SweetSue's Cannabis Oil Study Hall

MagicJim needs more canna cream for the wounded shoulder, so what better time than the present to get this experiment under way?

Rice is drying in the oven. Samples are ready to go.

The experiment begins

The experiment begins

  • Media owner SweetSue
  • Date added
 
Can you oven-dry buds in a sealed bag? The moisture needs to escape, no?
 
SweetSue said:
Did I get it right this time? :battingeyelashes:

Decarbing For Maximum Neutral Cannabinoids (~ 95% conversion)

High CBD chemovar (strain)


Heat 15 minutes @ 221° F (105° C) to dry.

Continue heating either

* 60 minutes @ 248° F (120° C)
* 30 minutes @ 284° F (140° C)

Large Batch (larger than 4 oz)

* 15 minutes @ 221° F (105° C) to dry
* Continue 55-90 min @ 293° F (145° C)


High THC chemovar (strain)

Heat 15 minutes @221° F (105° C) to dry

Continue heating for either

* 60-120 minutes @ 248° F (120° C)
* 110 minutes @ 230°F (110° C)

Large Batch (larger than 4 oz)

*15 minutes @ 221° F (105° C) to dry

* Continue 45-55 min @ 293°F (145° C)
Click to expand...
I agree. This makes more sense.

I do want to raise the issue of drying at over 212º F again. The following is from ilovegrowingmarijuana.com

"it’s valuable to keep the temperature below the boiling point. As long as the plant still contains moisture, the water can boil and damage the cells, which will destroy the integrity and appearance of the plant. Additionally, a lower temperature lowers the risk of mistakes, because there is less worry about forgetting about it. Remember, the first step is to dehydrate the plant. Don’t burn it or let it get too hot!"

Now, i have no idea what "damage the cells" actually means, so I don't know if this is an issue or not. Obviously water will boil and potentially rupture the cell membrane. Would this rupture the trichomes? Anyone else have any information to add?

FWIW, I pre-dry before decarbing at 180-200º F
 
Highya MedManMike,

Question - What's your purpose for decarbing? Does it matter whether it ruptures cell membrane? I only decarb before I use it for an edible; brownies, infused oil, etc.
 
Whole lot of speculation about decarbing going when that minor issue has been dealt with for decades.

If your pot is going into baked goods then do not decarb before baking. Baked goods will get decarbed while baking and almost everything will get soaked up by the ingredients and help the person(s) that eat them.

Decarbing in the oven should be in a sealed container. If your kitchen stinks while you are decarbing then you are losing valuable medicine and shame on you!

Why is this not widely known?

A few pages back someone was complaining about not getting enough medicine per dose using coconut oil/caps. The solution to that is turning the pot into a concentrate first then capping it up. If solvents are not to your liking then dry sift your herb and cap up the kief. Easy enough to put kief into a sealed container and decarb if that's the issue tho THCA is supposed to be just as effective as THC from most of the studies I've read so I wouldn't be too concerned. Your liver will still convert into what you need and if you don't feel high from it then you can take larger doses without being disabled from your chosen medication.

I just had an MRI to check for a prostate cancer and have been on tenterhooks for 6 months until it got done. Using pot in all sorts of formats plus taking prostate caps with Saw Palmetto and other ingredients to help. Got it done last Thursday and got a call Monday that all is clear! Can write that fear off now and concentrate on some suspicious skin cancer spots. Making up some fresh RSO to use on them and see what happens.

I really feel for those that have serious cancer or other life-threatening health issues and want the most potent meds to deal with it. Had I gotten a diagnosis of a cancer I was determined to deal with it using cannabis as my main medication but for decades I've striven to reduce my exposure to many of the things that can lead to serious health issues like cancer and injest things to help prevent it.

Things like mustard, broccoli, cauliflower and other foods that contain sulfur compounds known to help prevent cancer.

