Original source seeds from the 70's: Yes I have some

Well, thanks. At least some people are out there that have a clue.

What forums do you suggest? I only came back here to finish my catalog, and as expected, to get negative replies from people that do not understand that you can actually freeze Cannabis seeds long term and they actually do remain viable.


elchischas said:
Good day everyone
First at all let me show all my respect to you Big sur, this thread is one of the most interesting things amoung all the forums, your preservacionist work is awesome, sadly you post all this valuable info into the wrong place, I new here but this is the only thread enought good to stay every single word that you wrote is good info to me. I'm a landrace lover and heirloom as well, for many years I was part of a old forum called "Vibes Collective" that place was about to share and preserve old pure landraces cannabis around the world, the colombian gold 1972, original pure lansbread jamaican 1960, panama red 1974, mauritius, thais, angola red, pure swazi, pakistan chitral kush and many many others pure landraces that you can see on the forums and actually all the people can buy is from there, and always the main idea was not lost that awesome pure cannabis lines...
There's still many folks from the VC that still grow and reproduce many pure landraces so by my self I'm gonna work next year with some of it
As I say this is not the right place to share this kind of info or anything about pure landraces
I would like to invite you to others forum where you'll meet a serious breeders and truly canna-entusiast ... I'll let you some pictures of some of my reproductions later by now keep sharing this awesome info with us
Best vibes.
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Hope you stick around Big Sur, the vast majority of people here are interested in what you do, and really enjoy reading your posts.

Please don't let one troll ruin your spirit, some people just won't embrace new ideas, or the fact that somebody else can make something work that they can't.

@elchischas This is a nice place to share landrace (and any) info, check out Conradino's Landrace 101;)


Happy growing :Namaste:
 
Yeah I feel the same way. Some great and very knowledgable people on this forum who care deeply about seeds like this. Seems to me like almost kind of a sacred trust, carrying those kinda genetics around, and I wish them well.
 
I actually learnt how to treat trolls the hard way... and it's fighting back hard. Glad to see you checked in again, man. I don't know why it happened here, but usually this forum is pretty laid back, and people really respect each other.
 
Hi friends...
I see that a few folks take this thread seriously :thumb:
Big Sur, the forums that I comment to you are private sites, you need a recommendation to enter.. let me work on that.
by know I let you all some pictures of my rep of the original panama 1974, this line was shared by a good friend of mine from CA
GreenGrocer, he's got the seeds from a friend of him who's found the seeds at his father stuff I think he was a sailor at that time
I reproduce 36 females and 17 males I found some phenos on it but all with almost the same structure and form, the buds was tinny and lemony hash smell ... enjoy!
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Pretty plant, looks a lot like Colombian sativas.
 
So, now Oregon has changed the grow tiers and come up with a micro grow Tier I license for "only" $1,000 a year. That would allow me to grow in a 2,500 sq ft unlighted greenhouse, which would fit nicely on my property. Say in a 30 x 80 Gothic style metal frame greenhouse with clear 6 mil non-condensation plastic. I figure a 3' x 3' space per plant (I do not want to grow monsters), which would be 266 plants total. With a 1/4 lb bud harvest per plant per year, that would be a total harvest of 67 pounds of bud per year. Factoring for a low rec wholesale price, as in Colorado the wholesale rec bud has crashed to $1,500 per pound, that would yield a net of $100,000 a year. 67 pounds is a lot of bud. The most that I have ever grown and trimmed was about 20 pounds, and that was a LOT of work. I suppose I could hire temp labor to trim and package buds once a year though. I have the right zoning, I have the land, I have water rights (actually an exemption which is equivalent to a water right in Oregon), I am in a county that allows for rec weed growing, and I have the capital to finance it. I wonder if there is a market for old world 70's landrace weed here in this state? Seems that all anyone wants is the latest high THC Bubble-Goo-Lisious Wonder Bomb Hyper Crazy Weed, and not the classics. I will have to check around. I have a good source for any of the best heirlooms and latest strains south of PDX. I have the 38 landrace and heirloom seed collection as well. Maybe a mix... to cover my ass. Then of course I could cross my strains, which is what I really want to do.

