Feral's Journal Of Insanity & Some Growing

[santb]

Thanks bro

Defo give the DWC a go, its easy as all hell tbh id grow all mine in DWC's if I had the space
Really the size of the res doesn't matter at all, depends on how often you want to be checking in and adjusting, Larger res means the nutrient solution will be a lot more stable in ph fluctuations and strength, smaller reservoirs will fluctuate a lot more, plants will only take the elements they need from the solution or may only drink the water so may start seeing deficiencies if they are not replaced as needed whereas a larger res will have a lot more on hand when its needed, if the plant is only drinking water and leaving nutrients then if you keep topping it up with more nutes its going to get hot real quick and burn the shit out of your plants I run 8L reservoirs in veg and 20L in flower, veg I hardly ever need to do a thing, sometimes in that same solution for up to a month just adjusting PH, its only when I start seeing deficiencies or res gets a bit murky I change it lol. 20L flower res gets changed out once a week but only gets topped up with water during the week maybe once or twice, only time I check PH is when I mix up the res and it stays within the ph range all week
The amount they drink will depend on how big they are, the size of the res will depend on how much they drink, you basically want it so you don't need to touch it for the week Not sure if you remember or not but I ran a plastic tub DWC in my pollen tent for the Sour Diesel crosses with 8 plants in the one tub Everything went very successful for me, I would recommend if running different strains though to try find strains within the same flowering period, you don't want to try working out a feeding schedule for a 8 week and a 16 week in the same container, its impossible One thing I did learn from that is 8 plants is way too much if you want any kind of decent yield, you will need to space them out as much as possible to allow as much airflow through the lower canopies
One thing I will recommend to anyone running a DWC is to run a root zone conditioner, they will help keep the res clean and free from algae, diseases and bacteria and will also stop the ph from fluctuating so much in addition to boosting the root zone, there are a few out there and are pretty cheap, I use Rock Supercharge right now which seems to work great, I was using Dutch Master Zone but they don't stock it at my hydro shop anymore lol. Another big thing in DWC is making sure you have enough air pumping through the roots, if running multiple plants id recommend having multiple air stones, at least one under each plant

Cheers, bloke!!

Yeah, sorry; crashed hard last night. Biggish weekend..

Awesome info. That reply pretty much condensed down a lot of what I read elsewhere... Sticky it, Mods!

I know I'll be buying nutes more no matter what; so far I've been using s.f.a. (like, 3-6mls at a time MAX), so it's gonna be painful to a tight-arse like me to watch those bottles get empty faster!! But it is what it is. Was always planning on lower-strength-feedings to save a bit of nutes and just to not push it too hard. The whole "bubbleponics" things means you'll get a lot more value from your nutes, right? That's the point, right?? All that 02 does most of the heavy-lifting...
I feel like I could get away with a smaller res in the multi-plant-tub; or at least, I feel like maybe 10 litres per plant instead of 20 in an individual bucket??
The pH issue is a concern to me. I've been lucky so far; no major issues that I haven't caused myself..! My water is nice and stable and neutral, so I reckon that's why I've been getting away with so much!! I don't mind checking/topping up every day... I can build in a fluid-level to the tub as well.
It helps to know I might get away with no res change in veg.. Assuming I see the growth speed that I'm chasing; yeah 4, probably 3 weeks MAX in veg. Also, size-wise, spacing IS something I worry about, cos it does get humid in my cab. Thinking (now) maybe maximum 3 plants in my tub. Keeping them all similar makes sense. Feed-schedules wouldn't have occurred to me if you didn't say it!
I'd read about the res size being important for temp control also; I figured where I am, that was probably not gonna be such an issue. And yeah; I read that warmer temps called for some stabilizer/conditioner.
Was gonna ask if peroxide would work? Keep it natural ish in there...
Also, I was thinking of using a few big air stones, cos they are fairly cheap; can you have too many?? I'm thinking "too much" o2 isn't really a thing..

The tub is worth a shot. Mobility will help, at least in the beginning, but it also means I mite be able to empty and refill in the cab. It would be harder to quickly do that with buckets..
Your 8-plant box... How much solution in that during flower?
And, yeah; Can I use H202 as a conditioner?
Ooohh; and what are your favourite additives at the moment?? Like, Floralicious, or Resinator or what ever. If you could only buy 1 or 2, which ones? I don't wanna go crazy and dump all kinds of shit into my res unless I know it's gonna work!

Cheers, man!!!! Already got it built in my head! Already got a pump, tubing, tees/joiners; just need a few net pots (cheap spa-ones from bunnings??) and a few new air stones, and the tub.
YAY!!

Edit can you also recommend a good cheap pH/ppm meter, if there is a good "cheap" one..

 

[santb]

"Post Quick Reply"

That just took me over an hour!!

