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- #541
Emilya Green
Well-Known Member
No, I am just assuming that everything needed comes in with the Geoflora... but tell me about this... what do you use?
Emmie's Perpetual Vegetative Grow Rooms - 2020-2021
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- #543
Emilya Green
Well-Known Member
leaf mold tea! Lots of beneficials in the top layer of the forest! I have been meaning to try this for quite a while and never got back to it. I researched out a method to get white, blue, red, green, purple... everything but black mold from a sterile rice bed put in the forest loam for a few days. There are some woods not too far away... I think this spring I need to follow up on this and write another tutorial on what I find. It looks like you have found the perfect time to apply the stuff.
JADAM Information Link
for reference since somebody decided to send me down a damn JADAM rabbithole. See what I did there?!
All joking aside, thank you @Bode I appreciate you mentioning this microbe solutions. Last year I used many applications of aerated compost teas. This looks like another wonderful addition to improve a living soil bed. Again, thank you for giving something to look into.
for reference since somebody decided to send me down a damn JADAM rabbithole. See what I did there?!
All joking aside, thank you @Bode I appreciate you mentioning this microbe solutions. Last year I used many applications of aerated compost teas. This looks like another wonderful addition to improve a living soil bed. Again, thank you for giving something to look into.
Ohhh...and caught up Em. They are looking wonderful as always. Hey...so why not clean out more of the bottom canopy? I noticed you left some lower foliage that would amount to nothing. Back a week or two ago, you did some trimming but I was surprised it wasn't more. Maybe I'm getting too aggressive with my pruning causing unnecessary stress at the wrong times?! That's where my ? is stemming from. Thanks and blessings
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- #546
Emilya Green
Well-Known Member
Very good question @BakedARea because yes, I believe that proper timing has everything to do with maintaining rapid growth during the entire Veg phase.
At this point in the grow, I probably should get a little more aggressive with the cleanup, since it is now obvious what growth is going to the top and that which is not. My last grow showed me that I probably would have had a better yield if I had done so more thoroughly before going to bloom. Traditionally I give them a good final stripping of at least the bottom third of the plant, shortly after I move them into their final containers but this time I will be a bit more aggressive with this cleanup than I was on the last grow. Right now however, while we are still actively building the entire plant, is not the time to slow these plants down with what the plant reacts to as some sort of attack, as I have one goal at the moment... to build up the roots so we can move to the next container. My last trimming was very slight and minimally invasive, and only to help facilitate the watering process, so not really to thin out or clean up the plant. The trunk is getting thicker and the plant is getting stronger, so that it can hold up good weight. This and all the root building going on takes lots of energy, and for now she needs all the leaves she can get, photosynthesizing her heart out, working on building for the future. Once we move into that final container, things slow down quite a bit, and at that time we really only want the plant to concentrate on the roots anyway, making it the perfect time to aggressively trim her down to her blooming stature, where all the concentration and energy she can produce goes to those buds at the top. Stress really isn't a factor because she is still in VEG and a vegging plant has not yet kicked in its prime directive to produce buds, its only goal is to adapt to whatever happens to it and build build build. Stress only becomes a factor in bloom, when our supersurvivor will then REACT to stressors in a different way, always ready to hermi if she thinks that will be the only way to continue the species. No longer does she know how to adapt... she can only react to stress in relation to her prime directive... the species must go on.
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- #547
Emilya Green
Well-Known Member
From the veg room perspective, I have two separate grows going here, the sponsored Amnesia/Bushmans grow and in the other room the LSD grow, and unfortunately they are on different watering schedules. The big LSD plants are in their 4th day since the last watering and they still weren't ready for a proper refill. The sponsored grow did all need to be watered and they got what they needed to runoff. I am using SNS 209 and Dandelion extract to water the plants with. I have a problem with letting a plant go more than 3 or 4 days without getting water to the top spreader roots. so today I did a classic Emilya move... I watered around the edges on the LSD plants, an in-between watering! My little watering pitcher holds 3 cups, and I have a line drawn at the halfway point. I think this is about a cup and a half, and that is what they all got, just around the outside edge. This makes this outer edge the wettest place in the containers, and the place I want to entice roots to grow toward. Root balls like what we wish to form under these plants don't form naturally... you have to work at it.
Then I took some pictures of the pretty plants, centering in on each of them...
