- Thread starter
- #61
That's very kind of you to say that, Mr Spitz. Thank you. Glad you're here- welcome. I checked out your journal, it looks like a lot of fun. I'll read it all the way through first chance I get.
Oh No - It's A Green Hole! - Reverse Thrusters! - Dammit - Too Late!
- Thread starter Weaselcracker
- Start date
That's very kind of you to say that, Mr Spitz. Thank you. Glad you're here- welcome. I checked out your journal, it looks like a lot of fun. I'll read it all the way through first chance I get.
The journal makes you accountable... Ha! Love it. I agree completely with that statement. I Don't suspect heat with the temps you described. I had always heard "Led plants require more CaMg". I therefore added CaMg at 5 tsp/gal according to the instructions at every "non feed" watering. About week 5... BOOOM! Curled tacoed leaves that got brown and crispy at the ends. It might be different than yours. I'll try and post a pic in a bit. It's no single deficiency, and I got the exact same thing on 2 plants (different strains). That's my current research project. It was a weird one but I'm convinced it was too much Ca. I had OF soil, CaMg additive, and feeding with GH 3 part with CaMg in the micro (which I used more of as I didn't really use the grow). Anyway.. Just my $0.02. Rgds
- Thread starter
- #63
It's something that's in my mind too Spitz, as one of my second-pick explanations. There are always the main culprits - nutes, ph, temps - but for every problem I have dozens (hundreds? thousands? Ha ha) of less likely possibilities stashed away in the back of my head ready to pull out. In the meantime everything swirls around in my head creating an interesting foggy effect, which I try to peer through. I'd haul out my Undersandascope if I could find it. (Where did I put that damn thing!? I think I lost it some time in late childhood. Hope to get it back ASAP...).
I recently started using CalMag+ (A new version of CalMag) whatever it is... It's just all I could get at the time. I vaguely heard someone somewhere say they had some issues with it so I've used it at 3ml instead of five.
I think I'll cut back on it more, and cut out using it for the older plants
I recently started using CalMag+ (A new version of CalMag) whatever it is... It's just all I could get at the time. I vaguely heard someone somewhere say they had some issues with it so I've used it at 3ml instead of five.
I think I'll cut back on it more, and cut out using it for the older plants
TheRoach
Well-Known Member
That may be occasioned by salt built up in the roots too. Might as well be a combination of multiple factors heat/humidity /salt built up. I don't have that much experience in soil but based on my research on the matter (because my Aurora Indica plants sometimes get curled leaves) root problems account for a moderate percentage of those ailments we can't pinpoint precisely. Maybe checking the root area may give you some insight. I've read one should look for dry pockets.
I hope you find the solution for that tacoing soon my friend. I follow your grow closely, but haven't posted a lot since my internet connection is very poor. After this coming it should be much better.
Regards!
I hope you find the solution for that tacoing soon my friend. I follow your grow closely, but haven't posted a lot since my internet connection is very poor. After this coming it should be much better.
Regards!
Nice journal! Been a good read so far. Keep it up, ill be interested to see whats causing this tacoing.
OldMedUser
Formerly Known as LabRat
I've been perusing Jorge Cervante's web site looking into your plant's conditions and it basically confirms what I figured it was.
Toxic salts build up coupled with heat stress. Here's a quote from the section about it.
"Cupped leaves are a good sign it's time to flush out containers with 3 - 4 times the volume of the container with water. The flush will wash away the built up salts in the soil."
The buggers have set the site up so you can't copy/paste text from it or right click and save pictures either. Damn!
Just because your grow room temps aren't that high doesn't mean that heat stress isn't involved either. The radiant light from the grow lights can cause the internal temp of the leaves to to get high enough with the extra salts to burn like what you have even tho it doesn't feel all that warm at the canopy level.
The pot is still going to be good but a good flush will make it better.
Adding extra calmag is just adding more salts too and likely making the problem worse. LED lighting doesn't call for any more calmag than HID or CFL lighting needs. Pure water like RO or distilled or rainwater, as it is distilled water too, need extra calmag because they contain no minerals on their own like tap or well water does.
