When to flush?

Please give @InTheShedno flush” write
up a read. You’re stuck in the ole wife’s tale land. We all were at one point. I’ve never flushed and my smoke is as smooth as a tree frogs ass.
Your weed tasted harsh most likely because of the cure.
I have read the internet sales article which only addresses a single nutrient company's product line and originating student thesis. On which of the 88 page dissertation is this presented?

Surely if this is correct for all chemical fertilizers there must be many other peer reviewed published papers on the subject of removal of synthetic chemical fertilizer contaminates and harvest flushing effectiveness?

reprinted from the student thesis
3.9 FLUSHING OF CANNABIS PLANTS
At the end of the flowering cycle, two weeks prior to harvest, the effects of flushing
of the root zone with clear water were assessed with respect to water relations and nutrient
content of buds. Flushing occurred over the last two weeks of production when the nutrient
solution was replaced with clear water during routine irrigation events. Another flushing
method was to apply an additional 10L of water without any fertilizer to the plant over two
irrigation events at the start of the two-week period of clear water irrigation. To assess the
relative effects of various irrigation management/flushing treatments among the plants under
the experimental protocols in this study, the following treatments were monitored for plant
water potential during the treatments and subsequent bud nutrient content was determined on
3 separate experiments with each treatment:
1) Control Treatment with 10L initial flush completed twice and non-fertigated water
until harvest
2) Control Treatment without 10L initial flush and non-fertigated water until harvest
3) Mild-Stress Treatment with non-fertigated water until harvest
4) Mild-Stress Treatment with fertigated water until harvest
5) Moderate-Stress Treatment with non-fertigated water until harvest
6) Moderate-Stress Treatment with fertigated water until harvest
39
The first irrigation treatment was the ‘control’ which was the standard irrigation
procedure used in the facility. This treatment has irrigation events every 2 to 3 days. The
second irrigation treatment termed ‘mild-stress’ was an irrigation event applied every 2 days,
and the third irrigation treatment termed ‘moderate-stress’ was an irrigation event applied
every 3 days.

Every plant was harvest flushed!

The website reference [2] IMPACT OF DIFFERENT FLUSHING TIMES ON QUALITY AND TASTE IN CANNABIS SATIVA L

However, in many ways the findings that flushing has little to no effect on stored nutrients in the plant tissue while also having no effect on yields, cannabinoid percentages and terpenes are a win/win for both proponents of flushing and those against flushing. That is:

Against Flushing

Q: Do you flush?

A: No, I run water only for 2-weeks to save on nutrient inputs.

For Flushing

Q: Do you flush?

A: Yes, I do, for two weeks. It makes the product taste “cleaner/better/less chemically” etc.

That’s pretty much my position on things. Either way, it is worth flushing (running water only with no nutrients) in the last 10 -14 days of the crop cycle.

This is just a bad misappropriation of information a website has used to sell their products presented in a deliberate mis information format.

As someone who has extensively kept tadpoles, true aquatic frogs, dwarf frogs, Malawi clawed frogs, Northern leopard frogs, Canadian toads which are true toads, fire-bellied toads, toads commonly referred to as tree frogs whites tree frogs, green tree frogs, salamanders newts and other amphibians for periods including 16.5 years in captivity is that area of skin in an amphibians anatomy is quite wrinkly.
 
If the cannabis plant is grown with synthetic chemical fertilizers or Organophosphates insecticides and not flushed from the plant prior to harvest will be ingested.
Problem: There is absolutely no difference between the nutrients taken up by the plant in an organic grow and a synthetic grow, they are all mineralized nutrients. The difference is the carrier in synthetic nutes. With synthetic nutes the nutrients are immediately available to the plant, as they are already mineralized. The carrier of synthetic nutes (usually EDTA) remains in the soil and is not taken in by the plant. "Salts" are what's left after synthetic nutes are given, which sometimes build up to the point of lockout and must be flushed from the SOIL, in synthetic grows. In organic grows the microbial action mineralizes the nutrients, but synth or organic, they are the same nutrients in the same form.

