Oh No - It's A Green Hole! - Reverse Thrusters! - Dammit - Too Late!

Glad to see you take the plunge!

I think you're journaling for good reasons. This is really a great community and it's giving back. And people are so willing to help you out! I think the journal helps a lot with motivating too. You get feedback and you want to give updates of your plants. Plus you want to make sure they look good!

I understand your situation more too - now I see why you were curious about my automation project! It hasn't seen much attention lately... Soon

I've always been curious about the chlorophyll taste getting on buds when trimmed fresh. I don't really see it, but it you're that worried about it, couldn't you trim then wash? It's not much more time.

Anyway, I'll look forward to the updates and learning more about your grow!
 
I try to trim as little of the sugar leaves as possible. It has nothing to do with taste and everything to do with my understanding that the trichomes on the sugar leaves are often more potent than those on the buds. The fans come off and I loosely trim the tips of longer sugar leaves.

Roach, I like the idea of the TV box. I use a folding clothes dryer covered with weed blocker cloth, but I'm always there to monitor. That box idea is sharp. Just the right size. I'll be watching for the picture.
 
Bapple, Sweetsue, Pigeons, The Roach, JoJo, and a new acquaintance or two! This is really nice and I want to say specially thanks for coming to my journal.
 
As was I. I thought "Weaselcracker, you've been holding out on us." :laughtwo:
 
Well shucks thanks - though actually the sunglasses lend it a real gloss of perfection that it totally lacks in real life, trust me. But having said that - it is for sure doing the best it ever has - thanks to 420.
If it all grew to perfection and ever matures before I get old I could end up having more than I need someday. It's not going to happen this year - but if it did then I think I'd grow instead some more Sativas to keep the room full. There must be some awesome strains out there that people avoid because they produce small, or take too long. Where would I find strains like that though? Some extra-cool breeder?
But it won't grow to perfection this time that's for sure. There is a nute burned plant. And nanners and seeds. And Mold. I told you this is a skin of the teeth grow. Don't let those glossy pictures fool ya, kids.
 
I love the humility Weaselcracker. :laughtwo:
 
Well then here's another big helping of humility for Weaselcracker tonight, Sue.

I went and checked the elder Mama Thai over again tonight and Lo, what did I find but a whole bunch more nanners! I'm guessing roughly 25 more since last night. That's Way more nanner production than I ever saw in my other nanner prone plants in the past. I used to grow this one strain which usually always popped out a few, late in flowering. But I would go around and pick them out, they'd be gone, and they weren't a huge problem.

Besides the prolific nanner growth, I found -a whole bunch more seeds! Obviously they were there already, but now they're just swelling and popping out like crazy on her. Amazing how fast the little buggers started growing once they figured out they'd been seen.
She's not completely seeded to the max, by any stretch, but there are lots of them.

Naturally I started digging through the White Widow which is directly next door. Lots of swollen calyxes/ future seeds in there too. And kitty-corner to her is the Blueberry which looks like it's got lots of swollen calyxes as well.
(That BB is so nice smelling, and crazy sticky....)
The younger Mama Thai girl shows no sign of seeds yet but I'm sure they will be there.
As for the Pineapple Chunk on the other side - nothing to see but they are young. I expect there will have to be a number of seeds in there too.

In other words, probably my whole grow is seeded to some degree.
No nanners to be seen on the other plants but they're all just a little young for the nanner stage which in my experience has been about 3/4 of the way through flowering.

What does this all mean?
My herb goes to myself and a couple patients. Mostly it's a barter system or rather a system of trades, which is a very common form of business where I live.
It's a fairly forgiving situation but there's a limit to how many seeds there can be in there to be at all professional and keep them happy. I would like the number of seeds to be very low or zero.

The Mama Thai is my medicine so I'm not worried about seeds in that. The other strains I will keep some for me and share some.
I do hope if it's all seeded bud that it is very good seeded bud.

I suppose I could turn it all into hash or something but I'm not going to. It seems wrong. I want to grow out and see what the WW and the BB are like. I haven't grown either strain before and they both seem like good strains- other than the WW being fussy with me.

So at this point I suppose I'll just ride it through and deal with it, barring worse developments

What caused the treacherous nanners? Either some light leaks- meaning the dehum light, or a stray glimmer some time the door got bumped a hair, or something like that- or just a genetic tendency in this particular Mama Thai plant grown from seed. Landrace sativa is often prone to being hermie and I was surprised that the other MTs I grew last winter never had a single nanner.

How did I miss them?
Lack of attention, especially in the last 3 weeks or so. I've been away a lot. I didn't notice them. I didn't specifically look for them. Actually it never even occurred to me to look for them. I stare at the plants a lot when I have time. But I didn't see the nanners. And I must say that I am impressed with how much mayhem they caused. My past experience has been that nanners don't seem to produce that much pollen, and therefore seed. These nanners seem very fertile.

