Haight Solid State vs. H.G.LED

[slimm]

Re: 420 Consumer Reports Competition - Haight Solid State vs. Hydro Grow LED

I also wondered about reusing the runoff but worry about the possible buildup of salts or the mix being too weak. Any opinions or experience with this? I know most hydro systems reuse the nutes so why not in a hempy?

It's doable - I'm new to hydro so I have no experience with anything other than pouring hydro nutes into hempies and watching the runoff go down the drain. Once I understand how to add organics into the mix I will figure out the recirculating thing too.

SS, congrats on a great grow and a nice harvest!

 

[Doc Bud]

Re: 420 Consumer Reports Competition - Haight Solid State vs. Hydro Grow LED

I had a difficult first grow due to the poor drainage of FFOF. FFOF needs to be amended with at least 50% perlite. I now grow in perlite (really chunky #4) with a little coco and I water every other day. The watering frequency will increase during flowering. I use hempy buckets which, when coupled with the right medium, are impossible to over water. The only problem I have with my system is that it is currently drain to waste which is not environmentally sound. I will be making changes to recirculate the nutes and mix in some organics during flowering.

I went from feeling totally at the mercy of the soil to being in total control of my plants with the move from FFOF to perlite + coco.

I've already gotten in trouble on this journal for talking about HID's before the time.....so at great risk of horrible punishment, I'll offer my view on drain to waste.

Drain to waste is the most economical and environmentally sound practice in hydroponics...provided the bucket/pots have an internal reservoir, IE Hempy/bato buckets.

Think about this for a second: lets say you grow 10 plants Ebb nGrow. You'll have a 30-45 gallon res....correct? That means that each week, you dump 45-60 gallons of nutrient mix down the drain.

Now, if you grow 10 plants in 2 gallon hempy buckets, you use no more than 15 gallons of water/nutes per week, watering every other day. The waste from each watering is about 10-15%.....so about 1.5 gallons of waste per week.....plus what the plants eat.

But the waste is the thing to focus on....I pour about 1.5 gallons a week into my backyard. That's nothing.

If I had a 45 gallon reservoir, I'd dump 45 gallons a week down the drain.

Drain to waste leaves the smallest footprint and is also very economical to boot. There are other factors that make drain to waste the right choice.....you don't have a huge res that fluctuates in PH....you don't need a chiller, or a warmer.

 

[slimm]

Re: 420 Consumer Reports Competition - Haight Solid State vs. Hydro Grow LED

Thanks for the clarification Doc. Now I can actually feel good knowing that I am using the least wasteful method.

 

[Setting Sun]

Re: 420 Consumer Reports Competition - Haight Solid State vs. Hydro Grow LED

...and I put in a plug for the hydroponic method, specifically, Deep Water Culture.

Ok, then I will add yang to your yin and put a plug in for soil, specifically FFOF with plenty o' perlite .

 

[Setting Sun]

Re: 420 Consumer Reports Competition - Haight Solid State vs. Hydro Grow LED

Those roots looked really healthy. Cover the soil profile evenly from top to bottom, white, and of different sizes. Sign of a pro grower. Great job and can't wait for the final weights.

They did look good. I was wondering if the LED lights were going to affect the root balls in any way because of the lower metabolic demands on the plants, but the root balls were large and filled the pots in evenly.

thanks bro

<--- Dirt root envy !

Those roots look extremely healthy !

Will you please remind me what your final potting mix was ?

And

If/What would you change about it ?

+ Rep



MJ420

Originally, I had planned to go with Fox Farms Ocean Forest soil and 25% perlite, but I upped it to 33% at the last minute as I was mixing it up for two reasons.

The first is that plants under LED lights use less water because of decreased transpiration and soil evaporation, and the second is that I know myself well enough to know that if I'm going to screw up in soil, it's going to be on the side of over-watering, not under-watering, so the additional drainage from the extra perlite gave me a larger margin for error as regards over-watering.

There are no free rides though, so the trade-off for that choice was possibly having to water more frequently during flowering, but with these two lights and the 2-gallon rose pots, the HGL tent (which needed more frequent watering) only required water and/or nutes every 2-3 days.

It was a gamble that turned out OK, but it could have been a disaster since I had to leave town for 3 days during the bloom cycle.

thanks for your comments and rep

I'll let SS give you his potting mix.....but if you want roots like that, it's really quite simple:

Perlite. You can't have too much! In fact, I grow in 100% perlite.....the roots are fantastic.

Our beloved plant is quite happy growing in pure perlite, promix, volcanic rock, etc.

It's a plant that thrives in a well-drained medium, so pure perlite with hydro nutes makes them very happy, as your Hempy grows and other Hempy grows have shown.