Avoiding things like junk food. I ate my last big mac 40 years ago and haven't drank colas etc for at least 10 years and even before it was maybe one can/month. At least 90% of everything I ingest is made at home and most of that comes from our garden and chickens. Still only eat about 6 eggs a week and we got lots of eggs but something in them is bad for the prostate so if female eat all the free-range eggs you want! Store bought factory eggs are bad mkay . . . ;)

I'll be an old age pensioner in Oct when I turn 65 and still take no pharma or otc meds on a regular basis. Take quite a few dietary supplements like zinc, vit c, iron, D3 etc and eat very little junk. Still weigh the same as I did when I was 18, have a full head of long red hair and wake up with a boner every morning. Life could be lots worse and I figure I got lucky in the genetic crap-shoot tho pretty sure my views toward foods etc are helping.

I have so many friends/associates that are killing themselves with junk foods and other issues but preaching to them too much will leave me more alone so other that gentle hints and leading by example I grudgingly let them be. At a friend's today he told me that his liver doctor told him that signs of cirrosis of his liver are gone and his Hep-B test can no longer detect the virus. He quit his 4 can/day Pepsi habit a couple years ago after I pointed out how bad the high fructose corn syrup was for his liver and switched from smoking pot to eating my cocobudder. He also dropped a lot of his junk foods too so who knows but he feels so much better than ever he says and has lost a lot of weight around his belly too.

If you live in or near a city chop 10 years of healthy living off your life. All the latest data shows that you are breathing so much extra bad stuff that you might as well smoke 2 packs of radioactive commercial tobacco a day and live in the country. I grew up near Vancouver, BC and had serious lung issues twice a year at least and so did my wife. Since moving to northern Alberta in '01 we've each had about 5 or 6 bronchitis/lung issues and mostly just the first few years since we got here. We both are lifetime tobacco smokers too but for the last 5 years have only smoked tobacco that is naturally cured from leafonly.com or from tobacco plants we've grown ourselves. Like legal pot it's alien to your body and will kill you eventually. I still gotta quit soon or will be needing and O2 bottle in a few years.

Sorry to rant on but DAMN I got lots more.

:peace:
 
@OldMedUser, you rant away all you want, and

:theband::yahoo: :theband:
​
Your results reinforce our suggestion that you want to get cannabinoids into the body through multiple pathways and in diversified medicines. I’ve started a practice of chewing on bits of raw flower all day, dried and fresh when available. Those acid cannabinoids are beginning to look like the most powerful of all.

My mother taught me to pay attention to the “bull’s eye” foods, broccoli, garlic, yams, peppers, etc.......foods that replenish the body with the raw materials of rejuvenation. I now understand that they form the building blocks for the healthy function of the ECS. She also taught me to avoid processed foods, advice I’ve taken more seriously at some parts of my life than others.

People have to find their own way. We lead by joyful example. :slide:

I’m no longer as concerned with a complete decarb, but if you are, those notes from GW Pharma are a good resource to have. Finding and translating it can be challenging.

If you’re going to make CCO or keif capsules and take them through the gut it makes sense to process it a little with a carrier oil and some liquid sunflower lecithin to dramatically increase the bioavailability. :battingeyelashes:

Cajun said it took him 28 days to get rid of the melanoma on his scalp. CCO applied directly on the skin, changing the dressing out for fresh every 2-3 days. Let us know how it goes. :hugs:
 
Bode said:
Highya MedManMike,

Question - What's your purpose for decarbing? Does it matter whether it ruptures cell membrane? I only decarb before I use it for an edible; brownies, infused oil, etc.
Click to expand...
Mostly for making infused oils. I really don’t know if it matters (if it ruptures). I asked because someone else on 420 mentioned it and then I found the reference on the I love growing... site.

Just want to get the most out of the product. :ganjamon:
 
medmanmike said:
Mostly for making infused oils. I really don’t know if it matters (if it ruptures). I asked because someone else on 420 mentioned it and then I found the reference on the I love growing... site.

Just want to get the most out of the product. :ganjamon:
Click to expand...

