S1 stability

[Braddah Waiheesohai]

Long story short, each S1 reduces genetic variation by about 25%.

Cannabis has a tendency to herm, as long as you choose good parents/starting plants you should be safe.

Many of the dankest strains will throw nanners, lots of times those nanners won't produce viable pollen, so they don't represent a huge risk. In any case, they say "sometimes the only way out is through", meaning test and grow out your s1's and don't be afraid to kill offspring with undesirable traits (like herming) while searching for your s1 to s2.

The sad reality of the current seed market is that it takes close to a year to make a good batch of seeds, more with thorough testing, and the name of the month, Instagram, what else can we cross with cookies, give me new now mentality of most cannabis buyers means that to make money as a breeder, there simply isn't time to really work lines before release, so much of what's released is untested f1 crosses with whatever the flavours of the month are.

These will have a wide expression of "phenotypes", and while probably high in thc, won't give us anything really new or exciting.

The exciting strains of old came from crossing very different strains together, Mexican x Columbian x Thai x Afghani, etc. These crosses will give you lots of crap, a few mids, and most importantly some absolute fire! So rather than crossing everything to cookies, try crossing dissimilar things together is you have the desire/time to search for something amazing.

 

[cbdhemp808]

I grow feminized seed, and produce clones. One of these days I'm going to get into breeding, and use gibberellic acid or colloidal silver to cause a female to produce male flowers, collect the pollen, and then pollinate a different strain to produce a cross. Then I'll plant some of the seeds and grow out some phenos. Then I'll clone the interesting ones.

I agree with Braddah... cross some very different plants to produce something actually new. There's some interesting possibilities with CBD strains, CBG strains, and various other cannabis strains that aren't part of the typical world of THC strains. Phenotypic differences are cool as well, because you might find a particularly interesting pheno of a strain, and then use that in breeding.

I will actually be forced into breeding very soon, because a friend gave me some very unique regular autoflower seeds of a plant that took him 7 years to develop in Cali. Code name Kingston. I'll grow out the seed, collect pollen from a male, fertilize a female, and let the females produce flowers. I'll then get the flowers tested for cannabinoids... for the first time ever. This plant is/was renowned as an excellent medical plant. If the test results are impressive, I'll consider crossing it with something.

 

[CelestialNurseries]

. One of these days I'm going to get into breeding, and use gibberellic acid or colloidal silver to cause a female to produce male flowers, collect the pollen, and then pollinate a different strain to produce a cross. Then I'll plant some of the seeds and grow out some phenos. Then I'll clone the interesting ones.

I'm not sure if anyone reverses a female to make F1's...usually it's only done to self.

 

[cbdhemp808]

I'm not sure if anyone reverses a female to make F1's...usually it's only done to self.

Have you heard of any reason why it wouldn't work? Pollen is pollen.

 

[Melville Hobbes]

I'm not sure if anyone reverses a female to make F1's...usually it's only done to self.

Plenty of people do that.
@StoneOtter and @Stunger both have fairly recently.

 

[Stunger]

Plenty of people do that.
@StoneOtter and @Stunger both have fairly recently.

But mine was unsuccessfully unfortunately.

 

[Melville Hobbes]

But mine was unsuccessfully unfortunately.

For a minute there I thought I had misremembered as I couldn't remember the result.
Sorry to hear it didn't work.

 

[CelestialNurseries]

Have you heard of any reason why it wouldn't work? Pollen is pollen.

There is male pollen and female pollen...This is how FEM seeds work...

 

[CelestialNurseries]

But mine was unsuccessfully unfortunately.

Why did you do it?

 

[Stunger]

Why did you do it?

I was hoping to selectively reverse a female to make some female pollen for seeds.

 

[CelestialNurseries]

I was hoping to selectively reverse a female to make some female pollen for seeds.

Did you try to use the fem pollen on it self, only another strain or was there no pollen at all?

 

[Stunger]

Did you try to use the fem pollen on it self, only another strain or was there no pollen at all?

I was unable to stimulate any male pollen production at all, in spite of spraying CS 3 - 4 times a day. I was using CS at about 24ppm which I'd seen some folk using successfully, but most it seemed were being successful using 50-60ppm.

 

[CelestialNurseries]

I was unable to stimulate any male pollen production at all, in spite of spraying CS 3 - 4 times a day. I was using CS at about 24ppm which I'd seen some folk using successfully, but most it seemed were being successful using 50-60ppm.

Thank you for letting me bug you with all these questions.

 

[Mudballs]

Have you heard of any reason why it wouldn't work? Pollen is pollen.

cuz they wouldn't be f1's, i know it seems like "first cross" and sounds like they would be f1's, but they aren't. there's Law of Segregation and offspring ratio/allele combinations that determines what you would call them. i don't want to spook you and i'm excited to see a new player in the pollen chucking arena, but you should familiarize yourself with "filial generations" and some breeding terms....long journey and i'm not even up to par on it all, so we help each other along the way.

 

[StoneOtter]

Plenty of people do that.
@StoneOtter and @Stunger both have fairly recently.

Thanks Mel but my seeds were made conventionally with pollen from a male. I have been learning and trying to change them. No success yet.

 

[cbdhemp808]

There is male pollen and female pollen...This is how FEM seeds work...

Are you talking about seed, not pollen? Do you mean regular seed vs. feminized seed?

If you are saying a female flower can produce pollen, that's not true. Only a male flower can produce pollen.

If you reverse a female, she will produce male flowers (kind of like a hermie).

If you are saying these male flowers produces "female" pollen, that's also not true. Unless by that you mean, when this pollen fertilizes a female flower, it will produce only female seeds – I could understand that. Is that true?

 

[CelestialNurseries]

If you are saying these male flowers produces "female" pollen, that's also not true. Unless by that you mean, when this pollen fertilizes a female flower, it will produce only female seeds – I could understand that. Is that true?

Well lets think about this...Why would male pollen from a male sex organ on a female flower produce fem seeds but male pollen from a male plant will produce 50% male and 50% female seeds?

 

[Melville Hobbes]

Well lets think about this...Why would male pollen from a male sex organ on a female flower produce fem seeds but male pollen from a male plant will produce 50% male and 50% female seeds?

The pollen is exactly the same, whether it comes from a male flower on a female plant or from a male flower on a male plant.
It's the genetic material inside the pollen that matters. Since a female plant only has female genetic material to put in there, every plant grown from that pollen will be female.
It's like sperm. A man's sperm will contain either a X or a Y chromosome. That determines the sex of the baby. Pollen from a male plant will be like that.
Pollen from a reversed female will only carry the X chromosome.
Otherwise it's identical.

 

[CelestialNurseries]

The pollen is exactly the same, whether it comes from a male flower on a female plant or from a male flower on a male plant.
It's the genetic material inside the pollen that matters. Since a female plant only has female genetic material to put in there, every plant grown from that pollen will be female.
It's like sperm. A man's sperm will contain either a X or a Y chromosome. That determines the sex of the baby. Pollen from a male plant will be like that.
Pollen from a reversed female will only carry the X chromosome.
Otherwise it's identical.

Thanks Mel