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- #21
equates to 1 time per week of nutes, full strenght for the last 2 weeks so please explain if that's wrong
Soil too hot?
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Emilya Green
Well-Known Member
you are watering to runoff every other day?
Emilya Green
Well-Known Member
im sorry if I am being pedantic here, but trying to understand the problem. Are you using the feeding chart?
Emilya Green
Well-Known Member
Let me give you some background on why we f/w/f/w in soil, rather than just telling you that it is the way to do it.
Soil has a very special property... it will capture half of what you pour into it as feed for the next time. Soil has what is called a cation exchange capability, and it is purposely built into soil.
So most soil dosages of nutes are almost twice what would be given in a similar hydro situation where the nutes are constantly in contact with the roots through the water. Half of what you give gets stored away in the soil, and half goes into the plants.
Then, if you come back the next time they need water and give properly pH adjusted water, it releases the stored nutes from the soil and makes them available to the plants. This not only makes your nutes super efficient but it also helps keep the soil clean. The plants see a more or less constant feed of nutrients with this system.
In a f/w/w system, the first pass is the normal strong dose, the water on the next pass does as I have described above, and the third pass with just water provides nothing for the plant. We are coasting at this point. We are starving.
I believe that this is the primary cause of your MINOR deficiencies.
Soil has a very special property... it will capture half of what you pour into it as feed for the next time. Soil has what is called a cation exchange capability, and it is purposely built into soil.
So most soil dosages of nutes are almost twice what would be given in a similar hydro situation where the nutes are constantly in contact with the roots through the water. Half of what you give gets stored away in the soil, and half goes into the plants.
Then, if you come back the next time they need water and give properly pH adjusted water, it releases the stored nutes from the soil and makes them available to the plants. This not only makes your nutes super efficient but it also helps keep the soil clean. The plants see a more or less constant feed of nutrients with this system.
In a f/w/w system, the first pass is the normal strong dose, the water on the next pass does as I have described above, and the third pass with just water provides nothing for the plant. We are coasting at this point. We are starving.
I believe that this is the primary cause of your MINOR deficiencies.
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- #25
yes I am using the feed strengths recommended by FF. I changed it to full after you made the recommendation ~ 2 weeks ago. I'll modify it to every other water/feeding. I'll post a pic tomorrow under normal lights, the ts2000 seems to make them look a lighter shade. thanks again
Emilya Green
Well-Known Member
All that sounds good but you still haven't answered two important questions, and I only ask because many have been confused by this... Are you following the recommendation on the side of the bottle or the downloadable feeding chart? And, are you using the full trio?
Very good points and the points that many new growers seem to be confused by.
The chart found on-line or the paper copy is for the growers who have all 3 of the trio. When mixed as shown the end result is the balanced fertilizer that Fox Farm developed and the one that will give the best results if used as directed.
The dose that is found on the bottle itself is different than the printed chart. That weekly dose is higher than the chart meant for when all three are available. It is what is to be used when the grower had only the one bottle or only 2 of the 3 bottles. It is a bit higher to make up for what will not be available for the fertilizing sessions because of the missing bottle.
Over the years some outdoor growers were buying only one or two of the trio and then using what was listed on the bottle and getting good results. People started thinking that the bottle dose was only for outside growing and the paper printed or on-line dose was only for indoor growing.
Find the current charts for the Fox Farm line of fertilizers at their on-line site. We should keep reminding ourselves that the growers have to double check that they are looking at the the chart for the style and growing medium that they are using. Use the soil chart if actually growing in natural & mineral soil. If growing in a soil-less medium like coco-coir, peat moss or a water system then use the hydroponic. If in doubt contact Fox Farm.
Then there are the other schedules such as the Cultivation Nation and the Happy Frog. Those schedules will have different products along with some of the classic soil and hydro products.
Growers should not be afraid to call Fox Farm if they want in-depth answers to what to use or why. Do not worry that what is in their current grow will offend or confuse Fox Farm. The times I have called have always been easy going with discussions as detailed as wanted.
I had called them last year just to get their answer as to why the printed dose was different than the one of the bottle and the answer was as mentioned above.
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- #28
yes ! I thought I was clear on that. I'll post a pic taken under normal lighting in a little while
Yes, you did say that you were using the amounts recommended by Fox Farms. But, I am sure that Emilya was asking whether the dose was the one on the bottle or the one in the chart. They are not the same. They are different doses as I mentioned in the msg just above yours.
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- #30
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- #31
Appears to be their latest published schedule. They added the Cultivation Nation Cal-Mag to the schedule. I am going to have to call them up and ask them to send me a new paper copy.this the schedule I'm following.....
You might be sitting right on the edge of a near perfect feeding with a bit of tip burn which is not necessarily a bad thing. The plants look healthy and a nice dark green. Some growers feel that the dark green from extra nitrogen is bad but the plant will figure out how to use it when flowering starts.
