I was just thinking about you almost losing a friend and thought about you using a CO2-Smoke detector outside your room for safety. CL
Nick Hardy's Big Grow 2023 Gorilla Glue Skunk 11 OG Kush Coco Peat Co2 Mars Hydro
- Thread starter NickHardy
- Start date
Very interesting grow @NickHardy. I have CO2 in my future. I didnāt realize you use it in veg, I always thought it was for flower. But your growth rate speaks for itself, thatās insanity. I can completely understand the āthey look a little tiredā comment as that rate of growth, one would think, would necessitate occasional breaks or maybe a certain number of hours per day or whatever.
So I know you can blast them with ppfd using CO2. What ppfd level are they at in veg? I would normally veg growing in coco at somewhere between 600-900, and go up to around 1300 in flower if they can take it. I assume you can go significantly higher with your setup, yes?
Itās a great setup. Very impressive. Love your love affair with electricity. Iām pulling up a chair.
Plus: this maniac has 19 plants at once!!
(I very much respect that work load)
So I know you can blast them with ppfd using CO2. What ppfd level are they at in veg? I would normally veg growing in coco at somewhere between 600-900, and go up to around 1300 in flower if they can take it. I assume you can go significantly higher with your setup, yes?
Itās a great setup. Very impressive. Love your love affair with electricity. Iām pulling up a chair.
Plus: this maniac has 19 plants at once!!
(I very much respect that work load)- Thread starter
- #23
Haha - thank you, thereās some 420 Royalty tagging a long. Humbled. I was amazed and so happy with my first harvest, better than any first time grower deserved and I put that down to thing I learnt from more experienced minds than me, great lights and Co2. But, theyāre taking a break from it today. I canāt control the temperature very well in the tent. So with the extractor off even with Co2 its just too damn hot. 35cās. Fan on all day, temps down let them recover. And buy a freestanding AC maybe. Going to a big box hardware store in a moment.Gotta love a new journal that starts with a harvest! Not to mention the new electrical and a grow room with 10' high ceilings.
I'm in!
@CaptainLucky Iām promised that store should have the co2 detectors back in stock this week. I have just smoke detectors (and fire extinguishers) @Bill284 fire safety should be required reading. When that guy nearly died between us bar managers we probably had 30 tanks of Co2 for beer and post mix across 8 venues. No one even told us it was dangerous
In all likelihood it would never get high enough in a grow tent to be harmful but āabundance of caution before an abundance of growthā (just made that up but its true)@Jon yeah mental but my wife is fully involved Iām not running solo. Sheās the green fingered one. Without Co2 Iām ok with 1000 veg 1800 flower. With got as high as 2800 in flower. Didn't use in veg. EC which like real sciency types like Iāve seen 3 optimal with Co2 a couple of places. Tapers down to 3.5. I had 4 for a few days. No harm done but will be targeting 3-3.2. Right now they are 1.9 which is spot on for this stage with my nutes. So maybe should have had a little higher yesterday. But yeah give them a break, let them solidify their gains from yesterday. But when they go in flower in a couple of weeks with whole room AC Iāll be blasting them all day long.
Blast away bro Iām in for the rideHaha - thank you, thereās some 420 Royalty tagging a long. Humbled. I was amazed and so happy with my first harvest, better than any first time grower deserved and I put that down to thing I learnt from more experienced minds than me, great lights and Co2. But, theyāre taking a break from it today. I canāt control the temperature very well in the tent. So with the extractor off even with Co2 its just too damn hot. 35cās. Fan on all day, temps down let them recover. And buy a freestanding AC maybe. Going to a big box hardware store in a moment.
@CaptainLucky Iām promised that store should have the co2 detectors back in stock this week. I have just smoke detectors (and fire extinguishers) @Bill284 fire safety should be required reading. When that guy nearly died between us bar managers we probably had 30 tanks of Co2 for beer and post mix across 8 venues. No one even told us it was dangerous
@Jon yeah mental but my wife is fully involved Iām not running solo. Sheās the green fingered one. Without Co2 Iām ok with 1000 veg 1800 flower. With got as high as 2800 in flower. Didn't use in veg. EC which like real sciency types like Iāve seen 3 optimal with Co2 a couple of places. Tapers down to 3.5. I had 4 for a few days. No harm done but will be targeting 3-3.2. Right now they are 1.9 which is spot on for this stage with my nutes. So maybe should have had a little higher yesterday. But yeah give them a break, let them solidify their gains from yesterday. But when they go in flower in a couple of weeks with whole room AC Iāll be blasting them all day long.
