Jon's Sneak It In Auto Grow

[Jon]

Here’s what the young, healthy sprouts look like:

1. Peach CrescendO
2. Gorilla Zkittlez

 

[Jon]

Here’s what the young, healthy sprouts look like:

1. Peach CrescendO
2. Gorilla Zkittlez

I have a Dos Si Dos auto floating in water as well. I figured if five, it’s dumb to not do six. Lol!

 

[Jon]

Hi @Emilya Green! Hope this finds you well. I have a question for you, and I thought it would potentially be a good one to have the answer in the journal if you know. As my original go-to Sensei (sorry @Bill284, lol) here at 420, I always appreciate your assistance and education. What’s funny is that right now I’m about to begin teaching my little brother how to grow (on the phone, lol), and in thinking about the huge amount of information there is to convey, I figured it would be prudent to “order” what I want to teach him, both in terms of content and timing. Guess what I decided the very first lesson should be? HOW TO WATER A POTTED PLANT!!! My first bible here!

So this question is about microbes, I think. Not really sure, lol. Ok, so when I’m prepping pots, I use coco, perlite, bokashi and frass. The bokashi and frass also get periodically top dressed throughout the grow. This is to generate microbial growth and help the girls out a little bit, especially in the beginning when they barely get any nutes. I know in the past you told me there’s no point to mix chemical nutes and organic, and I get that. But Bill taught me this, I’ve done it with and without the bokashi and frass, and it makes a visible, noticeable difference. For whatever reason, using PB nutes in conjunction with these helps. I thought that was related to microbe generation. So I guess my first question is, why do I see this?

The other question is about the frass. As you know, it’s basically just the ground up exoskeletons of (in my case) the black soldier fly. But the box it comes in says 3-1-1.

This I find curious and confusing. It’s not a nute. Just helps generate microbes. So does this 3-1-1 refer to the nutes made from the specific type of microbes the black soldier fly generates? How do they know it’s 3-1-1? It’s the only frass product I’ve seen that lists the N-P-K. Quite mysterious.

I’m sure I’m displaying all kinds of hilarious ignorance in this post, but if it increases my knowledge base I’m more than cool with that.

Could you please help me bring light to this cursed darkness?

 

[Emilya Green]

Hi @Emilya Green! Hope this finds you well. I have a question for you, and I thought it would potentially be a good one to have the answer in the journal if you know. As my original go-to Sensei (sorry @Bill284, lol) here at 420, I always appreciate your assistance and education. What’s funny is that right now I’m about to begin teaching my little brother how to grow (on the phone, lol), and in thinking about the huge amount of information there is to convey, I figured it would be prudent to “order” what I want to teach him, both in terms of content and timing. Guess what I decided the very first lesson should be? HOW TO WATER A POTTED PLANT!!! My first bible here!

So this question is about microbes, I think. Not really sure, lol. Ok, so when I’m prepping pots, I use coco, perlite, bokashi and frass. The bokashi and frass also get periodically top dressed throughout the grow. This is to generate microbial growth and help the girls out a little bit, especially in the beginning when they barely get any nutes. I know in the past you told me there’s no point to mix chemical nutes and organic, and I get that. But Bill taught me this, I’ve done it with and without the bokashi and frass, and it makes a visible, noticeable difference. For whatever reason, using PB nutes in conjunction with these helps. I thought that was related to microbe generation. So I guess my first question is, why do I see this?

The other question is about the frass. As you know, it’s basically just the ground up exoskeletons of (in my case) the black soldier fly. But the box it comes in says 3-1-1.

This I find curious and confusing. It’s not a nute. Just helps generate microbes. So does this 3-1-1 refer to the nutes made from the specific type of microbes the black soldier fly generates? How do they know it’s 3-1-1? It’s the only frass product I’ve seen that lists the N-P-K. Quite mysterious.

I’m sure I’m displaying all kinds of hilarious ignorance in this post, but if it increases my knowledge base I’m more than cool with that.

Could you please help me bring light to this cursed darkness?

Hi Jon!
Bokashi is basically fermented organic matter and really doesn't include a whole lot of microbes. frass is the debris and the excrement of insects, again not with a whole lot of useful microbes. Both are highly nutritious for the plants but a better food for microbes would be molasses. If you're looking for the beneficial microbes needed for a garden I would look into adding real growers recharge along with your other inputs because very few of the popular crowd come along with the frass or the bokashi.

 

[Jon]

Hi Jon!
Bokashi is basically fermented organic matter and really doesn't include a whole lot of microbes. frass is the debris and the excrement of insects, again not with a whole lot of useful microbes. Both are highly nutritious for the plants but a better food for microbes would be molasses. If you're looking for the beneficial microbes needed for a garden I would look into adding real growers recharge along with your other inputs because very few of the popular crowd come along with the frass or the bokashi.

Ok I checked it out. Real Growers Recharge eh? I’ll give it a shot. Ok, so if I understand, that will give me a microbial base. And this will work in coco you think with nutes? Or do you believe I am spinning my wheels? I have no ego, if I’m being dumb please tell me.

 

[Grand Daddy Black]

Ok I checked it out. Real Growers Recharge eh? I’ll give it a shot. Ok, so if I understand, that will give me a microbial base. And this will work in coco you think with nutes? Or do you believe I am spinning my wheels? I have no ego, if I’m being dumb please tell me.

For what it's worth Jon, I use Recharge in all of my grows. I have no proof, but I strongly suspect that it is highly beneficial to my plants!