And then I noticed it. The random leaf damage suddenly made sense... I am having a bug invasion! I have been giving SNS 209 all along, so luckily they have not been able to take control yet, but tonight I was forced to step up the bug enforcement game. Whatever these crawly things are, thrips or aphids... I am prepared. I mixed up some SNS 203 and gave the plants a good thorough foliar spray top and bottom of the leaves. I will repeat this every 2-3 days until the problem has gone away.
and here are the critters:
Then I took some pictures of the pretty plants, centering in on each of them...
And then I noticed it. The random leaf damage suddenly made sense... I am having a bug invasion! I have been giving SNS 209 all along, so luckily they have not been able to take control yet, but tonight I was forced to step up the bug enforcement game. Whatever these crawly things are, thrips or aphids... I am prepared. I mixed up some SNS 203 and gave the plants a good thorough foliar spray top and bottom of the leaves. I will repeat this every 2-3 days until the problem has gone away.
and here are the critters:
CharlieWaffles
Well-Known Member
Reminds me of when I had aphids! I knew a few days prior that something was wrong but couldn’t figure it out. I think the leaves were spotting yellow and a little bubbly. And then wham. Infestation!!! Fun time lol. Looks like you caught it in time!!From the veg room perspective, I have two separate grows going here, the sponsored Amnesia/Bushmans grow and in the other room the LSD grow, and unfortunately they are on different watering schedules. The big LSD plants are in their 4th day since the last watering and they still weren't ready for a proper refill. The sponsored grow did all need to be watered and they got what they needed to runoff. I am using SNS 209 and Dandelion extract to water the plants with. I have a problem with letting a plant go more than 3 or 4 days without getting water to the top spreader roots. so today I did a classic Emilya move... I watered around the edges on the LSD plants, an in-between watering! My little watering pitcher holds 3 cups, and I have a line drawn at the halfway point. I think this is about a cup and a half, and that is what they all got, just around the outside edge. This makes this outer edge the wettest place in the containers, and the place I want to entice roots to grow toward. Root balls like what we wish to form under these plants don't form naturally... you have to work at it.
Then I took some pictures of the pretty plants, centering in on each of them...
And then I noticed it. The random leaf damage suddenly made sense... I am having a bug invasion! I have been giving SNS 209 all along, so luckily they have not been able to take control yet, but tonight I was forced to step up the bug enforcement game. Whatever these crawly things are, thrips or aphids... I am prepared. I mixed up some SNS 203 and gave the plants a good thorough foliar spray top and bottom of the leaves. I will repeat this every 2-3 days until the problem has gone away.
and here are the critters:
meffa
Well-Known Member
Eagle eye!From the veg room perspective, I have two separate grows going here, the sponsored Amnesia/Bushmans grow and in the other room the LSD grow, and unfortunately they are on different watering schedules. The big LSD plants are in their 4th day since the last watering and they still weren't ready for a proper refill. The sponsored grow did all need to be watered and they got what they needed to runoff. I am using SNS 209 and Dandelion extract to water the plants with. I have a problem with letting a plant go more than 3 or 4 days without getting water to the top spreader roots. so today I did a classic Emilya move... I watered around the edges on the LSD plants, an in-between watering! My little watering pitcher holds 3 cups, and I have a line drawn at the halfway point. I think this is about a cup and a half, and that is what they all got, just around the outside edge. This makes this outer edge the wettest place in the containers, and the place I want to entice roots to grow toward. Root balls like what we wish to form under these plants don't form naturally... you have to work at it.
Then I took some pictures of the pretty plants, centering in on each of them...
And then I noticed it. The random leaf damage suddenly made sense... I am having a bug invasion! I have been giving SNS 209 all along, so luckily they have not been able to take control yet, but tonight I was forced to step up the bug enforcement game. Whatever these crawly things are, thrips or aphids... I am prepared. I mixed up some SNS 203 and gave the plants a good thorough foliar spray top and bottom of the leaves. I will repeat this every 2-3 days until the problem has gone away.
and here are the critters:
First off...I always love watching your journals! I'm not the best at keeping up but they are always inspiring and educational Em. I eventually catch up.
* I have attempted to finish this reply 3 times over the past few hours. I hate when work gets in the way of my personal ventures. So damn annoying...*
Sorry about the bugs Em. Booo! My issue was having so many bugs outside that it seemed inevitable that they would come inside. And they did! I would see signs of pest damage early on and then poof, life cycle wouId die off and that was that. Would not see anything else. The SNS209 I found deterred pests when they would first munch...outside! Inside, there are no other options so they would keep eating it and eventually killing them. I used no other pesticide in my tent. Putting that SNS209 to the test! I did use it in every drench and also foliar sprays. Just thought I would give you that insight on how I used it. I have had zero sign of bugs in at least 2 months. Maybe longer.
