Radogast: Grow Big Or Go Home

[MagicJim]

Glad to see you back. I'll sit in. Hyena Merica has a sweet grow house set up. You might want to check out what he did


Hyena's Never-Ending Adventures In Growing

 

[Radogast]

Ali uses TradeAssurance for the transaction, shouldn’t be an issue anymore. With that being said I stand by my original statement. My plants seem to grow better under the BudgetLED and if money wasn't an issue that’s the route I would take.

I reached out to Budget LED, NextLight, and Fluence by Osram - waiting for responses

 

[Radogast]

My favourite wizard is back.

Don't be fooled, The pictures is old

I actually shaved my neck today (first time this year)
I have about a month to get my beard back to hipster length

 

[Radogast]

Glad to see you back. I'll sit in. Hyena Merica has a sweet grow house set up. You might want to check out what he did


Hyena's Never-Ending Adventures In Growing

I'm only about a year behind on this journal (March 2019) so just perfect at the start of a major makeover - Thanks

 

[Radogast]

I'm thinking about pots to flower in and I'm trying to decided between plastic and fabric.

My best yields have been in 10 and 7 gallon fabric Geopots. But there was also some better strains, better environments alomng with the upgrade in soil volume from 5 gallon buckets.

Looking at 20-30 plant harvests rather than 1 or 2 plant harvest, thinking of the ease of cleaning plastic vs fabric, thinking about a hand truck to move several pots up to 60 feet at harvest time - I'm tempted to go with plastic.

Anyone have strong opinions on yield, plant health,etc. between plastic and fabric pots in LOS/organic soil?

 

[Tead]

I'm tempted to go with plastic.

I ended up there.
I tried all fabrics from 3 to 7 gallons. In the end, they all needed support to stay up. The flat, hard bottoms of 5gal buckets didn't fall over from the top-heavy plants.
Your mileage may vary.....

 

[kelticBlue]

I am with Tead, been thinking plastic makes the better foundation container.
Even though I am considering trying a honor the plant core grow baG. They have a 6.6 gal short and wide one That has caught my eye.

 

[Graytail]

A 10 gallon fabric bag fits pretty well into a sterelite crate, too. You can sorta have both. But I still think plastic has a slight edge for overall plant health.

 

[The Phantom]

Be aware that the diodes in those Chinese ones are no longer Samsung diodes. Jus’ sayin’. They were at one point i believe, but no longer.

I just checked my Kingbrite’s and they do look like Samsung diodes but then again they could be lower bin Samsung’s, I’m also definitely not an expert by any means. I know you were specifically talking about a different company but I know Kingbrite is really similar to the one you were mentioning.

I just got my boards a few weeks from Kingbrite, the newer 240w models with lm301h in 3000/3500k with ir and uv.

I'm trying to stay on schedule with lighting - direct from China shipping makes me nervous.

Once I got my order in, about 3 days back and forth messaging them, it took 3 days to ship to the US and this was recently. I ended up with (2) 240w for just under $500. They included an invoice with the product totaling $150 which I’m sure is in case customs tries to get you for import fees.

 

[Radogast]

I just checked my Kingbrite’s and they do look like Samsung diodes but then again they could be lower bin Samsung’s, I’m also definitely not an expert by any means. I know you were specifically talking about a different company but I know Kingbrite is really similar to the one you were mentioning.

I just got my boards a few weeks from Kingbrite, the newer 240w models with lm301h in 3000/3500k with ir and uv.

Once I got my order in, about 3 days back and forth messaging them, it took 3 days to ship to the US and this was recently. I ended up with (2) 240w for just under $500. They included an invoice with the product totaling $150 which I’m sure is in case customs tries to get you for import fees.

Thanks for the information.

I just price estimated flowerboards and veg boards at Fluence at $3 per watt. Major sticker shock!

 

[Amy Gardner]

price estimated flowerboards and veg boards at Fluence

Great place to start! LOL! Now everything else will seem really reasonably priced. Good strategy

 

[Graytail]

The overseas stuff is like, $1 a watt.

 

[Radogast]

Great place to start! LOL! Now everything else will seem really reasonably priced. Good strategy

I really thought the Fluence/Osram would be the most expensive - but my estimate from NextLight came in 70% higher!

The major difference was in reading the Fluence website, they recommended 342w/860 ppf per 4x4' space FOR NON CO2 supplemented grows as opposed to the 650w/1400 ppf per 4x4' space from Next light. When I adjust up to a Fluence 631w/1700 ppf light, the numbers became closer, but NextLight was still 10% higher priced.


What do y'all think about the jump from 342w to 650w per 4x4'?

The initial cost in lights is about 50%, but an 85% jump in wattage is an 85% jump in energy consumption, both direct and in Air Conditioning costs, that probably won't translate into 85% more yield per light.

Is there an upper limit to the amount of usable umols ppf if I don't wish to mess around with supplemental CO2?

 

[Radogast]

The overseas stuff is like, $1 a watt.