 

[Jon]

Hi Jon!
Bokashi is basically fermented organic matter and really doesn't include a whole lot of microbes. frass is the debris and the excrement of insects, again not with a whole lot of useful microbes. Both are highly nutritious for the plants but a better food for microbes would be molasses. If you're looking for the beneficial microbes needed for a garden I would look into adding real growers recharge along with your other inputs because very few of the popular crowd come along with the frass or the bokashi.

Ok I was right about my massive ignorance. That said, based on your answer, with the RGR it would seem that the bokashi and frass may have more value?

 

[Jon]

For what it's worth Jon, I use Recharge in all of my grows. I have no proof, but I strongly suspect that it is highly beneficial to my plants!

It’s worth a lot. I just ordered the 8 oz size. Should be enough to check it out, right?

 

[Grand Daddy Black]

It’s worth a lot. I just ordered the 8 oz size. Should be enough to check it out, right?

That's plenty. You don't need much!

 

[Jon]

That's plenty. You don't need much!

This is why I always advocate for subjugating one’s ego. Makes it much easier to ask questions. Until they can download the Akashic Record and implant it into my brain at birth, the only way I know to learn is to ask questions. Thanks.

 

[Jon]

That's plenty. You don't need much!

I spoke to them on the phone to see if there’s a way to make it work in coco like I want. There is. It’s tricky but I’m trying it. Others do it.

 

[Jon]

For anyone keeping score at home, here’s how I interpret the Prescription Blend feed chart for seedlings. They suggest using a 1-2 ml/gallon of Core A and B only, until the plants have two sets of leaves. I’ve found in coco that’s too long to just feed the Core products. I started this way. Today is day 4. They have cotys and very small first leaves (not even real ones). Today my feed changed. Instead of 2ml/gallon of Core A and B, I switched to 5 ml Calmag + iron, 2ml of Core A and B, plus .5ml of all the other ingredients. Four days without calmag is plenty. Let them feed!

 

[Emilya Green]

As long as you don't overload the system with nutrients the microbes can do their job and take what they gather and feed it to the roots. But if you use bokashi and other nutrients that are readily available, then that will feed the plants directly and the microbes will be out of work, and they will die off. Organic growing is a balancing act where you give the microbes enough to do and where you don't feed the plants directly.
I know it's possible to go organic in Coco, but I see no reason to do that when it is so easy to feed available nutrients.

 

[Jon]

As long as you don't overload the system with nutrients the microbes can do their job and take what they gather and feed it to the roots. But if you use bokashi and other nutrients that are readily available, then that will feed the plants directly and the microbes will be out of work, and they will die off. Organic growing is a balancing act where you give the microbes enough to do and where you don't feed the plants directly.
I know it's possible to go organic in Coco, but I see no reason to do that when it is so easy to feed available nutrients.

I’m trying to prove you wrong and do both.

 

[Emilya Green]

I’m trying to prove you wrong and do both.

I'm sure you will! Just remember that every grow other than super soil with the full range of microbes and fungi, is a compromise, where either you or the medium makes decisions for the plants. The further you get away from natural organic, the more you are compromising.

 

[StoneOtter]

Made it. Not too late. So RGR is what I use as a staple too. It's a workhorse. I also think a little variety is fun until it isn't. I also have given bokashi and frazz every two weeks on top along with that. In flower a duo of microbes every two weeks, I'd have to look up and will if you want to know what they are. Sorry.

See Emilya's post for the LOS/not LOS compromise. There's something there I think.

 

[Jon]

Made it. Not too late. So RGR is what I use as a staple too. It's a workhorse. I also think a little variety is fun until it isn't. I also have given bokashi and frazz every two weeks on top along with that. In flower a duo of microbes every two weeks, I'd have to look up and will if you want to know what they are. Sorry.

See Emilya's post for the LOS/not LOS compromise. There's something there I think.

I understand I may be banging my head against the wall. She’s been pretty clear. But it won’t be my first fool’s errand here and likely won’t be my last. Lmao!

 

[Jon]

I understand I may be banging my head against the wall. She’s been pretty clear. But it won’t be my first fool’s errand here and likely won’t be my last. Lmao!

Btw - all you guys using RGR - did we have to wait two years to let Jon know?

 

[CaptainLucky]

For anyone keeping score at home, here’s how I interpret the Prescription Blend feed chart for seedlings. They suggest using a 1-2 ml/gallon of Core A and B only, until the plants have two sets of leaves. I’ve found in coco that’s too long to just feed the Core products. I started this way. Today is day 4. They have cotys and very small first leaves (not even real ones). Today my feed changed. Instead of 2ml/gallon of Core A and B, I switched to 5 ml Calmag + iron, 2ml of Core A and B, plus .5ml of all the other ingredients. Four days without calmag is plenty. Let them feed!

Hey Jon I’m curious as to why so much cal-mag or is that what you’re using call for? CL

 

[Jon]

Hey Jon I’m curious as to why so much cal-mag or is that what you’re using call for? CL

In coco @Bill284 taught me that they get calmag with every feeding from day one. I use Humboldt’s Secret CalMag plus Iron. Their only food is what I choose to give them. Although every nute company will likely say “it’s in there,” I have yet to find the nutes which don’t require a lot of calmag in coco. Coco tends to hold onto the C and Mg, so one is already somewhat behind the 8-ball to start. After some experimentation I have found that 5ml/gallon is about the sweet spot for this stage of growth. By mid veg I’ll be up to maybe 7ml/gallon depending on what the plants say. So maybe it does seem like a lot, I dunno. But when I began using it on that level from the get go my seedlings and early veg plants started to be greener and healthier.

Does that answer your question?