Systemic organophosphate insecticides cannot be leached out of the plant. They must degrade on their own time schedule from within the plant, usually from exposure to light. Things like pyrethrin (a topical) degrade in a few days, while systemics which are typically added to the soil, can remain for days, weeks, months, depending on the chemical, and unless leached from the SOIL, they will continue to be assimilated by the plant as long as the systemic remains in the soil.

Here is a recipe for a home made Clearex Flushing Solution
That's a sugar solution. It will feed the microbes in the soil, but I can see no way, chemically, that would act to flush nutrients or anything else. The plant does not uptake sugar from the soil, and sugar is a chelating agent, which makes certain micronutrients MORE available to the plant.
Not feeding towards the end can help start getting the chlorophyll out I believe but as far as nutrients out, that’s not how it works really
Most of the chlorophyll breaks down in the curing process. That "fresh mowed grass" smell you often get at the beginning of the curing process is chlorophyll. It will break down biologically until the RH hits about 55-60%, then the bio action stops. Which is why the low and slow drying process produces the best taste/smell.
 
Flushing simply robs the plant of nutrients in its last two weeks of life, that’s why they fade. The buds don’t fade because they’re getting plenty of nutrients from the leaves they’re pulling from. My simple bone headed explanation is Feed the the roots, The roots feed the leaves, the leaves feed the flowers. I say a green plant at the end is a healthy plant. Purple cultivars are the exception. Plants that would typically be green that turn all colors at the end are DEFICIENT. The buds are probably fine because they’re taking stored nutrients from the leaves. So the folks defoliating and flushing are really robing the buds.

If you’re getting a black ash it’s not nitrogen or chlorophyll—it’s WATER.

Heres another boneheaded explanation on so called curing. The things in your plant you don’t like (sugars and starches) naturally uptake Oxygen and break down and if there is enough moisture, rot. When you place your weed in anaerobic conditions (without O2) The things you don’t like that typically uptake O2, uptake nitrogen and gas off when you “burp”. If you could “fade“ your buds to yellow from flushing you wouldn’t get your so called “cure”.
 
I have read the internet sales article which only addresses a single nutrient company's product line and originating student thesis. On which of the 88 page dissertation is this presented?

Surely if this is correct for all chemical fertilizers there must be many other peer reviewed published papers on the subject of removal of synthetic chemical fertilizer contaminates and harvest flushing effectiveness?

reprinted from the student thesis


Every plant was harvest flushed!

The website reference [2] IMPACT OF DIFFERENT FLUSHING TIMES ON QUALITY AND TASTE IN CANNABIS SATIVA L



This is just a bad misappropriation of information a website has used to sell their products presented in a deliberate mis information format.

As someone who has extensively kept tadpoles, true aquatic frogs, dwarf frogs, Malawi clawed frogs, Northern leopard frogs, Canadian toads which are true toads, fire-bellied toads, toads commonly referred to as tree frogs whites tree frogs, green tree frogs, salamanders newts and other amphibians for periods including 16.5 years in captivity is that area of skin in an amphibians anatomy is quite wrinkly.
We aren’t talking about flushing in this scenario. They are discussing not feeding for the last couple of weeks so you get rid of the NPK and other elements held in your flowers.

I flush two weeks at the swell as a soil reset. That’s what’s described above, in which I agree a reset “flush” is beneficial in that it clears out any excess salts and unused nutrients from your soil essentially “resetting” you soil for the final push.

Again that’s NOT what’s being discussed here. You cannot flush or starve elements or chemicals from within a flower.

There’s a metabolic process during the cure that does this. Not starving your plants to remove chemicals in your flowers.

*** Which IS what we are debating***
Flushing to clear excess salts… GOOD!
Flushing so your bud will taste better… WASTE OF TIME.
 
So typical knowledge of flushing to limit smoking harshness is bs??
Bingo.... yes you are correct sir.

No amount of water in soil will change anything in the plant other than provide nutrients via transpiration and translocation.

