Xlr8's Hydroponic Adventures & Photos From The Garden - 2012

Thank you guys, for the all the replies.
Your answers actually, will save me money and a lot of hassle, to mess up with a ton of equipment !!

I was expecting to hear that kind of answers, -about adding nutrients to the res, but I was just to be sure on this !
So no adding extra nutes, just top off with water until res change !!-
Not wasting money, too ... :)

Considering that I won't have heat issues as I'm using LEDS, I'm gonna follow -your example xlr8 and jandre , of no adding an extra pump in the system, specially now it is proofed , is not needed ! Keep it simple, is what I need at this phase, anyway.-
..And yes, I don't want any microbes in my sterile-system i'm going to use ...
This is a valuable (new), info !!!!

I'm not saying anything about ph doser, you answers were very clear on this. That's all I wanted to hear !

Xlr8, i ve been reading your flo n gro review for months, I had bookmarked it !!! Now I'm thinking thought, I might didn't read it through the end. I ll check this out again..

Thank you jandre for the calimag info. I'm going to google this asap and see what I can find.

About the veg-in-cloner idea, I was just thinking the same!! Let it show roots 10-14 days, then add light nutes, top in a few days, wait for one or maybe two weeks IN THE Cloner. Then put them in 5-6" netpots and straight to 12/12 !!!
That's what I was thinking !!-
Of course I can veg them in flo n gro with lights set to blue mode, but this won't work well, in a perpetual grow.

Oh and no GLR for the clones, as you both guys-said !
If 24/0 shows-better results, I definitely need a diffrent tent, then !! SJ has a clone tent, if I remember correctly !! I ll check that too !!!
But as I need a new tent what any other-option I have -for veging -? Can I veg in a rainforest for example or ecogrower, systems ? Clones will respond better on something like this ? Faster developing rates etc ? (not only to the roots but better overall growth, as well ?)

Or is it better keep it simple and spent little bit more time in cloner ? (with nutes as I said .. Etc etc..)

Thank you guys very much for your answers !!!
They were all nothing than great info for me !
 
Billy420 said:
.... About the veg-in-cloner idea, I was just thinking the same!! Let it show roots 10-14 days, then add light nutes, top in a few days, wait for one or maybe two weeks IN THE Cloner. Then put them in 5-6" netpots and straight to 12/12 !!!
That's what I was thinking !!-
Of course I can veg them in flo n gro with lights set to blue mode, but this won't work well, in a perpetual grow.

Oh and no GLR for the clones, as you both guys-said !
If 24/0 shows-better results, I definitely need a diffrent tent, then !! SJ has a clone tent, if I remember correctly !! I ll check that too !!!
But as I need a new tent what any other-option I have -for veging -? Can I veg in a rainforest for example or ecogrower, systems ? Clones will respond better on something like this ? Faster developing rates etc ? (not only to the roots but better overall growth, as well ?)

Or is it better keep it simple and spent little bit more time in cloner ? (with nutes as I said .. Etc etc..)

Thank you guys very much for your answers !!!
They were all nothing than great info for me !
Click to expand...

Plants also veg just fine in a 24/0 lighting schedule (that's what I do for simplicity reasons). However, the 12-1/Gas Lantern Routine is a nice vegging schedule too, and it's a more energy efficient one to boot. But... don't worry, if it works for better for you to do, 24/0 is great for all around vegging, too.

Right now, If I veg before going into the Flo N Gro, I use little home-made DWC tubs which are just rubbermaid style containers with netpots in the lid, and bubble-stones in the nutrient water underneath. Simple to make yourself. Then, I just move the netpot from there to the Flo N Gro. However, I'm thinking of making a small Ebb and Flow style set-up using small rubbermaid containers. There are many ways to do it. I've never used an ecogrower or a rainforest, but they'd probably work fine if your environment is good.
 
Great stuff, Brother! Funny (:sorry:) about forgetting to lable the clones! That's happened to me more than once, but I wasn't experimenting with breeding, either, so I imaging it's even more frustrating!

BTW...I believe Cal-Mag is by Botanicare.
 