 

[FeralA9X]

Cheers, bloke!!

Yeah, sorry; crashed hard last night. Biggish weekend..

Awesome info. That reply pretty much condensed down a lot of what I read elsewhere... Sticky it, Mods!

I know I'll be buying nutes more no matter what; so far I've been using s.f.a. (like, 3-6mls at a time MAX), so it's gonna be painful to a tight-arse like me to watch those bottles get empty faster!! But it is what it is. Was always planning on lower-strength-feedings to save a bit of nutes and just to not push it too hard. The whole "bubbleponics" things means you'll get a lot more value from your nutes, right? That's the point, right?? All that 02 does most of the heavy-lifting...
I feel like I could get away with a smaller res in the multi-plant-tub; or at least, I feel like maybe 10 litres per plant instead of 20 in an individual bucket??
The pH issue is a concern to me. I've been lucky so far; no major issues that I haven't caused myself..! My water is nice and stable and neutral, so I reckon that's why I've been getting away with so much!! I don't mind checking/topping up every day... I can build in a fluid-level to the tub as well.
It helps to know I might get away with no res change in veg.. Assuming I see the growth speed that I'm chasing; yeah 4, probably 3 weeks MAX in veg. Also, size-wise, spacing IS something I worry about, cos it does get humid in my cab. Thinking (now) maybe maximum 3 plants in my tub. Keeping them all similar makes sense. Feed-schedules wouldn't have occurred to me if you didn't say it!
I'd read about the res size being important for temp control also; I figured where I am, that was probably not gonna be such an issue. And yeah; I read that warmer temps called for some stabilizer/conditioner.
Was gonna ask if peroxide would work? Keep it natural ish in there...
Also, I was thinking of using a few big air stones, cos they are fairly cheap; can you have too many?? I'm thinking "too much" o2 isn't really a thing..

The tub is worth a shot. Mobility will help, at least in the beginning, but it also means I mite be able to empty and refill in the cab. It would be harder to quickly do that with buckets..
Your 8-plant box... How much solution in that during flower?
And, yeah; Can I use H202 as a conditioner?
Ooohh; and what are your favourite additives at the moment?? Like, Floralicious, or Resinator or what ever. If you could only buy 1 or 2, which ones? I don't wanna go crazy and dump all kinds of shit into my res unless I know it's gonna work!

Cheers, man!!!! Already got it built in my head! Already got a pump, tubing, tees/joiners; just need a few net pots (cheap spa-ones from bunnings??) and a few new air stones, and the tub.
YAY!!

Edit can you also recommend a good cheap pH/ppm meter, if there is a good "cheap" one..

Yeah you will start using bigger measurements of nutes but really should work out about the same as you would in coco each week in feeds, DWC only has to be fed once whereas coco will have multiple feeds probably not saving on nutes but will get better results from the same amount the air does do a lot of the work but the main elements need to be there for it to perform well, id start at 1/2 strength and work up from there. Bigger air stones doesn't always mean better airflow through the res, you actually need a pump capable of running them stones, I found when I was running the full veg tent of DWC's and 6" air stones it wasn't doing a good job, switched them all out to 4" and they were at least twice as good as the 6", that's also running a electromagnetic pond pump not a cheap fish pump little heads up about the flexi bubble wall type air stones, don't waste your time as the nutes will fuck them in a matter of weeks
I think you should be able to get away with a 20L res for all your plants, I think my res on the 8pot DWC was around 14L to the bottom of the 3" netpots, too bad you are not closer as I have a shitload of 3" and 6" netpots here When it comes to changing reservoirs it shouldn't make much difference, its going to be a pain in the ass, especially when they are late in flowering and you don't want to have to move them too much, if you install a res level tube like I have on my reservoirs you can flip it down and use it to drain the reservoir which will make life a shitload easier
H2O2 will work as a conditioner but imo it doesn't last as long as a good root zone conditioner, will also kill any microbial activity in the root zone, basically means it will kill of all the goodies in any organic additives, with h2o2 will start seeing fluctuations a lot sooner and need to use it more often, would work out being more expensive in the longrun, I can pick up a 1L bottle of DM Zone for $20 and use it at 0.5-1ml/L or go buy a 250ml peroxide for like $5 and do one res
Additives, about the only onee I strongly recommend is silica, gives the plant a lot more strength and imo makes much healthier plants, Cal Mag is pretty much a necessity. I stopped using Floralicious plus about a year ago, really didn't see any benefit at all and its expensive shit for no results, not sure if the Flora Blend makes much difference either. Main ones I use are Rock Supercharge for conditioning and root growth 1ml/L, DM Silica for strength and health 0.5ml/L, GH Diamond Nectar for uptaking more of the nutes, GH Liquid Koolbloom as a bloom booster, GH FloraNectar as a sweetner The floranectar I run at full strength and the other GH stuff is all at 1/2 strength, I have a feeling the FN is the reason for the insane frost on my plants Probably around $100 or so in additives, for the 3 part GH its about $50 so around $150-200 for the everything and will do at least 5x 20L DWC grows, works out around $30 a plant for me, insane when you think about it
I wouldn't recommend any cheap PH pen, I use a bluelab and have for like a year and a half now without an issue as they are waterproof, before that I had a cheap one I dropped in a res and ceased to work again, the amount of times I have dropped my bluelab in the res if I were to buy a cheap pen each time it would be in the thousands $$$ by now you may find a cheaper option than the bluelab but make sure its waterproof and not a cheapie from china