A great point!

Looking at the Grow Bar style - the quotes from Shenzhen Meijiu are about 90 cents per watt
For the older QB style - the quotes from Shenzhen Meijiu are about 60 cents per watt
For a flower room with 1-2' about the canopy, the QB style seems about as efficient, though not as hi-tech looking.
I think I'll go with the Quantum Boards.

For vertically stacked (stacked in racks) veg shelves, neither style seems to come in good sizes. When you want the extra shelf of veg space you need to be able to place lights close to the canopy.

One exception I've seen: the Fluence RAZR4 126w 2x4' has nicely spread out dimming LED bars that they suggest at 5" from the canopy. This mimics the wide footprint and close spacing of T5 flourescent tubes at about twice the cost. Considering the veg time lost due to unnoticed burned out tubes (it's happened to me twice) and with eventual return on investment due to bulb replacements, I think the RAZR4 is worth it comared to the 216W T5HO arrays I've used before.

A few years back they were doing LED strips that mimicked flourescent tubes, I'll also look for those when I have time.

 

[Tead]

A few years back they were doing LED strips that mimicked flourescent tubes,

Those are all over the marketplace. One might even be hard pressed to find old school flouro tubes at the local shops. I have a flouro fixture in my kitchen and I've been running them in the NOLA heat for many years now without replacement. Seems like an excellent choice for tiny ones.

 

[Van Stank]

I'm thinking about pots to flower in and I'm trying to decided between plastic and fabric.

My best yields have been in 10 and 7 gallon fabric Geopots. But there was also some better strains, better environments alomng with the upgrade in soil volume from 5 gallon buckets.

Looking at 20-30 plant harvests rather than 1 or 2 plant harvest, thinking of the ease of cleaning plastic vs fabric, thinking about a hand truck to move several pots up to 60 feet at harvest time - I'm tempted to go with plastic.

Anyone have strong opinions on yield, plant health,etc. between plastic and fabric pots in LOS/organic soil?

I use both....not sure that I have a preference. Cleaning them...plastic is the winner hands down, though I came up with an easy way to do the fabric pots. I fill up a 20 gallon trash can about 3/4 with water and vinegar or H2O2 and have a second trash can to do the rinse with. I let my dirty fabric pots build up for a year and only do the cleanings once a year as I have a lot of fabric pots. Once done washing and rinsing....hang dry in the sun for 8 hours (the UV light helps as well). If you are using a ton of fabric pots you can just watch when you have a big enough supply to make it worth it.

Good luck either way you go!

 

[Van Stank]

Thanks for the information.

I just price estimated flowerboards and veg boards at Fluence at $3 per watt. Major sticker shock!

Fluence isn't cheap but you won't be disappointed with the performance. I am about to fire up the Next Light Mega and compare its performance to the Fluence. Price wise they tend to run very similar. 3 bucks a watt seems high though.....just saying.

 

[Graytail]

A great point!

Looking at the Grow Bar style - the quotes from Shenzhen Meijiu are about 90 cents per watt
For the older QB style - the quotes from Shenzhen Meijiu are about 60 cents per watt
For a flower room with 1-2' about the canopy, the QB style seems about as efficient, though not as hi-tech looking.
I think I'll go with the Quantum Boards.

For vertically stacked (stacked in racks) veg shelves, neither style seems to come in good sizes. When you want the extra shelf of veg space you need to be able to place lights close to the canopy.

Meijiu has a 128 diode board that I had them make for me in those early days. It has far fewer diodes per sq inch, so the dispersion is high and the heat is low. They'd be great for the stacked veg shelves. I can easily get mine within 6 inches without harm. Or a set of strips would be fabulous, too.

 

[bobrown14]

Welcome back Rad

GL with your new endeavor.

Go big or go home as they say.

If I was doing a building I'd go wit quantum boards. You're handy they offer lots you put together. You could probably get a deal on several.

Get the 550 r-spec from hlg many vendors sell them. They are professional lights. I use smaller 300w version that I really like.

Quantum boards are pretty efficient. You can move all the power supplies remote the lamps dont get very hot at all. The power supplies do when running full tilt. They use mean well drivers so pretty much the best in the biz. Theres a newer version out now the 650r good luck trying to find one. They should be pretty good.

Cement mixer yes

I can mix 60 gal by hand on the floor in my garage in about a 1/2 hour. You gonna need a good bit more. I'd look to cl and get a used gas powered one.

Oh get solar panels for the roof. I'm running them powering my grow sell excess back to utility no electric bill and get a paycheck 1x a year it's called net metering.

It's a beauty eh?

 

[Tead]

I use both....not sure that I have a preference.

I tried many different sizes and had tipping problems in them all.
Sounds like you've got plenty of experience with them.... how do you deal with tipping issues?

Thanks for the cleaning tips... they've been hanging around in a pile all dirty for many moons now. I'll try the vinegar and stuff them in a drawer somewhere when they're clean.