Plants also veg just fine in a 24/0 lighting schedule (that's what I do for simplicity reasons). However, the 12-1/Gas Lantern Routine is a nice vegging schedule too, and it's a more energy efficient one to boot. But... don't worry, if it works for better for you to do, 24/0 is great for all around vegging, too.

Right now, If I veg before going into the Flo N Gro, I use little home-made DWC tubs which are just rubbermaid style containers with netpots in the lid, and bubble-stones in the nutrient water underneath. Simple to make yourself. Then, I just move the netpot from there to the Flo N Gro. However, I'm thinking of making a small Ebb and Flow style set-up using small rubbermaid containers. There are many ways to do it. I've never used an ecogrower or a rainforest, but they'd probably work fine if your environment is good.
Click to expand...

Yes, I have to test it out first and then make my choise !
If you don't try , you can't be sure .. But I believe, I ll go with 24/0 for the first 14 days, untill the clones develop some nice roots and then turn the lights to GLR !
We ll see ....

Damn, this is great idea you just suggested !!!
I never thought of this, even if I watched you closely and you indeed have used this DWC Rubbermaid containers !!!
I'm gonna keep moms to DWC buckets anyway (I don't think T5's will warm up the solution) and those containers are great idea for vegging too !!! And very easy to make.
I'm going definitely to follow your idea on this ...
Thank you !!!-
(+reps for you xlr8 , just check to be sure , I'm still new on this :) )

And yes MR. Krip you're right ! It's botanicare's product.
 
Billy420 said:
Damn, this is great idea you just suggested !!!
I never thought of this, even if I watched you closely and you indeed have used this DWC Rubbermaid containers !!!
I'm gonna keep moms to DWC buckets anyway (I don't think T5's will warm up the solution) and those containers are great idea for vegging too !!! And very easy to make.
I'm going definitely to follow your idea on this ...
Click to expand...


Hey Billy420, here are a couple pics that show my small homemade tub bubblers (DWC). I went a little crazy one day and covered mine in mylar. What ever you use, make sure that the root area (inside) is dark. Roots are not fans of light!

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A_B_2_.jpg


Hope you don't mind the picture post X!
 
Hey heirloom !!
Thank you for the pics !!! Exactly, as I imagined and very simple indeed !!
I'm gonna make it in this way.

Let me ask you guys, something else as well:

When you transplant the root riot or rockwool into this netpot, the roots of course are not long enough to reach the solution.
I assume you put solution's level, something like 0.5-1" of the bottom of netpot, m I right ?
(this doesn't have anything to do with clones, I'm asking because I'll go from seed, to mum in a DWC bucket.)

Thank you again heirloom !
 
As with many things there are different ways of doing things.

I will tell you how I do it. Once roots are showing out of the root plug or rockwool I put it in a 3" net pot. In the 3" I put a single layer of hydroton clay pellets, then the rockwool, then fill with more hydroton. These go into the small dwc you see. I let the roots grow out for 3 weeks then take that whole plant, 3" net pot and all and pot it up to a 6". Again, hydroton in the bottom of the 6" (more than a single layer this time, more like 2-3 inches), then the plant in the 3", then fill in. I actually like to make sure I get roots to the bottom of the 6" and fill in hydroton around them. This way they 'know' where water and food is.
The water level I keep just touching the bottom of the net pots. Then as roots form and get longer I drop the water level a little bit (1/2" - 1" at a time) just to keep them searching for more. Once my water level is about 1/2 of the container I fill them back up to just below the net pot. For me the level change is easy because I have a reservoir drain back line that I can raise or lower to adjust the level in my growing chambers.

Hope that made sense! It works for me!
 
Heirloom said:
Hey Billy420, here are a couple pics that show my small homemade tub bubblers (DWC). I went a little crazy one day and covered mine in mylar. What ever you use, make sure that the root area (inside) is dark. Roots are not fans of light
Click to expand...

The biggest reason to make sure the bubbler res is lightproof is that light a nutrient and O2 rich water bath is a very comfortable place for ALGAE. It will grow FERY fast if light gets in there and muck up the works quick. Plus light degrades nutrient solutions very quickly.
 
