HedoneSpirit's First Pre To Post Indoor Grow Journal: 600W & Veg Bulb

[BluePhoric]

Good point, suddenly it seems straight forward. Although.Is it better to direct the camera towards the light source, or direct the camera on to said subject? Since I'm comparing this may not matter.

Find the way (light sensor towards the light) where the spot reads the brightest (should be right under the spot), at the level of the canopy of the plants. Note that reading. Then move to the outside 4 corners of your plants and note that. Compare 250/400/600w if desired.

FYI, I measured between 27,000 and 30,000 Lux on the top of my plants, using my 23w CFLs.

I think anything between 15,000 and 40,000 will give good vegetative growth.
Elongation can be caused by a lack of lumens, but is also a factor of light spectrum, blue vs red spectrum. More blue light promotes shorter internodes, less elongation. Absence of blue light (i.e. hps bulb or 2700k cfls) promotes more elongation.

I saw recommendations of between 45,000 and 65,000 Lux for flowering (minimum of 35,000).

Well, on that, I'm on the low side, but I flowered with my same 27k-30k lux Cfls and they flowered fine ;-)

I suppose that having 30,000 lux directly over EACH single cola is maybe better than having an uneven coverage ranging from 20,000 to 45,000 in different spots of the plant...

BP

 

[Phalangeal_Worrior]

Find the way (light sensor towards the light) where the spot reads the brightest (should be right under the spot), at the level of the canopy of the plants. Note that reading. Then move to the outside 4 corners of your plants and note that. Compare 250/400/600w if desired.

FYI, I measured between 27,000 and 30,000 Lux on the top of my plants, using my 23w CFLs.

I think anything between 15,000 and 40,000 will give good vegetative growth.
Elongation can be caused by a lack of lumens, but is also a factor of light spectrum, blue vs red spectrum. More blue light promotes shorter internodes, less elongation. Absence of blue light (i.e. hps bulb or 2700k cfls) promotes more elongation.

I saw recommendations of between 45,000 and 65,000 Lux for flowering (minimum of 35,000).

Well, on that, I'm on the low side, but I flowered with my same 27k-30k lux Cfls and they flowered fine ;-)

I suppose that having 30,000 lux directly over EACH single cola is maybe better than having an uneven coverage ranging from 20,000 to 45,000 in different spots of the plant...

BP

Cool, I'll have fun playing around with this today. I assume that this app is accurate enough to give me a vague value that I can compare to your results and ranges.

Did you self teach yourself all of the technicalities? I'm appreciating the level of competence .

 

[Phalangeal_Worrior]

Week 2 - testing height against wattage

Very pretty. The CK(bigger one) seems to have a tiny brown spot for a while now, hasn't advanced at all so I won't worry. I imagine it's a dry spot

 

[Phalangeal_Worrior]

Whilst taking measurements my lights timed to be off.

Got as far as recording 32,000 lx for 250w at 45 cm. I'll try it at a closer distance to see what difference it makes. On the other hand, having it this distance allows room for grow and error, but importantly to not need the extraction as high. I'll see what difference 10cm makes to the 250w and see if it's worth the compromise.

I could also use the 400w at 45cm but, again less room for error. Importantly for me would be more light energy wasted due to all the area of non-vegetation receiving light

I think before I need to worry about light power to height, I should wait until the plants can fullfil a square. 40cm at 250 is my choice for now recording 35000lx, little low with the positive of having good blue spectrum from the MH bulb.

 

[BluePhoric]

Whilst taking measurements my lights timed to be off.

Got as far as recording 32,000 lx for 250w at 45 cm. I'll try it at a closer distance to see what difference it makes. On the other hand, having it this distance allows room for grow and error, but importantly to not need the extraction as high. I'll see what difference 10cm makes to the 250w and see if it's worth the compromise.

I could also use the 400w at 45cm but, again less room for error. Importantly for me would be more light energy wasted due to all the area of non-vegetation receiving light

I think before I need to worry about light power to height, I should wait until the plants can fullfil a square. 40cm at 250 is my choice for now recording 35000lx, little low with the positive of having good blue spectrum from the MH bulb.

Inverse square law of light : The Inverse law states that the Intensity of waves on any body is inversely proportional to the square of the distance from the source.

If you move the same light from 45cm to 40cm, you'll go from 32k Lux to ~40k Lux. But coverage may suffer and heat will be higher on the foliage, so consider that too. 43 cm should give you 35k Lux ;-)

 

[Phalangeal_Worrior]

First symptom. New leafs, coming slow and in ill health (see pic below).
My initial thought is with the feed. I think I'll fix up a new one, safest bet. I think trying to correct it with out much Idea of the problem.
Tonight I'll just bring the pH down from 6.3 to 5.7.
Tomorrow new mix. This time a slightly lower amount of nutrients.

 

[BluePhoric]

Where do you see a problem ?

