I want to lollipop outside one summer. Just cannot get it right inside with the height restriction. The sunlight coverage on the sides is so much better than indoor light bouncing off of a tent wall.
Questions for expert outdoor growers
- Thread starter Gidorah
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And the movement of the sun lets direct light get to branches that would be shaded using a stationary light source. Not to mention the intensity.
Yep. We could not afford the electric bill if our LED lights came close to what the sun gives us, even on an overcast day
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- #44
Gidorah
Well-Known Member
Dang Emeraldo, that is a tall plant. Thanks for the info about starting seeds and daylight. I think I will start germination in late April and transplant into direct soil. I have clay soil and asked @Gee64 for some advice so it's all brewing and getting ready for planting time in May. As always, thanks for sharing your thoughts.@Gidorah if you germinate indoors you can start earlier, of course, even in mid March. You have a nice long growing season in SoCal. If you do germinate indoors, take care to give the plants light only about as long as the daylight is outside, or else the plants can go into flowering in May when you put them out. For example, if you give light 18/6 for their first 6 weeks then plant them outside when the day length is only 14 hours, they'll flower. They'll eventually re-veg, but this might be a source of stress. In 2020 I grew in the San Joaquin Valley in California, about 300 miles to your north, on my balcony. I sprayed neem oil to keep the whiteflies away (in July they settle on the highest buds and lay their eggs). As you walk through your garden, shake or touch the mainstem and you may see them flutter. They are the worst, because the caterpillars form inside the bud and destroy it from within.
Needless to say, my Acapulco Gold was not topped at all. Topless, au naturel as you say,I let her get as tall as she could in 15 gallons of super soil. She was germinated indoors on March 13, left outside at night beginning in late April, grew to about 8 feet tall, and harvested late September. Will you grow your plants in pots or plant them straight into the Earth? You'll get a tree!
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- #45
Gidorah
Well-Known Member
Thank you everybody! Love the conversation and thoughts. Here is the loose plan based on everything I've learned from you all. Germ seeds in late April in full sun, transplant begining of May into the ground, will top and maybe train until June, then let it grow, watch for moths and white flies, buy some BT spray, harvest I'm guessing in Sept or Oct. Wow, potential for monster plants! Gonna plant Sirius Black, Trainwreck and a GMO Cookies. Will revisit this post and update as we go, kind of a non-grow journal. Please feel free to stop in and throw around ideas and thoughts. Thanks again to everybody!
Emeraldo
Well-Known Member
Darn it, @Gidorah -- and sorry to keep providing unsolicited "advice" -- but clay? Now hear this: cannabis does NOT grow well in clay soil. Clay does not allow water to drain well, and oxygen does not reach the roots. There are ways to solve this issue, such as working a lot of gypsum and perlite and lime into the top 3 feet of your soil and waiting a year or two. Soil adjustment takes a lot of work and patience, especially with clay. Maybe @Gee64 has a great solution there but it will be a lot of heavy work. To keep this short, I would just say "don't even try to grow in that soil". You're flirting with disappointment and disaster. Get some nice big 15 or 25 gallon fabric pots and mix up your own super rich and nutritious soil or buy a lot of Foxfarm Ocean Floor or other tried and true commercial growing soil. Cannabis loves aeration at the roots. 'Nuff said. Cheers
PS growing in pots will also allow you to move the plants easily into a shady spot on a 110+ F day in summer, which you will almost certainly need to do where you are. Cannabis thrives at 75 - 85 F and doesn't like the heat. My unsolicited advice would be pick a spot with morning sun but shade in the hottest part of the day. 'Nuff-nuff.
Gee64
Well-Known Member
I wouldnt say what I said was a solution, but rather a start. If your soil is heavy clay you have to start somewheres, and it will take a few years. Calcium and organic matter will fix it eventually.
- Thread starter
- #48
Gidorah
Well-Known Member
Thanks Emeraldo, this is the reason why I ask these questions and please don't ever feel like its unsolicited advice, I am asking for it! This is my first season trying an outdoor grow and if I can learn from you and everyone else willing to share their experiences, then my learning curve will be that much faster. I understand the clay part, have killed many a fruit trees and ornamental. I have 2 large raised beds sitting on clay that I will fill up with the good stuff. Thank you again for your insight, looking back, ishould've started out with my soil is clay in the first post.
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- #49
Gidorah
Well-Known Member
Gee, you have inspired me to make my soil better so i thank you for the advice you gave me earlier. I am a patient man and know that it will take time but I also love a good experiment. Maybe in a year or three, I might be able to plant in the ground.