Almost everything plants eat is in the form of salts. Bacteria in the soil convert organic matter into salts the plants can eat and that's why soil mixes are "cooked" to give the bugs time to make the salts and enrich the soil. Hydro nutes are just those same salts in a pre-made form that the plants can use immediately without the bacteria to prepare them and not "chemicals" in the way that pesticides or herbicides are chemicals. Organic nutes do give pot more nuances in taste and smell but properly grown hydro pot still has all the medicinal properties of organically grown pot but most often more of it. Hydro nutes can also be used along with organic soil grows and does not destroy the micro-herd like many fervent organic growers believe. High quality hydro nutes like the ones AN makes also contain a lot of amino acids and chelated minerals that by antiquated labeling laws to do with plant nutrients they are forbidden to put on the labels.
L8r
Toxic salts build up coupled with heat stress. Here's a quote from the section about it.
"Cupped leaves are a good sign it's time to flush out containers with 3 - 4 times the volume of the container with water. The flush will wash away the built up salts in the soil."
The buggers have set the site up so you can't copy/paste text from it or right click and save pictures either. Damn!
Just because your grow room temps aren't that high doesn't mean that heat stress isn't involved either. The radiant light from the grow lights can cause the internal temp of the leaves to to get high enough with the extra salts to burn like what you have even tho it doesn't feel all that warm at the canopy level.
The pot is still going to be good but a good flush will make it better.
Adding extra calmag is just adding more salts too and likely making the problem worse. LED lighting doesn't call for any more calmag than HID or CFL lighting needs. Pure water like RO or distilled or rainwater, as it is distilled water too, need extra calmag because they contain no minerals on their own like tap or well water does.
Almost everything plants eat is in the form of salts. Bacteria in the soil convert organic matter into salts the plants can eat and that's why soil mixes are "cooked" to give the bugs time to make the salts and enrich the soil. Hydro nutes are just those same salts in a pre-made form that the plants can use immediately without the bacteria to prepare them and not "chemicals" in the way that pesticides or herbicides are chemicals. Organic nutes do give pot more nuances in taste and smell but properly grown hydro pot still has all the medicinal properties of organically grown pot but most often more of it. Hydro nutes can also be used along with organic soil grows and does not destroy the micro-herd like many fervent organic growers believe. High quality hydro nutes like the ones AN makes also contain a lot of amino acids and chelated minerals that by antiquated labeling laws to do with plant nutrients they are forbidden to put on the labels.
L8r
iwltfum
New Member
I think I'm confused by your wording OMU. Do you mind explaining this sentence? It sounds like it might be intriguing, but I can't seem to make sense of it. (EDIT: Never mind. I think I just figured it out. Man, I guess that was a good bong rip.
)I don't know if this exactly pertains to the subject at hand, but: I agree that proper use of salty ferts won't kill off your microbiology, but using only salty nutrients will definitely leave you with a depleted soil that can't sustain the diverse microbiological life that most plants (in the ground) require. Look up "dupont fertilizer soil depletion" in google images if you want to see for yourself. The most staggering images are the ones that show nice healthy fertilized fields (salty nutrients), but through the middle of the fields are these gross brown, dusty drainage ditches that don't even have weeds in them. There are also alot of pictures of just bare, brown, dusty fields where - yet again - even weeds refuse to grow.
Nice post OMU. I suspect with the plant locked up, it can't transpire properly causing what would normally be benign temps to cause some heat damage/discomfort. Comparing chemical fertilizer to organic is like shouting "fire" in a crowded theatre. We all know the organic periodic table of elements is a bit different than the one we learned in basic, organic, and physical chemistry. I don't want to spam Weasel's thread or I'd post a picture of a doozy. I decided I was done with CaMg after that last horror episode. Combination of root bound and lockout caused by too much CaMg and it went downhill instantly.
Get them back to green Weasel. I would just limp it home from there... But you're better than that! Good Luck
Get them back to green Weasel. I would just limp it home from there... But you're better than that! Good Luck
- Thread starter
- #69
Thanks folks. I'm on the road atm - busy digesting everything you guys were kind enough to post.
I suspect it's a combination of the things we mentioned. That would make sense to me- because I don't see a real obvious striking single cause, really. The ph runoff is something I'll have to check out again, when I get back- as I'm worried it actually may have snuck up higher than 6.5, while I had my back turned. Why it would do that I don't know, but I'll try and find out what it's up to.
Ph has been my number one problem forever.