Heirloom -- Awesome pics and post. +rep for that! Your DWC tubs look great, and I like the Mylar and emphasis on being light tight. Nice point on that one, too, Jandre. I'd also add that, if you aren't light tight, you'll be battling PH spikes constantly. The more light tight, the more consistent the PH is for the most part.

Thanks Billy for all the kind words. I'm glad if I can be helpful. :)

What I do... I germinate seeds directly into Rapid Rooters (similar product is called Root Riot plugs). Once roots show out the sides and bottom of the Rooter plug, I put it into a small net-pot, buried in hydroton as in the pictures I have below. I fill the tubs up to about 1-1 1/2" below the netpots, so that the bubbling water is splashing gently on the bottom of the netpots. This helps "draw" the roots down to the oxygenated moisture. I top-water by hand the netpots until the roots are showing out the sides and bottom of the netpots. The key is that the splashing bubbles are keeping the bottom of the netpot moist, but it shouldn't need to be all the way to the netpot to do so. They really don't stay in these little tubs very long for me, as I try to time it so the Flo N Gro is ready for them once the netpots have roots showing through. But, if they needed to they could live for a while in the DWC tub.

I don't use Rockwool, but many people use it and like it a lot. I prefer starting everything in Rapid Rooters (clones too) because they contain micro-nutrients and beneficial microbes that give you a really great start with seedlings or clones. I just go from that straight to hydroton, in my DWC or Flo N Gro systems. Just mentioning this to clarify that I am pretty clueless regarding rockwool. I know that it holds moisture well, and must be watered sparingly in the beginning to limit algae and overwatering issues - but that's about it for my knowledge of it. :)

I don't think I have many pics of my DIY bubble tubs, but I did find a couple. They just don't show the tub well. I prefer to cover the rapid rooter all the way with hydroton now, to help prevent algae. To Jandre's point, make sure that your bubble tubs are light tight!! These 2 I have pictured should have had mylar or something as I doubt they were super light tight.


bigbang_ak_auto_april_29_11.jpg


aug_21_11.jpg
 
Xlr8 said:
Heirloom -- Awesome pics and post. +rep for that! Your DWC tubs look great, and I like the Mylar and emphasis on being light tight. Nice point on that one, too, Jandre. I'd also add that, if you aren't light tight, you'll be battling PH spikes constantly. The more light tight, the more consistent the PH is for the most part.

Thanks Billy for all the kind words. I'm glad if I can be helpful. :)

What I do... I germinate seeds directly into Rapid Rooters (similar product is called Root Riot plugs). Once roots show out the sides and bottom of the Rooter plug, I put it into a small net-pot, buried in hydroton as in the pictures I have below. I fill the tubs up to about 1-1 1/2" below the netpots, so that the bubbling water is splashing gently on the bottom of the netpots. This helps "draw" the roots down to the oxygenated moisture. I top-water by hand the netpots until the roots are showing out the sides and bottom of the netpots. The key is that the splashing bubbles are keeping the bottom of the netpot moist, but it shouldn't need to be all the way to the netpot to do so. They really don't stay in these little tubs very long for me, as I try to time it so the Flo N Gro is ready for them once the netpots have roots showing through. But, if they needed to they could live for a while in the DWC tub.

I don't use Rockwool, but many people use it and like it a lot. I prefer starting everything in Rapid Rooters (clones too) because they contain micro-nutrients and beneficial microbes that give you a really great start with seedlings or clones. I just go from that straight to hydroton, in my DWC or Flo N Gro systems. Just mentioning this to clarify that I am pretty clueless regarding rockwool. I know that it holds moisture well, and must be watered sparingly in the beginning to limit algae and overwatering issues - but that's about it for my knowledge of it. :)

I don't think I have many pics of my DIY bubble tubs, but I did find a couple. They just don't show the tub well. I prefer to cover the rapid rooter all the way with hydroton now, to help prevent algae. To Jandre's point, make sure that your bubble tubs are light tight!! These 2 I have pictured should have had mylar or something as I doubt they were super light tight.
Click to expand...