Gee64
Well-Known Member
I think its worth the effort. Every time you grow something out of the soil you are cycling the soil, and every cycle it will get better as you keep ammending it.
It takes a few seasons outdoors so its never too soon to start. You should grow as much as you can from it every year, even if you only grow compost, and keep adding the good.
Every harvest takes a lot of the good out, but it also takes the bad out so it constantly gets better.
Patience
Weed cycles soil really well. Look at how big it can get in one season. That takes a lot of the bad out quickly. Its a good reclamation plant. Makes great compost for next year too.
It does depend on whether it is heavy clay like you mention. When I moved here 10 years ago the first thing I discovered was that clay soils can grow better than the sandy loam I had become used to growing in. It is kinda like mineral soil dust without sand or very tiny pieces of stone or organic matter. It seems like this area is sitting on large layers of clay dust left behind when the last of the glaciers receded 12,000 years ago.
Just about any clay can be worked with over time and the addition of organic material. Everything can be used from grass clippings to leaves to sticks to dead flowers. I might even start adding a bit of calcium this year just so I can see if I can get even bigger plants in the vegetable and flower gardens.
Around here spring can be frustrating because the winter melt and spring rains means the clay soil is saturated so it sticks to everything. The heat and dry spells in the summer means I should expect the clay to get as hard as concrete. But, lordy lordy, can this clay soil grow plants.
Emeraldo
Well-Known Member
@Gidorah to find out what amendments are needed, you need to have a test done. University of California Extension Service can do a soil analysis for you. That would be a solid way to get started on improving your soil. Find out what you have first, then figure out what you need to improve it. Their website states there is free advice on their hotline. Might be worth looking into!
You can check them out here: https://www.sandiegocounty.gov/content/sdc/fha.html#:~:text=UCCE (formerly the Farm and,the County of San Diego.
Alternatively, with or without testing, you could just dig a 3'x3'x3' hole for each plant and fill it in with soil known to be good for weed, or mix in the organic amendments others have recommended.
By the way, Jose Cervantes wrote a very good book available in a Kindle version "Marijuana Outdoors" that lays out lots of information on soil improvement and just growing outdoors generally. There is a chapter on clay soil with info on various kinds of clay soil. Conclusion: "Digging big yard square planting holes and adding much organic matter and good soil is the quickest way to improve heavy clay soils." Lots of tips and tricks in this book, it was an eye-opener for me even after years of growing outdoors. Cervantes' information is excellent. For $9.99 on amazon, worth every $0.01.
Good luck with your project, I wish you all the best and hope you'll post on 420 about your grow.
Emeraldo
You can check them out here: https://www.sandiegocounty.gov/content/sdc/fha.html#:~:text=UCCE (formerly the Farm and,the County of San Diego.
Alternatively, with or without testing, you could just dig a 3'x3'x3' hole for each plant and fill it in with soil known to be good for weed, or mix in the organic amendments others have recommended.
By the way, Jose Cervantes wrote a very good book available in a Kindle version "Marijuana Outdoors" that lays out lots of information on soil improvement and just growing outdoors generally. There is a chapter on clay soil with info on various kinds of clay soil. Conclusion: "Digging big yard square planting holes and adding much organic matter and good soil is the quickest way to improve heavy clay soils." Lots of tips and tricks in this book, it was an eye-opener for me even after years of growing outdoors. Cervantes' information is excellent. For $9.99 on amazon, worth every $0.01.
Good luck with your project, I wish you all the best and hope you'll post on 420 about your grow.
Emeraldo
- Thread starter
- #53
Gidorah
Well-Known Member
Thanks again Emeraldo! I really do appreciate the info. Definitely gotta read that book.
Hombre del Monte
Well-Known Member
Golden Tiger (Sativa) grown outside. Topped and supercropped.
Horse shit, worm castings and a little homemade compost.
In the photo I've already harvested about a1/4 off the plant.
Horse shit, worm castings and a little homemade compost.
In the photo I've already harvested about a1/4 off the plant.
zigzagman1960
Well-Known Member
@Gidorah in so cal—you know you can go to your dispensary and grab a couple clones right now and plant them outside. I live in NorCal and start seeds in the window while it’s still cold. Today we have a high of 68 and they’re outside and will be brought in tonight. There done on May 15.
Plants will stay short and start flowering right away—You have till May 15 to flower so you can get a little experience and have some stash while you get your summer crop Underway.
