Suggestion for first time growers

[Chuckeye]

Can't afford a tent ?

3/4" x 4' x 8' foil backed foam insulation board is $17 here.

$20 for a 2' x 2' enclosure !

$40 for a 4' x 4' enclosure !

Hang the light from your ceiling, floor is a $6 emergency blanket...

I went a little crazy and made curved panels out of 1/2" plywood and 1/8" hollow core plastic.

Every time I wanted bigger I just made more flat panels

Cheers

 

[Sativa1970]

Chuck's point should be well taken, not argued. Why the contentiousness?

I don't think any of the posts were intended with malice. When you make a statement of opinion on a forum, it is assumed you want it open for discussion. Chuckeyes been around long enough that he knew who was going to read it and what he was in for. The unwritten tittle of every post is "Everyone who has an opinion please leave it here."

PH perfect soil is the simplest, easiest and cheapest but prone to pest and fungus problems.
DWC and DTW are both a close second. startup cost are the same but you use less nutes with DWC so a little cheaper. Less daily maintenance and no medium for pests to lay eggs in accept sewer flies if you do no maintenance on DWC. Root rot is more common with new growers in DWC.

I think the only thing we will all agree on is that ebb and flow is the most complicated and expensive way to start your first grow. I am sure someone will still disagree and post why E&F is great for new growers. I am fine with that.

Can't afford a tent ?

3/4" x 4' x 8' foil backed foam insulation board

Excellent advice for new growers. My first room back in the 80s was the same stuff. Just cut so it would wedge between the floor and celling. Current room still has it wedged against the two exterior walls. Made nominal 4 x 8 frames out of 2 x 3 lumber and put the foam board inside each frame, backed with black plastic to light seal. Modular panels that I can easily reconfigure or add more. Two of the panels are hinged together for my door. Some of them are over 10 years old but work like new.

 

[ReservoirDog]

I don't think any of the posts were intended with malice. When you make a statement of opinion on a forum, it is assumed you want it open for discussion. Chuckeyes been around long enough that he knew who was going to read it and what he was in for. The unwritten tittle of every post is "Everyone who has an opinion please leave it here."

PH perfect soil is the simplest, easiest and cheapest but prone to pest and fungus problems.
DWC and DTW are both a close second. startup cost are the same but you use less nutes with DWC so a little cheaper. Less daily maintenance and no medium for pests to lay eggs in accept sewer flies if you do no maintenance on DWC. Root rot is more common with new growers in DWC.

I think the only thing we will all agree on is that ebb and flow is the most complicated and expensive way to start your first grow. I am sure someone will still disagree and post why E&F is great for new growers. I am fine with that.



Excellent advice for new growers. My first room back in the 80s was the same stuff. Just cut so it would wedge between the floor and celling. Current room still has it wedged against the two exterior walls. Made nominal 4 x 8 frames out of 2 x 3 lumber and put the foam board inside each frame, backed with black plastic to light seal. Modular panels that I can easily reconfigure or add more. Two of the panels are hinged together for my door. Some of them are over 10 years old but work like new.

Thanks for that Sativa. I understand what we're doing here, and I wasn't rushing in to defend someone I thought needed defending, but the bug crawled up my ass nonetheless! My "what aboutism" alarm was going off - you know how maddening those automated sensors can be, sometimes seems the only way to turn them off is tear 'em off and stomp up and down on them. Aw crap....

 

[SmokingWings]

Interesting topic. I like the points of discussion that are coming up, including the hydro related stuff, even though I think that soil would be a better choice.

And that enclosure you built as shown in msg #21 is great.

Don't just pile it on, understand what each amendment is going to do. Add them one at a time in test pots and SEE what they do..

Most likely this is what causes the problems for newer growers. They do not want to do the research so that they can understand what any one amendment does, let alone what all of the ones in any fertilizer blend or mix will do.

They will have more problems because they want to add all of the nutrients at once to whatever pot they are using and have it work out without waiting to see what each will do.

They are more concerned about the end result and do not understand that those great looking plants and harvests involve knowing how to get there. Some of them do not know how to do the research and some do not want to know. It is as if they believe that because they dropped money on seeds, more money on soil or hydro supplies and some more on lights then all they need to do is put it all together and turn the switch to on, just like when they plugged the wires into the TV.

 

[Emeraldo]

 

[Emeraldo]

Interesting topic. I like the points of discussion that are coming up, including the hydro related stuff, even though I think that soil would be a better choice.

And that enclosure you built as shown in msg #21 is great.


Most likely this is what causes the problems for newer growers. They do not want to do the research so that they can understand what any one amendment does, let alone what all of the ones in any fertilizer blend or mix will do.

They will have more problems because they want to add all of the nutrients at once to whatever pot they are using and have it work out without waiting to see what each will do.

