endive
New Member
Impressive penetration! Looks dense, even down low!
Soil/LED Air-Pruning Grow
- Thread starter JJ Bones
- Start date
If you don't mind me asking how much did those four led's cost? I am lookind into purchasing a new lamp and was wordering if they are up to par with a 1000w hps yet?
A new 1000w is about $400 here and I heard that led's cost more than that for 200w is that true? Other than cost to run or lowered heat levels what are the benefits? Nice looking buds by the way, are they getting tight? I heard that is a problem with led's that hasn't been worked out yet. Any opinions led growers ?
A new 1000w is about $400 here and I heard that led's cost more than that for 200w is that true? Other than cost to run or lowered heat levels what are the benefits? Nice looking buds by the way, are they getting tight? I heard that is a problem with led's that hasn't been worked out yet. Any opinions led growers ?
endive
New Member
I think the issue of loose LED buds was something early on, when LEDs were underpowered and people tried to grow too much (in area) with them. Most of the LED systems that remain now are all pretty awesome in their own right.
I've used LEDs for over a year, in addition to running a 600w HPS, I've not had a problem growing fat, dense buds under LED and from my limited experience, I actually believe you get better trichome production with LED over HPS.
If you look around the forum, you'll see a wide range of LED lamps being used successfully. Follow back to the vendors and see what price/power ratio will be best for you. Remember also, it's not all about the wattage, spectrum & lens angles all play a part too.
When you are looking at cost-per-watt on an LED vs. HPS, the HPS will always win based solely on that criteria. Where the LEDs win out is on reduced heat, reduced power consumption and long life of the lights. They also have targeted spectrum, so they aren't creating light that isn't in the PAR range.
You just need to evaluate your setup, requirements, budget and goals to see what is your best option. I've said it in my threads before; if I didn't have height and heat restrictions I would have gone HPS. Although now I am strictly an LED user. (maybe I should change my name to Capt LiteBrite)
- Thread starter
- #25
As the other two members mentioned LEDs have come along way (and continue to do so) and it really depends on your situation.
These four LED's have a MSRP of $899 per light, I got a discount plus these were proto-types so the price has risen a bit.
The benefits other then what you mentioned are the specific spectrum of light the LEDs produce which is all colors usable by plants unlike HID which wastes a lot of light.
To be honest I'm very impressed with how dense these buds feel, it's sweet.
I say if you're dabbling in growing stick with HID or Fluorescents, if you've gotten some grows under you belt and are good at getting an ROI now consider trying out an LED.
- Thread starter
- #27
Well in my case you're looking at $4.50 per watt on these, and on average I see people getting .5-1 gpw with these particular LED brand. Not sure about others.
endive
New Member
In terms of economics, I more than made up for the price of my LED grow light on the very first grow. It is all relative though, as I could have done so with any HID. The catch was I couldn't use metal halide nor high pressure sodium, even at their lower wattage because of my limited area.
I think getting away from thinking in terms of "cost" or "price" and just use the determination of an items value to you. A 1000w digital HPS may have been as much, or cheaper than my first LED, but the 1000watt system would have little value to me, as I could not use it.
I think a decent return is anything above .5g/watt, I think any LED worth its salt can easily sustain .75g/watt, but I'd be more concerned with grams per sq.ft of garden space, factored by the time it took to grow, that is the real tell.
I think getting away from thinking in terms of "cost" or "price" and just use the determination of an items value to you. A 1000w digital HPS may have been as much, or cheaper than my first LED, but the 1000watt system would have little value to me, as I could not use it.
I think a decent return is anything above .5g/watt, I think any LED worth its salt can easily sustain .75g/watt, but I'd be more concerned with grams per sq.ft of garden space, factored by the time it took to grow, that is the real tell.
I think 1gr-per-watt is very doable with an LED. You need to have the right setup though and maximize canopy space. My current grow is goin gto be bleow that mark because of removing 1/3 of the plants in the grow. My next journal (mid August) should hit 1+gr per watt. My last grow was very close to that mark. (about .75 gr). As I learn more about how to use these lights I will get the numbers consistently above 1gr.In terms of economics, I more than made up for the price of my LED grow light on the very first grow. It is all relative though, as I could have done so with any HID. The catch was I couldn't use metal halide nor high pressure sodium, even at their lower wattage because of my limited area.
I think getting away from thinking in terms of "cost" or "price" and just use the determination of an items value to you. A 1000w digital HPS may have been as much, or cheaper than my first LED, but the 1000watt system would have little value to me, as I could not use it.