The flushing thing comes from HYDRO growing or drain to waste. They do it all the time but it has no place in soil.
 
Harvest fasting may be a more appropriate term. I would call this a necessary step to reduce any synthetic chemical fertilizers which only become harmful contaminates in harvested cannabis buds.

My first grow and harvest was a great disappointment and the harvested cannabis buds were full of chemical fertilizers and when smoked a throat choking misery. My throat bleed when attempting to smoke this failure. I can not recommend anyone expose themselves to these harmful contaminants.
OK the reason for the harsh taste is the chemical fertilizer.

Flushing soil will not remove them from the plant once its already taken in the nutrients.

There's a thing called root exudate. This comes from the fan leaves and its sugars and carbs sent down from the leaves into the soil thru the roots. Up to 50% of the photosynthesis output goes into the root exudate.

The plant trades or exchanges root exudate for nutrients from soil microbes in a chemical exchange. Its chemistry at play.

IF you weed is harsh its likely due to 2 things. Genetics and poor harvest/dry/cure techniques. The harvest dry and cure are as important as your grow cycle for finished product.

The problems with harsh and weed grown with synthetic fertilizer is the plant up-takes too much Nitrogen during the flowering cycle. Growing naturally in soil without chemical fertilizers the plant prefers Calcium over nitrogen. With synthetic ferts there are soluble N and in soil there is only N when the plant sends down exudate to feed bacteria that are good at breaking down N. So the plant doesnt get any excess N. Its the N that creates leaves that do not change color (senescence) late in flower since you're feeding the plant. In organic soil we feed the soil microbes and those microbes feed the plant.

Its a symbiotic relationship thats been in play a very long time - millions of years.

If you want great tasting weed... genetics and organic soil gets me there every harvest.
 
Problem: There is absolutely no difference between the nutrients taken up by the plant in an organic grow and a synthetic grow, they are all mineralized nutrients. The difference is the carrier in synthetic nutes. With synthetic nutes the nutrients are immediately available to the plant, as they are already mineralized. The carrier of synthetic nutes (usually EDTA) remains in the soil and is not taken in by the plant. "Salts" are what's left after synthetic nutes are given, which sometimes build up to the point of lockout and must be flushed from the SOIL, in synthetic grows. In organic grows the microbial action mineralizes the nutrients, but synth or organic, they are the same nutrients in the same form.

Systemic organophosphate insecticides cannot be leached out of the plant. They must degrade on their own time schedule from within the plant, usually from exposure to light. Things like pyrethrin (a topical) degrade in a few days, while systemics which are typically added to the soil, can remain for days, weeks, months, depending on the chemical, and unless leached from the SOIL, they will continue to be assimilated by the plant as long as the systemic remains in the soil.
There is a fundamental miss understanding on how elements and chemical bonds interact with living plants.

Healthy living earth or active soil entirely stands alone in its abilities to host life mostly without harm to the organisms present while simultaneously buffering change of electrical chemical bonds in a given pH environment while constantly supplying energy and buffering toxic compounds into easily readily assimilable nutrients. Healthy earth or active soil is a electrical chemical buffer similar to a battery's energy supply ability whichever terms you prefer oxidase reduction, galvanic ion cation exchange or electrical potential or acid base reduction which takes a mineralized form of an element and converts it with the aid of living organisms into a chelated form assimilable by both living organisms and plants. Another term for this Chelation is catalyst or catalytic reaction which is usually either a metal or mineral is the active surface which the change of chemical bonds present is easily able to change or break complex chemical bond present both in the earth and the plants themselves. This is what the role calcium, magnesium, copper and other micro nutrients are actively doing when present either added to a nutrient solution, grow medium or present in the plants tissues themselves.

The mineralized or crystallized salt form of elements most plants and animals either are not directly able to easily assimilate or not able to assimilate without an intermediary agents process which makes the element directly absorb able and able to be used as energy or for a component of tissue generation.

