Ahhhhhahaha! I will need to get that on consignment, or take a home loan out!
How to get started growing indoors organically - No bottles
- Thread starter COorganics
- Start date
I know. Made me laugh too.
As, Microbman has stated that it is widely believed that over 50 liters as a minimum constitutes a `Living Soil`
Does this statement stand? My space won't accommodate more than a 7 gallon pot (closets in old Victorian buildings are shallow) and I'm planning to make them no-till.
Does this statement stand? My space won't accommodate more than a 7 gallon pot (closets in old Victorian buildings are shallow) and I'm planning to make them no-till.
When I get home later I'll need to research the inocculant I purchased. This is interesting stuff, but it's still trying to find a point of understanding in my brain. LOL!
- Thread starter
- #45
that's older information and i'm not sure how mm feels about that today, maybe the same, idk. I do know that some leading authorities on LOS claim that a successful no till can be done in as small as a 5gal container. hope that helps. Your 7gal containers will treat you nice I think.
- Thread starter
- #46
is it from bas? they have a decent looking endo myco product, although im confused with the relatively small spore count on that product compared to the 2 bulk products linked above. No trichoderma in there though, and that's a good thing.
It was Mycorrhizae and Inoculants from Kelp4less
Strains included:
Beneficial Endo Mycorrhizal fungi species:
Glomus intraradices, Glomus mosseae, Glomus aggregatum, Glomus clarum, Glomus deserticola, Glomus etunicatum, Gigaspora margarita, Gigaspora brasilianum, Gigaspora monosporum
Beneficial Ecto Mycorrhizal fungi species:
Rhizopogon villosullus, Rhizopogon luteolus, Rhizopogon amylopogon, Rhizopogon fulvigleba, Pisolithus tinctorius, Laccaria bicolor, Laccaria laccata, Scleroderma cepa, Scleroderma citrinum, Suillus granulatas, Suillus punctatapies
Trichoderma species:
Trichoderma harzianum, Trichoderma konigii
Beneficial bacteria:
Bacillus subtillus, Bacillus licheniformis, Bacillus azotoformans, Bacillus megaterium, Bacillus coagulans, Bacillus pumlis, Bacillus thuringiensis, Bacillus stearothermiphilis, Paenibacillus polymyxa, Paenibacillus durum, Paenibacillus florescence, Paenibacillus gordonae, Azotobacter polymyxa, Azotobacter chroococcum, Sacchromyces cervisiae, Streptomyces griseues, Streptomyces lydicus, Pseudomonas aureofaceans, Deinococcus erythromyxa
So my question is, before I add this to my soil, should I rethink and try something else, and if so, what would you suggest? I'm still about 5 weeks from planting so there's plenty of time to reorder. The idea of beneficial fungi and spores is still very new to me. I want the best for the soil, not just the best for a quick harvest.
Strains included:
Beneficial Endo Mycorrhizal fungi species:
Glomus intraradices, Glomus mosseae, Glomus aggregatum, Glomus clarum, Glomus deserticola, Glomus etunicatum, Gigaspora margarita, Gigaspora brasilianum, Gigaspora monosporum
Beneficial Ecto Mycorrhizal fungi species:
Rhizopogon villosullus, Rhizopogon luteolus, Rhizopogon amylopogon, Rhizopogon fulvigleba, Pisolithus tinctorius, Laccaria bicolor, Laccaria laccata, Scleroderma cepa, Scleroderma citrinum, Suillus granulatas, Suillus punctatapies
Trichoderma species:
Trichoderma harzianum, Trichoderma konigii
Beneficial bacteria:
Bacillus subtillus, Bacillus licheniformis, Bacillus azotoformans, Bacillus megaterium, Bacillus coagulans, Bacillus pumlis, Bacillus thuringiensis, Bacillus stearothermiphilis, Paenibacillus polymyxa, Paenibacillus durum, Paenibacillus florescence, Paenibacillus gordonae, Azotobacter polymyxa, Azotobacter chroococcum, Sacchromyces cervisiae, Streptomyces griseues, Streptomyces lydicus, Pseudomonas aureofaceans, Deinococcus erythromyxa
So my question is, before I add this to my soil, should I rethink and try something else, and if so, what would you suggest? I'm still about 5 weeks from planting so there's plenty of time to reorder. The idea of beneficial fungi and spores is still very new to me. I want the best for the soil, not just the best for a quick harvest.
