Un-Lucky Queen 12/12 Hempy

Doc,
This thread (like your others) has been really informative (and entertaining! :grinjoint: ). :bravo: AND :thanks:
I want to thank you again Doc for getting me pointed in the right direction. Your help has been a godsend. And OC+ is working great. My 4 Jack Herer are so healthy it's ridiculous! They're a few weeks into flower now and have been growing like crazy. Added a small light mover to provide enough coverage.

Did want to ask you a question. Do you know of any simple and safe ways to improve the taste of buds grown in hempy? I know you've said that those grown in soil taste the best, but, would adding something like Sweet help to improve it?

DocBud said:
I put up pictures in a new journal soon and then the games begin.
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It sounds like you're going to have a great setup there! Can't wait to see your next chapter!
:thumb::goodluck:
 
IrishBoy said:
sounds great! i cant wait to see you rock out some big boy watts! good luck with everything brother!
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RoorRip:thankyou:

I'm looking forward to it too! I'm especially happy about my relationship with my partner. I've known him for 27 years. He's an engineer who specializes in fabrication, and processes for production. I'm a take action kind of person. He's a thoughtful, planning type of person. We balance each other out very well. The grow room is going to look like a nuclear power plant control room....he'll have everything labeled, gorgeous wire runs....really nice. I'm hoping this improves everything.

GrownManHollr said:
Doc,
This thread (like your others) has been really informative (and entertaining! :grinjoint: ). :bravo: AND :thanks:
I want to thank you again Doc for getting me pointed in the right direction. Your help has been a godsend. And OC+ is working great. My 4 Jack Herer are so healthy it's ridiculous! They're a few weeks into flower now and have been growing like crazy. Added a small light mover to provide enough coverage.

Did want to ask you a question. Do you know of any simple and safe ways to improve the taste of buds grown in hempy? I know you've said that those grown in soil taste the best, but, would adding something like Sweet help to improve it?

It sounds like you're going to have a great setup there! Can't wait to see your next chapter!
:thumb::goodluck:
Click to expand...

Thanks bro! I'm so glad I could help....and I too love the OC+.

Taste....well, I've tried sweet and molasses. I dunno if they "helped" or not. Here's what I notice about hempy's vs soil in the taste department.

Hempy's smell less strong when cured but smoke VERY smooth. Potency is fine....but the buds don't stink up the room. That could be good or bad....a personal preference.

The soil grown plants have more flavor, smell more and have a more earthy pot-like aroma. They are just as potent as the hempys, and while not quite as smooth, the extra taste is not at all unpleasant. Like the difference between a lite beer and a full bodied ale.

As far as yield....hempy wins.
Potency: tie
Taste/bag appeal: soil

At least that's been my experience.
 
Setting Sun said:
Your new setup sounds really good Doc.

It's going to be very cool to see how you set things up after what you've learned in your trusty starter grow room.

Best wishes for success in the new digs ;)
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thanks, my friend! ;)

The set up is going to be a bit cleaner, with easier access to everything. No seperate veg and flower room....everything on 12/12....sex 'em in the first month, transplant, and move 'em under the big lights.

The best males will go outdoors for a while, I'll collect some pollen and pollenate some lower buds on a choice female.....I'm nervous about that. I may need some coaching. I want to establish a seed bank....get some good genetics, breed.....that sort of thing.
 
DocBud said:
thanks, my friend! ;)

The set up is going to be a bit cleaner, with easier access to everything. No seperate veg and flower room....everything on 12/12....sex 'em in the first month, transplant, and move 'em under the big lights.

The best males will go outdoors for a while, I'll collect some pollen and pollenate some lower buds on a choice female.....I'm nervous about that. I may need some coaching. I want to establish a seed bank....get some good genetics, breed.....that sort of thing.
Click to expand...


It does sound like the makings of a very good grow partnership with your engineer friend. Great combination of personality traits!

Perfectionists like your engineer friend pay a lot of attention to detail, but tend to procrastinate, so your "take action" personality will complement that very well.

About the seed-making, is there a specific part of the process that's making you nervous, or just the whole thing in general?

I can't wait for your new journal!
 
Setting Sun said:
It does sound like the makings of a very good grow partnership with your engineer friend. Great combination of personality traits!

Perfectionists like your engineer friend pay a lot of attention to detail, but tend to procrastinate, so your "take action" personality will complement that very well.

About the seed-making, is there a specific part of the process that's making you nervous, or just the whole thing in general?

I can't wait for your new journal!
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You described it exactly.....if he was doing this alone, the room would get built sometime in January....if i was doing it, I'd already have seeds popped, the room would be functional, but not elegant. We'll have it done this month, and it will be quite nice.

Regarding seeds: My plan is to put a couple males outside and pollenate a single female, lower buds only. I'd like to put that female back in the mix with the other plants, fans very low for a couple days. I don't want to seed the rest of the crop, just a single female.

How would you do that?
 