I have a pretty good method for germinating in rockwool, and it has gotten me 100% germination with all the bagseed I've come across. Of course, I'm selective with the seeds. If they look healthy, I attempt to germinate them. If they're blonde, feel light, look damaged, I obviously toss them.

Hehe, and it's simple.

  1. Soak seed 48 hours in glass of water in the refrigerator (I believe this causes the "winter" that seeds respond to).
  2. Ready your rockwool cubes by soaking 30sec in water adjusted to pH 5.5
  3. Remove seeds from water glass and place into holes in the rockwool and close the holes over by pinching at the top around the hole.
  4. Place in mini-greenhouse with dome and close vents. (This helps trap heat and moisture inside)
  5. Place under 24/0 T5 fluoro lighting lowered to 1/4" above the dome. (This will heat the inside to 86F)
  6. LEAVE THEM ALONE! Don't open, don't water, don't do anything but watch for seedlings to emerge.
  7. When seedlings emerge in 3-7 days, open the vents 1/4 of the way and raise the light 1".
  8. When seedlings are all emerged and standing over 1" tall, remove dome and leave it off.
  9. Feed 1/4 strength nute of choice.
  10. let sit in 1/4 strength nutes for 1/2 hour and then move to new home.
 
Xlr8 said:
Me too! I know you are busy, and I've been struggling with that myself. 4th room? You're sure not making things easier on yourself! :)
Click to expand...

With our dispensary and us hitting all the cannabis farmers markets we need to grow as much as we can! Our whole second story of the house is now devoted to growing as our last daughter at home just moved out 2 days ago. (my wife is still crying) I will find the time to chat with you. Just tell me when!
 
Sorry that I'm a bit late to this part of the thread. I have really enjoyed what I have been reading and it REALLY hits home how different we can all grow and still get fantastic results. With Hydro you can get no better info anywhere then from X, Jandre and Bassman.

I have some tids bits and questions so I'll hit them one person at a time lol

Jandre......Why? is it a bad thing to run airstones in a sterile system? If one is using DM zone to keep the system sterile is that not what it is doing? I would think that Airstones or not the Zone would keep anything from growing within the system since thats what it's made to do. To date I have found no issue with the airstones while running the Zone,

I have run GLR in my tents on babies right out of the cloner. I'm still undecided on the matter. I think it all depends on how well the clones are developed before they go into the system. I will try the 24/0 on my next tent and see if I notice any difference in the health and growing development of the clones.

On the refilling of the res......... I refill with water every damn night. No nutes until res change. Currently they are taking between 3 and 4 gallons a day. If it's really hot they will take 5.

Xlr8......... I check my system every dang night. I have found that during the veg cycle I have to pretty much PH down my res every night. After the second week of flower things seem to calm down and I hardly have to adjust the PH at all but they drink the water like a bitch! Every single night I check and record the following.

Where PH started
What I adjusted PH to
PPM readings
EC readings
Res temp
RH reading inside tent
Outside tent temp
Inside tent temp
How much water used
Comments

This helps me track the grow and retrace if needed.
I think another reason my PH my fluctuate is because of my nute and feeding schedule. It's far different then what anyone else here is using. So far I like it and so do the plants.
 
And on the matter of clone roots .....lol
I have found that the longer the roots are on my clones the better they take off from the start. My roots usually touch the bottom of the basket when they are entered into the Flo n Gro net pots. Since I use the DIY EZ Cloner there is no rockwool to hold water/nutes for the plants. Since there are more and longer roots there is more surface area to keep the plants fed and happy. I have had plants side by side same clone from the same mom and the one with the longer roots always looks better and takes off faster. Just for shits and giggles I have taken out my old trays and domes and will start a grow using that and rockwool to see just what a difference there really is between the two.
 
Okay... lemme answer them in order here....
Alaskan1 said:
<snip>

Jandre......Why? is it a bad thing to run airstones in a sterile system? If one is using DM zone to keep the system sterile is that not what it is doing? I would think that Airstones or not the Zone would keep anything from growing within the system since thats what it's made to do. To date I have found no issue with the airstones while running the Zone,
Click to expand...
I have used air stones in my buckets, then I took them out. I have a fungus problem in this house I guess, because with the air stones in, I noticed that I had grey sludge around the tops and sides of my res when it came time to change nutes. It was on the hoses, sides and lid of the res, and sometimes floating on the surface of the solution I had left.