. CL
Mars Hydro
420 Sponsor
Can't wait to see them become a jungle.Hi,
My second attempt at a journal. This is a total of 19 plants, 7 Gorilla Glue, 6 each of Skunk 11 and OG Kush. Iāll add in some details about them in another post. Thereās also a Dosidos Rocketas but think Iām going to outdoor SIP that separately
They were bought as clones not sure the seed lineage but I think from the blend the grower has probably Dutch Passion. They came in 1ā peat trays and repotted day I got them to clear plastic aerated cups with red solos outside.
3 days ago we up potted to about 1 gallon plastic pots with some volcanic rock/ coco peat/perlite/coco peat and perlite top. Not a day too soon as the root balls were packing out the cups.
Theyāre under two @Mars Hydro FCE 4800 lights in one of their 2.4x1.2x2m tents with a 6ā inline by them as well. Nets got added this morning because Co2. Since that picture theyāve added 2ā
I use an Inkbird controller here in the veg tent and upstairs in the flower room - where I think theyāll need moving to in two weeks.
These are the seedling and veg tents
I take electrics really seriously. This runs off the main MCB upstairs and runs 2 digital timers inside connected to 4 sockets. 32A total. I have some spare sockets not timed as well for fans etc. the drivers for the lights are all mounted outside the tents - its tropical here, hot and often humid. Humidity is fine with the Co2 in veg but my enemy in flower. I have a whole home type coming for the flower room but cover that later.
Inside the control box.
Using Dutch Pro Coco nutes and adding some Root Booster at the moment. Its the only stuff I found with 20L sized bottles here.
Just harvested my first crop. Pretty pleased but made some mistakes on the way. Never make the same ones twice is the plan.
When these three strains are into flower its Seriotica, Kali Mist and Strawberry AK from Serious Seeds - then the greenhouse build Hectic few months ahead!
Will add more a little later. Finish with some Bruce Banner harvest pics!
Thanks to @Bill284 @Weffalo @Azimuth @InTheShed @CaptainLucky and many others for the knowledge and laughs that got me my first two plants done!
- Thread starter
- #26
OK so Co2 - what I use now and stuff that didn't work over the last couple of months. (Just FYI I'm not sponsored by anyone - I just like any kit I say nice things about)
Co2 works best with high light, warmer conditions. You can increase your EC, PPM and decrease the distance the lights are from the canopy significantly. This results in the higher yields but you can't just thow it in without the other environmentals also being high.
First you need a source.
For a small grow or in veg you can buy those hanging bags, I actually used them in veg before but not sure of any impact. They don't fully activate for two weeks I read, so maybe you could use a couple in a 4x4 last two weeks of veg and then they'd be at their most active during the first few weeks of flower which is when they are most responsive to it. Hang them at canopy level.
Propane burners, maybe a tank. Pay for the propane to be burnt to harvest C02 essentially. Probably the most compolicated method but often what big commercial farmers of any crop will use. Creates heat, not good for me here, terrified of fire - maybe in a cooler climate in a dedicated building, like say @Bill284 the VivoHut would be ok.
C02 tanks - your local bar has these for beer and soda machines. But the stuff from steel shops is cheaper. Here I pay $15USD for a giant tank (a month) and $5 for a small lasts 10 days. The giant ones are too heavy to carry to the upstairs flower room so will be swapping for the small one when it runs out. It nets out cheaper than propane for me here too as well as involving an open flame.
Second you need a Regulator.
I have tried all three types. They all require electrics for the solenoid to control it.
The most common type is like this the tube flow:
This was badly made to start so added a load of silicone to try and seal it up. The real problem was frosting and the ball to measure flow freezing in place. We don't need to know our flow rate to be honest.
Second type - the bubbler.
This is used by acquarium types. The bubbles through the clear liquid show your flow rate. As I said we aren't really bothered by that. The problem was for me the water you are meant to fill it with would evaporate up into the pipe blocking it when it cooled. The level in the room would plummet until it cleared. So I swapped for mineral oil as some acquarium people recommended. Same problem but worse.
Goldilocks type
Two round dials one maybe shows flow rate but I don't care, no plastic tube or bubbler to mess with. I have two of these. Best ever setup.
Third you need a controller
I have two Inkbird ICC 500T's. They come as a set for around $150USD. There is a more expensive brand orange and grey I forget the name but doesn't have any additional functionality. Looks a bit easier to program is all.
There is the control unit to mount outside your room - if
there is a problem with too much C02 you want to know before you go in. There is a sensor of the light spectrum kind, its the best way to measure C02 - the stuff you buy "7 in 1 Air quality monitors are rubbish. This is proper standard for monitoring. There is a two plug controller.