If you have more than one male to choose from, I'd select the pollen donor by the traits you're wanting to establish. If you want big plants, go with the biggest male. If you want potency, snip a couple of the male tips and smoke them at least a few hours apart. If the planets line up, you may get both of those qualities in the same male.

It contributes 50% to the progeny, so it's worth the time and effort to select the best one for your needs.

If you can take the female you're going to pollinate outside to do the dirty deed, you can ensure that you won't seed any other females, but that's not always possible.

If you're going to pollinate the female when it's amongst the other females, you can still do it very safely.

Don't take the container you put the collected pollen in anywhere near your grow room. Take a q-tip and pick up some pollen with it. Don't use a brush like is advised often, because a brush doesn't hold onto the pollen nearly as well.

Take *just* that loaded q-tip into the grow room, but *only* after you've turned off all your fans.

Then, approach your favorite girl with roses and/or a box of chocolates, and murmuring sweet nothings, apply the pollen to the lower buds you want to pollinate. If you want lots of seeds, pollinate several lower buds. The pollen will stick to the cotton q-tip very well, so you may have to hold it right over the bud and tap it to release the pollen, but lightly touching it to the hairs works fine. If you run out, go outside to your pollen container and reload.

Once the pollen grains hit the hairs, they stick, so you don't have to worry about turning the fans back on and blowing it all over, but if you accidentally pollinated some leaves, try to wipe off any visible pollen from the leaves with a damp cloth.

If you can run the room with the circulation fan off for about an hour or so, that will help ensure that the pollen grains won't go anywhere when you turn them back on.

That's pretty much how I'd do it.
 
Setting Sun said:
If you have more than one male to choose from, I'd select the pollen donor by the traits you're wanting to establish. If you want big plants, go with the biggest male. If you want potency, snip a couple of the male tips and smoke them at least a few hours apart. If the planets line up, you may get both of those qualities in the same male.

It contributes 50% to the progeny, so it's worth the time and effort to select the best one for your needs.

If you can take the female you're going to pollinate outside to do the dirty deed, you can ensure that you won't seed any other females, but that's not always possible.

If you're going to pollinate the female when it's amongst the other females, you can still do it very safely.

Don't take the container you put the collected pollen in anywhere near your grow room. Take a q-tip and pick up some pollen with it. Don't use a brush like is advised often, because a brush doesn't hold onto the pollen nearly as well.

Take *just* that loaded q-tip into the grow room, but *only* after you've turned off all your fans.

Then, approach your favorite girl with roses and/or a box of chocolates, and murmuring sweet nothings, apply the pollen to the lower buds you want to pollinate. If you want lots of seeds, pollinate several lower buds. The pollen will stick to the cotton q-tip very well, so you may have to hold it right over the bud and tap it to release the pollen, but lightly touching it to the hairs works fine. If you run out, go outside to your pollen container and reload.

Once the pollen grains hit the hairs, they stick, so you don't have to worry about turning the fans back on and blowing it all over, but if you accidentally pollinated some leaves, try to wipe off any visible pollen from the leaves with a damp cloth.

If you can run the room with the circulation fan off for about an hour or so, that will help ensure that the pollen grains won't go anywhere when you turn them back on.

That's pretty much how I'd do it.
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That sounds easy enough....I think I can manage it.
How many seeds do you get from a single plant this way?
 
Setting Sun said:
Depends on how heavily you pollinate it and how many buds you pollinate, but as a very rough estimate, figure on around 5-10 seeds from each popcorn bud.

Also, mark the branches with the pollinated buds somehow so that you know which ones they are later down the line.
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Ditto on the marking....

I'd like to make 100 seeds each strain, each run....i've got plans.
 
To make 100 viable seeds from a single female, you may have to pollinate more than just the lower buds, unless there's several of them.

The sacrifice of the nicer buds would be worth it in the long run, if you have to do that.

On second though, with the size of your plants, it may not be that hard ;)
 
Setting Sun said:
To make 100 viable seeds from a single female, you may have to pollinate more than just the lower buds, unless there's several of them.

The sacrifice of the nicer buds would be worth it in the long run, if you have to do that.

On second though, with the size of your plants, it may not be that hard ;)
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Well, I'll just have to pollenate several girls, or an entire plant. I really like growing from seed. Cuttings are fine....lots of people do it well....easy to keep nothing but females in the room....but it's not just buds I'm after.
 
DocBud said:
:thanks: OC+ worked much better for me than FF. No comparison.



I think I ended up using about the "high" end of the recommended dose. I've used OC in vegetable and flower gardens, so I kinda knew how to do it. Seriously, you could double the recommended amount and have no problems. If you used less, you'd probably still be OK unless the plants are heavy feeders, then you just add more!



Ah.....how strong is your pH down?
You can test your total alkalinity with a pool test kit. I highly recommend it.

Here's an update on my new grow room:

We have the electric mapped out now. We'll have a 50 amp 240 circuit that we'll be running 3 1000 watt lights on....have room for 8 lights on the circuit, but the room "only" has room for 4. In addition to that we'll have a 20 amp 110 and a 15 amp 110. Should be enough for the fans, T5's, timers, controllers, etc.