I pulled out one of the two clones of this MT plant that I had in veg. It was a couple months old. I'll flower the remaining one and see if it has the same issue or not.
I was tempted to pull them both, and also start flushing the elder flowering one in preparation to harvest her early, and eradicate this pheno. But looking at the trichomes- she still has quite a lot of clear. It seems too soon.
And I don't know the cause so best to just chill and wait to see what happens next. Nanner watch in place now.

I'll watch her a while. If she keeps getting stickier I'll let her live. Otherwise she is coming down. I know she's good smoke because I've been smoking lots of the quick dried bud obtained in the mold control efforts. It makes me feel uplifted, clear and active.

What did I say ....? - "don't be surprised to see - embarrassing mistakes, trashed plants, dirt swept, or not, into the corners, and general mayhem and confusion."

See?
See why I'm sooooooooo humble?
Ha ha ha! ha ha! ha ha ha!! ha!
( He laughs hysterically.... with a slightly psychotic undertone )

Actually I'm a little disappointed about having to be this humble this early in the journal. It rubs my sense of perfectionism the wrong way. But this gives a very good example of how things often go around here, and it is a journal, so that's ok. I knew if I made a journal I would be documenting the 'seat of pants' thing, and here we are.
At least I still have pants.
Alright me mateys. It's very late here, and I shall call it a night. Goodnight all.
 
A little humility only makes you a stronger gardener and a more attractive man, so win-win there Weaselcracker.

DrZiggy is always pleased with seeds and frequently quips that his seeded plants are every bit as potent and give him the bonus of seeds to play with. When we were young all weed had seeds. That's why we cleaned our weed out on album covers before rolling it. I fail to see the problem with seeds. I care about potency. I understand the market driver behind it, but a good grower with potent product? I think I could accept the occasional "oops!" harvest and give him the seeds to play with. That's just me though. I'm super easy and mellow, mostly because I'm usually at least mildly buzzed. :battingeyelashes:
 
Yeah I agree with you there Sue and like I said it's partly just perfectionism. Someday I'll have my grow do mostly what I ask it to do!
I'm not worried about the potency loss. When I first started smoking most herb was Thai or Jamaican. It was almost all seeded to some extent. And some places I've travelled and lived, all herb had seeds as well, and it was usually sativa, and it was amazing and I'm very nostalgic about those places. I'm very happy to be picking seeds out before rolling something up.
There is a real sense of quality lost though for some people though- if their herb is harder to smoke because it's packed with seed. I think they will be forgiving though
I don't think the seeds are something I want, if they are coming from a hermie prone plant- but thats undetermined. I'm not sure how to find that out though except the obvious way- planting them.
When I read other people's journals I like the ones with a few ups and downs. Spices things up a little and makes it real hey!?
 
That's too bad WC

'Nanners happen. It's in the genes most of the time tho growers like to blame themselves. Beans created by 'nanners are most likely going to grow out with 'nanners themselves. One of the ways fem seeds are made is to let a female stay growing after she should have been harvested hoping that she will pop out some 'nanners in an attempt to pollinate herself. If that pollen is used on a different female grown from another seed, not a clone from the same mother, then the seeds produced should be fem but not be prone to hermie. The seeds that are made on the plant that had the 'nanners will more likely throw 'nanners earlier in flowering than you want.

It's like high school biology. Cross a black cat with a white cat and statistically you'll get 1 white cat, 1 black cat and 2 grey cats. Not so easy with seeds as they all look the same until you grow them out. You got the black cat. ;)

Not that you started with fem seed but somewhere in the gene pool a gene for hermaphrodism was swimming around and found it's way into a seed here and there.

Having all your girls knocked up will for sure impact your yield and potency. I just went through the same thing almost last XMas with my last grow. I had a tub with 12 pots and 4 or 5 seeds in each pot. They were all from regular plants that had been crossed with LowRyder1 and I was hunting for any that autoflowered so I could breed them towards developing autos of my own strains. A couple of the pots had a known auto strain in them, Purple Jems, and it was the best of the boys that got loose and knocked up all the girls in the room. I also had a couple girls flowering in large pots of ProMix. As these seeds were from a regular male plant and not from a hermie they will be fine to use to develop a true auto strain tho they are Regular X PJ x LR1 now. The seeds from the plants in pots however are just Regular X PJ and I will be focusing on using them to breed more autos. One of the regulars is my favorite strain I made by crossing Kali Mist with Northern Lights #5 and the other is a cross of L.S.D and BlueBerry. Both the Kali and the L.S.D. have Mazar in their roots as does the PJ which is Mazar X LR1.

