Medical Pot Garden Seized On A Technicality

[getright]

So make sure you pay every last cent in taxes man don't you dare not follow the rules. I do not think that is what Quincey, Adams, jefferson, washington and all the other founding fathers said when we decided we had had enough of Britain. This is a fight! This is not a pissing contest and until we start treating it like a fight we are going to lose homes, businesses, freedom and it will not stop there. Our government will stop at nothing to have you lose your rights. Do you really think some guy in a desert knocked over the WTC? That was done so we could move into Iraq and put someone in place that would play ball with the oil companies. The oil companies are the ones who are really against legalizing MJ not big pharma (although they do not want it either). Yes I am out of weed and a bit on edge! But this kind of lackadaisical way of thinking is killing us in the fight to end prohibition!

Wait, what? The oil companies?

 

[mikey232]

It's a sensitive situation that's filled with more politics then I care. And yes some day it will turn but not over night we must undo what are fofathers done and that not a overnight dealing

 

[J9BLACK]

Oil companies?! Hilarious!

I think we might have a dichotomy here between the long suffering stoners and the late to the party yuppie baby boomers. Between those that have lived under the huge pressure of incarceration most of their lives and those that played "by the rules", acquired a comfortable life and can now grow and medicate without fear. I can see how our respective life situations drive us to two different world views. Like blacks and whites.

I can live and work in the white world, but I remember the menacing surveillance of store clerks when I walked through what at the time was high end, Nieman Marcus.

God, I could see why some who have paid some kind of price for partaking could be completely resentful or even hateful to those that reaped the benefit of their suffering.

I honor guys like Marc and you who have been arrested for doing exactly what I am doing right now.

 

[420 Warrior]

If I may?

I think what these guys are saying, is that if someone is breaking the law, even if it's one we all disagree with, it just sets us back instead of moving us forward...It's the "One Bad Apple Effect" that we have to be careful to avoid!

If these MMJ laws are violated, then how do we expect to win over the support of the rest of the country?

I want MMJ for GA some day..But if we just keep getting carried away illegally, then I will never get to see that day because of all the black eyes people like this are giving us.

I totally agree that Marijuana should be legalized across the board for adult use but people need to remember that they are acting on EVERYONE's behalf when they are taking the easy rout and I can't support illegal activity, when you've already been given a pretty long leash to begin with!

This "Fight" is not about "One" person or "One" state...It's about shedding a positive light on something that's been lied about since the "War On Drugs" began!

Does that make sense to everyone? We need to handle MMJ with kit gloves and not ruin the chances for every state to have it!

 

[420 Warrior]

Wait, what? The oil companies?

Yep...Oil, Pharma, Alcohol and Tobacco are our competition/adversaries.

Hemp and Cannabis would certainly cut into their profits and they, will and have been fighting us every step of they way.

 

[Lord Indica]

Those of you who think that big oil has no interest in prohibition are unaware of the oil this plant can produce naturally to be used in biodiesel and other fuel operated entities. Yes the guy effed up, but to take everything for a harmless violation seems a bit extreme. Every time I deal with the government or law enforcement (cops, courts, dmv and IRS it seems like nothing makes them happier than to ruin your day. It seems like they get a sick thrill out of it. I stated the way I FEEL about it. I respect all your opinions but the truth is we are so quick to punish people for the smallest things that it is counter productive over all. Scenario: Guy sells 100lb of the diggity dank to an undercover agent. He is found guilty in a court of law and sentenced to 15 years in prison. The brother of this guy commits muder and gets 15 years. How is that justice? Cops go after pot smokers because it is an easy arrest. In other words the cop does not feel like he is any kind of danger when he arrests a Mj user. Why not go after rapists, murderers, pedophiles and other violent citizens with as much vigor as they do Mj users? You all have valid points but I still think he should have been fined and left alone after all thats what they do to people who serve underage persons. They dont destroy their property, kick in doors and hold guns to their head like they did this guy. Whatever happened to due process? The guy was probably waiting on his card to begin with. I just don't understand why we can't come together and stand up for each other. It's not like he was Bernie Madoff or Charles Manson. His actions hurt no one nor did it cause any property damage and it surely did not warrant the way he was treated by law enforcement. Peace

 

[420 Warrior]

Now, all that brother Indica, I totally agree with...As Jimmy Carter put it..."The Punishment Doesn't Fit The Crime"!

I'm sure most of you know how I feel about cops and their brutal tactics by now and I, in no way, support their actions in ANY Marijuana case but I just want to see MMJ treated with dignity and respect for those who strive to see their states have MMJ too.

I just want to know that it's not being corrupted by greed, in any way, shape, or form, because it's not helping to further the cause, what so ever!

On the flip side to that coin...The way law enforcement conducts themselves, should not be helping their cause either. Their just way too quick to bash innocent people and ruin lives for something that's not hurting another living soul!