 

[AussieBlueTHC]

Feral's Journal Of Insanity & Some Growing

Ive tried resevoirs from 1 litre to 60 litre and Feral is spot on with one thing. Bigger it is the less ph swing. Which i would say is the biggest factor. Your need to think of what your plant will be drinking 2 weeks out from harvest, not what it is doing now. And lastly being a tight arse will show in the end result. That extra $40 is like a couple of grams in dollar terms, but could be 2 ounces in your final yield. Always look at the big picture. You can save a lot of nutes just by having conditions right so they absorb it efficently.
Edit: 20litre (5 gallons) seems the norm and probably for good reason as its tried and tested.

 

[santb]

"I think you should be able to get away with a 20L res for all your plants"
That's awesome; just what I wanted to hear. I'll stick to 3 plants.. Think that'd be the best compromise between yield/space/effort..

"if you install a res level tube like I have on my reservoirs you can flip it down and use it to drain the reservoir which will make life a shitload easier"
Just what I was gonna do! Just gotta make sure I think about it and not forget to put it on the Door-side of the tub!

"Yeah you will start using bigger measurements of nutes but really should work out about the same"
Yeah; I'm just a tight-arse, not such a big deal.. I spend almost nothing now, so fuck it. Not much I can do about it! Have still barely used a quarter of the litre bottles I got when I started the hempy stuff!!

"6" air stones it wasn't doing a good job, switched them all out to 4" and they were at least twice as good as the 6"
Sweet! The small ones are cheaper!! I have a decent tank-pump with dual outlets.. I'l put a few small ones from each outlet and go from there..

"H2O2 will work as a conditioner but imo it doesn't last as long as a good root zone conditioner, will also kill any microbial activity in the root zone"
Didn't think of that.. Yeah it's expensive, but I was thinking like a teaspoon per res change!! Plus; yeah...don't wanna kill everything in there.

Calimagic is on the list; got some ArmourSi.. Conditioner; pH Up/Down and Diamond Nectar are also on the list. Will also give Koolbloom a crack..
Getting more Flora Nectar too! I already use it, but mostly in teas for outside... I use it a little on the hempys but I'm scared of putting too much to just sit in there without aeration....another thing that nudges me towards DWC..
The pH meter is on the list... Gotta save up for a Bluelab or Hanna..

Cheers, Fez. Perfect. Thanks to you, I feel pretty confident, actually...
Seems like only a step (or 2) above hempy in effort, so what the hell. Always pictured all hydro as complicated, tubes and pipoes and pumps and 50 power-points with double-adaptors...
Amazing what a bit of research can show you..!
And good advice! Thanks again!!

 

[AussieBlueTHC]

Water culuire is pretty forgiving Santb, really, i am about the worlds laziest grower and it did me ok. You will do fine.

 

[santb]

Re: Feral's Journal Of Insanity & Some Growing

Ive tried resevoirs from 1 litre to 60 litre and Feral is spot on with one thing. Bigger it is the less ph swing. Which i would say is the biggest factor. Your need to think of what your plant will be drinking 2 weeks out from harvest, not what it is doing now. And lastly being a tight arse will show in the end result. That extra $40 is like a couple of grams in dollar terms, but could be 2 ounces in your final yield. Always look at the big picture. You can save a lot of nutes just by having conditions right so they absorb it efficently.
Edit: 20litre (5 gallons) seems the norm and probably for good reason as its tried and tested.

Cheers, Aussie... You're totally right.
That's the way I operate, or try to.. If that extra 5 litres gives me that extra ounce, then fine by me!!
I don't mind wasting hours of labour trying shit out as long as I at least learn something... Wasting money, on the other hand, is a luxury I can't afford..! I'll give the DWC a crack, cos overall, it's not a lot of extra expense OR effort, for a potentially relatively hefty increase in return..
But even only one zip extra per grow will pay it back first grow! Shit; I'd be happy with a consistent half OZ extra...
20lt was the number I kept reading everywhere.. But I'm very happy that 20 will do for 3 plants, instead of 3-4 X 20lt buckets!! That was my main hope.. I reckon I can get close to that 1 gram -per-watt without doing too much more...
A few air stones will do it....!!!!