Once the girls get knocked up bad they throw most of their effort into ripening the seeds so further flower and resin production go on the back burner. Good news is that the further along your plants are into flowering the less impact pollination will have on yield and potency as the bulk of the buds are already formed. If harvested soon after pollination then there won't be any ripe seeds in the buds or very few. The tiny, immature seeds won't blow the cherry off your joint all over your mom's new wool carpet. lol

Most of the ripe seeds you get are going to be prone to doing the same thing when grown out so they are not worth keeping IMO but are great for tossing around your local town's flower pots and park gardens to freak out the local constabulary and get some great stories in the papers. :)

You likely had some 'nanners earlier and are going to get some mature seeds. It takes around 4 - 6 weeks for a seed to mature after pollination so if you see ripe seeds then the 'nanners started some time ago.

Not the end of the world but still a PITA. If you've been debating about harvesting some now would be a good time to reduce the mature seed numbers.

L8r
 
So you think the WW, Blueberry, and possibly the other MT and PC - all the other girl apart from the one with nanners, could produce fem seeds -with no hermie traits?
I've had a few seeding episodes before and generally resin production seems to stop when they get full of seeds.
I'd say they got pollinated about 3 weeks ago or just a little less- judging by the seeds- so I'd have to wait a while if I want viable seeds. None of them are ready yet.
I'm not sure what to do - I'll put some more work into seed and nanner patrol and assess the situation.
I think I'll start flushing that nanner laden Mama Thai. I don't love her quite as much as before she went and did this.
The next candidate to come to flower- the biggest girl in the veg room- is a clone of the traitorous MT. I may just put her in to flower anyway- and keep a very close eye on her. I'm not. Perhaps that's a bad idea.
Thanks OMU. You've got me thinking. I'll go through the veg room and see if I have anything in there that could move up to the big league.
 
Hmmmm. Nanners are a mild form of hermie to me.
I distinguish my hermies this way- there are ones that have balls along with calyxes and pistils. They show up at the time when the plant shows sex. Sometimes a plant that looks all female tricks me into throwing her in the flowering room, and then grows some balls. But it's going to show those balls within the first couple weeks of flowering in my experience. I tend to call those ones the true- hermaphrodites. I assume they carry both male and female genes.
Nanners in my experience show up about 3/4 of the way though flowering. They can be caused by light leaks or cold or possibly other stresses. They can also just show up because that plant is prone to growing them. I don't tend to think of this as a true hermaphrodite plant- just a female gone sideways a bit. There are no male genes present - correct?
I've never had a plant grow balls late in flowering
I've never had a plant grow nanners early in flowering

I do not know this-----
Are the seeds produced by the nanner prone plant going to be prone to growing nanners as well?
I thought fem seeds were produced by forcing a plant to grow nanners and pollinating itself?
OMU you say otherwise- I think ?
 
Sounds mostly correct to me.

A true hermie is going to show balls early in flowering and should be ripped out an destroyed. Good for the juicer but not much else.

I'm not positive but a plant that shows 'nanners later in flowering may also be hermie but may make fem seed or both fem and hermie. I do know that if you grow plants from those the girls that grow from them are much more likely to pop 'nanners before the grow is done and bugger things up like what's going on now so I wouldn't want seeds from them for future growing or breeding.

When a plant is fully flowered out and ready to harvest but allowed to keep growing until it finally pops 'nanners then these are the ones that are suitable and used for making fem seeds are are not likely to make 'nanners before flowering is complete in future plants.

I would wager that the seeds you get from your plants are at least 50% likely to show 'nanners later in flowering and mess you up again.

Fem seeds from reputable breeders can quite often go hermie even if they used the proper 'nanners to pollinate other females. Those other females may carry the hermie gene and then that will be in many of the fem seeds they produce. Female surrogates should be from strains that have shown over a few generations that they have no hermie tendencies to be considered suitable for producing stable fem seeds.

The same can be said for reversing sex on a female branch through the application of colloidal silver or other compounds,

I'm not an expert but have been pollen chucking for about 15 years and growing out a lot of the seeds I've made with good results. I've read a lot about the subject too but still haven't done all the actual breeding to establish a stable line.

L8r
 
I'm tempted to go start flushing 'Nanny' right now, because I know she is lovely smoke already- and I suspect she's going to be spending her energy growing seeds and nanners for the next while, at the expense of the quality of the rest of the bud.
Ok- decided. I'm going to give her a flush, using Clearex which hopefully speeds this process up. I may have an empty spot in my flowering room for the next while- so the 8 screen situation may have been short lived- but that's all good.

Edit- I went and flushed Nanny, and the Widow for good measure. I bumped into a fellow in a thread yesterday that said the Widows are very prone to nute burn. So I'm keen to pick his brains later. :)
 
Yes. I've used it quite a lot. It says on the bottle that you can harvest 3 days after you flush with it. I usually leave it longer- but I do notice the plant foliage yellowing up nicely after I use it.
Somewhere in the forum there's a recipe for DIY Clearex.
 
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