Marijuana Legalization is a no-brainier for us, but for those on the outside, looking in to our world, we don't want them to have one more excuse to make this fight any harder than it already is...That's my only argument about this whole situation.

For people who live in MMJ states, that's great! But there are proper channels that need to be fallowed to have your medication...Unlike states like mine, where we have no other way of obtaining our meds, other than illegal sources...We have no choice but y'all do! Just, please don't ruin it for the rest of us..ok?

The whole world is watching! Do it right! Just sayin'

 

[Lord Indica]

I can't understand why the feds are okay with Las Vegas prostitution but not Mj! I have never heard of the feds kicking down doors at the Chicken Ranch. Nor do they shut them down for any reason. Remember when the 3 minor boys (ea 17) were treated to a night of hard pounding? They never shut them down for a milisecond. I am not real clear on the case but I do recall that some years ago. My heart goes out to these growers that are trying to stay within the confines of the law and they get their whole op seized over a simple mistake. I don't advocate people breaking the law but I am also not a hypocrite. I have been obtaining herb from the underground since I was very (way too) young so for me to say "hey, you better stay within the confines of the law would make me a total hypocrite. None of us perfect and to have your leg cut off because you stepped in shit is totally unnecessary. He effed up so fine him or make him do 30 days but don't steal all his equip, destroy property, point loaded guns to his (their) head(s). It seems the punishment is way overkill for the crime. it would be no different than losing your license for j-walking. That was all i was saying. Peace everybody, we have different views and i do not expect you to agree with me 100% of the time. If I needed a yes man, i would hire one (he/she would be licensed though)

 

[mikey232]

That is right we do all have different views but the one thing that is true is that we are all out for the same goal so we must keep that in mind and fight togather untill it's reached

 

[J9BLACK]

I concur that he broke the law and he shouldn't have so it hurts our cause.

I concur that this was an abuse of power by the police and shouldn't be accepted.

I concur he should be compensated.

Jimmy Carter said something more on the lines of: "The punishment shouldn't be so much worse than the crime." Something to that effect.

 

[420 Warrior]

That's right brothers and sisters, the diversity of our opinions is what's going to make sure we win this war!

The one thing I wish we would stop doing though, is bickering among ourselves because even though we may or may not agree with each other 420% of the time, we all make good points and this is a learning tool for all of us...Not one of us here knows everything about everything, all the time and pointing fingers at one another is counterproductive at best. We are all on the same side here and our goal is always boiled down to the same thing, which is the federal legalization of Marijuana for adult consumption.

The way I see it, it's us against them and you guys are all my 420 family and I value each and everyone's opinions here.

The opposition want's us to stay at each other's throats because it just makes their job that much easier...It's just that much more ammunition to use against us.

We need to be better than that, because they will just capitalize on our shortfalls if we don't.

 

[TorturedSoul]

I can't understand why the feds are okay with Las Vegas prostitution but not Mj!

There is no federal law against whoring, AfaIK. The only federal prosecutions I know of related to prostitution involve things such as the "human trafficking" aspect or for tax evasion.

And in most (all?) state/local jurisdictions, it is only a misdemeanor. BtW, prostitution was technically legal in RI between 1980 and 2009.

Kind of comparing apples to shovels.

 

[J9BLACK]

@soul, not entirely.

The federal government is picking winners and losers on social issues vis a vis states' rights.

Gay rights/marriage, local abortion limits for minors, cannabis, gambling, etc.

The social pendulum is swinging towards the liberal under Obama in a great ululation of relief among the masses--despite his crackdown on grow-ops. Regionalization of social policy will continue.

That is not a bad thing. Texas is Texas and Florida is Freakish.

 

[Lord Indica]

There is no federal law against whoring, AfaIK. The only federal prosecutions I know of related to prostitution involve things such as the "human trafficking" aspect or for tax evasion.

And in most (all?) state/local jurisdictions, it is only a misdemeanor. BtW, prostitution was technically legal in RI between 1980 and 2009.

Kind of comparing apples to shovels.

I think you might be missing the point I was trying to make. The dangers of utilizing whores far out weigh the dangers of using cannabis. Hooking is illegal in most states as is using Mj. I thought I would use that reference to kind of drive home a point. The point being that the guy in which this commentary is about, was completely wiped out by the feds for hiring a guy without a Mj card. The brothel was merely issued a fine for allowing 2 17 year old males to purchase sex from the establishment. In most instances when an adult has sex with a minor, consensual or not, it is considered to be the actions of a pedophile and punishable by a prison sentence. The young men could have ended up with aides or any other kind of life threatening diseases that are common in the sex business. I would rather my 17 year old son try Mj than to receive sexual services from a brothel. DISCLAIMER: I do not have a 17 year old son nor do I have any children living at home with me. My kids are grown and gone. I hope that I see the end of prohibition in my lifetime.

 

[Lord Indica]

What is AfaIK?

 

[TorturedSoul]

What is AfaIK?