When you get a chance, check out "aquatic soil". This stuff retains 50% of it's weight in water, is completely PH neutral because it's used in ponds with fish and plants, and is a much better amendment as far as water retention than vermiculite, which you know I won't allow anywhere near my plants .

I think adding 25-33% of that stuff to perlite would be a good Hempy mix.

Hey DocBud,

I completely agree.
My current grow was my first time using FFOF and at first I was advised to cut with approx 25% perlite.
Well that just didn't cut the mustard , I was having up to ten days between waterings .
Now, my final mix is FFOF, FFLW, Verm, and perlite with mostly FFLW and perlite.

SS you used FFOF for this if I'm not mistaken , IYO is 25% perlite an undercut ?

I feel like my next grow will have to be some sort of soil-less , how often do you water in pure perlite .

MJ420

Too many growers have grown too many plants just fine in straight FFOF for me to believe that you *have* to add perlite to it to be successful, but having your soil compact during the grow and get too soggy isn't an easy thing to fix. Don't ask me how I know this . It only took me two failed and one almost-failed grow before I learned to not pack soil tightly into my pots, and to make sure that my medium is light and drains well.

You're cutting down the nute package that FF designed into the soil, but you can make up for that by using your own nutes. FFOF is a rich, high-quality soil that IMO can handle being cut by 25-50% and still work very well.

I had to wipe the drool off my chin and keyboard. Beautiful!

Thanks! It was fun using the camera again after playing with the other gadgets lately.

I had a difficult first grow due to the poor drainage of FFOF. FFOF needs to be amended with at least 50% perlite. I now grow in perlite (really chunky #4) with a little coco and I water every other day. The watering frequency will increase during flowering. I use hempy buckets which, when coupled with the right medium, are impossible to over water. The only problem I have with my system is that it is currently drain to waste which is not environmentally sound. I will be making changes to recirculate the nutes and mix in some organics during flowering.

I went from feeling totally at the mercy of the soil to being in total control of my plants with the move from FFOF to perlite + coco.

coco/perlite seems to be a great combo for soil-less. What size buckets are you using, and are you using coco-specific nutes?

 

[ledtester]

Re: 420 Consumer Reports Competition - Haight Solid State vs. Hydro Grow LED

I also wondered about reusing the runoff but worry about the possible buildup of salts or the mix being too weak. Any opinions or experience with this? I know most hydro systems reuse the nutes so why not in a hempy?

Hey warrior here's lot's of info on these very subjects...
Nutrient Solution Management and Longevity
.............................All about water wait till tomorrow!

 

[Setting Sun]

Re: 420 Consumer Reports Competition - Haight Solid State vs. Hydro Grow LED

Great pics bro! I am struggling to get bud shots like that. Its harder than one would think to get good light and a steady shot of a small thing like that.

Well, you just gotta time the pics between the butterfly farts in China, lol.

Can't tell from the pics, were the HSS ones a little more amber?

Yes, the HSS buds were a tad more amber at harvest.

Man this journal is just awesome right up to the last drop!

Glad you're enjoying it!

I'm having a good time .

Quick follow up:

I'm still learning about the LEDs, but is it possible that given the difference in weight. The HSS light is better in flowering vs veg for the HGL. I also seem to like the tris from the HSS a little more for some reason.

Not sure I'm following PG. Did you mean that the HSS might be better at veg?, because the HGL seems to have done better in flowering.

 

[Setting Sun]

Re: 420 Consumer Reports Competition - Haight Solid State vs. Hydro Grow LED

I also wondered about reusing the runoff but worry about the possible buildup of salts or the mix being too weak. Any opinions or experience with this? I know most hydro systems reuse the nutes so why not in a hempy?

You mean re-using it by collecting it and pouring it back through by hand-watering?

I've read of people doing that without problems.

As doc mentioned though, you really don't waste that much with Hempys to begin with, so I might try it with caution, but generally I like to go with what works well for most folks, and most folks run-to-waste.

I'd just use it for my houseplants and garden, so there wouldn't be much waste either way.

 

[Setting Sun]

Re: 420 Consumer Reports Competition - Haight Solid State vs. Hydro Grow LED

nice work SS. . . sea of trichs!!! love it! both lights did a fine job in that department.

thanks wheelo

they really did a fine job in the sticky department.

I use the glass of rubbing alcohol and switch between two scissors thing while trimming, and I did observe that when trimming the HGL buds, I had to switch scissors with about twice the frequency of the HSS buds.

Both lights showed good trich production, however.

And soon we'll be hearing how they taste, smell, and effect

Hopefully tomorrow!

Mrs. Sun and I are planning a little double-blind testing .

 

[Setting Sun]

Re: 420 Consumer Reports Competition - Haight Solid State vs. Hydro Grow LED

Thanks for the clarification Doc. Now I can actually feel good knowing that I am using the least wasteful method.