Conradino23
Well-Known Member
Just to chime in, with products like that they should present reports from agricultural studies that prove the effectiveness of inoculation. I use an Italian product basically, and it has maybe half of what you got here, but I read studies done on fruit plants, which were clearly showing the benefits. What I mean is maybe you can benefit from that kind of combo, but maybe it's just bullshit, and most of these bacterias and fungi won't even affect your grow. Colonization time is crucial usually, the longer the veg, the bigger the influence on flowering. Often some organisms compete with each other, and might affect condition of soil in a negative way. Anyway, there's much more to it than just pouring a diluted powder into the soil, or mixing powder with soil.
Keep it green
Keep it green
Just to chime in, with products like that they should present reports from agricultural studies that prove the effectiveness of inoculation. I use an Italian product basically, and it has maybe half of what you got here, but I read studies done on fruit plants, which were clearly showing the benefits. What I mean is maybe you can benefit from that kind of combo, but maybe it's just bullshit, and most of these bacterias and fungi won't even affect your grow. Colonization time is crucial usually, the longer the veg, the bigger the influence on flowering. Often some organisms compete with each other, and might affect condition of soil in a negative way. Anyway, there's much more to it than just pouring a diluted powder into the soil, or mixing powder with soil.
Keep it green
I'm beginning to understand that conradino. It all seemed so simple when I ordered it, something along the lines of more being better. I'm rethinking that approach now. I understand the value of the mycorrhizae, but I hadn't delved deeply enough into the particulars. I keep being reminded that the simplistic approach seems to be most beneficial in the end. See? I got distracted by the shiny.
I'm thankful that CO started this thread when he did. I have time to learn before beginning the grow and the investment in this product wasn't enough to make it hurt if I decide to toss it.- Thread starter
- #50
sue, ponder on it for a while. My soil has the great white product in it. It wont in the future but does now. plants are doing well in the soil. I believe it would be better to use a product without trichoderma to colonize the roots in the no till. And as far as beneficial bacterias, the verimcompost/castings and/or ACT introduces such by the millions. From reading, I would venture to guess that glomus intraradices is the most cost effective myco fungi and works well with cannabis. Im after a lb of it next time I order some things. which brings up an interesting point, since I have inoculated with the great white product in my no till containers, it may not be as easy as just sprinkling in some glomus intraradices spores. Seems I could throw some more money away that way. This trichoderma is bothersome. Looking back on a post here that cannabelle made on this thread recently, planting garlic and/or bunching onions as companion plants/living mulch may be my answer.
My thoughts exactly CO. I'll be ordering something with just glomus if I can find it. My thanks to cannabelle for sharing her knowledge here. You helped save my soil the unnecessary and ill thought out application of trichoderma. The garlic and bunching onions will also be making an appearance in my pots. They have the added benefit of being herbs that can be harvested for cooking if I choose. 
How simple that turned out to be.
How simple that turned out to be.
Does anyone know of the microbes in the Soil food web have any overlap with the Water food web?
I'm setting up a simple 40 gallon aquaponics grow area in the basement.
I plan to source the water from a healthy stream, and supplement with worm castings.
I haven't run across anything on water food web inoculants.
I'm setting up a simple 40 gallon aquaponics grow area in the basement.
I plan to source the water from a healthy stream, and supplement with worm castings.
I haven't run across anything on water food web inoculants.
- Thread starter
- #53
interesting, im no help though
I found a product that looks interesting on Amazon. Root Naturally Endo Mycorrhizae (4 oz for $8.95). That still keeps the cost of myco below $20 incl. the cost of the innoculant I won't be using. I'm not happy with the fact that the innoculant contains elements that would attack the fabric pots I will be planting in. Thank you again Cannabelle for that heads up.
Root Naturally contains Glomus intaradicea, G. mosseae, G. aggregatum and G. etynicatum.
What do you all think?
Root Naturally contains Glomus intaradicea, G. mosseae, G. aggregatum and G. etynicatum.
What do you all think?
- Thread starter
- #55
does it list spore counts?