Initial cost would be high. Business license and LLC incorporation: several hundred. A grow license application and fees, $1,250 ($1,000 a year recurring cost). Permitted and county approved perimeter 10' cyclone fence with heavy covering, $4,500. Gabled 6 mil 30' x 80' greenhouse with fans and heater: $10,000. Two 12'x18'' secure accessory buildings for storage and drying, $4,000. A camera security and alarm system would be $1,000. Oregon approved scale, $250. Oregon approved Franwell Metric Cannabis Tracking System (CTS), $??? {Will find out}. RFID tags, $0.45 each, x 266, $120. 266 x 15 gallon plastic pots to grow the weed in, $2000. Dirt to fill them I can get for free. I already have a cloning accessory building with T8 lights, power and well on the property. Water and power would both be low impact. So I am probably looking at a $25 grand minimum investment...
 
Even if for some reason the first year "failed" and you only yield half as much as you estimated, it's still double your initial outlay. You'd expect the wholesale price of bud (say two years) may be even less than $1,500/lb by then.

If you're willing to invest the time then it would definitely be worth it. Today's generation love anything considered to be of the old school.
 
Yah, hard to tell what the market will do as weed become legal in more states. I read that the cartels in Northern Mexico are coming under price pressure with the legal weed in the 4 western states. Also The Colorado growers can grow far more weed now than the rec sales demand, hence the price drop. Its the same in Washington state now.

Rastas said:
Even if for some reason the first year "failed" and you only yield half as much as you estimated, it's still double your initial outlay. You'd expect the wholesale price of bud (say two years) may be even less than $1,500/lb by then.

If you're willing to invest the time then it would definitely be worth it. Today's generation love anything considered to be of the old school.
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I also looked at a 625 sq ft indoor Tier I micro grow. It would $10 grand to build a 24' x 40' permitted structure, and be able to control the grow much better in this crazy and wet climate. But the lights would cost a whopping $14 grand (400w switchable HID Sunlight Supply system, one per 3'x3' area, or one plant). I would also have to buy a separate electric service hookup and wire to the service bus, and pay for permits. It would also trigger an increase in property value higher recurring property taxes, and a WHOPPING $15 grand recurring cost per year electric bill!!! With 64 lamps, 400 watts each, 12/12 cycle for flowering with HPS, and 20/4 cycle for MH, @10 cents a KwHr, is an average of $240 a year per lamp, or $15,360 a year total. *cough*

You just cannot beat natural sunlight for quality and cost.
 
Yikes. That is a lot of money. It's like any new business I suppose. You'll have to invest, invest, invest and those costs will totally blow out of proportion, but if you stick to it and create even a local name for yourself, the rewards will be there. It's just a matter of whether you want to put the work in or not. It would be some time before you see a return.


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Obviously you've looked into the seed breeding business BigSur. Any thoughts on that? Seems like breeders do well for themselves- though of course it's a huge investment in time. Maybe best as a side project while you grow crops for income?
 
Spendy to start the small micro business, yes. If I get a grow license, I can sell seeds in state only, until the Fed/DEA lightens up on weed. No MJ weed, MJ seeds or MJ plants can legally cross state lines at this point. I guess that you can legally send 'hemp' seeds, but I have read that interstate shipping of hemp seeds is so heavily regulated that it is virtually impossible to move them across state lines. I could go the black market-European storage and distribution route or some other method to sell seeds internationally, but I could do that now so a grow license does not really help there.

I could also sell rooted clones, but there is not a lot of money in that. Legal clones go for $15 + the 17% tax for $17.55 each. So the wholesale price for clones is half that, or $7.50 each, and you have to have them inspected and get a sticker. So the margins there are small... really small. You can buy and sell them on Craigslist here for around $10 too. OMMP card holders can legally sell extra plants and clones to other OMMP card holders in Oregon. There is a brisk trade here, as WPPM holders come here to North Oregon to buy a lot of clones. They do not sell live clones in the retail shops up there in Washington state like they do here.
 
