SweetSue's Cannabis Oil Study Hall

[fookinel]

No no, the other day while i was making my usual oil, i additionally had another small normal pot going with some water, 12ml olive oil, 20grams fresh material, for 4 hours.
Now after sampling that 'experimental' batch, i'm sold on the water/oil method.. it really does allow you to get more cannabis into the olive oil.

Next step is to do a real batch with lets say 400grams fresh material, 0.2L olive oil (instead of 1L), several liters of water, and in a pressure cooker for about 2 hours (temperature goes up even for water in the pressure cooker). Only thing i'm gonna try to check first is the exact water temperature under pressure in the pressure cooker, and then adjust cooking time accordingly.. more or less should be about 2 hours though.

edit.. i MEANT pressure cooker, i just realized i was typing crockpot previously, soooorryyy!!

edit2.. i am now on the hunt for a pressure cooker with adjustable pressure and pressure gauge, then i would know exactly what temperature is in there, and could adjust it accordingly..

edit3.. found some pressure cookers with 2 'settings', 7 psi for 112 degrees celsius and 12 psi for 118 degrees. Perfect for 1.5 hours for THC extract and 1.1 hour for CBD extract.

If you're confident that's the way to go then go for it! I'll be waiting to hear what happens!

I can't explain why but for some reason I really like the idea of the pressure cooker, however, I don't know if or how pressure can affect the decarboxylation process. I've only ever seen decarboxylation time vs temperature (well, conversion of THCA to THC as a function of time and temperature) but not as a function of pressure. Just like the boiling point of water changes with pressure, the ideal decarboxylation time may change with pressure too.

 

[fookinel]

So, a quick update to this post.

The person I'm helping took 3 of those capsules last night with some extra CCO diluted in hemp seed oil (I don't know how potent this CCO/hemp seed oil mix is as I didn't make it) and they didn't feel anything.

They took the same quantity this morning (3 capsules with some extra CCO diluted in hemp seed oil) and they finally felt something! They felt a bit light headed, a bit dizzy, a bit they're not sure how to describe! It only lasted about 3 hours so it wasn't too bad

So it looks like for now they'll be on two capsules with some of the CCO/hemp seed oil mix after breakfast, two capsules after lunch, and 3 capsules with some of the CCO/hemp seed oil mix after dinner for a little while and then we'll try to increase this. My guess is that they're taking about 90mg of CCO a day just in the capsules and I want to get to at least 200mg a day soon.

I may try a slightly different mix with less olive oil and lecithin so each capsule is more potent, if I do I'll post the method and results.

 

[SweetSue]

I'm off reading more about cannabinoids, in particular the acid cannabinoids, THC-A, CBD-A, because these components have actually been shown to have greater effectiveness against symptoms like inflammation and nausea than the metabolized molecules. Then I skipped over to SkunkPharms to review some extraction information in advance of my initial oil production attempt, and I'm wondering if one could produce a decent oil high in the acid cannabinoids by simply not decarbing at all. Go through the QWET process, boil off the solvent and remove it immediately.

This is the point where I'd have removed previously decarbed material to keep THC values higher. I'm now beginning to seriously question what we thought we understood about the cannabinoids and the decarb process. Although we've obviously been getting powerful medicine with the commonly used processes, it occurs to me that we're missing an important part of the puzzle here.

Anybody else as frustrated as I am by the lack of data available?

 

[Canyon]

Sue,

Some of my post on this thread have skirted much of your last post. I don't use eatables, so decarboxolating is not needed. While following along here, I have been thinking you are loosing the lighter compounds in an effort to maximize conversion of the acids. This could be a shortcoming with eatables over say vaping. Or, a shortcoming of vaping if you want to keep the acids.

I want to make keif but with a house painter around for a while it can wait.

I think it was here that I brought up using keif with QWET, someone had tried adding some with mixed results. I had some concentrate that I left enough alcohol left in it to keep it thin. I kept it in the frig in a sealed jar. Eventually it started to [FONT=&amp]crystallize on the glass at the top of the liquid. I have tried some other things that need another try. Chances are that I will get to some of them.

I think you are onto something.

[/FONT]Best

 

[Big Budha]

Sue have you thought of juicing? I've read that it is effective in treating some disorders I don't remember which ones but there are some videos on the subject and a case study of a woman who treated her ailment with juicing. This method would retain the TCHA and CBDA
Here's the link
Health Maven - Escape from the Medical Mafia Matrix: The Power of RAW Cannabis was PULLED--View the substitute video below with Kristen Peskuski who Shares her Cannabis healing

 

[SweetSue]

Sue have you thought of juicing? I've read that it is effective in treating some disorders I don't remember which ones but there are some videos on the subject and a case study of a woman who treated her ailment with juicing. This method would retain the TCHA and CBDA

Yes I have considered it BigBudha, but the sheer volume of leaves needed to effectively treat disease makes this a better option for someone growing outside or in a greenhouse. (Wow! What a dream!) It takes well over 50 leaves a day to do anything significant. That can be near impossible to maintain in a small closet or tent grow.

 

[panacea]

I think we had the discussion before about letting the alcohol evaporate naturally, No heat, just somewhere in a dark area. This may take 2-3 wks(just a speculation). ALso may want to put in a several different jars to speed up the process. But no heat should mean no decarb.

 

[Canna Montana]

Thank you so much for that reference. That led me to "Another Tincture Thread...." on another site (google it) and I can see there's some Green Dragon and Honey Elixer in my future.

I can't wait to try this method now. Lol! Thanks for the hook up on the info. I just bought a smaller pressure cooker at a tag sale for $2. Score! Now I have the perfect reason to use it. Yay. Happy days!

