Help - Day 45 - Crisis - What Do I Do Next?

[ExNavyInSTL]

Ok Bill, I'll look at your other questions now.

My ADD took me down the MSA rabbit hole again. : )

Sorry it took me so long to return.
Ok silica doesn't mix well with anything.
What You need to do is feed silicate by itself in plain water.
Once a week I give everyone a drink with potassium silicate by its self.

Whew boy ... see my post above.

Cal mag helps with uptake of nutrients, its important in coco.

Regardless of buffering you must put cal-mag in your plain water First.

Thank you for this. I just learned about this during this plant crisis. I'll begin to prep with one of the two Ca/Mgs I have. One of them has 2% Nitrogen, so I'll use that one in Veg, and the CaliMagic in Flower (1% N).

I wait 10 minutes then add nutrients in order, starting with micro.......etc as they are listed.

I'll have a look at that nutrient line when I get a minute.

I'm about to do a run with FloraFlex. It gets here Tuesday and I have a Blackstrap (Gnome Automatics) that I am going to experiment with in a 3.5 gallon SIP bucket.

But follow those recommendations.

Also a little drift in ph in the res is ok as long as you stay below 6.

Yeah, my drift is never more than 1/10. It goes up to 5.9 or goes down to 5.7. I give it a correcting nudge every time I see it.

What is the temp of the res?

Average temp this last week at 8 AM every morning has been 64.5.

#VIVOSUN #Love What You Grow
Bill284

 

[Peat Phreak]

MSA should not be used in a reservoir. When added to clean water, the monomer is activated allowing it to enter the plant, carrying nutrients with it. Over time silicic acid will recombine with itself in polymer form, which is why it’s important to mix fresh nutrients and feed immediately.

The Power of Mono-Silicic Acid – AGRO-SOLUTIONS

I also can't think of a reason to add cal mag before other nutes. Maybe there is one? My cal mag is inside part A and B. Adding silica first is a thing tho.

 

[Peat Phreak]

TPS Gold is what I use for silica. It's not MSA. It's two different forms of bioavailable silica. It doesn't mess with pH and it works like MSA. According to TPS:

Why is Silica Gold not made of orthosilicic acid? Orthosilicic acid or monosilicic acid is a very interesting topic, and we get a lot of questions about it. We engineered Silica Gold to not be made of this form of silicon on purpose, here are a few reasons you might want to consider when looking at OSA or MSA sources: 1. Orthosilicic acid can only exist in .0012% concentrations when at room temperature before changing forms and turning into a gel, which means when you buy a liquid OSA you are actually getting almost zero silicon.

Silica Gold has 2500% more silica per liter than OSA or MSA products. 2. Orthosilicic acid can only exist at very low pH range. When you add it to your reservoir or your plants roots at a more normal pH of 5.5-6.5, it immediatly begins to break down into non-bioavailable silicones. For this reason one of the best uses for something like orthosilicic acid is to foliar spray it, because it can absorb quickly and doesn't have time to break down at higher pH ranges.

 

[Bill284]

Ok Bill, I'll look at your other questions now.

My ADD took me down the MSA rabbit hole again. : )




Whew boy ... see my post above.

Thank you for this. I just learned about this during this plant crisis. I'll begin to prep with one of the two Ca/Mgs I have. One of them has 2% Nitrogen, so I'll use that one in Veg, and the CaliMagic in Flower (1% N).


I'm about to do a run with FloraFlex. It gets here Tuesday and I have a Blackstrap (Gnome Automatics) that I am going to experiment with in a 3.5 gallon SIP bucket.



Yeah, my drift is never more than 1/10. It goes up to 5.9 or goes down to 5.7. I give it a correcting nudge every time I see it.



Average temp this last week at 8 AM every morning has been 64.5.

64.5 f is perfect.
Never let it drop below that.
Below 18 c roots will have difficulty picking everything they need up properly.
Sounds like you have a plan.
Hope your enjoying your weekend.
Talk soon.




#VIVOSUN #Love What You Grow
Bill284

 

[ExNavyInSTL]

Bill ... again, I very much appreciate your advice. Some of it I have already implemented.

64.5 f is perfect.
Never let it drop below that.

My tent is in a loft area on the second floor of my garage. I know, for sure it is a strange house. I bought it from the children of the architect who designed it and lived in it. It is no Frank Llyod Wright house, but a one-of-a-kind no doubt.

Back to your advice. Because I have climate controlled garage I can control the external temperature. This winter I decided to be a cheapskate and lower the garage to 66 degrees. In the past, it was 69/70 to match the house.

To buy some reservoir temperature insurance, I'll raise one degree to 67 this week to see if that shows up in the average temps.

Below 18 c roots will have difficulty picking everything they need up properly.

Sounds like you have a plan.

I chuckle at this. Because folks like you and @Peat Phreak come in and give me some real education. If I am going to ever get good at growing, I have to remain flexible because of the certainty of new information will come my way.

Hope your enjoying your weekend.
Talk soon.




#VIVOSUN #Love What You Grow
Bill284

 

[Bill284]

Bill ... again, I very much appreciate your advice. Some of it I have already implemented.