Humans lack a digestive system which allows them to directly absorb energy or rocks, minerals from earth and most forms of crystallized minerals themselves, earthworms and many other organism are able to directly able to use these elements in healthy earth. The mineralized rock or crystallized salt precipitate is the form of an elemental bond no longer directly easily absorbable by plants or most animals.

When we write concerning nutrient lockout it is either a chemical bond which is much more difficult for the plant to access at a given pH or the interaction with another solute element in suspension or abnormal pH which causes a preferred dissolved elements chemical bond form to reach saturation and form suspended solids and or drop out of solution as crystallized salts which we term nutrient buildup in the grow medium.

Where in healthy earth the minerals present and elements chemical bonds already present buffer either pH or resistance to change of both which forms of elements are predominately present and resistance to pH change over the surface area of the cubic area spreading the effective reaction over the surrounding area measured in yards. This is how active soil is able to neutralize and buffer toxic ammonia or ammonium over a large surface area to reduce the active amount of the harmful form of a chemical bond into less harmful intermediary which can also be accessed directly by plants.

This complex system is called the nitrogen cycle and is present in every ecosystem in nature. Please see Nitrogen cycle. The system is based on concentrations of nitrogen become toxic in the environment and are either converted to or from more complex combinations to reduce the toxicity of individual concentration nitrogen or ammonium itself.


Depending in which environment system the nitrate nitrogen ammonium will have 5 - 7 intermediary steps in changing simple quick energy forms into longer stable forms.

Nitrogen fixation (N2 to NH3/ NH4+ or NO3-)
Nitrification (NH3 to NO3-)
Assimilation (Incorporation of NH3 and NO3- into biological tissues)
Ammonification (organic nitrogen compounds to NH3)
Denitrification(NO3- to N2)


Nitrate, nitrites, nitrogen and ammonium.

Nitrification, nitrate reduction to ammonium and Ammonification

These reactions are bi directional and occur when either abundance or deficiency of an element is present at a certain pH point.

Yes certain plants are able to directly access ammonium but not until the soil pH is above pH 8.6 - 9.4 and then above pH 11 or bellow pH 4. These pH ranges are outside of the optimal growing pH band for cannabis and while cannabis is potentially able to directly adsorb ammonium from a grow medium the ammonium crystals will cause visible leaf damage as well display other deficiency due to high pH imbalance.

Synthetic chemical fertilizers must be rendered into chelated chemical bond forms readily accessible to the plants nutrient requirements. EDTA is toxic and when added to gasoline as a valve train lubricant is considered 10x times more toxic that the lead in leaded gasoline for its harm potential. EDTA is the chemical which ceases cellular activity and coagulation in blood samples submitted for laboratory analysis. EDTA is known to accumulate in ecosystems, living tissue also not know to readily break down or become inert.

Synthetic chemical fertilizers when added to a nutrient solution the active predominant chemical bond present changes based on the presence of any excessive single element or pH change which then causes the active chemical bonds to alter based on recombining and reducing the excessive element. Peat moss coco coir and most water supplies either do not effectively resist change to buffer the reaction or when containing any excessively high element commonly such as calcium, copper, iron or sulphur cause the added nutrients to reform to reduce these excessively high concentrations of free dissolved elements many times creating chemical bonds of these chemical storage bonds of elements which cause harm to plant tissues. By the active form of the chemical forms in single or multi part grow product lines the reactive nature of the bonds are unstable and easily changed, any excessively high single element or complex chemical bond cause the majority of elements and chemical bonds present to reform into more complex bonds less easily available to the plants use. These less desirable chemical bonds also alter pH and usually result in cascading pH rise and pH instability.

There are also laevo and dextro forms of each chemical bond and interaction with living tissues to contend with.


That's a sugar solution. It will feed the microbes in the soil, but I can see no way, chemically, that would act to flush nutrients or anything else. The plant does not uptake sugar from the soil, and sugar is a chelating agent, which makes certain micronutrients MORE available to the plant.