Description of whats wrong ?

Your photos of the 2 plants from the top this morning looked fine !

Why lower the nutrients, they dont look like having any toxicity ?

 

[Phalangeal_Worrior]

The tips of new leafs are discolouring. Almost identical for both plants. The broader plant has more curling, see picture one.
The plants overall are in good health. One note is the RH is generally low.

There is one small and one small brown dot on the upper leafs of the broad plant. I concluded it was the harsh dry heat as there also was a slight leaf buckling to accompany it. Cooled the temps and made a small change of the RH.

Even though the plant growth seems a little slow the roots have advanced well.

 

[BluePhoric]

I see absolutely nothing wrong.

You're showing the tips of the cotyledons (the first round leaves from seed)... those are useless and will die, it's ok.

 

[Phalangeal_Worrior]

The nutrient level I disire to fine tune. Before I didn't mathematically concoct the solution ratio. After working out the ratios of nutrients feed to supplements, I know I over did the supplements.

I'm probably wasting feed.... Sigh... Oh well

 

[Phalangeal_Worrior]

Oh shit Big blue, I'm a stoned moron.
This what happens when I look forward problems, I find them.

When i have a hammer.

Thanks again!

 

[Phalangeal_Worrior]

Lux update:

Well measuring the lux on 250w ~40cm wasn't possible due to the app blanking when it reaches above 32k. I quickly concluded that above 32lux is enough, considering it's benifical to the environment.

As the area taken increases, I'll measure again to compare the lumen. This time I'll put the device further away.

 

[Phalangeal_Worrior]

Today I think about Topping and Fimming.

Fimming seems to be an obvious choice because the plants will have 'more Cola's and less stress'.

Anyway I'm going to compare techniques with both plants and come to my own conclusion.

Looking around it seems a lot of growers would of topped by now. Some growers leave it longer. I've concluded I can wait.

 

[Phalangeal_Worrior]

My version of a humidifier.

Was putting the wet tray in the tent but stagnant water is a pest best friend. So have a filtered intake bringing in my 'humidified' air.

 

[BluePhoric]

My experience with fimming was not so good.

I FIMed 2 plants in the hope of at least 1 success. I had read all I could read about it and was ready.
One was cut too short it seems and was topped instead, the other was fimed but did not grow well at the fimmed end, and I ended up re-topping her later.

I.M.O. Topping is more straight forward, gives you 2 tops and works well. Fimming is more hit-n-miss, and all plants may not react as well as others. After my experience I decided I'd never try fimming again.

Topping does not produce only two tops in reality, because you break the apical dominance of that top and redirect growth elsewhere and new tops begin emerging here and there from the main stem. I ended up with 10 and 11 tops on my 2 plants; They were only topped once, and then LST the rest of the grow.

BP

 

[Phalangeal_Worrior]

My experience with fimming was not so good.

I FIMed 2 plants in the hope of at least 1 success. I had read all I could read about it and was ready.
One was cut too short it seems and was topped instead, the other was fimed but did not grow well at the fimmed end, and I ended up re-topping her later.

I.M.O. Topping is more straight forward, gives you 2 tops and works well. Fimming is more hit-n-miss, and all plants may not react as well as others. After my experience I decided I'd never try fimming again.

Topping does not produce only two tops in reality, because you break the apical dominance of that top and redirect growth elsewhere and new tops begin emerging here and there from the main stem. I ended up with 10 and 11 tops on my 2 plants; They were only topped once, and then LST the rest of the grow.

BP

Ah thank you for your insight once again Mr Phoric. I am choosing to follow it, this time .
If topping is a safer bet, I'll wait until I have a greater number of plants before I start performing high risk surgeries.

Now, since I'm no longer comparing FIM /w Top, I shall top at different times see if any shock is reduced.

Before my first top I'm aiming to have the stem, at least twice the size it is currently.

Three reasons why,
- small node spacing making it
difficult

- my instinct tells me not to stress
out such a young plant.

- I would like to have more of an
idea how I'm going to adjust
future growth

 

[BluePhoric]

Do you have a side-view photo of plant today ?

 

[Phalangeal_Worrior]

Week 3:

Side pic of plant today

Pinapple K

Critical K

The tin foil is to help keep nutrients cool. Using it until I have a water thermometer and a can safely use ice packs.

 

[BluePhoric]

I know the small node spacing makes it hard to see where to cut, but the thing is... at the top of the plant it will always be like that.

You can isolate the part to cut with tweezers or toothpicks...
If you can target the very top new leaves AND cut the tip of the stem, it'l be a successful topping and the plant wont be in a big shock. She will start growing elsewhere, and that gives the impression of being stunned for a few days...

 

[Phalangeal_Worrior]

Week 3, Tuesday.

Topped the smaller plant, PK. Let's see how it does.

Pictures.

Before

After

Brought a disposable scalpel... So sharp.