I think a decent return is anything above .5g/watt, I think any LED worth its salt can easily sustain .75g/watt, but I'd be more concerned with grams per sq.ft of garden space, factored by the time it took to grow, that is the real tell.
My next grow is another test of the effects of height above canopy. It should be my last run of performance tests before I start full-scale production runs. It will be worth the time though to determine the optimal height for blooming.
- Thread starter
- #30
In terms of economics, I more than made up for the price of my LED grow light on the very first grow. It is all relative though, as I could have done so with any HID. The catch was I couldn't use metal halide nor high pressure sodium, even at their lower wattage because of my limited area.
I think getting away from thinking in terms of "cost" or "price" and just use the determination of an items value to you. A 1000w digital HPS may have been as much, or cheaper than my first LED, but the 1000watt system would have little value to me, as I could not use it.
I think a decent return is anything above .5g/watt, I think any LED worth its salt can easily sustain .75g/watt, but I'd be more concerned with grams per sq.ft of garden space, factored by the time it took to grow, that is the real tell.
Thank you endive. It's rare to see others with the same mindset as yourself. Many forget to realize the value within a price and focus on the price itself. Once you truly understand value in things you become much more powerful.
Now that being said, I like to use a liquor store as an example. I have two stores literally next to each other. One is named Cork 'N' Bottle the other is La Barata (the cheapest, lowest price). I've been going to La Barata for 4 years; took me that long to find the value. Cork 'N' Bottle has better customer service, and COLDER BEER.
That's value, I can get the same brand of beer, same model, made in the same place, the same factory, shipped in the same truck, giving me the same outcome, yet if it is COLDER I pay a higher price. That, my friend, is the definition of a value purchase. If you understand this post FULLY, you can be a successful entrepreneur no matter then field.
- Thread starter
- #31
Update: Week 7 to 8
Things are going well, I learned what I wanted to learn by letting the plants get closer to the light than recommended. Thinking this may actual go to week 10 possibly, but could see changes throughout the week.
Oh and unfortunately noticed one nug has a seed forming in the middle, which sucks but is what I get for being lazy and not lowering the plants to get further from the lights.
Reference for myself, when too close: leaf burnage, heat stress on leaves, hermie
Just been flushing no nutes at all, waiting to find hardly any PPM in my run-off.
July 28, 2011 - Week 7 Day 5
OG Kush
GDP
Overall
Things are going well, I learned what I wanted to learn by letting the plants get closer to the light than recommended. Thinking this may actual go to week 10 possibly, but could see changes throughout the week.
Oh and unfortunately noticed one nug has a seed forming in the middle, which sucks but is what I get for being lazy and not lowering the plants to get further from the lights.
Reference for myself, when too close: leaf burnage, heat stress on leaves, hermie
Just been flushing no nutes at all, waiting to find hardly any PPM in my run-off.
July 28, 2011 - Week 7 Day 5
OG Kush
GDP
Overall
endive
New Member
Re: Update: Week 7 to 8
Bones! (said in a Shatner-esqe tone),
Looking good! With all those sugar leaves, please tell me you're hashing or kiefing them
The leaf browning & discoloration looks more like a possible salt/nutrient buildup. Many growers begin removing those leaves anyway at about this time. And since you're flushing now, problem solved. I usually discard the top 2-3 inches of soil in the pot prior to the flush, then replace it with fresh soil after.
Anytime I've gotten too close with my LEDs the leaves do show heat stress, but the big issue is bud bleaching, parts of the colas go from healthy green to ghost white.
Finding an occasional seed or two isn't uncommon, I don't consider that to be a hermie. Many feminized seeds will tend to self pollenate at some point, so occasional "boy bananas" emerge from calyxes where pistils should be and such, but i've seen full blown colas and dangling, grape-like clusters of balls all on one branch ... Now that's a hermie.
I recently found 3 seeds while weighing my Jock Horror, all from the very tip on one cola. A few of my most "interesting" plants, are in-house seeds. When there's a little extra space in the tent, I'll pop one or two.
Enjoying the journey!
Bones! (said in a Shatner-esqe tone),
Looking good! With all those sugar leaves, please tell me you're hashing or kiefing them
The leaf browning & discoloration looks more like a possible salt/nutrient buildup. Many growers begin removing those leaves anyway at about this time. And since you're flushing now, problem solved. I usually discard the top 2-3 inches of soil in the pot prior to the flush, then replace it with fresh soil after.
Anytime I've gotten too close with my LEDs the leaves do show heat stress, but the big issue is bud bleaching, parts of the colas go from healthy green to ghost white.