Leme see here... last one was the Big Sur Holy Weed I think. So now for some more NorCal local homegrown seeds in my collection. Call them heirloom I suppose. Early landraces planted, seeded and re-planted like the Big Sur Holy, or early crosses with African and other exotics. One thing about this era in NorCal was that 90% of the weed was sativa. Mexican sativa, Thai sativa, Colombian sativa, South Indian sativa... not much in the way of indica was ever common there. That was all turned into hash it seems, which we had a lot of as well (but no seeds in hashish!).

Hashish came in from Lebanon (blonde and red), Morocco (light brown or tan), Pakistan (dark green-brown), Afghanistan (dark chocolate brown) and Nepal (bright green Nepalese fingers and dark green temple balls). Then there was some green hashish from Mexico that was so-so, and Kona gold hash from the big Island of Hawaii that was insanely good. My favorite was the Lebanese.
 
My landrace/heirloom MJ seed catalog (cont.):

Seed pack #25
Primo A+++
Big Sur local weed
Fall, 1980
$35 for 1/4 oz.
Beautiful small green tops with red hairs, harvested early. Light sativa high. Likely second generation Mexican sativa. Almost sinsemillia, but about 20 seeds in the 1/4 oz.
 
My landrace/heirloom MJ seed catalog (cont.):

Seed pack #26
Primo A+
California heirloom
Sept. 1981
$120/oz.
This is an odd lot, and could be from Colombia. At least that is what I thought and wrote down at the time. This had red-gold leaf color and red-brown flowers. Somewhat seedy for the price (30 seeds in an ounce), which was going way up by then. Has really large seeds for a sativa. I am thinking now that these may have been an early California grown Colombian cross, like Haze from the Santa Cruz area. If it is early Haze, I bet there are a lot of people out there that want this strain. The Haze Bros. had a series of early crosses with 3 different Colombians, then they later crossed in South Indian, Thai and other strains. I know I smoked some Purple Haze that was going around Gilroy at that time. Not the famous acid, or the later strain made from Haze that is called Purple Haze. The Haze Bros. grew what was called Purple Haze (and later just called Haze) in their greenhouses in Corrolitos, just west over Hecker Pass from Gilroy.
 
My landrace/heirloom MJ seed catalog (cont.):

Seed pack #27
Primo A+++ 5*
Monterey local weed
October, 1979
$30 for 1/4 oz.
Beautiful light green tops grown in the Aguajito Road area. Excellent high. Almost sinsemillia, about 10 seeds per 1/4 oz. (likely self-crossed). Also has big seeds, likely a local cross of imported strains.
 
My landrace/heirloom MJ seed catalog (cont.):

Seed pack #28
Primo A+
Carmel Valley local weed
Late summer, 1980
$145 per oz.
Lovely green tops with red hairs, local grown from Mexican sativa seeds (that I supplied to this grower). Great high. True sinsemillia, only 5 seeds in one ounce. I am not sure what seeds I gave him for this grow, but he produced a stellar crop from them. I got one oz for supplying the seeds, and price is what he sold the rest for.
 
My landrace/heirloom MJ seed catalog (cont.):

Seed pack #29
Primo A+
Carmel Valley local weed
January, 1979
$60 per oz.
Green tops with red hairs, local grown from Mexican sativa seeds (that I also supplied to this same grower). Good high. True sinsemillia, only 10 seeds in one ounce. I got one oz for supplying the seeds, and I bought most of the rest of what he grew. I turned Neil Young's band, Crazy Horse onto this weed one night at The Old Sash Mill in Santa Cruz where they used to play a lot with Neil Young. They got so stoned they could barely play any more. The whole bar followed my brother and I outside to smoke some of this stuff, and it was stellar compared to what was available there at that time.
 
BigSur said:
You just cannot beat natural sunlight for quality and cost.
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I cannot agree with this statement enough, we use to start plants indoors in Florida then move them outside just for this reason. I miss the old Colombian Gold, as well as others from that era and would love to have some to grow and further preserve the originals. Personally I am not so sure the "super strains" are any better than the old ones, perhaps the high was much more pure than today's hybrids. I wish you great success and hope your genetics will make their way into the public, so that one day we can grow some out ourselves.
 
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