Emilya Green
Well-Known Member
They are not sponsors so I am only going to give you a clue to find it... the model number that I purchased is
Far Red Question
- Thread starter Buds Buddy
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Yes, you are doing both the 660nm & the 730nm together in 1 light. I'm only adding the 730nm for my final 20 minutes of Flower only. Only time it will run is the last 5 minutes with my white lights & then 15 minutes after that.Here is the spectrum on the strip that I bought... It looks like a small Meanwell driver will run it just fine.
Cwmoore577
Well-Known Member
I have the red spec 250watt from budgetled. It has the Samsung LM301H, UVA, Samsung LH351H v2 Deep Red 660nm, and Samsung LH351H Far Red 730nm diodes. Not sure how many diodes are the far reds but I can say the light has outperformed my expectations and I love it. I've done 2 full grows with it and the buds are not comparable to the ones before. I can't really say how much improvement is tied specifically to the far reds though.
Cwmoore577
Well-Known Member
I've also watched a few videos from Bruce and love hearing his knowledge. From what I've read the far red light is important for inducing shade avoidance which causes the plant to think it's being blocked and therefore grow taller and also for flowering induction.
Edit: grow taller just means better stem elongation and stronger branching.. it does say it can increase yields and quality but I'd like to see a side-by-side study at least. Have to take these claims with a grain of salt, especially if the ones making them are trying to sell a product.
Here's an article talking about this:
Here is another article talking about both as well as why you wouldn't want to have too much far red.. "excessive far red light would decrease chlorophyll and anthocyanins in the plants"
Edit: for anyone else looking into this.. these videos from Dr. Bugbee are brilliant and packed with great information
Edit: grow taller just means better stem elongation and stronger branching.. it does say it can increase yields and quality but I'd like to see a side-by-side study at least. Have to take these claims with a grain of salt, especially if the ones making them are trying to sell a product.
Here's an article talking about this:
Important! Two Major Effects of 730nm Far-Red LEDs On Plants Growth
The effect of light on plants is mainly shown in two aspects: One is to provide radiant energy for photosynthesis. Second, as a signal to…
medium.com
Here is another article talking about both as well as why you wouldn't want to have too much far red.. "excessive far red light would decrease chlorophyll and anthocyanins in the plants"
Edit: for anyone else looking into this.. these videos from Dr. Bugbee are brilliant and packed with great information
I've been running 3K + 1750K COBs
Here's the spectrum on the 1750K COB
Run full tilt 100w per COB all thru flower.
It overlaps the far red. Works GREAT.
Here's the spectrum on the 1750K COB
Run full tilt 100w per COB all thru flower.
It overlaps the far red. Works GREAT.
the diodes would actually emit a red colour. white light leds don't carry spectrum wide enough to include red that deep.
exact same as any other samsung lm301. the h once meant the emitter was destined for horticulture. used to be an informal indicator but really means nothing. the lm310h's are the same chip as the lm301b's.
these are the emitters i would use now. they can be had as a printed strip. you provide the power supply. super cheap and easy to power if you diy.
you really don't need a pile.
you don't need a peak that big. more of a blip.
you also won't find a pile of far red diodes in most rigs. hardly enough for a watt or two. that's all it really takes. the whole emerson effect thing runs on very little.
there should be a tiny blip near the 730-ish mark and not just a slope. it's thicker between the 740-780 mark than a number of emitters though, and the deep red 660 - 700 slope is thicker than you'll see on some too.
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Both articles say the Far Red works at a certain percentage of Far Red.... but neither give you that percentage info.
If they're going to say it takes a certain percentage, they should tell you what that percentage is.