It's really a great method for lots of reasons.

Do you have any stability issues with your plants in the coco/perlite?

I know that in pure perlite, sometimes the roots don't have enough support.

 

[slimm]

Re: 420 Consumer Reports Competition - Haight Solid State vs. Hydro Grow LED

thanks wheelo

they really did a fine job in the sticky department.

I use the glass of rubbing alcohol and switch between two scissors thing while trimming, and I did observe that when trimming the HGL buds, I had to switch scissors with about twice the frequency of the HSS buds.

Both lights showed good trich production, however.



Hopefully tomorrow!

Mrs. Sun and I are planning a little double-blind testing .

That's a pretty significant difference! I wonder if there are qualitative differences between the plants. I'm sure we will find out after your smoke test.

...

coco/perlite seems to be a great combo for soil-less. What size buckets are you using, and are you using coco-specific nutes?

...

Do you have any stability issues with your plants in the coco/perlite?

I know that in pure perlite, sometimes the roots don't have enough support.

It is a good medium. I am using 60/40 perlite to coco in bato buckets and feeding with GH Flora series hydroponic nutrients. I'm not settled on that ratio yet - I may want to use a little less coco and drip feed them frequently.

The medium holds enough moisture to remain fairly stable and I am using very large chunks of perlite that tend to stay in position well when combined with the coco. Plus, I water before it dries out completely so the root mass is holding some moisture between pockets of air and the bucket's reservoir contains water, adding weight. Hydroton can be used as a top dressing to further hold roots in place. I plan to stake a tall, narrow vertical screen into each bucket to keep the buds away from the vertically oriented bulbs and provide added stability.

 

[Keith Lake]

Re: 420 Consumer Reports Competition - Haight Solid State vs. Hydro Grow LED

What a fantastic demonstration - mad props to setting sun for his flawless execution while under the spotlight

While we await the final weights and measures, we thought we might generate a bit of buzz for setting sun's next project

420 Magazine is pleased to announce the next installment in our ongoing series of competitions and demonstrations.

GrowLEDHydro's 300 watt vs. 400 watt HPS

We're still hashing out the details and are open to feedback However our overarching goal in this next demonstration is to optimize each tent for maximum yield as opposed to controlling for identical inputs. We'll rely on setting sun's experience with HPS in one tent and utilize GrowLEDHydro's set points and instructions in the other tent.

We hope you'll all stop by the new thread, when it's launched later in April, and join in with the adventure

 

[Tyrone Hamilton]

Re: 420 Consumer Reports Competition - Haight Solid State vs. Hydro Grow LED

GrowLEDHydro's 300 watt vs. 400 watt HPS

We're still hashing out the details and are open to feedback However our overarching goal in this next demonstration is to optimize each tent for maximum yield as opposed to controlling for identical inputs. We'll rely on setting sun's experience with HPS in one tent and utilize GrowLEDHydro's set points and instructions in the other tent.

We hope you'll all stop by the new thread, when it's launched later in April, and join in with the adventure

 

[1234a5678b]

Re: 420 Consumer Reports Competition - Haight Solid State vs. Hydro Grow LED

That should be interesting.

 

[OldMedMan]

Re: 420 Consumer Reports Competition - Haight Solid State vs. Hydro Grow LED

What a fantastic demonstration - mad props to setting sun for his flawless execution while under the spotlight

While we await the final weights and measures, we thought we might generate a bit of buzz for setting sun's next project

420 Magazine is pleased to announce the next installment in our ongoing series of competitions and demonstrations.

GrowLEDHydro's 300 watt vs. 400 watt HPS

We're still hashing out the details and are open to feedback However our overarching goal in this next demonstration is to optimize each tent for maximum yield as opposed to controlling for identical inputs. We'll rely on setting sun's experience with HPS in one tent and utilize GrowLEDHydro's set points and instructions in the other tent.

We hope you'll all stop by the new thread, when it's launched later in April, and join in with the adventure

Of Course we will!

 

[hydronewbie]

Re: 420 Consumer Reports Competition - Haight Solid State vs. Hydro Grow LED

What a fantastic demonstration - mad props to setting sun for his flawless execution while under the spotlight

While we await the final weights and measures, we thought we might generate a bit of buzz for setting sun's next project

420 Magazine is pleased to announce the next installment in our ongoing series of competitions and demonstrations.

GrowLEDHydro's 300 watt vs. 400 watt HPS

We're still hashing out the details and are open to feedback However our overarching goal in this next demonstration is to optimize each tent for maximum yield as opposed to controlling for identical inputs. We'll rely on setting sun's experience with HPS in one tent and utilize GrowLEDHydro's set points and instructions in the other tent.