This is my setup outside the flower room. (that Mars Hydro thermo is broken, they are kindly sending me a new one free even though I said I thought my builder dropped it!) So when the sensor reads 1300ppm I have it to switch off the gas. It will continue to climb when you first set it up to say 1800. This is becausee gas remains in the line and it takes a bit of time to release and the sensor to catch up. At this point you can have your extraction fan pop on as its plugged into socket two on that power board. You need to program this. Its a balance - waste that paid for C02 or freshen up? At night in flower I just have the fan come on - I think in veg its more important to freshen it.
So we have just setup and we set our max to 1300 but it runs to 1800. We set to come back on at say 1000 but it drops to 700 before climbing. How to fix that? All designs of reg have a little thumb screw to adjust the flow. Just spend an hour or so with that fine tuning it. Eventually you'll have say 1350 climbs down slowly to 950 before climbing to 1350. This means it is averaging 1200 say which is the perfect number for flower under great lights and warm and high EC. We don't need a flow meter - we just watch.
The downside to the Inkbird is it is a little bit of a pain to program. Think 1990's VHS recorder. But there is a great video from a Canadian grower on Youtube who did an awesome video (he uses the same bubbler type reg which didn't work for me) Here's the link:
Fourth you need to deliver it.
I just used 4mm Co2 pipe dropped next to the canopy level for two plants.worked better than any hacked together stuff I tried. Its heavier than air so canopy level it will sink down nicely. I saw a guy using the same but behind an occilating fan which I reckon I'm going to do. It seems very basic but reckon its totally fine for say up to 12x12' spaces.
Final thoughts
You've got to have warm conditions and loads of light to get the benefits. I am lucky to have both. Some nute brands give indications of adjustments to make if you are using. The scientist reckon an EC of 3.0 is optimal and PPM 2400 - that's what I aimed for in flower. It went higher at times but the plants came out great.
Anyone got any questions fire away - I will say now maybe the other reg types can work in different environments but one less bit to go wrong was what sold me - I do miss having a red light to show me when the solenoid is on - but the Inkbird tells me that anyway.
Hope it helps someone out there!
Nick
Co2 works best with high light, warmer conditions. You can increase your EC, PPM and decrease the distance the lights are from the canopy significantly. This results in the higher yields but you can't just thow it in without the other environmentals also being high.
First you need a source.
For a small grow or in veg you can buy those hanging bags, I actually used them in veg before but not sure of any impact. They don't fully activate for two weeks I read, so maybe you could use a couple in a 4x4 last two weeks of veg and then they'd be at their most active during the first few weeks of flower which is when they are most responsive to it. Hang them at canopy level.
Propane burners, maybe a tank. Pay for the propane to be burnt to harvest C02 essentially. Probably the most compolicated method but often what big commercial farmers of any crop will use. Creates heat, not good for me here, terrified of fire - maybe in a cooler climate in a dedicated building, like say @Bill284 the VivoHut would be ok.
C02 tanks - your local bar has these for beer and soda machines. But the stuff from steel shops is cheaper. Here I pay $15USD for a giant tank (a month) and $5 for a small lasts 10 days. The giant ones are too heavy to carry to the upstairs flower room so will be swapping for the small one when it runs out. It nets out cheaper than propane for me here too as well as involving an open flame.
Second you need a Regulator.
I have tried all three types. They all require electrics for the solenoid to control it.
The most common type is like this the tube flow:
This was badly made to start so added a load of silicone to try and seal it up. The real problem was frosting and the ball to measure flow freezing in place. We don't need to know our flow rate to be honest.
Second type - the bubbler.
This is used by acquarium types. The bubbles through the clear liquid show your flow rate. As I said we aren't really bothered by that. The problem was for me the water you are meant to fill it with would evaporate up into the pipe blocking it when it cooled. The level in the room would plummet until it cleared. So I swapped for mineral oil as some acquarium people recommended. Same problem but worse.
Goldilocks type
Two round dials one maybe shows flow rate but I don't care, no plastic tube or bubbler to mess with. I have two of these. Best ever setup.
Third you need a controller
I have two Inkbird ICC 500T's. They come as a set for around $150USD. There is a more expensive brand orange and grey I forget the name but doesn't have any additional functionality. Looks a bit easier to program is all.
There is the control unit to mount outside your room - if
there is a problem with too much C02 you want to know before you go in. There is a sensor of the light spectrum kind, its the best way to measure C02 - the stuff you buy "7 in 1 Air quality monitors are rubbish. This is proper standard for monitoring. There is a two plug controller.