The home made clearex solution functions by several methods. The home made solution is a wetting agent which allow the alteration of surface tension or osmotic preessure tension and the mobility of any unused built up nutrients present in the grow medium to more easily interact with water or become directly usable to the cannabis plants roots. This simple sugar blend also allows an energy source for the cannabis plant to easily metabolize stored nutrients within the fan leaves and bud tissues reducing high storage nutrient levels accumulated over the grow to finally be used up for completion of the plants life cycle and allowing harvest.

Most of the chlorophyll breaks down in the curing process. That "fresh mowed grass" smell you often get at the beginning of the curing process is chlorophyll. It will break down biologically until the RH hits about 55-60%, then the bio action stops. Which is why the low and slow drying process produces the best taste/smell.

I do not believe that harvest flushing greatly changes the rate at which chlorophyll degrades, only that the presence of synthetic chemicals in the cannabis buds greatly extends and slows the chemical breakdown of chlorophyll. I have had conversation with a local patient collective and the opinion that calcium, iron, copper and other micro nutrients were at either cause for or were greatly extending and slowing the breakdown of chlorophyll present which resulted in harsher taste of fresh cannabis when smoked rather than aged and cured cannabis where these contributed to altered flavor until which time they denatured at the length of required cure times. Several individuals claimed they could distinguish between different sources of well water by the the flavor of cured cannabis buds.

It is the extended slow curing process which denatures and breaks down chlorophyll and other less desirable flavours which is how we are able to produce mellow balanced terpene flavors we enjoy as cannabis connoisseurs.

I would greatly prefer not to expend the time required to trim fan leaves and pin leaves from within the cannabis bud structure, I do this to remove as much excess green vegetation with low amounts of trichomes from the bud and reduce total green vegetative mass to additionally reduce what green vegetation contributions to the less palatable chlorophyll presence after fully curing the cannabis buds. Reducing vegetative mater with low trichome density from the bud structure refines cannabis buds to potent medical grade cannabis medicine.
 
Please give @InTheShedno flush” write
up a read. You’re stuck in the ole wife’s tale land. We all were at one point. I’ve never flushed and my smoke is as smooth as a tree frogs ass.
Your weed tasted harsh most likely because of the cure.

I have previously read this thread which you referenced the discussion is relative to the grey water underweb website's claims of the nutrient line used does not require flushing. I have read the internet sales article which only addresses a single nutrient company's product line and originating student thesis. The actual student thesis makes no claim in regards to either flushing or not flushing, only comparatives between harvest flushing methodology. Once again, deliberate miss information.

This happens quite commonly academically when unscrupulous shameful claims are made and unsupported by either the author student thesis and or research which results in an extensive long legal process is required to legally separate an individual from a underworld entity falsely profiting on intellectual identity theft of an academics student.

We aren’t talking about flushing in this scenario. They are discussing not feeding for the last couple of weeks so you get rid of the NPK and other elements held in your flowers.

I flush two weeks at the swell as a soil reset. That’s what’s described above, in which I agree a reset “flush” is beneficial in that it clears out any excess salts and unused nutrients from your soil essentially “resetting” you soil for the final push.

Again that’s NOT what’s being discussed here. You cannot flush or starve elements or chemicals from within a flower.

There’s a metabolic process during the cure that does this. Not starving your plants to remove chemicals in your flowers.

*** Which IS what we are debating***
Flushing to clear excess salts… GOOD!
Flushing so your bud will taste better… WASTE OF TIME.

As pointed out by bobrown14 the metabolic wastes or exudates secreted or excreted by specific cell parts of a plants root system back into the grow medium usually at harvest only significantly occurs by a reduction of osmotic pressure and reduction of any stored amount of nutrients present in any significant quantities in the grow medium. A wetting agent greatly assists to reduce the osmotic surface tension imbalance should any present significant quantity of stored nutrients in any form. Translocation within the plant and back to the grow medium is why i have provided recommendations for different timelines to be used with different grow mediums and sufficient time for the plant to consume stored nutrients from energy sinks or fan leaves and access any remaining nutrients still present in the grow mediums.
 
