Building A Better Soil: Demonstrations & Discussions Of Organic Soil Recipes

Robert Celt said:
Morning Yankee :)

If you have had that soil cooking in the dark/shade, it could be mycorrhizae, the fungus that aids in nutrient transport.

Warm, humid and dark/dim conditions, it will appear above ground. I have seen it appear over night in the pot Big Momma was in (outside) only to disappear once the sun shone on the soil.

It appears as a bright white 'fuzz' and if that is what it is, it is a good thing. Your plants will be better for it :thumb:
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Once the soil was mixed, I added some water to it to moisten things up and covered it. The container is in an area under a table (nice and dark) and I just pull it out once a week to "stir things up"...
 
What Yankeetoker hasn't mentioned here is that one of 3 plants responded badly to the transplant into this new soil - at the same time as a switch to Mars Hydro LEDs.

YT has treating with Cal-Mag. I can't say whether Cal-Mag is friendly to the health of the new soil and I am befussled by the whole situation.


If anyone want to pop over there and take a look at this evolving plant/soil/light issue:
Yankeetoker's 2nd Grow Attempt - 2016 - All Advice Welcome!
 
Radogast said:
What Yankeetoker hasn't mentioned here is that one of 3 plants responded badly to the transplant into this new soil - at the same time as a switch to Mars Hydro LEDs.

YT has treating with Cal-Mag. I can't say whether Cal-Mag is friendly to the health of the new soil and I am befussled by the whole situation.


If anyone want to pop over there and take a look at this evolving plant/soil/light issue:
Yankeetoker's 2nd Grow Attempt - 2016 - All Advice Welcome!
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I really think it's the lights...the plant squarely under the HPS is looking pretty good....

The CalMag I added is Botanicare (which claims it is organic)....

...as Radogast said, I'm perplexed as well and hope that some of you experts can help me out.

YT
 
Mag issues are from the leds. Primary red/blue led fixtures hit chlorophyll a and b hard and they become the primary source of energy for the plant. Chlorophyll requires alot of Mg. Always had Mg deficiencies under Mars leds.

IMG_20160422_170734.jpg
 
Atulip said:
Mag issues are from the leds. Primary red/blue led fixtures hit chlorophyll a and b hard and they become the primary source of energy for the plant. Chlorophyll requires alot of Mg. Always had Mg deficiencies under Mars leds.

IMG_20160422_170734.jpg
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So should I add CalMag to my watering regimen? I currently have a 150w HPS and a Mars Hydro reflector 48 in my tent. The plant primarily under the HPS is doing well...the plant under the Mars Hydro not so much...
 
Atulip said:
If it's just Mag, you can get some Epsom salts and add up a tbs to a gallon and water in.
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Ok, so I'm getting it now....CalMag for Calcium deficiencies and Epsom salt for magnesium deficiencies (can be watered in or used as a foliar spray (which I did to the worst of my 3 plants).

Be prepared to consistently add epsom salt in some fashion when using Mars Hydro lights.

Thanks...

YT
 
YT, what is your bloom mix? I veg under the old model and 48x3 and have NEVER had cal mag issues. I haven't flowered under them except as extra light for the 400w or 1000w hps(in the winter).

It looks like a root or watering issue to me. What % of your overall mix is aeration?
 
I have never used cal mag, and I have most of my Epsom salt somewhere around here. It was used on tomatoes outside more than anything, but I haven't touched it in months.

Congrats on the fuzz, to attract more you can add some oatmeal to the top of your mix.
 
EsNero said:
Thank-you Robert celt for taking the time and the info. You, 36grow and Heirloom provided enough info for me to start with making the perfect soil. :goodjob: :thanks:
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You are much welcome EsNero :thumb:

Just keep in mind that as "perfect" as we try to make our soil, we can still run into issues, as witnessed by YankeeToker in the posts above. It pays to keep some Epsom Salt on hand as more often than not, if a deficiency occurs, it will be due to Mg. Some plants, especially under LEDs are more prone to it than others.

And reps+ to Atulip for stepping up and providing an explanation to YankeeToker :thumb:

RC
 
I mixed up a batch of soil about 10 days ago and yesterday finally got around to cleaning up the leftovers, which had been sitting in/under the tarp I mixed it on. Lo and behold: Fuzz!