This is my setup outside the flower room. (that Mars Hydro thermo is broken, they are kindly sending me a new one free even though I said I thought my builder dropped it!) So when the sensor reads 1300ppm I have it to switch off the gas. It will continue to climb when you first set it up to say 1800. This is becausee gas remains in the line and it takes a bit of time to release and the sensor to catch up. At this point you can have your extraction fan pop on as its plugged into socket two on that power board. You need to program this. Its a balance - waste that paid for C02 or freshen up? At night in flower I just have the fan come on - I think in veg its more important to freshen it.
So we have just setup and we set our max to 1300 but it runs to 1800. We set to come back on at say 1000 but it drops to 700 before climbing. How to fix that? All designs of reg have a little thumb screw to adjust the flow. Just spend an hour or so with that fine tuning it. Eventually you'll have say 1350 climbs down slowly to 950 before climbing to 1350. This means it is averaging 1200 say which is the perfect number for flower under great lights and warm and high EC. We don't need a flow meter - we just watch.
The downside to the Inkbird is it is a little bit of a pain to program. Think 1990's VHS recorder. But there is a great video from a Canadian grower on Youtube who did an awesome video (he uses the same bubbler type reg which didn't work for me) Here's the link:
Fourth you need to deliver it.
I just used 4mm Co2 pipe dropped next to the canopy level for two plants.worked better than any hacked together stuff I tried. Its heavier than air so canopy level it will sink down nicely. I saw a guy using the same but behind an occilating fan which I reckon I'm going to do. It seems very basic but reckon its totally fine for say up to 12x12' spaces.
Final thoughts
You've got to have warm conditions and loads of light to get the benefits. I am lucky to have both. Some nute brands give indications of adjustments to make if you are using. The scientist reckon an EC of 3.0 is optimal and PPM 2400 - that's what I aimed for in flower. It went higher at times but the plants came out great.
Anyone got any questions fire away - I will say now maybe the other reg types can work in different environments but one less bit to go wrong was what sold me - I do miss having a red light to show me when the solenoid is on - but the Inkbird tells me that anyway.
Hope it helps someone out there!
Nick
Good Morning.OK so Co2 - what I use now and stuff that didn't work over the last couple of months. (Just FYI I'm not sponsored by anyone - I just like any kit I say nice things about)
Co2 works best with high light, warmer conditions. You can increase your EC, PPM and decrease the distance the lights are from the canopy significantly. This results in the higher yields but you can't just thow it in without the other environmentals also being high.
First you need a source.
For a small grow or in veg you can buy those hanging bags, I actually used them in veg before but not sure of any impact. They don't fully activate for two weeks I read, so maybe you could use a couple in a 4x4 last two weeks of veg and then they'd be at their most active during the first few weeks of flower which is when they are most responsive to it. Hang them at canopy level.
Propane burners, maybe a tank. Pay for the propane to be burnt to harvest C02 essentially. Probably the most compolicated method but often what big commercial farmers of any crop will use. Creates heat, not good for me here, terrified of fire - maybe in a cooler climate in a dedicated building, like say @Bill284 the VivoHut would be ok.
C02 tanks - your local bar has these for beer and soda machines. But the stuff from steel shops is cheaper. Here I pay $15USD for a giant tank (a month) and $5 for a small lasts 10 days. The giant ones are too heavy to carry to the upstairs flower room so will be swapping for the small one when it runs out. It nets out cheaper than propane for me here too as well as involving an open flame.
Second you need a Regulator.
I have tried all three types. They all require electrics for the solenoid to control it.
The most common type is like this the tube flow:
This was badly made to start so added a load of silicone to try and seal it up. The real problem was frosting and the ball to measure flow freezing in place. We don't need to know our flow rate to be honest.
Second type - the bubbler.
This is used by acquarium types. The bubbles through the clear liquid show your flow rate. As I said we aren't really bothered by that. The problem was for me the water you are meant to fill it with would evaporate up into the pipe blocking it when it cooled. The level in the room would plummet until it cleared. So I swapped for mineral oil as some acquarium people recommended. Same problem but worse.
Goldilocks type
Two round dials one maybe shows flow rate but I don't care, no plastic tube or bubbler to mess with. I have two of these. Best ever setup.
Third you need a controller
I have two Inkbird ICC 500T's. They come as a set for around $150USD. There is a more expensive brand orange and grey I forget the name but doesn't have any additional functionality. Looks a bit easier to program is all.
There is the control unit to mount outside your room - if
there is a problem with too much C02 you want to know before you go in. There is a sensor of the light spectrum kind, its the best way to measure C02 - the stuff you buy "7 in 1 Air quality monitors are rubbish. This is proper standard for monitoring. There is a two plug controller.