Bingo.... yes you are correct sir.

No amount of water in soil will change anything in the plant other than provide nutrients via transpiration and translocation.

The flushing thing comes from HYDRO growing or drain to waste. They do it all the time but it has no place in soil.

We need to differentiate between what is organic healthy earth or active soil and any other "kitchen sink" blends with which component's possibly may be components of soil or are otherwise soilless mostly lifeless inert grow mediums resulting from either extreme environmental conditions which resulted in decidedly lacking decomposition of organic fibres and root systems materials.

exhausted soil lacks the very qualities which define healthy earth or active soil.

OK the reason for the harsh taste is the chemical fertilizer.

Flushing soil will not remove them from the plant once its already taken in the nutrients.

There's a thing called root exudate. This comes from the fan leaves and its sugars and carbs sent down from the leaves into the soil thru the roots. Up to 50% of the photosynthesis output goes into the root exudate.

The plant trades or exchanges root exudate for nutrients from soil microbes in a chemical exchange. Its chemistry at play.

IF you weed is harsh its likely due to 2 things. Genetics and poor harvest/dry/cure techniques. The harvest dry and cure are as important as your grow cycle for finished product.

The problems with harsh and weed grown with synthetic fertilizer is the plant up-takes too much Nitrogen during the flowering cycle. Growing naturally in soil without chemical fertilizers the plant prefers Calcium over nitrogen. With synthetic ferts there are soluble N and in soil there is only N when the plant sends down exudate to feed bacteria that are good at breaking down N. So the plant doesnt get any excess N. Its the N that creates leaves that do not change color (senescence) late in flower since you're feeding the plant. In organic soil we feed the soil microbes and those microbes feed the plant.

Its a symbiotic relationship thats been in play a very long time - millions of years.

If you want great tasting weed... genetics and organic soil gets me there every harvest.


The harvest and cure are paramount to creating high quality cannabis medicine.

when cannabis is smoked if the ashes do not burn to pure white, its is contamination by either presence of excessive chemicals or insecticides which cause the pop crack and sizzle and dark ash.
 
You obviously haven’t read Sheds post. It’s not from a nutrient company promoting their line. Where do you see “Shop our Products”.
1647059598644.png


Look man… all I’m saying is that starving you’re plant 2 weeks before harvest isn’t beneficial. It’s BS (Bro Science).

Feed till the end, (lower the dosage if needed), research how to read your plants, how to cure your buds properly, and you will be golden.

@KingJohnC
This isn’t the 1st time I’ve seen a bunch of cut/paste jibberish coming from you. You’re always against the grain and standoffish about things this community has had well established for years.

We’re here to help, not overwhelm folks with nonsense.
 
Any use of cut and pasted material is either reference and cited if 420 Magazine posting rules allow the link to the originating source or originates though my digits.

I have spent over 6.5 hours to reply in an attempt to logically explain the reasoning and complex processes mechanisms to provide an answer and solution to further understanding.

Proceed as best your perception allows
 
Any use of cut and pasted material is either reference and cited if 420 Magazine posting rules allow the link to the originating source or originates though my digits.

I have spent over 6.5 hours to reply in an attempt to logically explain the reasoning and complex processes mechanisms to provide an answer and solution to further understanding.

Proceed as best your perception allows
And we appreciate that John, but you should understand that most folks aren't necessarily on your level, so in an attempt to help us understand, you go too far down the rabbit hole and lose 99% of the people you’re trying to help.

That renders that 6.5 hours of work useless to us feeble minded folks.

No disrespect intended, but it’s somewhat self inflicted and I think you fully get that.

Don’t starve you’re plants to make the smoke better. Get your cure down!
 
We need to differentiate between what is organic healthy earth or active soil and any other "kitchen sink" blends with which component's possibly may be components of soil or are otherwise soilless mostly lifeless inert grow mediums resulting from either extreme environmental conditions which resulted in decidedly lacking decomposition of organic fibres and root systems materials.
I’m mean…. Come on man, this makes absolutely no sense.