Without the air stones, this problem was almost completely solved.




Alaskan1 said:
I have run GLR in my tents on babies right out of the cloner. I'm still undecided on the matter. I think it all depends on how well the clones are developed before they go into the system. I will try the 24/0 on my next tent and see if I notice any difference in the health and growing development of the clones.
Click to expand...
What I was saying about 24/0 is that I see roots faster with lights on all that time, rather than on GLR. However, once I see roots, and new growth starts on top, GLR makes them explode with new growth.



Alaskan1 said:
On the refilling of the res......... I refill with water every damn night. No nutes until res change. Currently they are taking between 3 and 4 gallons a day. If it's really hot they will take 5.
<snip>
Click to expand...

Refilling with water is fine between nutrient changes. Bumping with NUTRIENT WATER is not. RO Water with a bit of Cal/Mag is fine, too.
 
jandre2k3 said:
I have a pretty good method for germinating in rockwool, and it has gotten me 100% germination with all the bagseed I've come across. Of course, I'm selective with the seeds. If they look healthy, I attempt to germinate them. If they're blonde, feel light, look damaged, I obviously toss them.

Hehe, and it's simple.

  1. Soak seed 48 hours in glass of water in the refrigerator (I believe this causes the "winter" that seeds respond to).
  2. Ready your rockwool cubes by soaking 30sec in water adjusted to pH 5.5
  3. Remove seeds from water glass and place into holes in the rockwool and close the holes over by pinching at the top around the hole.
  4. Place in mini-greenhouse with dome and close vents. (This helps trap heat and moisture inside)
  5. Place under 24/0 T5 fluoro lighting lowered to 1/4" above the dome. (This will heat the inside to 86F)
  6. LEAVE THEM ALONE! Don't open, don't water, don't do anything but watch for seedlings to emerge.
  7. When seedlings emerge in 3-7 days, open the vents 1/4 of the way and raise the light 1".
  8. When seedlings are all emerged and standing over 1" tall, remove dome and leave it off.
  9. Feed 1/4 strength nute of choice.
  10. let sit in 1/4 strength nutes for 1/2 hour and then move to new home.
Click to expand...

Thanks for sharing your rockwool seed starting process Jandre. +rep if I can! :thumb:
 
Alaskan1 said:
With our dispensary and us hitting all the cannabis farmers markets we need to grow as much as we can! Our whole second story of the house is now devoted to growing as our last daughter at home just moved out 2 days ago. (my wife is still crying) I will find the time to chat with you. Just tell me when!
Click to expand...

Sounds like it'll be a little lonelier around your place now. Lots of plants though! I've been having a hard time getting on here reliably, too, but I'm sure we'll cross paths here once in a while. Sure hope the growing is going great and the dispensary is a success for you! :)
 
Heirloom said:
As with many things there are different ways of doing things.

I will tell you how I do it. Once roots are showing out of the root plug or rockwool I put it in a 3" net pot. In the 3" I put a single layer of hydroton clay pellets, then the rockwool, then fill with more hydroton. These go into the small dwc you see. I let the roots grow out for 3 weeks then take that whole plant, 3" net pot and all and pot it up to a 6". Again, hydroton in the bottom of the 6" (more than a single layer this time, more like 2-3 inches), then the plant in the 3", then fill in. I actually like to make sure I get roots to the bottom of the 6" and fill in hydroton around them. This way they 'know' where water and food is.
The water level I keep just touching the bottom of the net pots. Then as roots form and get longer I drop the water level a little bit (1/2" - 1" at a time) just to keep them searching for more. Once my water level is about 1/2 of the container I fill them back up to just below the net pot. For me the level change is easy because I have a reservoir drain back line that I can raise or lower to adjust the level in my growing chambers.

Hope that made sense! It works for me!
Click to expand...

Sounds like a great way to do it! Thanks for sharing your method. :thumb:
 
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