This is my setup outside the flower room. (that Mars Hydro thermo is broken, they are kindly sending me a new one free even though I said I thought my builder dropped it!) So when the sensor reads 1300ppm I have it to switch off the gas. It will continue to climb when you first set it up to say 1800. This is becausee gas remains in the line and it takes a bit of time to release and the sensor to catch up. At this point you can have your extraction fan pop on as its plugged into socket two on that power board. You need to program this. Its a balance - waste that paid for C02 or freshen up? At night in flower I just have the fan come on - I think in veg its more important to freshen it.
So we have just setup and we set our max to 1300 but it runs to 1800. We set to come back on at say 1000 but it drops to 700 before climbing. How to fix that? All designs of reg have a little thumb screw to adjust the flow. Just spend an hour or so with that fine tuning it. Eventually you'll have say 1350 climbs down slowly to 950 before climbing to 1350. This means it is averaging 1200 say which is the perfect number for flower under great lights and warm and high EC. We don't need a flow meter - we just watch.
The downside to the Inkbird is it is a little bit of a pain to program. Think 1990's VHS recorder. But there is a great video from a Canadian grower on Youtube who did an awesome video (he uses the same bubbler type reg which didn't work for me) Here's the link:
Fourth you need to deliver it.
I just used 4mm Co2 pipe dropped next to the canopy level for two plants.worked better than any hacked together stuff I tried. Its heavier than air so canopy level it will sink down nicely. I saw a guy using the same but behind an occilating fan which I reckon I'm going to do. It seems very basic but reckon its totally fine for say up to 12x12' spaces.
Final thoughts
You've got to have warm conditions and loads of light to get the benefits. I am lucky to have both. Some nute brands give indications of adjustments to make if you are using. The scientist reckon an EC of 3.0 is optimal and PPM 2400 - that's what I aimed for in flower. It went higher at times but the plants came out great.
Anyone got any questions fire away - I will say now maybe the other reg types can work in different environments but one less bit to go wrong was what sold me - I do miss having a red light to show me when the solenoid is on - but the Inkbird tells me that anyway.
Hope it helps someone out there!
Nick
Thanks Nick.
Do you plan oh running it in the greenhouse?
My temps are pretty high it would help.
But it prevents me from ventilating it?
Catch 22.
#Vivosun #Love What You Grow
Bill284
- Thread starter
- #28
You have a little Howie controlled window into my mind?!Good Morning.
Thanks Nick.
Do you plan oh running it in the greenhouse?
My temps are pretty high it would help.
But it prevents me from ventilating it?
Catch 22.
#Vivosun #Love What You Grow
Bill284
Iāve been spending a lot of time thinking about it. Like more than is healthy!
In glass greenhouses its easy. Well understood. But plastic ones yeah for a reason within regions, often are more open less closed which defeats the object. My preferred thermal design needs a tweak to work with greenhouse grows. Think I maybe have a design but need some feedback and thatās def a whole different thread!
Today no food, no gas, gentle lights. Drilled holes in the side of the plastic pots - yellowing leaves on ones had it mostly fixed. Probably overwatering/lack of air. 3 droopy ones overwatering/lack of air. Improving but still a little worried. Generally plants a mid/deep green and not all curling for the sweet light but getting that way.
Nick Stress Level? (NST)
AM - 7/10
PM - 4/10
Weffalo
Plant of the Month: April 2023
Loads of good info there on c02 Nick, I watched a video that might be of interest to those using c02... it's Garden Talk which is a super interesting podcast and the guy being interviewed runs plenty of commercial grows as well as somewhat automated home setup. He uses c02 at home and talks about extraction and fan setups to achieve optimal c02 for the plants inside a tent.
Not sure any of it is cold hard facts more his individual experience but he does this professionally so would assume results speak for themselves. He doesn't use extraction fans or believe all too much in FRESH air circulation when using c02 at home... something to think about/consider
NST, hope it stays at lower levels bro
Not sure any of it is cold hard facts more his individual experience but he does this professionally so would assume results speak for themselves. He doesn't use extraction fans or believe all too much in FRESH air circulation when using c02 at home... something to think about/consider
NST, hope it stays at lower levels bro
- Thread starter
- #30
Hiya @Weffalo ! Not seen that video but exactly my dilemma the last day. In flower I had temps higher than perfect but plants were fine. In veg (no co2) they had ok temps circulated air. The tents in the veg tent went really high yesterday unlike flower no AC and of course idiot boy here has the fan off for 18 hours. Yellowing leaves on some, droopy on others. I think an aproach to Co2 during veg 18/6 lights 8am - 2am on might be like this:
7am - fan OFF. Co2 ON
This allows Co2 to build up before,
8AM Lights on
9AM Co2 off. Extractor low
12PM fan OFF Co2 ON
1PM etc, etc.