My tent is in a loft area on the second floor of my garage. I know, for sure it is a strange house. I bought it from the children of the architect who designed it and lived in it. It is no Frank Llyod Wright house, but a one-of-a-kind no doubt.

Back to your advice. Because I have climate controlled garage I can control the external temperature. This winter I decided to be a cheapskate and lower the garage to 66 degrees. In the past, it was 69/70 to match the house.

To buy some reservoir temperature insurance, I'll raise one degree to 67 this week to see if that shows up in the average temps.






I chuckle at this. Because folks like you and @Peat Phreak come in and give me some real education. If I am going to ever get good at growing, I have to remain flexible because of the certainty of new information will come my way.

I hope 8m helpful.
I tell everyone I'm just a friendly beginner.
I help where I think I can.
But I'm learning every day , and forgetting the next, hehe.
We all just do the best we can and improve what we can.
Biggest thing I've learned is roots are the key to everything.
Keep em happy.




#VIVOSUN #Love What You Grow
Bill284

 

[ExNavyInSTL]

MSA should not be used in a reservoir. When added to clean water, the monomer is activated allowing it to enter the plant, carrying nutrients with it. Over time silicic acid will recombine with itself in polymer form, which is why it’s important to mix fresh nutrients and feed immediately.

The Power of Mono-Silicic Acid – AGRO-SOLUTIONS

I also can't think of a reason to add cal mag before other nutes. Maybe there is one? My cal mag is inside part A and B. Adding silica first is a thing tho.

@Peat Phreak:

First, I totally believe you without citation. And for the record, my MSA rant above was more about the wide price-to-value that exists with MSA products out there.

As for MSA's effectiveness, the only positive I knew about it, was that it was plant available.

As I have said before on here: "There's always an asterick!"

I heard that and said, "that's what I want" and ran with it. Of course, I have shelves of supplements that show I need to do more research before going to Amazon.

---

Here Comes Another Embarrassing Anecdote

A good example of my hasty shopping happens to be another silica product. I bought, Bloom City's version of potassium silicate. In that story, I read about all the benefits of silica so I ordered a bottle. Before the bottle arrived, I learned about MSA and ordered MSA Stout. The Bloom City bottle never got opened.

Now you come along and hit me with facts.

Not that you need it, but here are more facts for other readers that back up what you say:

PubMed: The Effects of Foliar Sprays with Different Silicon Compounds

---

This leads me to more questions:

(1) Now, thanks to your schooling, that my bottle of Front Row Si has become a lifetime supply of MSA foliar, do you agree with spraying every 10 days (starting as a seedling) is adequate?

(2) As for Potassium Silicate (a few questions):

(a) I understand the relationship between microbes (I load up on them) and getting PS to the plants. However, how should I time it to "game" this inevitable delay of availability while waiting on the microbe poop?

(b) Or is it just the nature of the compound that you start adding your PS to the reservoir in the beginning knowing it will become advantageous to growers in the second half the grow?

(c) Or does the Silica Gold have something in it that helps the conversion to go quicker?

Note about (c): If the delay in availablity for this nutrients is just a fact of science, I am fully ok with that. I can foliar every 10 days for a month (or however long you recommend) knowing the potassium silicate will arrive some time later in the grow.

The reason for all these questions is that I'm sad to say, even my Auto grow can run 90 - 100 days. So, there is plenty of time for a second-wind of potassium silicate to arrive later. I am trying to improve on those grow times. Hence, why I am a sponge on this forum.

 

[cbdhemp808]

This kind of grow is very foreign to me... I'm an outdoor greenhouse grower, using organic living soil. Well, it seems the praying is due to too much light, as others have said. The other leaf distortions... seems like not enough water. I think you're in good hands with Bill's recommendations. I get a feeling also that you could benefit by somehow simplifying your grow some.

Happy growing!

 

[Peat Phreak]

(1) Now, thanks to your schooling, that my bottle of Front Row Si has become a lifetime supply of MSA foliar, do you agree with spraying every 10 days (starting as a seedling) is adequate?

(2) As for Potassium Silicate (a few questions):

(a) I understand the relationship between microbes (I load up on them) and getting PS to the plants. However, how should I time it to "game" this inevitable delay of availability while waiting on the microbe poop?

(b) Or is it just the nature of the compound that you start adding your PS to the reservoir in the beginning knowing it will become advantageous to growers in the second half the grow?

(c) Or does the Silica Gold have something in it that helps the conversion to go quicker?

1. once a week is easier to remember and works well. You can still use the MSA for the roots and keep your reservoir. Mix it with a gallon of pH water or whatever quantity makes sense. Feed that first. Then feed from the reservoir.

2. TPS gold has two types of silica. The first is a form of silica that is not MSA, but it is immediately available for uptake like MSA. The other form is chelated potassium silicate. This is different than using regular potassium silicate. The chelation makes it bioavailable to the plant. It doesn't need microbes to make it bioavailable like regular potassium silicate. They say the chelated form takes 1-10 days for complete uptake.

It's also important to note that TPS gold should not be held in a reservoir with other nutes. But it's worth trying after you use all your MSA. It's reasonably priced and does what silica is supposed to do.