I’m sorry brother, I’m really trying… but gotta drop this and leave it here.
 
Synthetic chemical fertilizers when added to a nutrient solution the active predominant chemical bond present changes based on the presence of any excessive single element or pH change which then causes the active chemical bonds to alter based on recombining and reducing the excessive element.
The above and what precedes and follows it sounds great, but is mostly a non sequitor. Having nothing to do with what is absorbed by the plants, and it still doesn't change the fact that whether organic or synthetic nutrients the exact same chemicals are being absorbed by the plant. Either method you use will get you to the same conclusion. Once incorporated into the plant, you cannot "Flush it out".
This simple sugar blend also allows an energy source for the cannabis plant to easily metabolize stored nutrients within the fan leaves and bud tissues reducing high storage nutrient levels accumulated over the grow to finally be used up for completion of the plants life cycle and allowing harvest.
Sugar is not absorbed by the roots, it feeds the microrgnisms in the soil, which in turn help break down nutrients into absorbable form. If you use chelated fertilizer it is already in an absorbable form. That's basic plant physiology.

Synthetic chemical fertilizers must be rendered into chelated chemical bond forms readily accessible to the plants nutrient requirements. EDTA is toxic and when added to gasoline as a valve train lubricant is considered 10x times more toxic that the lead in leaded gasoline for its harm potential. EDTA is the chemical which ceases cellular activity and coagulation in blood samples submitted for laboratory analysis. EDTA is known to accumulate in ecosystems, living tissue also not know to readily break down or become inert.
EDTA is NOT absorbed by plants. If you drink water from a water softener you are consuming some EDTA, if you use shampoo you are being exposed to EDTA. Other than organically grown fruits and vegetables, EDTA containing fertilizers are used to produce most of the fruits and vegetables we consume, where does the human toxicity come from? EDTA is also what water softeners use to "soften" water, through ion exchange. It swaps Na for Calcium and magnesesium, which is why you need to add cal-mag to soft water. I can't find any reference that EDTA is or was added to gasoline (please reference it if you can), and, in fact, EDTA is used to chelate lead in people suffering from environmental lead poisoning. Valve trains were lubed by tetraethyl lead, when the lead was removed from gasoline, the metal composition of the valves were changed so they didn't need lead as lubricant. Injected intravenously and once in the bloodstream, EDTA traps lead and other metals, forming a compound that the body can eliminate in the urine. The process generally takes 1 to 3 hours. The toxic level of EDTA is quite high, about 3 grams per day over a 6 or 7 day period. I believe you are confusing EDTA with MTBE, which was added to gasoline after the lead was removed to reduce knocking and pinging, and was subsequently found to be toxic and banned in the US.
 
The above and what precedes and follows it sounds great, but is mostly a non sequitor. Having nothing to do with what is absorbed by the plants, and it still doesn't change the fact that whether organic or synthetic nutrients the exact same chemicals are being absorbed by the plant. Either method you use will get you to the same conclusion. Once incorporated into the plant, you cannot "Flush it out".


Sugar is not absorbed by the roots, it feeds the microrgnisms in the soil, which in turn help break down nutrients into absorbable form. If you use chelated fertilizer it is already in an absorbable form. That's basic plant physiology.


EDTA is NOT absorbed by plants. If you drink water from a water softener you are consuming some EDTA, if you use shampoo you are being exposed to EDTA. Other than organically grown fruits and vegetables, EDTA containing fertilizers are used to produce most of the fruits and vegetables we consume, where does the human toxicity come from? EDTA is also what water softeners use to "soften" water, through ion exchange. It swaps Na for Calcium and magnesesium, which is why you need to add cal-mag to soft water. I can't find any reference that EDTA is or was added to gasoline (please reference it if you can), and, in fact, EDTA is used to chelate lead in people suffering from environmental lead poisoning. Valve trains were lubed by tetraethyl lead, when the lead was removed from gasoline, the metal composition of the valves were changed so they didn't need lead as lubricant. Injected intravenously and once in the bloodstream, EDTA traps lead and other metals, forming a compound that the body can eliminate in the urine. The process generally takes 1 to 3 hours. The toxic level of EDTA is quite high, about 3 grams per day over a 6 or 7 day period. I believe you are confusing EDTA with MTBE, which was added to gasoline after the lead was removed to reduce knocking and pinging, and was subsequently found to be toxic and banned in the US.
Man that’s some well articulated knowledge right there!
 