As for the nute burn/salts buildup - well- I hope it is that. It's a little odd because the nutes for that plant were a bit low to begin with,lower than they had been in veg, and I flushed very thoroughly (I thought) - then fed it half strength (400 ppm)- and it's grown steadily worse. I flushed again a few days back. I let it sit for four days after the flush. Came back to it and it was much worse. Then I fed it 600 ppm (which I now regret- I think (?)). I figured a plant should be able to handle 600 ppm on an empty stomach. And if feeding it nothing appeared to make it worse- well...I was trying to take the middle road...a couple months ago I starved some plants in flower, thinking it was nute burn, as I mentioned before, and the resulting deficiencies weren't a pretty sight.
Anyway- let's put that confusion aside for now. It's certainly possible I didn't flush well enough/it's a combo of problems/ph is being squirrelly/ whatever. I'm confident that with all this great help I will figure it out. I can see that I just have to be increasing meticulous in order to nail down the facts of the situation.
Thanks for the vote of confidence Spitz - I can't really agree with you re being 'better than that' ha ha. But it's just a challenge, I like it. And, honestly, I'm not the least worried about the sick plant from the angle of lost yield or whatever. As long as I can figure out how to learn something from this and keep moving forward, it's all good.
Thanks all of you for all the interesting info. You guys are awesome. And welcome Jahmid, thanks for wandering in. I hope that ' mold' you found yesterday turned out to be imaginary.
I suspect it's a combination of the things we mentioned. That would make sense to me- because I don't see a real obvious striking single cause, really. The ph runoff is something I'll have to check out again, when I get back- as I'm worried it actually may have snuck up higher than 6.5, while I had my back turned. Why it would do that I don't know, but I'll try and find out what it's up to.
Ph has been my number one problem forever.
As for the nute burn/salts buildup - well- I hope it is that. It's a little odd because the nutes for that plant were a bit low to begin with,lower than they had been in veg, and I flushed very thoroughly (I thought) - then fed it half strength (400 ppm)- and it's grown steadily worse. I flushed again a few days back. I let it sit for four days after the flush. Came back to it and it was much worse. Then I fed it 600 ppm (which I now regret- I think (?)). I figured a plant should be able to handle 600 ppm on an empty stomach. And if feeding it nothing appeared to make it worse- well...I was trying to take the middle road...a couple months ago I starved some plants in flower, thinking it was nute burn, as I mentioned before, and the resulting deficiencies weren't a pretty sight.
Anyway- let's put that confusion aside for now. It's certainly possible I didn't flush well enough/it's a combo of problems/ph is being squirrelly/ whatever. I'm confident that with all this great help I will figure it out. I can see that I just have to be increasing meticulous in order to nail down the facts of the situation.
Thanks for the vote of confidence Spitz - I can't really agree with you re being 'better than that' ha ha. But it's just a challenge, I like it. And, honestly, I'm not the least worried about the sick plant from the angle of lost yield or whatever. As long as I can figure out how to learn something from this and keep moving forward, it's all good.
Thanks all of you for all the interesting info. You guys are awesome. And welcome Jahmid, thanks for wandering in. I hope that ' mold' you found yesterday turned out to be imaginary.
- Thread starter
- #70
I want to say one thing about my grow 'mission' which I forgot before.
Well ok- there are two things-
My signature used to say 'Rage, rage against the dying of the grow light'. That kind of sums up my growing history and I'd still have that in my signature but I got tired of seeing 'rage rage' every damn time I did anything. I'm pretty peaceful in my old age
The other important thing about my grow. Besides that it is a seat of the pants/skin of the teeth thing.
I'm on a mission to try and figure out how to grow properly with the equipment and method I have. I decided years ago to try and make this grow work the best I can - with two 600s for flowering, peat moss soilless mix, and botanicare nutes. So I'm trying to stick to this system for a while before I switch anything up.
It's not because I think any of the things I'm doing are necessarily the best way. My outside gardens and greenhouse are more raw and organic. My lifestyle is pretty damn organic too and I'm attracted to organic growing. I'll switch directions one of these days.
I'd also like to try hydro- Cap'n style, approaching the opposite end of the growing scale.
I'm plugging away at growing in this way because I want to learn the basics. If I had been able to join 420 a few years ago I think I would be light years ahead by now- but I had no internet where I lived up until a year or so ago, and couldn't.
Well ok- there are two things-
My signature used to say 'Rage, rage against the dying of the grow light'. That kind of sums up my growing history and I'd still have that in my signature but I got tired of seeing 'rage rage' every damn time I did anything. I'm pretty peaceful in my old age
The other important thing about my grow. Besides that it is a seat of the pants/skin of the teeth thing.
