Questions for expert outdoor growers

[Gidorah]

There just came in today. 3 Sirius Black and 3 old school Trainwreck. This will be the outdoor grow, now I just gotta wait til .arch to germinate. Radio silence until then, be back when it's germination time. Thanks to everybody for sharing their experience and helping out a rookie.

 

[Phytoplankton]

Spring equinox is March 21st, ok to plant in April or May?

I'm just a little North of @BeezLuiz, and echo his advice, outdoors, mid-May at the earliest. I had the same problem with tiny plants going into flower when I put them out in late April. Some re-vegged, others just flowered and faded away. You've got a huge grow period in SOCal.

 

[Gidorah]

I'm just a little North of @BeezLuiz, and echo his advice, outdoors, mid-May at the earliest. I had the same problem with tiny plants going into flower when I put them out in late April. Some re-vegged, others just flowered and faded away. You've got a huge grow period in SOCal.

Thanks Phyto, i appreciate the advice. Saves me a lot of potential heartache, glad I asked. Mid May it is. Gonna set up my calendar to make sure I have plants ready.

 

[Lerugged]

I'm in Cape town. Similar climate I think to you. We grow grapes here too.
Long season. We have great sun but lots of heavy winds at times. I like to FIM after 10 nodes and strap everything down super low and of the wind. Not for stealth. Get up to 800g from wine barrels.
Other than that, I grow organic and with really rich soil and mostly just water.
tons of ways to roll a fatty so just got to find what works or you.
Yeild in my humble opinion is better when topped and all the branches are pulled down into a canopy just like indoors but waaaaay bigger.
Good luck with your grow .
I'll leave this for you

will keep an eve. Love me some outdoors sun grown vibes

 

[BeezLuiz]

Also, a word of caution once your plants get into flowering outdoors: When you can smell the buds flowering, the moths can also smell them, and begin laying their eggs. You will likely get caterpillars. If left unchecked, they will decimate your plant. Either build netting around them,

20211020_134451.jpg

• BeezLuiz
• Oct 20, 2021

Granddaddy Purple sheltered from the coming storm.

or spray weekly with BT.

20200718_091502.jpg

• BeezLuiz
• Jul 18, 2020

BT

 

[Gidorah]

I'm in Cape town. Similar climate I think to you. We grow grapes here too.
Long season. We have great sun but lots of heavy winds at times. I like to FIM after 10 nodes and strap everything down super low and of the wind. Not for stealth. Get up to 800g from wine barrels.
Other than that, I grow organic and with really rich soil and mostly just water.
tons of ways to roll a fatty so just got to find what works or you.
Yeild in my humble opinion is better when topped and all the branches are pulled down into a canopy just like indoors but waaaaay bigger.
Good luck with your grow .
I'll leave this for you

will keep an eve. Love me some outdoors sun grown vibes

Hey Lerugged, love that setup with the wine barrels and pvc pipe and it rolls! Thanks for the knowledge, seems like we can do whatever we like in regards to training, I like your style. I read a book that there are 16 areas around the world that have a Mediterranean climate and I think you are correct, we share the same climate. Thanks for helping me out.

 

[Gidorah]

Also, a word of caution once your plants get into flowering outdoors: When you can smell the buds flowering, the moths can also smell them, and begin laying their eggs. You will likely get caterpillars. If left unchecked, they will decimate your plant. Either build netting around them,

20211020_134451.jpg

• BeezLuiz
• Oct 20, 2021

Granddaddy Purple sheltered from the coming storm.

or spray weekly with BT.

20200718_091502.jpg

• BeezLuiz
• Jul 18, 2020

BT

Beez, I think you just saved me a ton of disappointment. I didn't even realize moths could be a problem! Thank you immensely. Will go buy some of that stuff next time I'm out.

 

[Emeraldo]

@Gidorah if you germinate indoors you can start earlier, of course, even in mid March. You have a nice long growing season in SoCal. If you do germinate indoors, take care to give the plants light only about as long as the daylight is outside, or else the plants can go into flowering in May when you put them out. For example, if you give light 18/6 for their first 6 weeks then plant them outside when the day length is only 14 hours, they'll flower. They'll eventually re-veg, but this might be a source of stress. In 2020 I grew in the San Joaquin Valley in California, about 300 miles to your north, on my balcony. I sprayed neem oil to keep the whiteflies away (in July they settle on the highest buds and lay their eggs). As you walk through your garden, shake or touch the mainstem and you may see them flutter. They are the worst, because the caterpillars form inside the bud and destroy it from within.