We hope you'll all stop by the new thread, when it's launched later in April, and join in with the adventure

420magazine/Setting Sun:
Any thoughts about complementing the next grow with audio/video snippets?
This would assist those like me who struggle with dyslexia or are challenged with reading comprehension. Just an idea.

If so, all I ask is that Setting Sun keeps his clothes on...my mother in-law reported that he has some peculiar proclivities about gardening in the buff.

 

[IrishBoy]

Re: 420 Consumer Reports Competition - Haight Solid State vs. Hydro Grow LED

What a fantastic demonstration - mad props to setting sun for his flawless execution while under the spotlight

While we await the final weights and measures, we thought we might generate a bit of buzz for setting sun's next project

420 Magazine is pleased to announce the next installment in our ongoing series of competitions and demonstrations.

GrowLEDHydro's 300 watt vs. 400 watt HPS

We're still hashing out the details and are open to feedback However our overarching goal in this next demonstration is to optimize each tent for maximum yield as opposed to controlling for identical inputs. We'll rely on setting sun's experience with HPS in one tent and utilize GrowLEDHydro's set points and instructions in the other tent.

We hope you'll all stop by the new thread, when it's launched later in April, and join in with the adventure

i think two 180's would kick ass and you would get more covarge area, their for grow bigger plants and get fatter buds

300w would be cool to see also against a 400w hps. cant wait to see this one

 

[Mmmmick]

Re: 420 Consumer Reports Competition - Haight Solid State vs. Hydro Grow LED

This was an awesome comp grow and the next installment is gonna be excellent. SS is turned loose to tweak to his hearts content.

Definitely grabbing a chair for the new grow Setting Sun.
Don't forget to wear a hard hat, lol....

 

[Maccar]

Re: 420 Consumer Reports Competition - Haight Solid State vs. Hydro Grow LED

Cant wait. It looks as though im going to spend another 3 months glued to the pc waiting for SS's new pics and comments!!!

 

[Setting Sun]

Re: 420 Consumer Reports Competition - Haight Solid State vs. Hydro Grow LED

dry weights & smoke report

The buds are fairly solid and weren't all that wet when harvested, so as I suspected, they didn't lose 75% of their wet weight.


HSS total yield: 48g

HGL total yield: 117g



SMOKE REPORT

I like to use this glass one-hitter for my smoke report research. It smokes very clean, and it's real easy to clean in-between samples if I'm comparing different strains, buds, etc.


I sampled the HSS bud this morning and the HGL bud this evening.

As I've mentioned in previous journals, since becoming a medical marijuana patient, my priorities have changed somewhat as regards what's important to me in the final product.

If it doesn't work for well for me medically, then flavor, aroma, bag appeal, etc., doesn't matter all that much to me.

I'm currently an even better test bed for pain-relief than usual because I had a nasty fall a few days ago and I'm still not back to my baseline level of back pain.

The pain-relief from these buds is excellent. Easily the best analgesia I've experienced from medical marijuana. It's faster and more effective than anti-inflammatory meds like Advil, and for moderate pain, I think it would work just as well for me as opiate pain meds, which I do much better avoiding. Both the HSS and HGL buds seemed equal in this regards.

The aroma and taste are still developing and need at least a couple of more weeks to achieve their potential, but it's very pleasant smoke right now.

Not a hint of skunk and they don't smell really strong like OG kush, just the same earthy mustiness that they had in bloom and a hint of citrus. Some of the plants have more of an orange citrus aroma and some more like pink grapefruit.

It smokes very smooth and neutral. The earthiness and citrus come through slightly, but overall I'd say it's just smooth and neutral. Not too much character in the flavor, but it's not harsh or unpleasant in any way.

Now, the effect. This is the most potent herb I've ever smoked. One or two rips is plenty for me. More than that would only be good if I was heading straight for bed. As Barney's states about this strain, it provides "comfortable couchlock". The effect is like wrapping yourself up with a nice warm heavy blanket. No paranoia, no anxiety, just a very warm and comfortable body and head effect. If you take that one extra rip or two though, you might as well pack it in . The effect lasts well.

I did not notice any significant differences in taste, aroma or effect between the HSS and the HGL groups, outside of the HSS 2 sativa pheno, which has a much stronger grapefruit aroma than any of the other plants. I did not sample the HSS 2 plant, so I can't comment on whether its effect is different, but I'll check it out tomorrow . The HGL buds are somewhat stickier and denser, but the quality of both groups seems about equal.

PAIN-RELIEF: 9-10/10

AROMA: 6-7/10 (and improving)

TASTE: 6/10 (smooth, still developing, but lacks character at this point)

POTENCY: 10/10 (my new benchmark)