't see any purple, except from the lights. The description goes on to hedge their bets by saying that they could exhibit either the sativa or indica phenotype (where's the small print, your mileage may very, these results are not typical of all grows etc...).

The good new is that the P-chunk and G-bud are growing as advertised. I think the P-chunk is going to be a breeze to trim when I harvest her in 4 weeks. I haven't touched them and the look like they were lollipopped already. The G-buds are getting fat, thick buds on them. Here are a few shots of them under the different lights. I color corrected a bit so they aren't overly pink in these shots.

Under the 180:
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Under the 200:
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Under the 360:
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And the obligatory lighter-next-to-the-bud shot:
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The P-chunks are getting a little frosty. It's a real shame on the Twilights, when I did the topping and chopping on them the other day, may hands were very sticky, they do produce some resin.
 
Awesome! Well done buddy! That sugar dusting looks insane under those LEDs! I hope those Twilights kick into overdrive for you. The purple may not show up until the last week or two of flower.
 
Made the decision to cull the herd this morning and removed all of the Twilights from the grow. It was a tough decision but I made it based on timing for the next grow. If these somehow miraculously started to bud this week, I would then have another 7-8 weeks for them to finish. The P-chunk and G-bud will be finished in 4 weeks, which means that I would have to wait another 4 weeks past that to start another run.

I will be taking some G-bud clones this weeks in prep for the next round. I think a full run of them would be a good basis for the next comparison grow. I may have an opportunity to test out a new light and I like the way the G-bus have a consistent height and would be a good SOGgrow. I'll veg them one extra week (in the cloner) so I will have a little more vertical growth and I will top/fim them twice in that period to maximize the number of tops on them. It should be a good run.

Here are some pics of the culled Twilights. I put the 6 of them into a bucket for the pic. This will now be referred to as the "bucket of failure".

You can see how they were really stacking up and looking very healthy. Roots were looking nice too. It's a shame they weren't performing, maybe once I have my tent set up I can let one grow out in a hempy bucket to see how it performs. I have the original mom and one clone in 2gal hempies that I would use.

Onto the Bucket of Failure pics:
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There is a little discoloration on the roots near the hydroton, not sure if that is the beneficials, or a little staining from the nutes (CES Micro is a pink color). The roots smell like fresh vegetables and are very "crisp" when pulled.

I moved some of the G-buds into the areas that were opened up by removing the Twilights, a little more light on them should be a good thing.

I'll post pics of them in a couple days to show any improvements on their growth as a result of less crowding.
 
Looking great as always! you mentioned that you are going to do another comparison on your next grow, can you shed some light on the details? It's a shame you had to pull the twilight's from the grow but i totally understand your reason, i would have done the same thing.
 
stevehman said:
Surfin, I'll PM you some of the potential details. I don't want to let the cat out of the bag too soon.
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Hey Buddy. :)

Hehe....I like to keep my next round a bit of a secret too. Adds excitement to the grow. I think anyway.

I also full understand you pulling the Twilights. That's a lot of time to waste.

I said this to you in a post in my journal, but here it is again.

My Twilight jumped right up and then died. I've got one more seed and I'm gona try it for the hell of it. Can a whole strain be bad? :):popcorn:
 
OldMedMan said:
Hey Buddy. :)

Hehe....I like to keep my next round a bit of a secret too. Adds excitement to the grow. I think anyway.

I also full understand you pulling the Twilights. That's a lot of time to waste.

I said this to you in a post in my journal, but here it is again.

My Twilight jumped right up and then died. I've got one more seed and I'm gona try it for the hell of it. Can a whole strain be bad? :):popcorn:
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Who knows, my first Twilight seed died, so I had planted a second and it wouldn't bud. I have the mom and one of her clones that I will put into 12/12 when I get the BAT. It will be in a hempy so I don't have the issue of it sucking up nutes that the other plants need. I'll keep you posted.
 
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