Needless to say, my Acapulco Gold was not topped at all. Topless, au naturel as you say, I let her get as tall as she could in 15 gallons of super soil. She was germinated indoors on March 13, left outside at night beginning in late April, grew to about 8 feet tall, and harvested late September. Will you grow your plants in pots or plant them straight into the Earth? You'll get a tree!

IMG_2098.jpeg

• Emeraldo
• Aug 10, 2020

Acapulco Gold, Aug 10

 

[SmokingWings]

... is yield better topped than untopped? somebody should start a survey there. you know, it could be the yield is going to be the same, topped or not.

Don't know if a survey was ever done but the topic of whether there is a difference in yield has come up on occasion. If I am remembering right if someone grows two identical plants under identical conditions then the harvest should be pretty much the same whether it was topped or not topped. Maybe a slight edge to the plant that was topped since there are now at least two dominant growing tips. The usual minor growing tips along the sides of the plants should be similar on the two plants.

In theory, if the plant will grow a main dominant tip that is 24" inches and the grower tops the plant early enough they should get 2 dominant tips of 12". Top those two at the right time and they should have 4 dominant tips of about 6" each. This sort of topping comes in handy for the outdoor growers who want their plant to stay shorter than their privacy fence.

I have not experimented with my indoor plants enough but I have the feeling that too much topping ends up having an effect on how large the buds get. In the end I have the same weight but if the plant was topped to many times I end up with more buds but they are smaller and sometimes a bit less dense.

 

[Emeraldo]

Don't know if a survey was ever done but the topic of whether there is a difference in yield has come up on occasion. If I am remembering right if someone grows two identical plants under identical conditions then the harvest should be pretty much the same whether it was topped or not topped. Maybe a slight edge to the plant that was topped since there are now at least two dominant growing tips. The usual minor growing tips along the sides of the plants should be similar on the two plants.

@SmokingWings you've eloquently summarised my own topping experience. After topping, the central apical bud is diminished, and surrounding upper and side branch buds become equally prominent. Doesn't necessarily mean more weed, it's just re-apportioned. There seems to be a mathematical proportion at work, the number of buds is multiplied by 2 with each topping, but the size of the buds is divided by number of buds. The growth hormones are distributed differently than on an untopped plant. I mentioned a "survey" half jokingly, but maybe it would be interesting.

 

[Melville Hobbes]

Hi everybody, first outdoor grow coming this spring. Live in a Mediterranean climate in Southern California. Got a few questions.

Does anyone top or train their outdoor grow?
Spring equinox is March 21st, ok to plant in April or May?
Is the quality of bud different than tent grown?
I use Geoflora indoors, anyone use it outdoors?
Any nutrient recommendations?

Thanks in advance, while I know my way around a tent, I don't know much about outdoor growing and am excited to try it. Bought seeds that are known to like a Mediterranean climate.

Different climate here, Southern Ontario is classed as a Continental climate, but yes, I top and LST my outdoor grows.
I start my plants indoors between early March and mid-April under 15 hours of light since that's how many hours of light we're getting late May when it's definitely safe to move my plants outdoors here (although that date has been moving to mid-May over the years).
I would say the bud looks less frosty, but tastes better and is a bit stronger than indoors, although that might just be down to having less experience growing indoors.
Can't get geoflora here, so I can't help you there. I use MC on plants in pots and let the plants in the ground fend for themselves.

As far as yield is concerned, I don't know how much it might be affected by topping, but I think any affect it might have is probably offset by letting them recover longer before going into flower.

In theory, if the plant will grow a main dominant tip that is 24" inches and the grower tops the plant early enough they should get 2 dominant tips of 12". Top those two at the right time and they should have 4 dominant tips of about 6" each. This sort of topping comes in handy for the outdoor growers who want their plant to stay shorter than their privacy fence.

Can't say I agree with this. I had some near two foot colas on my topped Jack the Ripper this summer, and while I would love to think they could've been 4' on an untopped plant, I don't think that's possible.
Here's a pic from my summer grow. The ruler in the pic is 60cm/24 inches.

 

[bluter]

topping alone won't change the weight but it will redistribute it. topping with a training regime will increase production but is not always relevant outdoor.

 

[Joe Brewster]

Hi everybody, first outdoor grow coming this spring. Live in a Mediterranean climate in Southern California. Got a few questions.