And the SNS team and headquarters are from my home town!! Curb side pickup from their office is about 10 minutes from my house. WooHoo! Not sure why it took me until they sent me that amazing gallon of the SNS209 to figure that one out.
No point in getting too amped/anxious about bugs in the tent. Soooo much easier to deal with them in the tent. You bring out the weapons and get it handled. Love it! I need to get some of that SNS203 to try. I have heard lots of great things.
Oh...and another little preventative that I have brought over from another hobby is pyrethrin. I have aerosol cans of it that I spray around the zippers and edges of the tent. I used when I first setup the tent and then when I first saw signs of pests. Since then, I think I have only sprayed twice outside of the tent. It's potent stuff! With the pyrethrin spray, pests won't venture through the killer force field. It is a clear deterrent and will attack their nervous system if they come in contact with it, ultimately killing them. Similar to the no-pest strips vapor but for the outside of your tent. You want to spray it heavy (tent closed) and walk out of the room while it dissipates from the air. The residue stays on the object you sprayed. Not sure for how long but definitely a while!
Kidding...but serious. I think a problem my plants are having is that they are not happy with my watering habits (quantity and timeliness. I do approach some of my drenches like you have recommended (edges and work toward the center slowly). And then I have also approached it like this, "ladies... tsunami incoming...brace yourselves!". Drown them in a few liters of drench and rush out the door to get to work.
I think those two approaches have their place. Where I am NOT consistent is the moisture level in the top few inches of the container. I have not been keeping to the 3-4 day watering no matter what. Your post here helped me better understand the quantity of water you use. Not very much at all! Not sure why I hadn't realized that before. I am feeling foolish here Em. I was keeping away from watering them every 3-4 days because they had not used up the water already in the container. I know you clearly stated you give them a drink at the 3-4 day mark for the top feeder roots. I for some reason was thinking it was a big drench on the surface. This could be a very good reason why I have so much topdress still left. I was not keeping moist enough for it to get broken down as it's intended. The microbes, worms, and the rest of the crew wanted nothing to do with my dry as Mars topdress. It was probably wonderful for a few days until it evaporated and got bone dry again.
For anyone reading this far down, there is a support group if you have been affected by negative watering habits. Simply click the link in my signature. It has been there for I don't know...at least a year, maybe two! The link includes something about learning how to water properly in a pot...yadda yadda yadda...
*insert head slap emoji*
* I have attempted to finish this reply 3 times over the past few hours. I hate when work gets in the way of my personal ventures. So damn annoying...*
Sorry about the bugs Em. Booo! My issue was having so many bugs outside that it seemed inevitable that they would come inside. And they did! I would see signs of pest damage early on and then poof, life cycle wouId die off and that was that. Would not see anything else. The SNS209 I found deterred pests when they would first munch...outside! Inside, there are no other options so they would keep eating it and eventually killing them. I used no other pesticide in my tent. Putting that SNS209 to the test! I did use it in every drench and also foliar sprays. Just thought I would give you that insight on how I used it. I have had zero sign of bugs in at least 2 months. Maybe longer.
And the SNS team and headquarters are from my home town!! Curb side pickup from their office is about 10 minutes from my house. WooHoo! Not sure why it took me until they sent me that amazing gallon of the SNS209 to figure that one out.
No point in getting too amped/anxious about bugs in the tent. Soooo much easier to deal with them in the tent. You bring out the weapons and get it handled. Love it! I need to get some of that SNS203 to try. I have heard lots of great things.
Oh...and another little preventative that I have brought over from another hobby is pyrethrin. I have aerosol cans of it that I spray around the zippers and edges of the tent. I used when I first setup the tent and then when I first saw signs of pests. Since then, I think I have only sprayed twice outside of the tent. It's potent stuff! With the pyrethrin spray, pests won't venture through the killer force field. It is a clear deterrent and will attack their nervous system if they come in contact with it, ultimately killing them. Similar to the no-pest strips vapor but for the outside of your tent. You want to spray it heavy (tent closed) and walk out of the room while it dissipates from the air. The residue stays on the object you sprayed. Not sure for how long but definitely a while!
Yeah...that kind of sucks. So I need to dive into your brain more and watering habits. Some plants develop faster than others or the genetics...whatever the case may be. But I have been ignoring the individual needs of my plants. I have kept everything on the same schedule. Not really thinking about how I have negatively affected their growth.
Ok...I think I am a chronic UNDER waterer AND I want to blame you! That's right...I said it folks! Go look at yourself in the mirror Em and feel the guilt.