Granular
4 oz = 27 Teaspoons = 9 Tablespoons
Packaged in easy scoop white jar
4 Species Endo-Mycorrhizae (Glomus intraradices, G. mosseae, G. aggregatum, G. etunicatum)
60,000 Propagules/lb
DarkGreenGoo
New Member
Reading through this has helped me a lot, but I am still quite confused. It's strange for me. I have been growing for quite some time now, and have mastered DWC in just about all forms. Yet I feel like a complete beginner when it comes to these types of Organics. I guess we all have to start somewhere.
So I want to get a good no-till, water only (or mainly water only) soil going. I think the soil in the OP should work for this if I am not mistaken.
What else will I need to do, and how would I go about doing it, to make it a full no-till soil?
I understand I need to topdress and mulch, but how exactly would I go about doings thi, and what should I use as mulch?
If you were going to do a notill garden/soil what exactly would you do?
I am a complete beginner when it comes to gardening like this. Where I live people have been doing Hydroponics for as long as I can remember. Only recently have been started getting into organics, as the medical laws have changed.
Most threads on the Internet seem to be discussions among people who already know what they are doing, or assume you have some knowledge in the first place.
Any help would be awesome!
So I want to get a good no-till, water only (or mainly water only) soil going. I think the soil in the OP should work for this if I am not mistaken.
What else will I need to do, and how would I go about doing it, to make it a full no-till soil?
I understand I need to topdress and mulch, but how exactly would I go about doings thi, and what should I use as mulch?
If you were going to do a notill garden/soil what exactly would you do?
I am a complete beginner when it comes to gardening like this. Where I live people have been doing Hydroponics for as long as I can remember. Only recently have been started getting into organics, as the medical laws have changed.
Most threads on the Internet seem to be discussions among people who already know what they are doing, or assume you have some knowledge in the first place.
Any help would be awesome!
Conradino23
Well-Known Member
You don't have to mulch, it's only beneficial outdoor where plants need much more nutrients than indoor. It would be actually kinda risky mulching indoor as you'd be eventually injecting nitrogen and potassium into the soil, which would destroy the nutrient balance. And you want to keep these two under control basically, don't worry about phosphorus, cause it breaks down much slower.
The good way to start is to get good black organic soil, and mix bat guano, worm castings, and compost, but without going over 30-40% with these amendments. I've been growing a lot with soil mix which is mostly compost, but after this season I'm gonna reduce it in my soil a little bit against my loam to try to raise the Brix. Commercial soil that you want to look into is ProMix I heard. Then inoculate the root with mycorrhizae and stuff that was mentioned here and you're set
The good way to start is to get good black organic soil, and mix bat guano, worm castings, and compost, but without going over 30-40% with these amendments. I've been growing a lot with soil mix which is mostly compost, but after this season I'm gonna reduce it in my soil a little bit against my loam to try to raise the Brix. Commercial soil that you want to look into is ProMix I heard. Then inoculate the root with mycorrhizae and stuff that was mentioned here and you're set
- Thread starter
- #59
You don't have to mulch, it's only beneficial outdoor where plants need much more nutrients than indoor. It would be actually kinda risky mulching indoor as you'd be eventually injecting nitrogen and potassium into the soil, which would destroy the nutrient balance
sorry Conradino, but I have to call bullshit here (with all do respect).
here is some good information.
What Should I Top Dress my Organic Grow with? - BuildASoil
Life Under The Barley Mulch - YouTube
why on earth mulch would be good for outside but not indoors in living soil containers, especially if they are larger no till containers, is beside me.
quoting bas, re: mulching indoor containers, "#1. Mulching is huge, keeping the top few inches of soil moist and alive will keep this whole system we designed into a powerful plant growing machine. This layer between the mulch and the soil will house many forms of life and also allow the plants' rizosphere to really take off and stay active in the top layer of the soil. In my opinion, mulch also eliminates over-watering just to keep the top moist. I know many growers will constantly moisten the top of the soil while the lights are constantly drying it out.... it's like a never ending battle until the canopy is full.
How important is mulch? I'll let you decide. (Read the Full Blog Post Here)"
Conradino23
Well-Known Member
Ok, if it's good indoor, and doesn't mess with nutrient balance, I'm not opposed to the idea. I just wanted to say you can start much easier if you're a noob, and then take it from there after a run or two.