Does anyone top or train their outdoor grow?
Spring equinox is March 21st, ok to plant in April or May?
Is the quality of bud different than tent grown?
I use Geoflora indoors, anyone use it outdoors?
Any nutrient recommendations?

Thanks in advance, while I know my way around a tent, I don't know much about outdoor growing and am excited to try it. Bought seeds that are known to like a Mediterranean climate.

Had to, these Autos are too tall to grow in the city.
Plant in ground, compost, bone & blood meal. A bit of bud boom in bloom

SuperStinky by Short Stuff

• Joe Brewster
• Sep 5, 2019

My first outdoor grow & First Auto

IMG_1863.JPG

• Joe Brewster
• Sep 1, 2020
• 1

Super Stinky got stolen before I could harvest

 

[SmokingWings]

Can't say I agree with this. I had some near two foot colas on my topped Jack the Ripper this summer, and while I would love to think they could've been 4' on an untopped plant, I don't think that's possible.

Nice stretch on that growing tip.

A number of growers tell us that we should plan on a plant stretching enough in the first several weeks of flowering that the plant can double in size.

Not saying that the entire stretch will be packed with buds but it will be part of what I am calling a growing tip. Below that section that is packed with buds there still is more of the stem that is producing but the numbers are dropping off.

And even further below that, the plant has grown additional stems that are branching off to the sides. All of these are receiving flowering hormones and have to have some affect.

As far as yield is concerned, I don't know how much it might be affected by topping, but I think any affect it might have is probably offset by letting them recover longer before going into flower.

That is a bit of a problem. Outdoors means that the plant has be be topped in time to allow for any recovering. Indoors not as much to worry about since the grower can hold a plant back for a couple of days or weeks or longer.

I am thinking about some of those nicely lollipop plants that have a ball of buds at the top that is about 3 feet across. Some of which seem to have colas that are about 2 or 3 inches but it always looks like there are a 100 or more of them .

 

[greenjeans]

When you can smell the buds flowering, the moths can also smell them, and begin laying their eggs.

Damn, something else I never knew and now will worry about!!!!!!! Thanx a lot Beez!!!!
I am way North of you - around the 45th - I actually don't drop seeds until June 1st - but only because I want to keep the plants smaller and I can move them into the greenhouse in the fall. I use wheeled tubs and quadline them.

 

[greenjeans]

Here's a pic from my summer grow.

Jeepers Mel, if I saw a tomato in there I'd have sworn we shared a garden!!!

 

[greenjeans]

these Autos are too tall to grow in the city.

Just itching to get some beans in cups - gonna try turning one and getting feminized seeds!!!!

 

[Joe Brewster]

Also, a word of caution once your plants get into flowering outdoors: When you can smell the buds flowering, the moths can also smell them, and begin laying their eggs. You will likely get caterpillars. If left unchecked, they will decimate your plant. Either build netting around them,

Damn, something else I never knew and now will worry about!!!!!!!

Watch out for any of these moths. the caterpillars can get as big as your finger.
It's called a hawk moth big as a humming bird

 

[greenjeans]

Watch out for any of these

It's always the pretty ones, isn't it!!!

 

[Melville Hobbes]

Nice stretch on that growing tip.

A number of growers tell us that we should plan on a plant stretching enough in the first several weeks of flowering that the plant can double in size.

Not saying that the entire stretch will be packed with buds but it will be part of what I am calling a growing tip. Below that section that is packed with buds there still is more of the stem that is producing but the numbers are dropping off.

And even further below that, the plant has grown additional stems that are branching off to the sides. All of these are receiving flowering hormones and have to have some affect.

She did stretch quite a bit, got to almost 6 feet including the pot. I'm just saying I had 4 of those colas and the lower buds on one plant, where I would only have had one on an untopped plant.

That is a bit of a problem. Outdoors means that the plant has be be topped in time to allow for any recovering. Indoors not as much to worry about since the grower can hold a plant back for a couple of days or weeks or longer.

I stop topping as soon as I have as many main tips as I want. After that it's just canopy management.
Starting the plants early indoors means I'm done topping early enough that they have plenty of time to veg and recover outdoors.
Given the climate the OP will be growing in they could be done topping by mid June which gives them plenty of time to recover and continue vegging to get longer stems for the stretch.

I am thinking about some of those nicely lollipop plants that have a ball of buds at the top that is about 3 feet across. Some of which seem to have colas that are about 2 or 3 inches but it always looks like there are a 100 or more of them .

I see where you're coming from on this. I haven't done much lollipopping in my outdoor grows so those smaller lower buds are usually still there.