So just dose to say 1000 4 hours a day perhaps and benefit from better air circulation.
Why I lifted the lights, dialled them down, offed the Co2 and was super careful on water today.
Dunno, I forgot to tag one guy who always talks sense @StoneOtter - he might know?
Nick
7am - fan OFF. Co2 ON
This allows Co2 to build up before,
8AM Lights on
9AM Co2 off. Extractor low
12PM fan OFF Co2 ON
1PM etc, etc.
So just dose to say 1000 4 hours a day perhaps and benefit from better air circulation.
Why I lifted the lights, dialled them down, offed the Co2 and was super careful on water today.
Dunno, I forgot to tag one guy who always talks sense @StoneOtter - he might know?
Nick
Weffalo
Plant of the Month: April 2023
I think you defo need some AC units mate and the issue with needing to exhaust hot air won't even be there? I also find exhausting air to be fairly redundant when the air outside the tent is hot still, I run my exhaust on high purely for the smell/stealth aspect at the moment.
The reason that guy doesn't run extraction is because it's wasting c02 and as long as you have good air circulation via circulation fans he doesn't believe it's needed... maybe worth a watch or consideration. If you've got a central AC unit in your house I'd be adapting it so it can cool the room the tents are in or even better the tents themselves, would let you control environment way better. It's the next thing I desperately need before summer myself for *optimal* conditions.
The reason that guy doesn't run extraction is because it's wasting c02 and as long as you have good air circulation via circulation fans he doesn't believe it's needed... maybe worth a watch or consideration. If you've got a central AC unit in your house I'd be adapting it so it can cool the room the tents are in or even better the tents themselves, would let you control environment way better. It's the next thing I desperately need before summer myself for *optimal* conditions.
- Thread starter
- #32
Yeah I have a full room Split Ac in the flower room.
The veg spot is my carport. No AC. Not worth it to mess with that - when I was going to do the cold room style there it would have had dedicated AC. But - as I said, Iām here and its hot. Not sure mega growth in veg like I saw yesterday is desirable. So ramp it down in a place I have less control over temp.
And buy a $200 standalone AC just have a and have a rethink like I did this morning
Iām in deep
The veg spot is my carport. No AC. Not worth it to mess with that - when I was going to do the cold room style there it would have had dedicated AC. But - as I said, Iām here and its hot. Not sure mega growth in veg like I saw yesterday is desirable. So ramp it down in a place I have less control over temp.
And buy a $200 standalone AC just have a and have a rethink like I did this morning
Iām in deep
Weffalo
Plant of the Month: April 2023
Haha your in so deep there's no backing down nowYeah I have a full room Split Ac in the flower room.
The veg spot is my carport. No AC. Not worth it to mess with that - when I was going to do the cold room style there it would have had dedicated AC. But - as I said, Iām here and its hot. Not sure mega growth in veg like I saw yesterday is desirable. So ramp it down in a place I have less control over temp.
And buy a $200 standalone AC just have a and have a rethink like I did this morning
Iām in deep
Surely the faster you can get the plants big in veg the faster you can flip them? I'd imagine you can shave weeks off with proper conditions but what do I know 
Ahh I see so it's just the veg spot, standalone AC would work well, it's what Buds Bunny is using in his tents and what I will be buying ASAP
- Thread starter
- #34
Yeah. But you know Iām also planning how to do this Co2 malarky/AC/venting in a 20m x 5m green house on a tropical island?
This is a small problem compared to that
But you know me @Weffalo
Thanks for stopping by!
This is a small problem compared to that
But you know me @Weffalo
Thanks for stopping by!
- Thread starter
- #35
I mentioned earlier having some stress (my plants were stressed. Weāre linked. Two types of problem.
Droopyness. X 3
Yellowing leaves. X 2 I worried about. But noticeable on say 8x total
Both x 1
So 5 total. 25% crop.
Decided not enough airflow, too much/too little water (not sure) and not enough root flow (because if they are struggling up top must br worse in Standard garden pots.
I dialled everything back. No Co2. 24/7 fan. Lights raised. Minimum water I could
Get away with.
The yellowing disappeared for the extra 8 in a day. Iām just mildly worried about 5 now. 4 are Skunk 11, 1 is OG Kush.
Just gonna treat the same for another day. But there are 15 problem free plants now so these 5 I don't want to slow them up. Thinking they won't die but maybe move to the seedling tent for TLC special attention and not drag the herd down.
