TheCapn's - Not So Simple - Aeroponics

Re: TheCapn's "not so simple" Aeroponics

Thanks for the response bro, technically could you run an aerosystem at roomtemp (say 70-75) and expect the beneficial bacteria to still keep anaerobic bacteria under control?
 
Re: TheCapn's "not so simple" Aeroponics

Subbed aint missing this one!
 
Re: TheCapn's "not so simple" Aeroponics

AfricanGrower said:
Thanks for the response bro, technically could you run an aerosystem at roomtemp (say 70-75) and expect the beneficial bacteria to still keep anaerobic bacteria under control?
Click to expand...

That's a good question, AG, and some people (including cultivater, I suspect) will tell you yes, you can use the fungi and a higher temp. However, this is no substitute for dissolved oxygen levels. We know D.O. levels decrease with higher temps, no mater what method you are using to oxygenate the water. It is a bit of a gamble, the higher temp you go.

Most beneficial bacteria prefer a temp of 68-73F, but will survive in highly oxygenated environments at a much wider range. This is a subject that could turn into a 100 page thread easily. Right now, I'm leaning on the cool side, to keep dissolved oxygen levels as high as possible. The bulk of the roots are inside the hydroton in the 10" net pot, and this area will run a little warmer right now, since it's not being flooded with the cool water. Eventually, I'll take the temp to 68.

Here are the top 10 things I've learned about beneficial bacteria:

1. DWC and Aeroponics, provides a happy place for Pythium to thrive.
2. The bad guys (pythium) thrive especially in water with low dissolved oxygen. The good guys (mycorrhizal fungi) thrive especially in water with high dissolved oxygen.
3. Sterilizing products such as h2o2, chlorine, dutch master zone help to kill both good and bad guys, but rarely are able to cure an infection.
4. Plants grow slower without the addition of mycorrhizal fungi to colonize the plant roots and aid in the uptake of nutrients.
5. Using a grow method that includes a medium, like rock wool, coco, and allows the medium to dry slightly in between waterings is less prone to pythium outbreaks.
6. It's best to colonize the root zone of a plant as early (when the plant is young) as possible.
7. The fungi live best in the root zone, where it attaches to roots and creates a symbiotic relationship between bacteria and roots.
9. Don't purposely FEED bacteria (using sugary or sweet products) in the growing system. The food will also feed the bad guys, and could trigger an outbreak.
10. In almost every case, pythium is fatal. The ONLY technique I've seen that will help cure a severe infection of pythium / root rot, is by correcting the situation that led to the problem, and then combating it with beneficial bacteria.
11. The most effective way to colonize your root zone with beneficial bacteria is by breeding an army of them, outside the root zone, in a "tea", and then pouring them over the root crown / zone. It's almost impossible to add too much (within reason).

Ok, that was 11 ;-)

Check out the "live or sterile" article for more information on this.
 
Re: TheCapn's "not so simple" Aeroponics

i agree with all the above. dissolved oxygen is the way to go, if someone were struggling to keep temps down then an army of good bacteria will help stave off bad bacteria. also its super important to keep res and grow area as clean as poss. i always wash my hands before handling plants.
 
Re: TheCapn's "not so simple" Aeroponics

I've been running benny's from the beginning through veg and then switching to zone before flower with great results.

the reason behind this is with the high D.O. levels in my system when I add my sweeteners (Sweet raw or Prime) in flower it turns my system into a microbe brew tank and causes fast ph swings.

because I run a chiller I've had no root problems with this method :)
 
Re: TheCapn's "not so simple" Aeroponics

The tea I use (t&j soil life and activator) is the only tea I have heard of that can go anaerobic and still be safe to use and benefit the plants I tested this claim by letting a gallon of the tea "go bad" then tried it on 1 plant to see if death was soon to follow (there was no existing mykos in the medium it was straight Coco W/no ammendments other than Calmag) the plant grew just fine not even any slower than the others, I'm wondering if this tea is not the perfect tea for hydro apps
I will know soon I'm gonna use it in my upcoming ebb & flow organic test ,I think if I am to ever be successful with hydro it's gotta be "live" since everytime I've tried hydro it was sterile and no matter what I did the pith bich got me! I'm talking I even used the bleach method,35% h2o2, blah blah etc etc
 
Re: TheCapn's "not so simple" Aeroponics

Capn, would you give an opinion about refrigerating the bennies for mid week use? Double the pleasure, double the fun?

