- Thread starter
- #261
They are certainly recovered nicely. I would have hit them earlier in veg and then again. But that's fine you're doing great. I also responded to your pm.
Increasing yield with defoliation indoors: What's it mean? How to do it?
- Thread starter Bassman59
- Start date
Inkdot
New Member
I read your post on day 26 hehe. Before I thought defoliation was something that hydro growers did late in flowering.
Good news is I have more seeds of the same strain so next round I'll know a lot more about how to treat them.
I'll try flip them tomorrow and then I'll do the second defoliation around day 21 of flower.
Good news is I have more seeds of the same strain so next round I'll know a lot more about how to treat them.
I'll try flip them tomorrow and then I'll do the second defoliation around day 21 of flower.
JokerJohn
New Member
Joker haze
before
After
17 days later
JJ
before
After
17 days later
JJ
Hey Bassman, Just posted these to my journal and thought you might be interested.
Before
After
Before
After
that plant will bounce back quick hiker. I have been defoliating for a while now and like what I am seeing.
- Thread starter
- #266
Looks great
It already has. This picture is from Friday or Saturday.
I posted some more pics in my journal showing the recovery. There is a pic of the garden less than 24 hours after the defol, then I took another today (3-4 days after defol on Fir & Sat)
bladesmith
New Member
Good info on subject not talked about much but is real important, been wondering about this stuff, i strip like crazy, actually known for it, always seems better for em to me, going try this right now, this can only be done if experienced with your strain, think it says that in there...thanks for info...
crashnfool
New Member
So I have been quite surprised by how well this works!!!!!!!!!! Thanks Bassman for explaining what you learned so that my dumbass could understand it... 
I only have one more question to ask you so I'll ask it here for everyone to see and learn from... How many times do you feel its safe to defol in veg??? I realize that I will want a week or so before flip to allow for recovery... But I have already stripped twice and see room for at least one or possibly two more strips before veg is done for me.. This plants history started with me almost two weeks ago. She came pre-loaded with bugs and I wasn't sure she would make it at all. So I have soaked her down with just plain water for the last two weeks three times a day(foliar) and fed her every 3-4 days...She is an indica dominant Cannatonic... Supposedly a good pheno?... We'll see about that later( this was a trade deal for another plant I had just gotten) Soil and a ton of CFL's for lighting(42) .. I was going to try a side by side but due to the bug issue I want no other plants harmed during the making of this film.. (
)... P.S. no more bugs by the way...Apparently you can drown ANYTHING..
I only have one more question to ask you so I'll ask it here for everyone to see and learn from... How many times do you feel its safe to defol in veg??? I realize that I will want a week or so before flip to allow for recovery... But I have already stripped twice and see room for at least one or possibly two more strips before veg is done for me.. This plants history started with me almost two weeks ago. She came pre-loaded with bugs and I wasn't sure she would make it at all. So I have soaked her down with just plain water for the last two weeks three times a day(foliar) and fed her every 3-4 days...She is an indica dominant Cannatonic... Supposedly a good pheno?... We'll see about that later( this was a trade deal for another plant I had just gotten) Soil and a ton of CFL's for lighting(42) .. I was going to try a side by side but due to the bug issue I want no other plants harmed during the making of this film.. (
)... P.S. no more bugs by the way...Apparently you can drown ANYTHING.. - Thread starter
- #270
Glad the bugs are gone.
How many times depends on the strain and end size you want the girl. But let's look at some generalities:
1. A 1000w HPS will have best light penetration up to a max of about 36". This means anything further than 36" away from the bulb will not be getting very good light, hence basically crap bud.
2. Strain dependent, stretch will be 2x - 3x of their size when flipped to 12/12. Knowing your strain here is key. If it's 2x and you were using a 1000w hps @ 12" away from canopy, then you want to flip at 12" tall for a 24" end height.
3. Topping and bending in veg can reduce height dramatically and open up the canopy with lateral outwards bends. But you still need width with that penetration from the light. This is where your hood comes in to play. A narrow hood will not give wide & deep penetration. Multiple hood growers have less to worry about here because of overlapping light.
Now you're using cfl's. The problem with cfl's is they don't penetrate very far and they can create a lot of heat if you're using a ton of them as you state. But you can place them all over the place.
So it's going to have to be up to you to determine, based on what your conditions are and what you're seeing in your grow. Hopefully that gives you some idea though. The reason I mention defoliating twice in veg is because it promotes lots of branching and generally speaking, the plant will still be small enough that when it stretches it's within the optimal range for most home growers using reflector hoods and hps lighting or for those with enough LED lighting and also have height limitations. Folks that are using vertical hps tend to surround their plants with light and can actually grow taller as they may stack two hps vertically along side the plants and get the penetration through the sides.
How many times depends on the strain and end size you want the girl. But let's look at some generalities:
1. A 1000w HPS will have best light penetration up to a max of about 36". This means anything further than 36" away from the bulb will not be getting very good light, hence basically crap bud.
2. Strain dependent, stretch will be 2x - 3x of their size when flipped to 12/12. Knowing your strain here is key. If it's 2x and you were using a 1000w hps @ 12" away from canopy, then you want to flip at 12" tall for a 24" end height.