They are more concerned about the end result and do not understand that those great looking plants and harvests involve knowing how to get there. Some of them do not know how to do the research and some do not want to know. It is as if they believe that because they dropped money on seeds, more money on soil or hydro supplies and some more on lights then all they need to do is put it all together and turn the switch to on, just like when they plugged the wires into the TV.

There ought to be a genre of humor based on the New Grower phenomenon...

New Grower 1: Hey howzit goin me and I set the lights on 12/12 last week.
New Grower 2: Oh yeah great. Very satisfying. So... what kinda pot you growin'?
New Grower 1: Sez on the label it's Terra Cotta.
New Grower 2: Oh yeah great, I got summa those too. So far nothing comin' out.

 

[SmokingWings]

Based on a true story I came across on another growing message board years ago.

New Grower 3: I buy on of the Super Duper Skun seeds for $20 only read guy on youtube say to put on a warm shelf in dark area.
New Grower 4: What light type you goin to use?
New Grower 3: youtube guy say leave it there until it sprout then put it in tent. It came out of dirt 3 day ago but has not sprout yet.

Two Weeks Later....
New Grower 4: So you goniing to get LED lights?
New Grower 3: youtube guy say to wait till it sprout. It come out of dirt 2 weeks ago think it dead now cause it turned whte and fell over.
New Grower 4: What kind a lights you going to get?
New Grower 3: Saw aonther guy on youtube say he like special seed. I am Going to buy some Double Super Duper sKunk seeds for $40 each.

 

[Emeraldo]

no more New Grower jokes? now that's funny!

 

[ReservoirDog]

Can't afford a tent ?

3/4" x 4' x 8' foil backed foam insulation board is $17 here.

$20 for a 2' x 2' enclosure !

$40 for a 4' x 4' enclosure !

Hang the light from your ceiling, floor is a $6 emergency blanket...

I went a little crazy and made curved panels out of 1/2" plywood and 1/8" hollow core plastic.

Every time I wanted bigger I just made more flat panels

Cheers

El Bookmarko!

 

[GreenFingaz]

Can't afford a tent ?

3/4" x 4' x 8' foil backed foam insulation board is $17 here.

$20 for a 2' x 2' enclosure !

$40 for a 4' x 4' enclosure !

Hang the light from your ceiling, floor is a $6 emergency blanket...

I went a little crazy and made curved panels out of 1/2" plywood and 1/8" hollow core plastic.

Every time I wanted bigger I just made more flat panels

Cheers

That's an awesome space

 

[Peat Phreak]

Nothing will make me switch from using peat, perlite and powdered nutes. Water less often than coco. More reliable and easier to control than soil. I've seen a lot of evidence of beginners having a bad time with FFOF or other soils.

OP mentioned Promix HP. It works fine right out of the bag. Sunshine #4 is even cheaper. It comes in the same size as Promix, but the peat is a hard compressed cube that contains double or triple the peat. A $50 cube lasts more than a year with two tents running all year. SS#4 often contains fungus gnats and a lot of them. So I nuke it before planting. Promix is supposedly not buggy.

They even named some weed after it

sunshine #4 | Marijuana Strain Reviews

Sunshine #4 is a rare evenly balanced hybrid (50% indica/50% sativa) strain created through a cross of the delicious Chemdawg #4 X Sunshine Daydream strains. This bud won the gold medal for Best Hybrid at the 2015 High Times' Medical Cup in Michigan, and for good reason. With an THC level of 26...

www.allbud.com

 

[GreenFingaz]

Interesting topic. I like the points of discussion that are coming up, including the hydro related stuff, even though I think that soil would be a better choice.

And that enclosure you built as shown in msg #21 is great.


Most likely this is what causes the problems for newer growers. They do not want to do the research so that they can understand what any one amendment does, let alone what all of the ones in any fertilizer blend or mix will do.

They will have more problems because they want to add all of the nutrients at once to whatever pot they are using and have it work out without waiting to see what each will do.

They are more concerned about the end result and do not understand that those great looking plants and harvests involve knowing how to get there. Some of them do not know how to do the research and some do not want to know. It is as if they believe that because they dropped money on seeds, more money on soil or hydro supplies and some more on lights then all they need to do is put it all together and turn the switch to on, just like when they plugged the wires into the TV.

Knowledge is power

 

[Chuckeye]

Nothing will make me switch from using peat, perlite and powdered nutes. Water less often than coco. More reliable and easier to control than soil. I've seen a lot of evidence of beginners having a bad time with FFOF or other soils.

OP mentioned Promix HP. It works fine right out of the bag. Sunshine #4 is even cheaper. It comes in the same size as Promix, but the peat is a hard compressed cube that contains double or triple the peat. A $50 cube lasts more than a year with two tents running all year. SS#4 often contains fungus gnats and a lot of them. So I nuke it before planting. Promix is supposedly not buggy.