I think the unspeakable nutrient is chelated via amino acids, not EDTA and there were some very persistent folks on here trying to figure out what that exactly meant.
 
You obviously haven’t read Sheds post. It’s not from a nutrient company promoting their line. Where do you see “Shop our Products”.
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Cannabis Agronomy Services
@KingJohnC
This isn’t the 1st time I’ve seen a bunch of cut/paste jibberish coming from you. You’re always against the grain and standoffish about things this community has had well established for years.

We’re here to help, not overwhelm folks with nonsense.

And we appreciate that John, but you should understand that most folks aren't necessarily on your level, so in an attempt to help us understand, you go too far down the rabbit hole and lose 99% of the people you’re trying to help.

The Mad Hatter's tea party for the Osborne?
Problem: There is absolutely no difference between the nutrients taken up by the plant in an organic grow and a synthetic grow, they are all mineralized nutrients.

There are 5 or greater entire disciplines of science where a man, woman or even a child can earn and hold either a Masters or Doctorate in which the discipline is based on the transitive forms of matter and their energy potentials, how small selections greatly affect the resulting outcome. One of these disciplines is the chemistry of actual rocket science.

Please do not take life advice or grow advice from the people with D - F comprehension levels of the 6 - 8 grade education levels they last were placed in before they quit school. This back door ass end of life assumption every selections input results where everything output is the same is of no consequence. I can never understand why people with low comprehension ability pontificate that everything is the same and results are same when the daily exposure in their surrounding environment constantly shows example after example of how the statement is fallacy.

I’m mean…. Come on man, this makes absolutely no sense.

I’m sorry brother, I’m really trying… but gotta drop this and leave it here.

I am not a member of the brother hoods and Osborne.

The term organic is originating in nature. When peat moss is a residual plant mass which due to large environmental event and the acidic pH water which caused the plant matter to fail to decompose naturally and leaves large peat bogs. Coco coir is the coconut husk and the part of a coconut which isolates heavy metal and toxic insecticide substances from the rest of the coconut tree. When questioning what is and is not earth or soil anything which can be visibly identified out is not earth or soil. The humus layer is not fully decomposed and is not soil. Pebbles, stones and twigs are not earth or soil. A majority of the potting soil or soil blends actively lack sufficient active organisms populations, fungus and bacteria and or simple elemental forms of readily available nutrients and regularly either cause deficiency or require the constant addition of additional nutrients for a cannabis plant to reach harvest without stunted growth and or severe deficiencies.
 
Why not give a few days of plain water? Any nutes in the last few days won't have any effect on the bud anyway since the plant is not growing any more, the resin is simply maturing, which continues even after the chop and not reliant on roots/input at all at the very end - I frequently drought/dry in the pot
Is the idea to feed til death to wring another gram or two out of it? Don't think so
This is why i have provided a recommended timetable so as to give the plant sufficient time to use any remaining chemical fertilizers present either in the plant or grow medium. If this timeline is extended for to long of time the vegetative mass degrades and after curing gives an undesirable dead dry grass chaff taste to the cannabis buds.
 
I can never understand why people with low comprehension ability pontificate that everything is the same and results are same when the daily exposure in their surrounding environment constantly shows example after example of how the statement is fallacy.
You mean with statements like this:

EDTA is toxic and when added to gasoline as a valve train lubricant is considered 10x times more toxic that the lead in leaded gasoline for its harm potential.
Patently untrue.
 
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