3. Topping and bending in veg can reduce height dramatically and open up the canopy with lateral outwards bends. But you still need width with that penetration from the light. This is where your hood comes in to play. A narrow hood will not give wide & deep penetration. Multiple hood growers have less to worry about here because of overlapping light.
Now you're using cfl's. The problem with cfl's is they don't penetrate very far and they can create a lot of heat if you're using a ton of them as you state. But you can place them all over the place.
So it's going to have to be up to you to determine, based on what your conditions are and what you're seeing in your grow. Hopefully that gives you some idea though. The reason I mention defoliating twice in veg is because it promotes lots of branching and generally speaking, the plant will still be small enough that when it stretches it's within the optimal range for most home growers using reflector hoods and hps lighting or for those with enough LED lighting and also have height limitations. Folks that are using vertical hps tend to surround their plants with light and can actually grow taller as they may stack two hps vertically along side the plants and get the penetration through the sides.
crashnfool
New Member
So light not being an issue...I guess this is the part where we experiment!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! WOOOHOOO!!! I love experimenting...Maybe I should've started a journal... Oh well I'll update you on my progress later... Thanx again for your input.. Now off to try the third strip in veg!!! 
hey bassman =)
as you probably know im not much use experimenting with anything at the moment while im battling a house full of fungus gnats =/
im just wondering what your thoughts are on experimenting your methods of defoliation blended with the GLR lighting system. i do not believe that has been covered properly and i dont see many experimentors of your defol calibre...maybe that could be your first 'just you' part of this whole defol movent
there would be a lot of very happy people if you can get glr and defol dialed in to a successful recipe =)
as you probably know im not much use experimenting with anything at the moment while im battling a house full of fungus gnats =/
im just wondering what your thoughts are on experimenting your methods of defoliation blended with the GLR lighting system. i do not believe that has been covered properly and i dont see many experimentors of your defol calibre...maybe that could be your first 'just you' part of this whole defol movent
there would be a lot of very happy people if you can get glr and defol dialed in to a successful recipe =)
- Thread starter
- #273
@ Gig, Last grow and my current grow are both using GLR & Diminishing light schedule.
fantastic!
i have found some definate usage for it in auto's...at the moment, mainly focusing on taming giants into a more reasonable grow space. my research is just on hold till my next crop....looks like 2013-2014 will give our community a final and definitive answer on all things defoliation and all the myths can be put to bed forever =)
i have found some definate usage for it in auto's...at the moment, mainly focusing on taming giants into a more reasonable grow space. my research is just on hold till my next crop....looks like 2013-2014 will give our community a final and definitive answer on all things defoliation and all the myths can be put to bed forever =)
Gig
I had a lot of gnats last grow and made significant dent in the population with 2 things
1. mosquito dunks
2. yellow sticky traps right above the soil. I made a holder for the sticky traps from pieces of old garden fence and laid them right across the top of the pots. Next grow placed right above the soil from day one and I have seen less than a dozen of them on the traps.
im just wondering what your thoughts are on experimenting your methods of defoliation blended with the GLR lighting system. i do not believe that has been covered properly and i dont see many experimentors of your defol calibre...maybe that could be your first 'just you' part of this whole defol movent
there would be a lot of very happy people if you can get glr and defol dialed in to a successful recipe =)
@ Gig, Last grow and my current grow are both using GLR & Diminishing light schedule.
I'm using GLR also.
yep got the yellow sticky traps, got more coming as well.
afaik we dont have those dunks around here. ive been using nilnat (2 doses so far) but ive just bought h202 and superthrive im going to use in combination.
wish i knew the absolute minimum h2o2 level that kills the larvae as i want to dose every few days to to kill them beyond any possibility of ressurection, lol
afaik we dont have those dunks around here. ive been using nilnat (2 doses so far) but ive just bought h202 and superthrive im going to use in combination.
wish i knew the absolute minimum h2o2 level that kills the larvae as i want to dose every few days to to kill them beyond any possibility of ressurection, lol
crashnfool
New Member
I would guess somewhere around 3-5 ml per gal. But I'm no expert.. I know that when I use h202, thats how much I use depending on plant size... But only every other watering... Warning!!! May be hazardous to beneficial microbes...
crashnfool
New Member
Just wanted to let you know that third strip is complete!!!!!! Might not get a fourth one in though.. Oh well such is life...
Typically, you want to use a beneficial bacteria regiment (ie tea) OR H2O2. The peroxide will kill all the bacteria, but it's also fairly short lived in the reservoir. If you want to use both the h2o2 and bennie tea, use the h2o2 to clean things up at res change. Then just wait a 2-3 days to add your bennies. You may need to use pretty high concentrations of h2o2 though since you will be killing off whatever members of your beneficial bacteria population is still floating around the system.
If your goal is to kill fungus gnats or some other pest, I'm not sure h2o2 is your best course. You need a pesticide. I am reluctant to recommend one, as I have no pests yet in my new room (let's hope it stays that way!), but I have been looking at the SNS stuff. I read their website and I was interested, and since then I've read a lot of folks here say they work great. If I were to buy a pesticide today, it would probably be from SNS.
Good Luck