What do the top of the plant look like. I’m guessing it’s Fasciation.
Post Your Polyploids
- Thread starter MyDogSpot
- Start date
The rest of my plant is developing normally. It does not have the fasciation mutation that this thread is entirely composed of.
From my understanding you lose additional genes as the plants continue to develop. That's why when i topped it it only shot out three additional branches.
Have you seen this mutation before? Looking through the thread I can only find Fasciation and possibly what could be a triploid with 3 branches per node. Out of the hundreds of photos in this thread I believe only mine and one other is a true polyploid.
This is why you have to tissue sample to actually know if tissue is polyploidal, because not all tissue on a polyploid plant is polyploid. At least right now, I believe the goal is to produce off spring of two tetraploids tissues.
If this is the case, I imagine you're in a very tight time window where you have to breed two extremely rare plants with each other before they have a chance to grow out of tetraploidism. This means having male and female tetraploid's, triggering flowering and pollination with only a couple weeks of veg.
It's understandable how difficult an undertaking this would be and it makes sense why you question whether or not it can even REoccur naturally, ie pass on the hereditary trait rather than a random mutation.
If this is the case, I imagine you're in a very tight time window where you have to breed two extremely rare plants with each other before they have a chance to grow out of tetraploidism. This means having male and female tetraploid's, triggering flowering and pollination with only a couple weeks of veg.
It's understandable how difficult an undertaking this would be and it makes sense why you question whether or not it can even REoccur naturally, ie pass on the hereditary trait rather than a random mutation.
If you look at the book by Billy Buds, offspring from Polyploidal parents are normal.
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I'll add it to my list of reading material.
I'm still skeptical though, Just because this Billy Buds fellow was unable to achieve the results, doesn't conclude that It can't be done.
If there is an actual scientific explanation for why the cannabis genome doesn't support this type of speciation, I'd love to hear it so i can put to rest any idea's of this.
Would there be any difference between a naturally occurring polyploid versus one induced via colchiline?
Polyploidy in cannabis isn’t known outside of a lab
According to Billy Budds website.
Famous Tetraploids:
- UBC Chemo
- OG Kush
- Master Kush
- Pink Kush
- Acapulco Gold (suspected polyploid, long gone)
Am i just interpreting that last line how I want to? Or does even Bill think there are and have been natural poly's kicking around?
Also just an observation, Acapulco Gold, Swazi Gold, and Zambezi Gold (what my tetraploid is) are all land race sativa's that would have had a tremendous range of pollen donors, which i might be simplifying and stretching to a conclusion, but it would make sense to me that uncontrollable cross polination, inbreeding, etc could easily result in a far greater likelihood for these mutations to occur on a regular enough basis.
I managed to find Billy's email, sent him a pic and asked the man himself what I'm looking at.
All photos I’ve seen of polyploid plants are showing fasciation.
Can you provide a picture of a "lab" polyploid? Have you seen one to know what to look for?
Thank you by the way, you pointing out the whole fasciation thing cleared up alot of confusion for me. Kinda messed up that my first google result when searching "polyploidism" is a picture of fasciation linking to a blog post about polyploidism where the author is mass misinforming people who then come to their thread to post what they think is polyploidism.
However, as i said my plant has no fasciation what so ever. So either my mutation is something else entirely or I actually have this extremely rare phenomena happening in my tent.
I believe the only other picture I saw of a poly in this entire 300 post thread is the guy who posted a 3 branch/node plant at the top of this page, post Tuesday.
Thank you by the way, you pointing out the whole fasciation thing cleared up alot of confusion for me. Kinda messed up that my first google result when searching "polyploidism" is a picture of fasciation linking to a blog post about polyploidism where the author is mass misinforming people who then come to their thread to post what they think is polyploidism.
However, as i said my plant has no fasciation what so ever. So either my mutation is something else entirely or I actually have this extremely rare phenomena happening in my tent.
I believe the only other picture I saw of a poly in this entire 300 post thread is the guy who posted a 3 branch/node plant at the top of this page, post Tuesday.
The trait that produces 3 or 4 branches per node is a mutation called Whorled Phyllotaxy.
More from Billy Budds
Diploid and Tetraploid crosses produce Triploids that are infertile due to chromosome mismatch. These are known as "Terminator Seeds" (e.g. Diablos Pink Kush) as customers must buy seeds for each crop due to infertility. The resulting generations of seeds will be diploid. Triploids can be treated again, with Colchicine, to create a Hexaploid. This can be then crossed with a tetraploid or diploid to produce tetraploid plants again. I believe that Warmke was wrong about triploids and Sam the Skunkman thinks that they are not sterile.
How To Identify Polyploids:
You can identify a polyploid be mere physical appearance and no need to examine the chromosones. Most people have never grown or smoked these real legendary plants. The gangters rap about OG Kush because they had the money to buy this extremely rare connoisseur product. Most product out there is just "wangsta OG".
- Polyploid Traits:
- Ducksfoot
- Four sets of leaves at the nodes
- Stretched (doubled) flowers
- Dark green leaves
- Double bud sites
- Heavy feeder
- High water consumption
- Thick meristem
- Pistil discoloration (pink pistils under black light)
- Extreme potency
- Crooked looking plant providing a Bonsai appearance
- Larger stomata
- Thicker leaves
I'm not so sure it's Whorled Phyllotaxy either. I don't have any leaf mutations, which is what basically defines whorled phyllotaxy. For one thing, they're not Whorled - they're proper opposite alternate spirals. That being said it is confined to the main stem,
It’s a debate that’s been going on for years.
ducknaldo
420 Member
I have a polyploid Ducksfoot (non-auto) growing right now. Grown from Dutch Passion fem seed.
The stem is huge, flat, wide and has distinct stripes.
Leaf growth is extreme.
It split by itself into 3 main stems. Maybe to accomodate the extra leaf growth?
It has never shown the Duckfoot traits with webbed leaves.
I just took a clone of it.
I plan to keep this and clone as many as I can to experiment with.
The stem is huge, flat, wide and has distinct stripes.
Leaf growth is extreme.
It split by itself into 3 main stems. Maybe to accomodate the extra leaf growth?
It has never shown the Duckfoot traits with webbed leaves.
I just took a clone of it.
I plan to keep this and clone as many as I can to experiment with.
mrking
Well-Known Member
Here is my polyploid from a high CBD Harlequin plant I am growing outdoors.
Cool mutation
@ducknaldo looks like celery!
@Pennywise I don't think people are picking up that these are not polyploids
here's 2 trifoliates that i just found in seeds. 1 is from Red Lazerlite2 and the other is VitalityF3....
@Pennywise I don't think people are picking up that these are not polyploids
here's 2 trifoliates that i just found in seeds. 1 is from Red Lazerlite2 and the other is VitalityF3....
That's a polyploid? I have one of those going now. The one on the right is what the rest of them are shaping up to look like.Here is my polyploid from a high CBD Harlequin plant I am growing outdoors.
I know, still a lot of talk about polyploidy but the only place cannabis has shown polyploidy is in a laboratory. It’s caused by applying the chemical Colchicine. It’s not passed on to offspring. Monsanto has Colchicine treated corn seed that they push. Farmers can’t make their own corn seed and have to buy it from Monsanto every year.
The Mutation you see is called Fasciation.