That is the way I remember it but their latest schedule published on-line says "Feed Up To Twice A Week". It has been that way for a couple of years since it also is in my published paper schedule they mailed me in early 2021.
I'm interpreting that as one feeding using the dose on the chart at least once a week and a second time several days later is optional.
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- #33
They have changed it a few times in the last 2 years. People keep telling me the super dark green means too much N so I keep a close watch on their feeding chart
This is my first grow with a photoperiod strain so don't know is this is expected. Sorry for the questions but I feel like I'm getting conflicting recommendations at times, just trying to sort them out. I know there is a lot of knowledge on this site and just trying to learn.
Wastei
Well-Known Member
Typically "Cal-Mag" 4-0-0 formula has chelated iron in it. It aids in chlorophyll production and the added Ca will decrease available iron in the medium, that's why most branded "Cal-Mag" products add it to their formula.
4-0-0 cal mag is pretty rich in n. there are 1-0-0 and 2-0-0 formulations easily available if you are worried about n. you don't necessarily have to use the fox farm brand.
if you use an alternate just sub it into the feed schedule in the same amounts. if you are on tap water you can cut it back from the suggested amounts on the schedule.
if you use an alternate just sub it into the feed schedule in the same amounts. if you are on tap water you can cut it back from the suggested amounts on the schedule.
Too much nitrogen often will cause a dark green color to leaves on most if not all plants and not just Cannabis. Nitrogen is necessary for the life of the plant where it is part of the chlorophyll, is used to build proteins, helps the plant grow stems and leaves, and helps with the health of the root system and the absorbing of water and nutrients.People keep telling me the super dark green means too much N so I keep a close watch on their feeding chart
Dark green leaves does not necessarily mean that a Cannabis plant is receiving too much Nitrogen. Some plants seem to naturally produce dark leaves even when they are getting the same Nitrogen source and amounts as the others.
During flowering excess nitrogen can effect the plants switching over from the vegetative stage to the production of flowers. Often, the plant produces fewer and/or smaller flowers. The way I see it the natural reaction by early growers years ago was to follow the recommendation of fruit, vegetable and flowering plant growers to reduce the available Nitrogen when flowering was starting. What I feel happened was many newer growers started to drop the Nitrogen levels even more.
Several years ago I noticed that there was an increase in growers asking what was going wrong with their flowering plants. What was common was that the problems started 2 and sometimes 3 weeks after flowering started and was continuing to get worse. The signs were yellowing lower leaves often followed by the leaves higher up in the canopy showing a slightly different pattern of yellowing. Soon the leaves were falling off while the yellow continued to spread.
And when asked many of these growers would mention that they had cut the amounts of fertilizer they were using when flowering started, often by half, so not only were they reducing the availability of Nitrogen but also Potassium.
We, as home growers whether one plant or two or 15, have gotten very good at producing large healthy vegetating stage plants in 3, 5, or 7 gallon containers. The last thing these plants need during flowering is a drop in the fertilizer levels or how often it is applied.
My thoughts are to continue the fertilizing levels as listed by the company and sometimes to even supplement with mild doses of Nitrogen as a way to reduce the loss of the fan leaves that are producing most of the needed photosynthesis process.
Emilya Green
Well-Known Member
By the time we are in our final containers, the watering cycle is usually 2-3 days. If we are feeding every other time, we feed once a week if our cycle time is 3 days, with an extra day floating. If we water every two days feeding every other time, we feed twice in a week. Each is acceptable and each allows the soil to do its thing without starving the plant for a period of time with an extra water only cycle. Presumably we all buy fertilizer to grow big plants, not just to keep them alive. Garden like a boss. Fertilize every other time and use the soil the way it was designed to get the maximum load of nutrients up into the plant.
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- #38
I do really appreciate the help from everyone, I'm 70 and have been growing a large veggie garden all my life and know each plant is different. I have only been growing medical cannabis for onl;y 2 years. It's been a challenge compared to my garden. We're used to starting plants inside but to grow a plant in your basement from start to end isn't easy even with veggies. Everyone also has a slightly different opinion on best practices as well. I have a chemistry (although out dated) and IT background and I am a bit anal on my approach to things so sorry if I annoyed anyone with dumb questions. Thanks again and I'll keep you posted.
relax. the plant does most of the work. you'll do it just fine. it takes a couple three grows to get a rhythm and have things sussed out.
there are many approaches to growing. after a bit you'll figure your own style and tweak it to suit your personal conditions. finding what works best for you is a process. the basics remain the same, but you'll develop your own thing and it'll work great with time.
cbdhemp808
Well-Known Member
Sorry, I didn't read the entire thread; however, I agree with @Emilya... if you're growing in Ocean Forest, using FF liquid nutes, then follow the directions to the T. I don't know off hand when they tell you to start using the liquid nutes... I know you can go a while (1 month?) without feeding them. Then follow their liquid fert chart.
Your plants look amazing... good luck with the grow!
Your plants look amazing... good luck with the grow!