Some photos:
Droopyness. X 3
Yellowing leaves. X 2 I worried about. But noticeable on say 8x total
Both x 1
So 5 total. 25% crop.
Decided not enough airflow, too much/too little water (not sure) and not enough root flow (because if they are struggling up top must br worse in Standard garden pots.
I dialled everything back. No Co2. 24/7 fan. Lights raised. Minimum water I could
Get away with.
The yellowing disappeared for the extra 8 in a day. Iām just mildly worried about 5 now. 4 are Skunk 11, 1 is OG Kush.
Just gonna treat the same for another day. But there are 15 problem free plants now so these 5 I don't want to slow them up. Thinking they won't die but maybe move to the seedling tent for TLC special attention and not drag the herd down.
Some photos:
- Thread starter
- #36
Edit last photo not great as makes it look like leaves curling up. Def down tip. Yellow is way more than photos. But not worried. The others are think full green to recovering from mild tint of yellow.
I did a sort of experiment. The 2 droopy ones i drilled 9 holes through.
The double yellah/ droopy the same.
The single drooper just on one side.
Then drilled air holes 3 per side on the ones recovered over the day less well. So a couple of corners from yellow side snd other plants gfeen corners. Try and figure out how much stress ai can take before upped to airpots
So its too much/too little water, transplant stress or too little air to the roots I can't really tell quickly unless ai try and overlap paramter testing. Hence - drill holes on dome half pots with yellow and ignore another. Droopy do half and half. My EC and ppm sweet for non Co2.
Test and see - fortunate to have the freedom to test with so many plants. Maybe Skunk 11 needs something quite different?
Dunno - stay tunedā¦
NIck Stress Temp - 3/10
I did a sort of experiment. The 2 droopy ones i drilled 9 holes through.
The double yellah/ droopy the same.
The single drooper just on one side.
Then drilled air holes 3 per side on the ones recovered over the day less well. So a couple of corners from yellow side snd other plants gfeen corners. Try and figure out how much stress ai can take before upped to airpots
So its too much/too little water, transplant stress or too little air to the roots I can't really tell quickly unless ai try and overlap paramter testing. Hence - drill holes on dome half pots with yellow and ignore another. Droopy do half and half. My EC and ppm sweet for non Co2.
Test and see - fortunate to have the freedom to test with so many plants. Maybe Skunk 11 needs something quite different?
Dunno - stay tunedā¦
NIck Stress Temp - 3/10
Brilliant. Thanks.OK so Co2 - what I use now and stuff that didn't work over the last couple of months. (Just FYI I'm not sponsored by anyone - I just like any kit I say nice things about)
Co2 works best with high light, warmer conditions. You can increase your EC, PPM and decrease the distance the lights are from the canopy significantly. This results in the higher yields but you can't just thow it in without the other environmentals also being high.
First you need a source.
For a small grow or in veg you can buy those hanging bags, I actually used them in veg before but not sure of any impact. They don't fully activate for two weeks I read, so maybe you could use a couple in a 4x4 last two weeks of veg and then they'd be at their most active during the first few weeks of flower which is when they are most responsive to it. Hang them at canopy level.
Propane burners, maybe a tank. Pay for the propane to be burnt to harvest C02 essentially. Probably the most compolicated method but often what big commercial farmers of any crop will use. Creates heat, not good for me here, terrified of fire - maybe in a cooler climate in a dedicated building, like say @Bill284 the VivoHut would be ok.
C02 tanks - your local bar has these for beer and soda machines. But the stuff from steel shops is cheaper. Here I pay $15USD for a giant tank (a month) and $5 for a small lasts 10 days. The giant ones are too heavy to carry to the upstairs flower room so will be swapping for the small one when it runs out. It nets out cheaper than propane for me here too as well as involving an open flame.
Second you need a Regulator.
I have tried all three types. They all require electrics for the solenoid to control it.
The most common type is like this the tube flow:
This was badly made to start so added a load of silicone to try and seal it up. The real problem was frosting and the ball to measure flow freezing in place. We don't need to know our flow rate to be honest.
Second type - the bubbler.
This is used by acquarium types. The bubbles through the clear liquid show your flow rate. As I said we aren't really bothered by that. The problem was for me the water you are meant to fill it with would evaporate up into the pipe blocking it when it cooled. The level in the room would plummet until it cleared. So I swapped for mineral oil as some acquarium people recommended. Same problem but worse.
Goldilocks type
Two round dials one maybe shows flow rate but I don't care, no plastic tube or bubbler to mess with. I have two of these. Best ever setup.
Third you need a controller
I have two Inkbird ICC 500T's. They come as a set for around $150USD. There is a more expensive brand orange and grey I forget the name but doesn't have any additional functionality. Looks a bit easier to program is all.