@BigIrishDoode,

Is your test for an entire grow, or just long enough to go anaerobic and develop bad bacteria?
 
Re: TheCapn's "not so simple" Aeroponics

Skybound said:
Capn, would you give an opinion about refrigerating the bennies for mid week use? Double the pleasure, double the fun?

@BigIrishDoode,

Is your test for an entire grow, or just long enough to go anaerobic and develop bad bacteria?
Click to expand...

It was just the 1 gallon and 1 plant so for about 2 weeks it got the anaerobic tea long enough to kill it if we're going to I think, a thing I find noteworthy is this tea smells different both fresh brewed and "bad" it did not develop that sewer fart smell I have noticed with all the other teas
 
Re: TheCapn's "not so simple" Aeroponics

>>>The tea I use (t&j soil life and activator) is the only tea I have heard of that can go anaerobic and still be safe to use and benefit the plants

Hey Doode, can you elaborate on your method of making tea with ingredients, measurements and such?
 
Re: TheCapn's "not so simple" Aeroponics

AfricanGrower said:
>>>The tea I use (t&j soil life and activator) is the only tea I have heard of that can go anaerobic and still be safe to use and benefit the plants

Hey Doode, can you elaborate on your method of making tea with ingredients, measurements and such?
Click to expand...

Skybound said:
Capn, would you give an opinion about refrigerating the bennies for mid week use? Double the pleasure, double the fun?

@BigIrishDoode,

Is your test for an entire grow, or just long enough to go anaerobic and develop bad bacteria?
Click to expand...

Please let's steer this journal back on track. Sky, in my blog post, I talk about storing the tea. BID, You're welcome to post your tea recipe as a comment in my blog too.

I love the talk about beneficial bacteria, believe me, but I also want to keep the bloat down, in order for subscribers and readers to be able to read this journal without having to go thru too many pages of chit chat.
 
Re: TheCapn's "not so simple" Aeroponics

I will know soon I'm gonna use it in my upcoming ebb & flow organic test ,I think if I am to ever be successful with hydro it's gotta be "live" since everytime I've tried hydro it was sterile and no matter what I did the pith bich got me! I'm talking I even used the bleach method,35% h2o2, blah blah etc etc
Click to expand...

I respect the capn wants to keep on the topic of aero. I just wanted to make a quick point which is relative to any hydro where roots are submerged in liquid or an inert media such as clay pebbles. I cant stress enough how important water temps and cleanliness are to any hydro grow and that is where so many people go wrong. Even something simple like not washing hands before a res change can introduce bad bacteria to the system. The main reason people get pyth is warm water and it then being contaminated, which is so easy to do. Once that happens people shy from hydro and believe it isnt simple or too much work. I believe if u keep area clean, pay attention to not touching anything with dirty hands and keep water temps in the 65-68f range then u are onto a winner.
 
Re: TheCapn's "not so simple" Aeroponics

5 day update. No signs of pythium.

I decided to not get a bigger pump. Instead, I put another 396gph in SERIES with the other. This is giving it the extra boost it needs. Plus, if a pump dies, I'll have a backup. Note to self, in the next system I make, I'll rig up two separate water pumps, on two separate sprayer systems. In case one pump dies, I'll have the backup.

Chiller at 67F
PPM at 500
PH is a bit unstable, 5.6 to 6.1 but I'm getting control of it.

5 days ago:
GoodRoots3.JPG


Today:
Roots11-13-2013.jpg


5 days ago:
aeroPlant11-08.jpg


Today:
11-13-2013.jpg


I decided to trash that extra Kushage plant. It won't fit into my future schedule, and I need to focus on my bubble gum pheno hunt.
 