 

[AussieBlueTHC]

It depends how big your going to grow your plants, so many variables. I couldnt grow 3 of my current sized plants in one 20l tub. You can get massive 100l tubs for $12 if you shop around. Bigger is always better, 9/10 girls agree...

 

[santb]

Yeah, I only need a few average plants.. My cab won't allow tall monsters, and I'm not chasing a pound per grow...
I'm averaging around 1-2 zips per plant, or around 2.5-3.5 zips per grow If I could get minimum 2 zips every time, or 4-5 zips per grow I'd consider that a huge win.. That oxygen mite just get me there.....

 

[AussieBlueTHC]

You could do 3 2oz plants in a 20l. .

 

[FeralA9X]

just need to remember when looking for a tub or bucket, if you get a 20L it wont hold 20L once you have the netpots in there as you only need to fill to the bottom of them depending on the dimensions you may need to double the size to 40L, the shorter the tub the less it will hold, in a 20L bucket I only fit 14L in

Edit.. another example, my Nutrifield DWC's I run in flower are 27L but only filled to 20L which sits right at the bottom of the netpot lid

 

[santb]

You could do 3 2oz plants in a 20l. .

Fingers crossed!!

just need to remember when looking for a tub or bucket, if you get a 20L it wont hold 20L once you have the netpots in there as you only need to fill to the bottom of them depending on the dimensions you may need to double the size to 40L, the shorter the tub the less it will hold, in a 20L bucket I only fit 14L in

Edit.. another example, my Nutrifield DWC's I run in flower are 27L but only filled to 20L which sits right at the bottom of the netpot lid

Yeah; I'll take my tape when I go tub shopping. I'll get my pots first. I think the spa ones I've seen are shallow, but wide... Might allow for 20lt under them in a 25-30lt tub. I just hope they are not too shallow.. Not much point if the plants wanna fall over. I'm only going on about the filter pots cos they have some in bunnings, which is where I'll probably get the tub. I'll get a good black one..
Otherwise, ebay will do for pots.. Only need 3, and a couple spares.

 

[AussieBlueTHC]

I think he is worried about head height, so if going lower profile rectangular tubs would definately want bigger for the reason you just explained. If you sacrifice depth you need to make up for it in width. Also agreed upon by 9/10 ladies... (i am totally just making up these statistics)

 

[FeralA9X]

Plants shouldn't fall over, once their roots start going they grow in all different directions through the netpot and grab on only way they will topple is if the netpot is not in the lid properly, that's why I switched to the netpot lids when I was running the buckets, lot more stable when the netpot and lid are 1 complete unit

 

[FeralA9X]

Also agreed upon by 9/10 ladies... (i am totally just making up these statistics)

yet a lot more real than most statistics out there

 

[AussieBlueTHC]

CARROTS KILL: -70% of people who die per year have eaten carrots at least once in their lifetime.

 

[santb]

I think he is worried about head height, so if going lower profile rectangular tubs would definately want bigger for the reason you just explained. If you sacrifice depth you need to make up for it in width. Also agreed upon by 9/10 ladies... (i am totally just making up these statistics)

You got it right.. That's what I'm thinking about. I got a bit of height but to lose 4-500mm would mean 12/12 from seed all the time and I wanna have theoption of at least a few weeks.. I find for me it seems a bit easier if the girls are mature before flip.. But so far I've only used fem seeds, so at lot less shit to have to think about.. I got about 600 X say 5-400 footprint to work with, so I should find something low enough..

Plants shouldn't fall over, once their roots start going they grow in all different directions through the netpot and grab on only way they will topple is if the netpot is not in the lid properly, that's why I switched to the netpot lids when I was running the buckets, lot more stable when the netpot and lid are 1 complete unit

That's good to know. I was thinking if I had to I could just use a stake at the very start, in the coco that I use to start seedlings. It'll go straight into perlite in the netpot.. Not overly worried but was a concern..
I'll rig up something to hold the pots down if need be..

yet a lot more real than most statistics out there

That's the problem...

 

[FeralA9X]

Ah shit I forgot about my MNS order Simone just messaged me to let me know, thank god for that

 

[FeralA9X]

Some pics from the last couple of days

Mango 1

Mango 2

White Jack reveg

SSH

White Jack #2

Killer Queen x Cindy Haze

Elephant Stomper

Bruce Banner

Jandre Kush #1

Jandre Kush #2

Sour White Jack

Skywalker Kush

Atomic x Cindy Haze

and a few pics from veg, check out these Sour White Jack seedlings

C99 starting to bounce back

and Mango 2 now getting vegged up in the DWC

 

[Blacksmith]

Beautiful work Feral, I aspire to that kind of quality, time and practice I think.