Getting the most out of the product is pretty relative to the goals at the start. :cheesygrinsmiley: Couldn’t resist Mike. :laughtwo:

If I’m looking to get high, then as close to total decarb is the way to go, but the more I study the more obvious it becomes that a wide range of cannabinoids, including the valuable acid ones, is probably a better systemic medicine.
 
@InTheShed, I ran the experiment- the oven won by a wide margin, but that’s not all the story. :laughtwo: Pictures and a full report will follow. A diversion stepped in.

I went on a study journey for another member and learned a couple important things:
- how the body decides to make a cannabinoid
- how THC acts to offset autoimmune expression

*BIG SIGH* These were primary questions I’ve been searching for decent answers to all along, and this morning @lazyfish dropped the link to LipidWeb and there was the explaination about eCBs, all laid out for me by William W. Christie.

It’s in response to a rise in intra-cellular calcium levels that the ECS creates 2-AG and anandamide. There are many, many other cannabinoids not being studied the way these two have been.

So the cell has too much calcium flowing in, and it’s too excited for the job at hand. The ECS creates endocannabinoids with the correct signal and calcium balance is restored.

Another fascinatingly interesting thing I learned here (among so many other delights!) - that it’s possible 2-AG can diffuse freely through membranes to reach the sites of activity.

Just stop and think about that for a moment.........

There are concentrations of 2-AG in the brain ~170 to 1000 times higher than anandamide.

2-AG is a precursor to other bioactive lipids.

God....I love this work! I need a good buzz! :bongrip:

It’ll take me days to understand all this.

Oh! The autoimmune response!

Well... I dropped the link above for Camaro, and reading it I learned that there are microRNAs whose job it is to tell the immune system, “Enough. We’re done” by influencing gene expression - silencing them. In people with autoimmune disease the mRNAs are turned off and the genes they’d be silencing are over-expressed.

They found 13 mRNAs that we’re inflienced by THC, and one in particular that was more profoundly affected.

In the presence of THC mRNA -690 dramatically increase in number. Cool, eh?

I recently came to understand that there are microfibers in the the extracellular matrix capable of exerting sustained, constricting stress - a wrinkling of the ECM - effectively silencing some of the finer nerve receptors that tell the cell what’s going on out there.

When communications with the outside goes down, what’s a cell to do? I suspect a few get sick trying to wing it. It’s a beautifully complex system, isn’t it?
 
Highya SweetSue,

I tried reading the post by lazyfish, but couldn't understand. It's fascinating stuff! I'd like to know about cellular biology, but need to start from square one, and not get high while trying. lol. I've been amazed at all the signaling by the ECS. Fun to learn about something I can understand, though. Cheers
 
SweetSue said:
@InTheShed, I ran the experiment- the oven won by a wide margin, but that’s not all the story. :laughtwo: Pictures and a full report will follow. A diversion stepped in.

I went on a study journey for another member and learned a couple important things:
- how the body decides to make a cannabinoid
- how THC acts to offset autoimmune expression

*BIG SIGH* These were primary questions I’ve been searching for decent answers to all along, and this morning @lazyfish dropped the link to LipidWeb and there was the explaination about eCBs, all laid out for me by William W. Christie.

It’s in response to a rise in intra-cellular calcium levels that the ECS creates 2-AG and anandamide. There are many, many other cannabinoids not being studied the way these two have been.

So the cell has too much calcium flowing in, and it’s too excited for the job at hand. The ECS creates endocannabinoids with the correct signal and calcium balance is restored.

Another fascinatingly interesting thing I learned here (among so many other delights!) - that it’s possible 2-AG can diffuse freely through membranes to reach the sites of activity.

Just stop and think about that for a moment.........

There are concentrations of 2-AG in the brain ~170 to 1000 times higher than anandamide.

2-AG is a precursor to other bioactive lipids.

God....I love this work! I need a good buzz! :bongrip:

It’ll take me days to understand all this.

Oh! The autoimmune response!