IMG_189527.jpg


I immediately thought of all you cool cats and all the good stuff I've learnt here already!
 
Robert Celt said:
Just keep in mind that as "perfect" as we try to make our soil, we can still run into issues, as witnessed by YankeeToker in the posts above. It pays to keep some Epsom Salt on hand as more often than not, if a deficiency occurs, it will be due to Mg. Some plants, especially under LEDs are more prone to it than others.
RC
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A well built soil with the correct amounts of minerals will not run into mag deficiencies if you water correctly. Wet/dry cycles and being rootbound can cause issues. High room temps or low root temps can cause problems. Lack of light to the plant too.

Ewc, compost, and mulching help with that.

Everyone has different soil mixes. I don't like recommending much due to the many variations in mixes and grow styles. If someone is growing "organic" and has a problem, the first thing to do is apply an ewc or compost tea and wait a few days. That tea is around 1 cup of ewc/compost and a few globs of molasses per 5g, and aerate for a day. If that doesn't work after 10 days or so, I would do a 1/4 cup alfalfa meal or neem meal, and 1/4 cup kelp meal per 5g water. Stir with a stick whenever or bubble with something. You should see results soon after. This is standard practice for many, I'm just repeating others after seeing the same thing.

Soil is the collection of living organisms that work together to grow an incredible plant. Give them an environment to thrive in, and growing is easy.
 
36Gr0w said:
A well built soil with the correct amounts of minerals will not run into mag deficiencies if you water correctly. Wet/dry cycles and being rootbound can cause issues. High room temps or low root temps can cause problems. Lack of light to the plant too.

Ewc, compost, and mulching help with that.

Everyone has different soil mixes. I don't like recommending much due to the many variations in mixes and grow styles. If someone is growing "organic" and has a problem, the first thing to do is apply an ewc or compost tea and wait a few days. That tea is around 1 cup of ewc/compost and a few globs of molasses per 5g, and aerate for a day. If that doesn't work after 10 days or so, I would do a 1/4 cup alfalfa meal or neem meal, and 1/4 cup kelp meal per 5g water. Stir with a stick whenever or bubble with something. You should see results soon after. This is standard practice for many, I'm just repeating others after seeing the same thing.

Soil is the collection of living organisms that work together to grow an incredible plant. Give them an environment to thrive in, and growing is easy.
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Thank you for reinforcing the simplicity of growing in LOS.
 
Morning Yankee :)

I would never consider an organic soil ruined, sometimes flaws/errors in preparation may cause deficiencies.

There are certain compounds that need to be in the right ratios for healthy grow. There is a whole science around soil and plant growth involving biochemistry and exchange rates, but to keep it simple "too much of a good thing can be bad"

You were experiencing Cal/Mag issues which can be caused by a number of things. Too much potassium in your mix can cause Mg lockout which will lead to calcium deficiencies as well. As Atulip mentioned, light types can cause issues with nutrient uptake and LEDs can be notorious for this.

If the foliar spray is helping, then water your girls with a tablespoon or two of Epsom Salt in the water to increase the magnesium levels in your soil. Wait a few days to see how they respond before adding more.

Much of the information passed around is based on Hydro and Salt-Based feeds that have been used for years, and doesn't really apply to organic soils. Flushing for example does little for organics as the nutrients are not in a salt form and are not easily washed out of the soil.
One thing the Hydro people do say, that we all need to learn, is to watch your plants as you feed them and see how they respond. If they respond poorly, cut the feed back.

This applies to us with ACTs as well. If a plant responds well to the application, all is good and you can try feeding more/more often. If it responds poorly, cut back on the application.

Once we learn to read our girls, they will tell us what they want or don't want :)
 
yankeetoker said:
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I know it goes against the idea of LOS, but the CalMag and Epsom salt foliar really helped this girl....

Can I give a compost tea next watering or is the soil "ruined"?
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I may be off but this doesn't look like Mg deficiency. . The lower older leaves should develop interveinal chlorosis first, then it progresses upwards. Zinc, manganese, and iron deficiency start at newer growth. This appears to be starting in the middle.

Molybdenum deficiency has interveinal chlorosis in the middle growth, work it's way upward and will have a distinct red/orange color on leaf edges.

Bottom right corner you u can see the red, this is late flowering. I have more in mid flowering showing molybdenum deficiency. I believe low soil pH is my issue.
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