I'm on a mission to try and figure out how to grow properly with the equipment and method I have. I decided years ago to try and make this grow work the best I can - with two 600s for flowering, peat moss soilless mix, and botanicare nutes. So I'm trying to stick to this system for a while before I switch anything up.
It's not because I think any of the things I'm doing are necessarily the best way. My outside gardens and greenhouse are more raw and organic. My lifestyle is pretty damn organic too and I'm attracted to organic growing. I'll switch directions one of these days.
I'd also like to try hydro- Cap'n style, approaching the opposite end of the growing scale.
I'm plugging away at growing in this way because I want to learn the basics. If I had been able to join 420 a few years ago I think I would be light years ahead by now- but I had no internet where I lived up until a year or so ago, and couldn't.
Up until a year ago I didn't even know people grew like this. Sometimes I still have to shake my head in wonder. I'm in the same boat, wetter than wet behind the ears. You'll figure it all out Weaselcracker.
- Thread starter
- #72
UPDATE
Alright folks- post #2000, and I'm back on the scene, having had escaped the gravitational pull of this green hole for a while, physically if not mentally. How long has it been - let's see... Ten days since I was last in here. I arranged for my friend to come in for a half hour and give the girls a splash of water five days ago. Other than that they've been just growing away in here quietly with only each other for company. For which I'm sure they are usually grateful.
THE VEG ROOM
Before I left I turned the light down to 300 watts. It hasn't been higher than 400 much lately anyway as I have too many plants in there and they are too big so I don't particularly want them growing fast.
I also managed to raise the ceiling of that room (which is a piece of plywood which doubles as a shelf on its upper surface) up by 4 inches, therefore raising the light in the room up by 4 inches. I thought this would be plenty. Ha ha
I opened the door to the veg room to see this.
Holy crap!!!
If you look at the couple leaves right next to the bulb you can see that they are burnt but surprisingly nothing else is.
What to do?
At the moment - Nothing.
I don't have time to deal with this. It's already in the middle of the night and I haven't slept in days and I have to process the situation. They will be fine for another night, hey girls?
I pinched off the highest two (burnt) tops. Onwards!
FLOWERING ROOM
At first glance everything looks pretty good. It's pretty thick in there as you can see. All was watered well ( thanks friend! ) and I see no major disasters. So I'm already happy in general.
Closer inspection brings to light some problems. However, I fully expected the problems that I am seeing right now so they do not surprise me at all.
Last time I was rambling about the curling leaves and possible high PH in my pots of sunshine mix. As well- possible nute burn- though I don't believe my nutes have been high. I'm well below the reccomended schedule.
This has been turning over in my head a lot while I was away, and I kind of expected to come home and see that the problems I saw in the White Widow had spread to some of the other plants.
And so it is.
I see curled leaves on the remaining Mama Thai, in front, and the 3 Pineapple Chunks behind it in this photo, while not curled so much, have many burnt tips. What I would generally assume to be nute burn. One PC in particular has quite a lot of burnt leaves, seemingly in random spots.
No I didn't splash nutrient there- though some of those spots look a bit like that. I'm hoping some of you guys can help diagnose this.
Here is a closer shot of the front of that side of the room, showing the MT, and you can see plenty of curled leaves as you move in closer to the light- which hangs above the back corner of the MT.
Here is the problem White Widow.
Looks about the same as I did last time I saw it in terms of its 'issue'. The buds are a little bit bigger and they are hard as rock. If there are seeds in there (I'm sure there are) I'll have to use a bloody chisel to get them out.
Here is the new WW which I wrestled in there last time.
A little bit thin in the screen still but I think it will be fine.
I don't have time to dig into this situation too much tonight.
However I did do this- I set the problem WW up on top of a bucket and ran a bunch of water through it and checked the runoff.
Water in was pure rainwater. Ph 5.7.
After letting a half gallon or so run out- I collected the next half gallon. This is what I got.
I kept on flushing -got it down to about 6.2 before I got tired of it and left. I'm curious to see what the other plants are going to read.
I checked my meter against both PH 4 and PH 7 solution. It was perfect.