Well... I dropped the link above for Camaro, and reading it I learned that there are microRNAs whose job it is to tell the immune system, “Enough. We’re done.” by influencing gene expression - silencing them. In people with autoimmune disease the mRNAs are turned off and the genes they’d be silencing are over-expressed.

They found 13 mRNAs that we’re inflienced by THC, and one in particular that was more profoundly affected.

In the presence of THC mRNA -690 dramatically increase in number. Cool, eh?

I recently came to understand that there are microfibers in the the extracellular matrix capable of exerting sustained, constructing stress - a wrinkling of the ECM - effectively silencing some of the finer nerve receptors that tell the cell what’s going on out there.

When communications with the outside goes down, what’s a cell to do? I suspect a few get sick trying to wing it. It’s a beautifully complex system, isn’t it?
Click to expand...
Lots of amazing information thank you guys for all the time and money you spend on research on these topics, not everyone has the resources to be able to do what you amazing folk have done and continue to due, some of it goes way over my head and I’ll do research or ask questions of the stuff I’m unsure of but in the meantime, a big thank you once again
 
Camaro1691 said:
Lots of amazing information thank you guys for all the time and money you spend on research on these topics, not everyone has the resources to be able to do what you amazing folk have done and continue to due, some of it goes way over my head and I’ll do research or ask questions of the stuff I’m unsure of but in the meantime, a big thank you once again
Click to expand...

You're more than welcome Camaro. :hugs: It costs very little to be curious. Lol! We'll keep looking, and if anything shows up you'll be the first to know. Most of this is way over my head too, the first dozen or so times through. :laughtwo:
 
Bode said:
Highya SweetSue,

I tried reading the post by lazyfish, but couldn't understand. It's fascinating stuff! I'd like to know about cellular biology, but need to start from square one, and not get high while trying. lol. I've been amazed at all the signaling by the ECS. Fun to learn about something I can understand, though. Cheers
Click to expand...

:laughtwo: If you could see the confused brain cells when I first approach this subject Bode.....:rofl: I've simply stuck at it over and over again until it started to make sense. Now it's getting easier to grasp, but many basic cellular functions and terminology still give my gray matter fits too. I can't even attempt to do this straight. :hookah:
 
I wish I had payed more attention in biology class in school and health class lol.. I’ve always been decent at growing the plant but I’ve never understood the whole breakdown of THCA and CBDA and getting the benefits from them. Finding ways to make the body uptake these things the easiest is what I strive for, while I’ve always enjoyed given people a good product to smoke, after having SO diagnosed with AI and mother with cancer, I want to switch over towards being a care giver like I have always wanted to do but this pushes me to want to even more, the thought of helping people is what drives me not soo much the money aspect of it
 
Camaro1691 said:
I wish I had payed more attention in biology class in school and health class lol.. I’ve always been decent at growing the plant but I’ve never understood the whole breakdown of THCA and CBDA and getting the benefits from them. Finding ways to make the body uptake these things the easiest is what I strive for, while I’ve always enjoyed given people a good product to smoke, after having SO diagnosed with AI and mother with cancer, I want to switch over towards being a care giver like I have always wanted to do but this pushes me to want to even more, the thought of helping people is what drives me not soo much the money aspect of it
Click to expand...

One of the keys to success is the desire to use what we have for the benefit of others. There's a trap to that. One can begin to believe this is your purpose, and I no longer buy into the idea that we have a "purpose" beyond exploring more ways to express love and joyful expectation. :laughtwo: We hone our craft and it seems the universe has us meet up with the people who can most benefit from our help, and from whom we can benefit from.

This field has a particular addictive pull. Once you see the potential for cannabis therapeutics there's no easy way to turn away from the passion to spread the news. There's much to learn Camaro, and it's a wonderful journey getting to it. I'm so glad to have you join the exploration. :hugs:
 
SweetSue said:
I ran the experiment- the oven won by a wide margin, but that’s not all the story. :laughtwo: Pictures and a full report will follow.
Click to expand...
Thanks! I look forward to the full report, though I never doubted the oven would win. :)
 
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