 

[SweetSue]

I can't wait to try this method now. Lol! Thanks for the hook up on the info. I just bought a smaller pressure cooker at a tag sale for $2. Score! Now I have the perfect reason to use it. Yay. Happy days!

Alright. Let us know how it goes. Pictures, if you're daring and can remember.

 

[Canna Montana]

Shoot, I'll take you up on that dare! It'll be a month or so though. I want to wait for our first harvest so there are ample buds to use. I'll mark it on my calendar so I remember. Lol.

 

[JBUptown]

Hello 420Friends,

I ingest 1 to 2 grams of dried cannabis and 10 or so frozen leaves in a shake twice a day, in addition to my 4 daily CCO capsules. The buds are not decarbed or modified in any way, are minimally cured, and probably (I don't like that measurement!) are still in Acid form. I'm trying to get both molecules into my body at a constant therapeutic level. I am NOT a Physician but think I have experienced enough "Doc Stuff" to know how to test dosage and evaluate. I don't have to worry about dying from overdosing either ... how rare is that with ANY other medicine?

I couldn't keep enough fresh leaves in production to satisfy the two daily shakes, I needed much more grow space to keep available daily 100 or so big fresh leaves . When I first started using MM for my disease, I hadn't smoked weed in about 30+ years. After much research and reading, I determined that the making of my medicine, the dosage and the methods of administration were all of my choosing. SO much different than having Docs and PAs dictating every "choice". I have sound, and this is just my body and my experience, but the my liver benefits from having the Acid form to process. My liver enzymes haven't measured better in 8 years, and all this because Big Pharma almost killed my liver out! I am a believer in consumption of both raw and decarbed cannabis. CajunCelt has helped me way more than he knows ... but I don't want him to get a big head or anything.

Best of Buds

JB

 

[SweetSue]

Hahaha! I don't think we have to worry about Cajun's big head. I could be wrong about this but my sense is he's about as enamoured with the idea of star potential as I am. Thanks for that laugh. Yeah, he kinda changed my life too, the crazy cajun.

This has been my thinking for quite a while now JB. Get as many different forms of cannabis in by as many different delivery systems as you can without stressing about it. Be diverse. That's usually a good path to happiness.

So, if I understand you correctly you modified the shakes to be dried bud plus the ten leaves instead of trying to grow enough plants to supply more leaves? I take it you started out trying for 50 leaves per shake? That would be difficult to achieve on a regular basis.

May I ask, what dosage do you make the capsules? You may have shared this already, so forgive me if I've forgotten. I'm trying to get a sense of your daily dose.

 

[CajunCelt]

Happy 420....420!

 

[SweetSue]

Time To Make It Happen

Time to take the plunge and try a batch of oil. I don't have any critical health issues other than some minor problems with psoriasis that I'm hoping will begin to heal once I begin using CCO. Before that can happen though, I need to suck it up and make my first batch of oil.

Stage One: Decarb and Freeze

I began by weighing out an ounce of plant material. This batch will be made with a half ounce of Fatasmo Express and a quarter ounce of both Tikal and Zamaldelica. This is going to be a wicked sativa-dominant high THC oil that I'll use, at least initially, in place of my regular brownie doses. I'm pretty fond of those brownies, so I may keep them for one part of my personal protocol.

I broke it up lightly, just to get it to a more uniform size for the decarb step.

Into the oven bag and into the oven at 225 degrees Fahrenheit for an hour.

After cooling in the freezer for an hour I took the time to crumble it by hand. I'm selfish about my trichomes.

Into the jar and into the freezer with the wash jars and the solvent. Tomorrow afternoon I'll do the washes and Saturday I'll make oil.

Deep breath girl. I've thought through this process forwards and backwards and have even talked a couple guys through the process to success. I can do this.

 

[Neiko]

Way to go Sue! I thought we were decarbing at 240 for 1 hour. What did I miss that it is now 225?

 

[Pigeons420]

 

[SweetSue]

Way to go Sue! I thought we were decarbing at 240 for 1 hour. What did I miss that it is now 225?

The oven temp varies enough that I feel confident with the 225 degrees Neiko. I can't control my oven enough to risk a higher temperature. This is the temp I've always decarbed at.

 

[Canna Montana]

May I ask what is in all the jars? What does wash jar and the solvent mean. I've never seen this before and I'm quite interested in what you are doing.

 

[Pigeons420]

I'll be keeping a close eye on this Susan. I'm very interested to know how this turns out. I can't wait to dabble in the excitement of CCO!!

+ Reps for testing the depth of the water with both feet

 

[SweetSue]

May I ask what is in all the jars? What does wash jar and the solvent mean. I've never seen this before and I'm quite interested in what you are doing.

Why certainly Canna, you may ask. There are four jars in there. Three are empty, those will be used for the washes. The fourth has the ounce of bud in it.

The solvent is the bottle of ethanol alcohol, in my case I'm using Everclear 151.

You freeze the solvent and jars and bud so everything is as cold as you can get it. This allows the solvent to pick up the cannabinoids, terpenes and flavinoids but leave behind the fats, waxes and chlorophyll that we don't want in the oil.

After it's frozen you do a series of three minute washes where you cover the plant material with cold solvent, shake it gently for three minutes and then strain it into an empty jar. Repeat that two more times and you have three washes of different quality that can then be processed into concentrated oil by evaporating off the solvent, after it all spends another 24 hours in the freezer. In my case I'm going to do that part of the process using an essential oil still I purchased that'll let me recover some of the expensive Everclear.

I'm improving on the technique demonstrated in this video. Although she produces a usable oil in this video it's a low quality oil that probably tastes nasty. We can do better. She doesn't winterize (freeze) at all, and that's an important piece of the puzzle.