Doc, As a GC, I've learned that when a client says "that should be enough," it never is. If you're still in the rough-in planning, I'd recommend at least one more 20A circuit, 2 if it was me, and as many duplex outlets as you can.

I've got 2/20A, and a 220V circuit in the crawl, and it's a pain. Timers and some plugs can be bulky, and inadvertently resetting a timer is an adventure. I'd spread thing out so you don't have a cluster fork.

It's a lot easier to put stuff in now than later, when you're trying to work around your plants. Think plug n play :grinjoint:

We've bombed, and now we're ready to start some mild construction, ducting, sealing and panda plastic.

Getting ducting in the right places is another thing that usually raises some issues. It always seems to be an afterthought, and ends up looking and working like it. Flex duct is great, but it also greatly reduces efficiencies. If you're going to be in this room for a while, I'd hard duct as much as I could.

Acoustic caulk is pricey, but much better at really sealing things than painter's caulk.

We'll be growing in 3 4x4 trays, with seedlings in 2x4 trays. The idea is to have 20 plants in each tray at varying degrees of maturity. I'll be making seeds.

Now, our water:

We've got well water. pH 6.4 PPM 640! Yikes. I have not tested total alkalinity yet.

However, my grow partner uses this well water and grows amazing vegetables. He's got a quarter acre vegetable garden and it is incredible. So, sumpin tells me we'll be OK with this water.

IMO, outdoor growing and well water are a whole nother thing from indoor and well water. You've seen my battle :) A well can be a constantly changing system. You may want to check the water for a couple of weeks to see if it's as stable as you need.

We'll be using OC+ for sure, but we'll also try the Mittleider method, some of which I've discussed on this thread. They are the folks I got that micronute mix from and this is what my partner uses in the vegetable garden.

I put up pictures in a new journal soon and then the games begin.
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Put up some pics of where you are with your new room. I am sure it's sweet.

And, if you need any help, you know where to crawl :)

:peace:
 
Too possibaly give some peace of mind I would put each bud in a zip lock bag tape it shut if you can do a good one with the seal. Wait a couple days and remove the spent pollin and put your ribbon as before.
 
Greenhouse Grower: Understanding Plant Nutrition: Controlled- And Slow-Release Fertilizers

Understanding Plant Nutrition: Controlled- And Slow-Release Fertilizers

By Bill Argo and Paul Fisher
October 2008

Nutrients are mainly released from a CRF prill following absorption of water through the membrane. The water dissolves the fertilizer inside the prill. The dissolved nutrients then diffuse back out through the coating into the soil solution.

Once the CRF prill has absorbed water, soil temperature determines the release rate of nutrients. Depending on the product, the ideal release temperature (i.e., the temperature used to predict the duration of the fertilizer release) can vary from 70°F to 78°F (21°C to 25°C). For example, one type of CRF has an ideal release temperature of 70°F. For a fertilizer with a six-month release rate, 90 to 95 percent of the nitrogen fertilizer contained in the prills will be released over six months if the temperature of the medium is maintained at an average of 70°F.

The higher the average soil temperature above the ideal release temperature, the more quickly nutrients will be released from the fertilizer prill, shortening the duration of the fertilizer. In contrast, lowering the average soil temperature below the ideal release temperature will slow the nutrient release rate and increase the fertilizer duration. Using the example above, if the average soil temperature increased from 70°F to 80°F (21°C to 26°C), the release duration would decrease from six months to four months, whereas decreasing the average soil temperature to 60°F (15°C) would cause the release duration to increase to seven to eight months.​
 
on pollinating, i would use a small glass or test tube to hold the male spunked q-tip in as you make your way to and around the garden.
 
DocBud said:
FYI: Tapla, the author, is legendary grower Uncle Ben's brother.
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Get out of here!!! That's interesting.

I think you posted a link in this thread somewhere to a micronutrient mix that can be purchased online. Can you post it again? I can't find anything like that locally and google searches are coming up empty too.

Even though hempys yield better and are easier, I do believe the soil plants taste better. Quality is what we're after....so we're gonna go with soil.
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So is the distinction on taste, not between simply organic vs. chem but soil food web vs. non soil food web?
 
Grower Z said:
Get out of here!!! That's interesting.

I think you posted a link in this thread somewhere to a micronutrient mix that can be purchased online. Can you post it again? I can't find anything like that locally and google searches are coming up empty too.



So is the distinction on taste, not between simply organic vs. chem but soil food web vs. non soil food web?
Click to expand...

The micronutrient mix I have can be found here:
Natural Mineral Fertilizers

These are enough micronutes to make 60 pounds of fertilizer....in other words, if you have a 30x1.5' bed you can completely fertilize it 60 times. I calculated it as about 120 plants....for 10.95! :Hookah:

this isn't the only micromix out there...not by a long shot!
Since I bought this product, I learned that Aquarium stores have good micronute products. Also, there is "Micromax" by the same folks who make Osmocote.
 
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