Both are the same price here

$37/bale

Cheers

 

[Emeraldo]

Nothing will make me switch from using peat, perlite and powdered nutes. Water less often than coco. More reliable and easier to control than soil. I've seen a lot of evidence of beginners having a bad time with FFOF or other soils.

OP mentioned Promix HP. It works fine right out of the bag. Sunshine #4 is even cheaper. It comes in the same size as Promix, but the peat is a hard compressed cube that contains double or triple the peat. A $50 cube lasts more than a year with two tents running all year. SS#4 often contains fungus gnats and a lot of them. So I nuke it before planting. Promix is supposedly not buggy.

They even named some weed after it

sunshine #4 | Marijuana Strain Reviews

Sunshine #4 is a rare evenly balanced hybrid (50% indica/50% sativa) strain created through a cross of the delicious Chemdawg #4 X Sunshine Daydream strains. This bud won the gold medal for Best Hybrid at the 2015 High Times' Medical Cup in Michigan, and for good reason. With an THC level of 26...

www.allbud.com

Hi @Peat Phreak sounds like you might be trying to sell something. Which is fine, but did you know that peat is a limited natural resource? Maybe the prospect of running out of available peat is one possible thing that might force you to switch or moderate your use? I confess, in my own soil mix I use about 20% white sphagnum. It is a truly wonderful soil ingredient in terms of water retention, pH level, etc.

Our hypothetical New Grower probably is concerned about sustainability and will want to find ways to limit peat use or at least to use it more sustainably than many did in the past. I recommend using wood fiber + composted bark, which has a pH of 5.8, mixing in some peat (which has a pH of 4.5 which is way too low) and other ingredients as medium. Instead of using mostly peat and then having to raise the pH to the right level, use less peat to achieve a balanced pH. Just my $0.02.

Enjoy your grow

Emeraldo

 

[Sativa1970]

I've seen a lot of evidence of beginners having a bad time with FFOF or other soils.

Beginning growers can have problems with everything. Kind of the point in this thread and the biggest section of this forum. I do see a lot of new growers blaming the soil when it is watering, lighting, temperature, or some additive causing the problem. If a little Nitrogen is good, I'll pour in the whole bottle and name it Seymour! Assuming they started with an appropriate soil not strait manure or miracle grow it is one less thing for them to screw with.

Anyone who has been around horticulture for any length of time has used peat. I still have a 25square foot compressed bag in the garage brought home from the greenhouse. Nobody uses it much any more. That alone should make you wonder why. Emeraldo pretty much summed it up.

So good at growing, they named a whole type after my user name. lol

 

[CelestialNurseries]

Beginning growers can have problems with everything. Kind of the point in this thread and the biggest section of this forum. I do see a lot of new growers blaming the soil when it is watering, lighting, temperature, or some additive causing the problem. If a little Nitrogen is good, I'll pour in the whole bottle and name it Seymour! Assuming they started with an appropriate soil not strait manure or miracle grow it is one less thing for them to screw with.

Anyone who has been around horticulture for any length of time has used peat. I still have a 25square foot compressed bag in the garage brought home from the greenhouse. Nobody uses it much any more. That alone should make you wonder why. Emeraldo pretty much summed it up.

So good at growing, they named a whole type after my user name. lol

If you can think of anything that's comparable in price to peat for making clone rooting cubes let me know.

 

[SmokingWings]

If you can think of anything that's comparable in price to peat for making clone rooting cubes let me know.

Some of those rooting cubes, especially the ones that feel like a sponge, are made from a shredded and compressed bark from some kind of tree.

 

[Peat Phreak]

"Nobody uses peat"

Not true. 27% of commercial weed growers use peat. 39% use coco.

Cannabis Media and Nutrient Use

"Peat is not sustainable"

Exaggerated claim. It's regulated and they only utilize 0.02% of Canada's peat for agriculture. There are thousands of years of supply just in Canada. It's sustainable enough for me.

The Truth About Peat — Is It Sustainable? • Good Dirt

"You must be a shill for big peat"

Nope. I actually don't care what people use. Just sharing what works best for me.

 

[Sativa1970]

The big advantage to peat is the price. That is why it is so so popular in commercial use. Profit margins are made one penny at a time. PH, water retention, and so forth are easily remedied. When the "Karen" walks in spouting bought how peat is killing the polar bears, GMOs are making her kids dumber, and lecturing you on "all natural" fertilizers, it looses it's appeal. Customers are worth more than the savings and ignorant customers generally spend more. That is how I ended up with a free truck load of compressed peat bags.

Grew in DTW peat for years before switching to DWC. It worked great but it did add a bit of PH and watering challenge over coco. For a new grower, spend the small extra $ to simplify and increase the odds of success.PH and water are the two things that trip up new growers the most.