There is the control unit to mount outside your room - if
there is a problem with too much C02 you want to know before you go in. There is a sensor of the light spectrum kind, its the best way to measure C02 - the stuff you buy "7 in 1 Air quality monitors are rubbish. This is proper standard for monitoring. There is a two plug controller.
This is my setup outside the flower room. (that Mars Hydro thermo is broken, they are kindly sending me a new one free even though I said I thought my builder dropped it!) So when the sensor reads 1300ppm I have it to switch off the gas. It will continue to climb when you first set it up to say 1800. This is becausee gas remains in the line and it takes a bit of time to release and the sensor to catch up. At this point you can have your extraction fan pop on as its plugged into socket two on that power board. You need to program this. Its a balance - waste that paid for C02 or freshen up? At night in flower I just have the fan come on - I think in veg its more important to freshen it.
So we have just setup and we set our max to 1300 but it runs to 1800. We set to come back on at say 1000 but it drops to 700 before climbing. How to fix that? All designs of reg have a little thumb screw to adjust the flow. Just spend an hour or so with that fine tuning it. Eventually you'll have say 1350 climbs down slowly to 950 before climbing to 1350. This means it is averaging 1200 say which is the perfect number for flower under great lights and warm and high EC. We don't need a flow meter - we just watch.
The downside to the Inkbird is it is a little bit of a pain to program. Think 1990's VHS recorder. But there is a great video from a Canadian grower on Youtube who did an awesome video (he uses the same bubbler type reg which didn't work for me) Here's the link:
Fourth you need to deliver it.
I just used 4mm Co2 pipe dropped next to the canopy level for two plants.worked better than any hacked together stuff I tried. Its heavier than air so canopy level it will sink down nicely. I saw a guy using the same but behind an occilating fan which I reckon I'm going to do. It seems very basic but reckon its totally fine for say up to 12x12' spaces.
Final thoughts
You've got to have warm conditions and loads of light to get the benefits. I am lucky to have both. Some nute brands give indications of adjustments to make if you are using. The scientist reckon an EC of 3.0 is optimal and PPM 2400 - that's what I aimed for in flower. It went higher at times but the plants came out great.
Anyone got any questions fire away - I will say now maybe the other reg types can work in different environments but one less bit to go wrong was what sold me - I do miss having a red light to show me when the solenoid is on - but the Inkbird tells me that anyway.
Hope it helps someone out there!
Nick
Sounds like you have all the potential problems covered. Theyāll be alright. Nick Stress Temp. Lmao.Edit last photo not great as makes it look like leaves curling up. Def down tip. Yellow is way more than photos. But not worried. The others are think full green to recovering from mild tint of yellow.
I did a sort of experiment. The 2 droopy ones i drilled 9 holes through.
The double yellah/ droopy the same.
The single drooper just on one side.
Then drilled air holes 3 per side on the ones recovered over the day less well. So a couple of corners from yellow side snd other plants gfeen corners. Try and figure out how much stress ai can take before upped to airpots
NIck Stress Temp - 3/10
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- #39
Cheers - yeah I am a bit more blase than most. I see yellow, I see sallow, wilty plants. Sure I have lots. But I hope those out there that mega stress over this stuff learn my biggest take aways so far. Once over 4ā tall with a normal photo coco grow donāt overreact to problems. Most everything is fixable. Dial it all back to airy substrate, right mild food and plenty air flow. They will come back. You are likely to make it worse with speculative additions. Not sure too much too little water? If you can - give one water and the other one not. The plant that recovers first provides your answer. Over changing too many things at once on āguessingā stuff I killed lots. Patience. Dial it all back and get the basics.
Very much my ethos - (plus blasting with Co2 which is a bit more experimental
)Talk to them. Give them names.
And get lucky
Heh. Iām with you man. I often toss a plant to whoever sees the post and ask for name suggestions. Almost always take the first one, lol.Cheers - yeah I am a bit more blase than most. I see yellow, I see sallow, wilty plants. Sure I have lots. But I hope those out there that mega stress over this stuff learn my biggest take aways so far. Once over 4ā tall with a normal photo coco grow donāt overreact to problems. Most everything is fixable. Dial it all back to airy substrate, right mild food and plenty air flow. They will come back. You are likely to make it worse with speculative additions. Not sure too much too little water? If you can - give one water and the other one not. The plant that recovers first provides your answer. Over changing too many things at once on āguessingā stuff I killed lots. Patience. Dial it all back and get the basics.
Very much my ethos - (plus blasting with Co2 which is a bit more experimental
Talk to them. Give them names.
And get lucky