Finding an occasional seed or two isn't uncommon, I don't consider that to be a hermie. Many feminized seeds will tend to self pollenate at some point, so occasional "boy bananas" emerge from calyxes where pistils should be and such, but i've seen full blown colas and dangling, grape-like clusters of balls all on one branch ... Now that's a hermie.
I recently found 3 seeds while weighing my Jock Horror, all from the very tip on one cola. A few of my most "interesting" plants, are in-house seeds. When there's a little extra space in the tent, I'll pop one or two.
Enjoying the journey!
My last grow, I found a single seed on one of the fattest bud. No other seeds or signs of male flowers. I guess the plant's last ditch effort to reproduce. It's my understanding that when a plant does that, the seeds are female. I'm keeping that seed for a future grow to see how it works out.
endive
New Member
Nature and its ability to foster life, it never ceases to amaze me.
- Thread starter
- #36
Update: Harvest
August 3, 2011 - Week 8 Day 5
Well ready to cut them down, everything is lookin' ready to go, plus had a Lake Tahoe trip to take so wanted to let them dry while I was gone for a few days.
Been flushing them since about week 7, went to a gradual lowering of PPM to zero w/ Final Phase. Began lower doses around end of week 6.
OG Kush
GDP
August 4, 2011 - Cut/Trim Day
OG Kush
(Yes those are dog pee-pads, surprisingly absorbent.)
GDP
I have a few dried pics on my gallery if interested. I'm going to cure some a bit longer, then try and get some better pictures of them.
Overall I'd say I'm very satisfied, and this is some of the best stuff I've grown thus far. Nugs are VERY dense, which was awesome to experience.
I'll update with finished pics/yield etc in a few days or less. Thanks to all who've been watching from finish to end, always appreciate you guys.
August 3, 2011 - Week 8 Day 5
Well ready to cut them down, everything is lookin' ready to go, plus had a Lake Tahoe trip to take so wanted to let them dry while I was gone for a few days.
Been flushing them since about week 7, went to a gradual lowering of PPM to zero w/ Final Phase. Began lower doses around end of week 6.
OG Kush
GDP
August 4, 2011 - Cut/Trim Day
OG Kush
(Yes those are dog pee-pads, surprisingly absorbent.)
GDP
I have a few dried pics on my gallery if interested. I'm going to cure some a bit longer, then try and get some better pictures of them.
Overall I'd say I'm very satisfied, and this is some of the best stuff I've grown thus far. Nugs are VERY dense, which was awesome to experience.
I'll update with finished pics/yield etc in a few days or less. Thanks to all who've been watching from finish to end, always appreciate you guys.
Magic beans
New Member
Omg those are some beautiful plants. Send me a clone!! Lol. Say those lights look a lot like the diamond series.....
endive
New Member
- Thread starter
- #39
Yeah, the Diamond series has the same casing as these, as well as the Shanty LED's. The diodes look the same as well, look like my LED and the Apache LEDs.
- Thread starter
- #40
One Week Cure
Well nearly two weeks of cure now. Took some pics of buds today, wanted to add to the journal.
My total yield was only 22.5 ounces total, which isn't bad really, over one ounce per plant.
About two plants were really wimpy in yield, however this is my own fault due to allowing the plants get too close to the LED. Although I left it there to really see what happens myself. That said, I highly recommend keeping the lights 12-18 inches away the entire grow for optimal yield.
The OG Kush was farther away than the GDP and yielded 2.5 ounces more, which could be genetic but I'm positive the light distance/coverage played a role.
Looks like I'm at 0.77 GPW, which is decent, guarantee I can beat it next time around.
Overall I'd say I'm very satisfied with LED, and it does produce dense, quality buds with a good yield. It has come along way, and continues to innovate indoor grow lighting.
All that said, here are a ton of pics of some finished product.
OG Kush
Grand Daddy Purple
Journal Completed
Well nearly two weeks of cure now. Took some pics of buds today, wanted to add to the journal.
My total yield was only 22.5 ounces total, which isn't bad really, over one ounce per plant.
About two plants were really wimpy in yield, however this is my own fault due to allowing the plants get too close to the LED. Although I left it there to really see what happens myself. That said, I highly recommend keeping the lights 12-18 inches away the entire grow for optimal yield.
The OG Kush was farther away than the GDP and yielded 2.5 ounces more, which could be genetic but I'm positive the light distance/coverage played a role.
Looks like I'm at 0.77 GPW, which is decent, guarantee I can beat it next time around.
Overall I'd say I'm very satisfied with LED, and it does produce dense, quality buds with a good yield. It has come along way, and continues to innovate indoor grow lighting.
All that said, here are a ton of pics of some finished product.
OG Kush
Grand Daddy Purple
Journal Completed
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