Re: TheCapn's "not so simple" Aeroponics

Chiller at 67F
PPM at 550
PH is a stable at 5.8-5.9

10 days ago:
GoodRoots3.JPG


Today:
Roots11-18-2013.jpg


10 days ago:
aeroPlant11-08.jpg


Today:
11-18-2013.jpg


Lets compare this to 10 days capn style (rock wool grow cubes):

Picture from 7-1:


Picture from 7-11:


So far, the aero growth is rapid, but is it faster than using regular grow cubes? Too soon to tell.
 
Re: TheCapn's "not so simple" Aeroponics

Now that I have the flower room cleared out, I was able to give the other two plants in some room to breathe. They have been very crowded. In this first journal entry I said I was going to do a "semi vertical". I'm practicing with these two. These two plants are 6 weeks into flower. They are the same UN-announced strain as the aero plant. The aero plant featured in this journal is a cut from the closest plant in this picture. The one in the rear is not as vigorous, so I didn't keep it.

This is 1800W on two plants. I hope this strain has the potential to produce 1.5lbs like I promised. So far, it's looking good, but still getting used to the strain. It is calmag hungry, that's for sure.

I wish you could scratch and sniff the screen. This strain doesn't smell like anything I've grown before. The best I can describe it; it smells like soap. This could be good if odor is a concern; it is for me. Even if the odor leaks, it doesn't smell like weed.

SemiVert2.jpg
 
Re: TheCapn's "not so simple" Aeroponics

Real nice cap! I don't know how I missed this one. Better late than never.
Do both plants have the soap smell? I've def. had some strange smelling plants but thats a first Ivory Kush haha

I really like the idea of two pumps in case one fails, like the aircraft industry and I think Ferrari incorporates into their systems, redundancy. I should hook up two timers and two pumps and two sets of everything but my luck I'd get two power outages :high-five:or I'd forget to push auto two times:clap::clap:
 
Re: TheCapn's "not so simple" Aeroponics

AfricanGrower said:
Ivory Kush eh!

Hey Capn, is that a bottomless cooltube that you HID is hanging semi-vertical in?
Click to expand...

Ivory Kush... drives the girls crazy. No the cool tube is ducted. See the duct to the right of it? That's attached to the other end of the cool tube.
 
Re: TheCapn's "not so simple" Aeroponics

TheCapn said:
Ivory Kush... drives the girls crazy. No the cool tube is ducted. See the duct to the right of it? That's attached to the other end of the cool tube.
Click to expand...

Ahh, I see. Thanks for clearing that up! How are temps with the HPS so low into the canopy? Seems like they are almost touching?
 
Re: TheCapn's "not so simple" Aeroponics

AfricanGrower said:
Ahh, I see. Thanks for clearing that up! How are temps with the HPS so low into the canopy? Seems like they are almost touching?
Click to expand...

Adding another 600W brought my max temps in my flower room from 78 to 80. I keep ballasts outside the room. It does look close, but the lights are about 15" away. When I put my hand between the light and the plant, I can feel a tiny bit of warmth... no more than you would feel from the sun, so I think I'm ok.

You bring up a good question for a blog entry. Here ya go:

Don't dry out your leaves! - Blogs - 420 Magazine ®

 
Re: TheCapn's "not so simple" Aeroponics

Yesterday I added a quart of tea to the aero plant. Today, the PH had dropped from 5.8 to 5.2. A quart was probably too much tea for aero. Lesson learned.

Here's a picture, since the aero cam doesn't do it justice. Look at the size of those fan leaves. The growth rates are really stepping up now. Notice I'm not "training", "bending" or "LST'ing" (as stoners call it). I have topped the plant twice to form 4 main branches, and now I'm letting it do it's own thing. Remember, this one will NOT go under a trellis. I'm not even moving fan leaves out of the way. The lower branches are stretching up right thru the big fans.

BigAero.jpg
 
Back
Top Bottom