Do you guys have any thoughts on why it should be so high? And - is it way too high? It's high- but I don't know that it's extreme. However- the curled leaves would say otherwise. And.....if I am putting in pH 5.7 and getting out pH 6.7 -what does it say about the actual pH of the medium? It must be quite a lot higher- right? - like closer to 7.7? (shudder)
I will find out more tomorrow or whenever it is that I get the time to check the other pots.
Temps in the room while I was gone ranged from a high of 79.2 down to a low of 72 point something or other.
My temperature gauge sits on a shelf, out of the direct light, but at a higher level than the lights. So I figured it does a good job of measuring room temperature. However, tonight before I left I tucked it in with the Mama Thai, down under the curled leaves- just in case there is a hot spot underneath the lights. I doubt this as I don't feel it, and there is an oscillating fan blowing directly through those areas.
I'm hoping that late tomorrow night I may get a chance to go in there again and work a bit, at the expense of.... what's that thing called again? That thing that other people do at night? Oh yeah- sleep.
I had mixed feelings about documenting this growing situation I have going on here. Ha ha ha. But I told you guys- this is a seat of the pants themed grow, and I wasn't kidding.
Expect more of this type of stuff in future. I figure I may as well take some sort of perverse pleasure in it because actually it is kinda funny what I do trying to hold this whole thing together.
But I also have hope that the problems I'm seeing here can be fixed someday, and I can carry on doing my skin of the teeth thingy but still grow nice, not screwed up, plants.
Ya think so?
Ha ha ha... Maybe...
Love you guys. Catch you later
Alright folks- post #2000, and I'm back on the scene, having had escaped the gravitational pull of this green hole for a while, physically if not mentally. How long has it been - let's see... Ten days since I was last in here. I arranged for my friend to come in for a half hour and give the girls a splash of water five days ago. Other than that they've been just growing away in here quietly with only each other for company. For which I'm sure they are usually grateful.
THE VEG ROOM
Before I left I turned the light down to 300 watts. It hasn't been higher than 400 much lately anyway as I have too many plants in there and they are too big so I don't particularly want them growing fast.
I also managed to raise the ceiling of that room (which is a piece of plywood which doubles as a shelf on its upper surface) up by 4 inches, therefore raising the light in the room up by 4 inches. I thought this would be plenty. Ha ha
I opened the door to the veg room to see this.
Holy crap!!!
If you look at the couple leaves right next to the bulb you can see that they are burnt but surprisingly nothing else is.
What to do?
At the moment - Nothing.
I don't have time to deal with this. It's already in the middle of the night and I haven't slept in days and I have to process the situation. They will be fine for another night, hey girls?
I pinched off the highest two (burnt) tops. Onwards!
FLOWERING ROOM
At first glance everything looks pretty good. It's pretty thick in there as you can see. All was watered well ( thanks friend! ) and I see no major disasters. So I'm already happy in general.
Closer inspection brings to light some problems. However, I fully expected the problems that I am seeing right now so they do not surprise me at all.
Last time I was rambling about the curling leaves and possible high PH in my pots of sunshine mix. As well- possible nute burn- though I don't believe my nutes have been high. I'm well below the reccomended schedule.
This has been turning over in my head a lot while I was away, and I kind of expected to come home and see that the problems I saw in the White Widow had spread to some of the other plants.
And so it is.
Here is a closer shot of the front of that side of the room, showing the MT, and you can see plenty of curled leaves as you move in closer to the light- which hangs above the back corner of the MT.
Here is the problem White Widow.
Here is the new WW which I wrestled in there last time.
A little bit thin in the screen still but I think it will be fine.
I don't have time to dig into this situation too much tonight.
However I did do this- I set the problem WW up on top of a bucket and ran a bunch of water through it and checked the runoff.
Water in was pure rainwater. Ph 5.7.
After letting a half gallon or so run out- I collected the next half gallon. This is what I got.
I kept on flushing -got it down to about 6.2 before I got tired of it and left. I'm curious to see what the other plants are going to read.
I checked my meter against both PH 4 and PH 7 solution. It was perfect.
Do you guys have any thoughts on why it should be so high? And - is it way too high? It's high- but I don't know that it's extreme. However- the curled leaves would say otherwise. And.....if I am putting in pH 5.7 and getting out pH 6.7 -what does it say about the actual pH of the medium? It must be quite a lot higher- right? - like closer to 7.7? (shudder)
I will find out more tomorrow or whenever it is that I get the time to check the other pots.
Temps in the room while I was gone ranged from a high of 79.2 down to a low of 72 point something or other.