As far as I Know

I think you might be missing the point I was trying to make. The dangers of utilizing whores far out weigh the dangers of using cannabis.

<SHRUGS> Inasmuch as I don't see cannabis-use as being inherently harmful, I agree. But - and bear in mind that I'm not a fan of prostitution whether it be a streetwalker selling her(?) services on the street or a prostitute who doesn't seem to understand that she is one selling lap dances in a strip club - many would argue that the actual act of prostitution is not inherently harmful, either, that it is the associated things where the harm is.

Hooking is illegal in most states as is using Mj. I thought I would use that reference to kind of drive home a point. The point being that the guy in which this commentary is about, was completely wiped out by the feds for hiring a guy without a Mj card.

Your point was about a federal action about something that is illegal under federal law but you used a comparative that is not illegal under federal law. You will, I hope, pardon my confusion.

The brothel was merely issued a fine for allowing 2 17 year old males to purchase sex from the establishment. In most instances when an adult has sex with a minor, consensual or not, it is considered to be the actions of a pedophile and punishable by a prison sentence.

Having had sexual relations with an adult when I was 17 (she was 27 at the time), I would have to say that I - and many jurisdictions in the US - don't consider such people to be peds. In fact, the age of consent in many states is probably only 16. (To anyone who is curious, I didn't actually move in with the woman until I was 18, lol.)

The young men could have ended up with aides or any other kind of life threatening diseases that are common in the sex business.

Sure. If they were rutting with an infected partner and didn't have sense enough to use protection (or used a type which is not nearly as much protection as people seem to think). Who, then, would be chiefly to blame? The whore? Her owner? The 17-year olds who in reasonable terms should have known better? The educational system for not properly driving the points home in the sex ed classes? The public, for getting up in arms whenever someone makes them aware of what is covered in a good sex ed class and getting it canned? The 17-year old's parents (for, as you say, they are still minors and therefore the parents must have some responsibility for the minor's actions... not to mention that most properly-raised 17-year olds I have known weren't brothel customers, lol)?

Technically, a prostitute who does her own "business," takes proper precautions against sexually-transmitted diseases, and who doesn't steal from her Johns... is far more likely to be harmed by her Johns than they are by her.

I just tried to think of something that would be better to compare this to than prostitution. Something that is actually illegal under federal statues, but can (reasonably) be considered as harmless as cannabis use.

I got nuthin', lol. So I guess I can understand why you used such a flawed comparison. Cannabis use is... special.

But back to the topic at hand...

Seems to me a person is either growing cannabis legally or they are growing it illegally. If they are growing legally, it would seem to be 100% their responsibility to ensure that they are, in fact, growing legally. Hiring people who are illegal aliens, not legally allowed to tend the garden, or both and playing shuffle with the on-site recommendations would be pretty stupid, IMO, since by doing so they have absolutely stopped growing legally. Additionally, by their actions they have brought further negative press about the possibility of fraud in the medicinal-use cannabis "industry."

 

[420 Warrior]

The house also contained $4,355 in cash believed to be proceeds from drug trafficking

This is all those cops cared about in the first place! It's always been about greed and always will be!

If you ask me, MMJ has turned law enforcement into a bunch of thieves just looking to steal from the innocent without any recourse from us because no Judge will side with us and against them!

IMO, these cops are not much more than legalized mafia, who will strong arm anyone who will not pay them for their protection.

I'd almost guarantee that, if this guy were making large donations, he would still be in business to this day and this story would never have been written!

Maybe I'm wrong about that but personally, I smell corruption all over this one!

 

[J9BLACK]

I consider this an "abuse of power" issue. The LEO had every legal right to raid and arrest the illegal worker, but the other arrests, and the seizure of the business equipment and goods is approaching gestapo like abuse.

This is why we have lawyers.

Debates on a board like this are fine, but dissecting another's post is over the top. Hopefully, Lord Indica comes back but if not...I'll see him elsewhere!

 

[ChroniCowgirl]

It seems to me that these things happen primarily because of the ways the MMJ laws come about. It is impossible to think of everything and have it all written into one law that is passable, they have to add things later as they become issues. If fines for breaking the rules were delineated, then I believe that law enforcement would by-and-large follow those guidelines. I just wonder if a fair punitive plan has not been outlined for a reason? That is where the corruption lies imo. All that being said, if it were entirely legal, it would sure simplify things for everyone. Here is a question though: Is anyone familiar with what the consequences are for hiring a minor to serve alcohol? Would there not be some sort of further investigation to find out if the owner had done due diligence, or if he/she had been misled? During said investigation, would the place be shut down entirely? This is one of the huge down sides to being in a business WHILE the laws are being ironed out, rather than waiting till the dust settles. It sucks, but someone has to do it.

 

[J9BLACK]

One cannot compare/contrast how we as a nation treat alcohol versus cannabis.

As far as these grow operations, dispensaries and businesses taking risks as pioneers...I applaud the doctors, investors, growers and property owners--all who are involved--for their courage.