Emilya Green
Well-Known Member
I don't plan on this light being additive to the already great light I get from my NextLight MEGA. I plan on using the red panel as a trigger light only. I will set it to be on for 20 minutes at the beginning and the end of the light period, simply to wake the plants up and put them to sleep, rapidly. From what I understand, this will allow me to run as much as 14 hours of daylight without causing the plants to have a negative reaction, so I will get dramatically more DLI. This I believe will result in faster grows and tighter/bigger buds. I also understand that even if I kept to the 12/12 schedule, using the lights in this way would make the transitions from day to night much faster, and again the plants will finish out faster as a result. I will probably run at 13/11 on this next run, just to see how it works and not get too aggressive with the Emerson effect.
"buds are not comparable" Can you elaborate on what is different? Are they on with other lights or are you getting funky with 13/11 concepts as well?
Has anyone considered this. We are only considering the red end of the spectrum and adding lots of it at the end of the day, cool. In humans we filter out blue light before we cash-in for the night, supposed to help us fall asleep faster.
What if we "filtered" out or don't add-in blue light at the end of the day? Say 30 minutes of no blue at the end of the day.
Now, hit them with lots of extra blue light in the morning to stimulate them to wake up, just like animals. Even consider a way to reduce reds to start the day.
The same concepts as added blue lights at the start of the seeds/clones and red at the end of the grow. Now add filter-out blue and filter-out red and on both a daily and seasonal basis.
All these ideas and my only red light is the one on Main St. and 3rd Ave.
that's the way to use them.
the red only period could be longer depending on the main rig. i run a ramp / up down period for up to an hour at either end of the cycle.
the nexlight rigs also carry a fair bit of blue, so you may want to counter a bit.
i run a diminishing light schedule in flower. it works fantastic. i end with a 10 hour light period. it would include the red only period if i had it installed on my flower rig. total main rig time would be 8 - 9 hours only.
i'm doing the next couple runs under the nextlight and will use the break to upgrade old lightzilla. then i'm doing a run including the ramp up/down supplemental lighting all the way through for fun. about 2 grows from now or so.
Cwmoore577
Well-Known Member
The overall quality improved. Buds were denser, bigger, and noticeably more trichome production. Like I said though, all of this could have been the same from just the upgraded lights. I have no way to say what impact the far red had specifically because my previous lights were not comparable.
Just to be clear, you plan to run the 20 minutes at lights on and again before lights off just during flowering right?
For anyone else wanting to nerd out, this article talks about experiments conducted using far red in veg as well. Also a bit more about the use of far red and impacts on cannabis as well as other plants.
Frontiers | An Update on Plant Photobiology and Implications for Cannabis Production
This review presents recent developments in plant photobiology and lighting systems for horticultural crops, as well as potential applications for cannabis (...
www.frontiersin.org
These are older COBs 1750K Vero29s, still kicking it.
There's plenty of science on the blue/red spectrum and plant growth and how it interacts with PGRs and the influence on how the plants react and grow with the blue/red spectrum.
That Darwin guy was the first to figure it out in the 1800s.
Here's a good read on it. Nothing for sale other than education and that is free, yay.
This is the science of why blue/red influences growth in plants.
Link:
Plant Responses to Light | Biology for Majors II
Emilya Green
Well-Known Member
Yes, it is my belief that not only is this good enough to get the extra growth but essentially I will be using the red lights as trigger lights, before and after the normal light period
For the daily LED run lights that have the appropriate 10% red/far-red ratio there is also ONLY FAR-RED added. I recently read this article about far-red only 10 minutes immediately before lights on and 10 minutes immediately after lights out. The far-red at the end of day puts plants to sleep faster so we can get 13/11 lighting.
The far-red at the beginning of the day initiates shade avoidance. Because high energy far-red passes thru upper leaves and impacts lower leaves "in the shade" causing shorter stems to grow more compared to the upper leaves resulting in a more level canopy.
Frontiers | An Update on Plant Photobiology and Implications for Cannabis Production
This review presents recent developments in plant photobiology and lighting systems for horticultural crops, as well as potential applications for cannabis (...
www.frontiersin.org
Lighting is important and I spend most of my cost for production on lighting.
That said.... genetics are WAY more important.
That said.... genetics are WAY more important.