My temperature gauge sits on a shelf, out of the direct light, but at a higher level than the lights. So I figured it does a good job of measuring room temperature. However, tonight before I left I tucked it in with the Mama Thai, down under the curled leaves- just in case there is a hot spot underneath the lights. I doubt this as I don't feel it, and there is an oscillating fan blowing directly through those areas.
I'm hoping that late tomorrow night I may get a chance to go in there again and work a bit, at the expense of.... what's that thing called again? That thing that other people do at night? Oh yeah- sleep.
I had mixed feelings about documenting this growing situation I have going on here. Ha ha ha. But I told you guys- this is a seat of the pants themed grow, and I wasn't kidding.
Expect more of this type of stuff in future. I figure I may as well take some sort of perverse pleasure in it because actually it is kinda funny what I do trying to hold this whole thing together.
But I also have hope that the problems I'm seeing here can be fixed someday, and I can carry on doing my skin of the teeth thingy but still grow nice, not screwed up, plants.
Ya think so?
Ha ha ha... Maybe...
Love you guys. Catch you later
Looks great. I love that"Guardian" wish I had one!
OldMedUser
Formerly Known as LabRat
I think you could probably take a machete to to vegging girls. If they have to be in there much longer it wouldn't hurt to cut them way back and let some of the lower branches catch up for more top colas.
With your burning plants if they are getting close to the end I'd flush them good and let them steal nutes from the leaves for the last couple of weeks. Maybe just a light dose of P and K but not much. I'm flushing mine today and went to a friend's to get a couple jugs of town water to do it with. Then wash that through with my usual RO water and 3/4 strength nutes to get the town water out. It's 200 ppm.
You could do the same with yours. Flush with tap water then finish with nice rain water if you have enough.
L8r
If they have to be in there much longer it wouldn't hurt to cut them way back and let some of the lower branches catch up for more top colas.With your burning plants if they are getting close to the end I'd flush them good and let them steal nutes from the leaves for the last couple of weeks. Maybe just a light dose of P and K but not much. I'm flushing mine today and went to a friend's to get a couple jugs of town water to do it with. Then wash that through with my usual RO water and 3/4 strength nutes to get the town water out. It's 200 ppm.
You could do the same with yours. Flush with tap water then finish with nice rain water if you have enough.
L8r
- Thread starter
- #75
My problem WW is probably in the 'close to the end of nutes' category. It's the only one. The MT and PC which account for the entire right hand section shown- I would consider as being about half way through flowering at best. Well, the MT maybe 2/3 max.
You think that this is nute burn OMU? Because of/in combo with high ph I suppose? The PCs are clones/reveg which are getting a lighter diet than they were in their earlier reincarnations and they didn't do this to me last time. And curled leaves? I'm assuming I have a combination of things going on but it's hard to convince myself that it's straight over feeding.
I feel like there's something going on with my PH that shouldn't be. I'm going to wash out/sterilize my rain barrels for the heck of it. Can't hurt anyway. Maybe I've got some slime thing causing rising ph.
I'll check the other plants' runoff ASAP I have to do some more research about this.
I'll give them all a flush after I scavenge up the rainwater. Then I don't know what I'll give the growing ones. The four PCs should be getting full strength nutes at this point, and the others not too far behind that. I think there's other crap going on. Not sure what to do at this point.
You think that this is nute burn OMU? Because of/in combo with high ph I suppose? The PCs are clones/reveg which are getting a lighter diet than they were in their earlier reincarnations and they didn't do this to me last time. And curled leaves? I'm assuming I have a combination of things going on but it's hard to convince myself that it's straight over feeding.
I feel like there's something going on with my PH that shouldn't be. I'm going to wash out/sterilize my rain barrels for the heck of it. Can't hurt anyway. Maybe I've got some slime thing causing rising ph.
I'll check the other plants' runoff ASAP I have to do some more research about this.
I'll give them all a flush after I scavenge up the rainwater. Then I don't know what I'll give the growing ones. The four PCs should be getting full strength nutes at this point, and the others not too far behind that. I think there's other crap going on. Not sure what to do at this point.
OldMedUser
Formerly Known as LabRat
Leaves that go all taco and crispy brown are sure signs of nute burn/toxic salts buildup. Real dark leaves that feel thick as well.