I top the crap outa my outdoor grow and trim ALL small branches and undergrowth. Long colas only! These examples are summer outdoor—not the little outdoor winter stuff.
to hit on one of your questions—you can get summer outdoor stared outside by april 15–they’ll get huge though so if space is an issue start em later—all the way to mid June.
Plants will stay short and start flowering right away—You have till May 15 to flower so you can get a little experience and have some stash while you get your summer crop Underway.
I top the crap outa my outdoor grow and trim ALL small branches and undergrowth. Long colas only! These examples are summer outdoor—not the little outdoor winter stuff.
to hit on one of your questions—you can get summer outdoor stared outside by april 15–they’ll get huge though so if space is an issue start em later—all the way to mid June.
- Thread starter
- #56
Gidorah
Well-Known Member
Hey Hombre, that's one plant? She's a beauty, a one in a million girl. Sorry, like my 80s music. So many buds! What kind of soil do you have?Golden Tiger (Sativa) grown outside. Topped and supercropped.
Horse shit, worm castings and a little homemade compost.
In the photo I've already harvested about a1/4 off the plant.
- Thread starter
- #57
Gidorah
Well-Known Member
Thanks Zig! I got a couple in the tent to get me by, great idea though. The only dispenseries I have been in were up in Humbolt, never been to a San Diego one. Would be fun to see what kind of clones they have.@Gidorah in so cal—you know you can go to your dispensary and grab a couple clones right now and plant them outside. I live in NorCal and start seeds in the window while it’s still cold. Today we have a high of 68 and they’re outside and will be brought in tonight. There done on May 15.
Plants will stay short and start flowering right away—You have till May 15 to flower so you can get a little experience and have some stash while you get your summer crop Underway.
I top the crap outa my outdoor grow and trim ALL small branches and undergrowth. Long colas only! These examples are summer outdoor—not the little outdoor winter stuff.
to hit on one of your questions—you can get summer outdoor stared outside by april 15–they’ll get huge though so if space is an issue start em later—all the way to mid June.
Your grows are huge! Topping and clearing leaves are tent tactics that I use, to do the same outdoors with lots of room would be crazy! If I get 1/4 of what you show in the pics, I will be a happy man. Thanks for sharing.
Hombre del Monte
Well-Known Member
Hi @Gidorah , yes that's one plant.
For almost 30 I grow indoors and when I moved to Spain I adapted scrog techniques to keep the height down.
My soil is crap. Very stoney with not much nutrition at all. I just keep adding horse shit, hay and homemade compost. Last year I used no bottled nutrients right until almost the end of flowering, when I used A little BAC organic PK.
For almost 30 I grow indoors and when I moved to Spain I adapted scrog techniques to keep the height down.
My soil is crap. Very stoney with not much nutrition at all. I just keep adding horse shit, hay and homemade compost. Last year I used no bottled nutrients right until almost the end of flowering, when I used A little BAC organic PK.
- Thread starter
- #59
Gidorah
Well-Known Member
Once again, thanks for everybody's advice. As promised, here is an update on things. As suggested, i bought some BT spray, haven't used it yet as i see no bugs. Will use it when it goes into flower. Also, big difference in soils as the pics below will show. Best grower and moisture retaining plant is the Sirius in Fox Farms. Second is the Trainwreck in old dirt, requires more water and shows signs of wilting a day or so before the Fox Farms. I have a plant in native clay that has been ammeded and its the smallest and stunted. I guess things are growing as expected. Next summer grow will all be Fox Farms.
First pic is a Trainwreck, sativa dominant strain that is growing in old dirt. Doing ok.
Second pic is Sirius Black growing in Fox Farms, doing much better. Sirius is a indica dominant strain. Both plants were topped around 8th node.
First pic is a Trainwreck, sativa dominant strain that is growing in old dirt. Doing ok.
As a grower in So. Cal. I can tell you that done correctly you can grow just about anything unlike people in other parts of the country. I have grown Malawi for 22 weeks and it would have gone longer. I know someone that grew old school Thai, Durban Poison outside and finished flowering.
Topping will give you more branches which means more tops. I saw pictures of a Cherry Bomb (Mr. Greengenes) that was about 5-6 foot high but had been topped and looked to be 8 feet wide. They harvested 5 lb from that plant.
Topping will give you more branches which means more tops. I saw pictures of a Cherry Bomb (Mr. Greengenes) that was about 5-6 foot high but had been topped and looked to be 8 feet wide. They harvested 5 lb from that plant.