I taper my feeding down the last few weeks and it doesn't happen to me anymore. Just flushed my one girl real good and finished up with 4L of lighter nutes, Connoisseur, some Big Bud and no damn CalMag! Tsp of epsom salts instead.
L8r
I taper my feeding down the last few weeks and it doesn't happen to me anymore. Just flushed my one girl real good and finished up with 4L of lighter nutes, Connoisseur, some Big Bud and no damn CalMag! Tsp of epsom salts instead.
L8r
- Thread starter
- #77
Thanks so much man. I don't mean to question your advice because it is very helpful. I can tell that you know your shit. This stuff just causes me a lot of confusion. I could sit here all day and tell you about how and why it confuses me under the circumstances, but I won't. Screw it -I will flush all the plants to start- give the mid-flowering ones a lite feeding and see how we do from there. I got to get this pH thing sorted out too.
Maybe I just haven't been doing enough run off through those pots, although I find that a little bit hard to believe as well.
Got to start somewhere here...
Maybe I just haven't been doing enough run off through those pots, although I find that a little bit hard to believe as well.
Got to start somewhere here...
jojo677
Well-Known Member
When in doubt, flush it out!
That sucks about the problems though, and I'm surprised the pH would be so high in peat/perlite... Have you added lime or anything? I know when I grew in Promix, I had to flush with lots of water (+ vinegar, don't judge!) to get my pH in range. It took forever.
See, aren't you glad you started a journal? We get to share some of your confusion!
That sucks about the problems though, and I'm surprised the pH would be so high in peat/perlite... Have you added lime or anything? I know when I grew in Promix, I had to flush with lots of water (+ vinegar, don't judge!) to get my pH in range. It took forever.
See, aren't you glad you started a journal? We get to share some of your confusion!
- Thread starter
- #79
Ha ha. Well this is sort of one of the reasons why I didn't want to start a journal actually, and hang out my dirty laundry like this. Oh well- No pain no gain though. Hopefully I get somewhere with this.
Can you tell me more about this promix flushing episode? What made it high to begin with?
No I haven't added lime in the mix.
I've used vinegar for years. People say it doesn't shift the ph as well and the ph will start to rise again quickly after you add vinegar. I didn't notice a huge difference from the ph minus but maybe I didn't pay enough attention. I'm using ph minus now though, when I need to drop the ph, because I found a big bottle I'd misplaced.
Can you tell me more about this promix flushing episode? What made it high to begin with?
No I haven't added lime in the mix.
I've used vinegar for years. People say it doesn't shift the ph as well and the ph will start to rise again quickly after you add vinegar. I didn't notice a huge difference from the ph minus but maybe I didn't pay enough attention. I'm using ph minus now though, when I need to drop the ph, because I found a big bottle I'd misplaced.
jojo677
Well-Known Member
Well the Promix debacle was during my first grow and I didn't know much about pH meters. I had a cheap one (new one now) that I abused and never calibrated, so that led to trying to manage pH issues. Once I got a new meter I saw my pH had creeped way up (very few organic nutes were used) and was in the 8.0s. I had added lime to the mix (not knowing Promix already contained it) and that surely didn't help! I did lots of flushing and resulted to up to 25% vinegar solution.
The next round I didn't add any lime, and was just Promix, and the pH still crept up. I had to flush quite a bit at the beginning in order to get it down to 6.2 pH. Those were just newbie mistakes though. I did notice the salt buildups in the Promix seemed to affect the girls a lot though. It was for me to flush, as the peat and perlite didn't like to absorb water very fast, and I'm sure it didn't get fully saturated many times. That was the most irritating part, watering took so long.
I have also noticed that ph minus works quite a bit better than vinegar. I add maybe 10 drops/gallon (my tap is like 8.4) whereas I add a few tsp of vinegar. The runoff is more consistent too.
The next round I didn't add any lime, and was just Promix, and the pH still crept up. I had to flush quite a bit at the beginning in order to get it down to 6.2 pH. Those were just newbie mistakes though. I did notice the salt buildups in the Promix seemed to affect the girls a lot though. It was for me to flush, as the peat and perlite didn't like to absorb water very fast, and I'm sure it didn't get fully saturated many times. That was the most irritating part, watering took so long.
I have also noticed that ph minus works quite a bit better than vinegar. I add maybe 10 drops/gallon (my tap is like 8.4) whereas I add a few tsp of vinegar. The runoff is more consistent too.