Kidding...but serious. I think a problem my plants are having is that they are not happy with my watering habits (quantity and timeliness. I do approach some of my drenches like you have recommended (edges and work toward the center slowly). And then I have also approached it like this, "ladies... tsunami incoming...brace yourselves!". Drown them in a few liters of drench and rush out the door to get to work.
I think those two approaches have their place. Where I am NOT consistent is the moisture level in the top few inches of the container. I have not been keeping to the 3-4 day watering no matter what. Your post here helped me better understand the quantity of water you use. Not very much at all! Not sure why I hadn't realized that before. I am feeling foolish here Em. I was keeping away from watering them every 3-4 days because they had not used up the water already in the container. I know you clearly stated you give them a drink at the 3-4 day mark for the top feeder roots. I for some reason was thinking it was a big drench on the surface. This could be a very good reason why I have so much topdress still left. I was not keeping moist enough for it to get broken down as it's intended. The microbes, worms, and the rest of the crew wanted nothing to do with my dry as Mars topdress. It was probably wonderful for a few days until it evaporated and got bone dry again.
For anyone reading this far down, there is a support group if you have been affected by negative watering habits. Simply click the link in my signature. It has been there for I don't know...at least a year, maybe two! The link includes something about learning how to water properly in a pot...yadda yadda yadda...
*insert head slap emoji*
Hi @BakedARea, I'm a big Emilya fan so I read this far down. Lol. Hey may I ask you a question? I just put my first plant outdoors to flower. It's in a 7 with FF soil mix and getting Geo nutes. Natural light cycle, 13/11 here, makes it bud as it was on 20/4. Anyway, I also have some of the SNS209. And while I hope to not need it, if I read your response right I get the impression you kind of used it in part as a deterrent, regardless of not having any issues at the time. Is that correct? Like a preventative? If that is right, is there any reason I should not do the same? I love the idea and if it works I'll run with it. Thanks in advance!
Hey Jon! Yeah, Em is awesome. Been tolerating me for far too long.
Yup! You read that absolutely correctly. Every soil drench since the beginning has been at 8mL/gallon and foliar sprays has been at 1oz/gal.
I personally think I could get away with half that concentration for both drench and foliar and STILL be effective INDOORS. If I did not have any pests. Only as a preventative from the beginning. At the first sign of any pests, I would immediately go back to 100% and a full dose foliar.
I would not risk a diluted solution for any outdoor plant. I would stick with 100% dosage as recommended by SNS for anything outside.
Just for a reminder since I had it on my phone.
Yup! You read that absolutely correctly. Every soil drench since the beginning has been at 8mL/gallon and foliar sprays has been at 1oz/gal.
I personally think I could get away with half that concentration for both drench and foliar and STILL be effective INDOORS. If I did not have any pests. Only as a preventative from the beginning. At the first sign of any pests, I would immediately go back to 100% and a full dose foliar.
I would not risk a diluted solution for any outdoor plant. I would stick with 100% dosage as recommended by SNS for anything outside.
Just for a reminder since I had it on my phone.
Forgot to mention. Not IF! It works and it's cheap insurance even at 100%. So yes, after I'm done with the bottle so generously donated, you bet your booty I will be buying more.
I'm just frugal and have to save money where I can. If I know that my indoor environment is essentially free of pests unless I bring them in, then in my opinion that means needs far less of the active ingredients to be effective. I do NOT recommend using half the dosage. I meant to include that in my original response only because I will be running that experiment on my next run. I am that confident in it. Blessings !
Thanks! Yeah I have no issues whatsoever in the tent indoors. It was the outdoor plants I was wondering about. I really appreciate it, and she's been putting up with me too long too. Lol!
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- #556
Emilya Green
Well-Known Member
As of last night, it has been 7 days since the last full watering. Yes, they did get that partial watering a few days ago around the edges, and that seems to be keeping them going. Visually, it can be seen that the outer edges are still the wettest regions in the container, and I can only imagine all the new roots growing out toward that outer ring.
Tomorrow I need to take a 3 day trip. My helpers will come in to look over things every day, and I will have them keep up on the spraying of the SNS 203. I sprayed again last night, after 3 days from the first application, and I did not note one living critter in my quick inspection while I sprayed. The first application apparently has killed the crawling generation that was out there, and now with this next application we go after those just hatching out. I will keep doing the every 3 day sprayings until it is clear that the problem has been eliminated.
Rapid growth up top seems to have slowed a bit, but I bet that resumes after this next full watering, which will happen this evening. I will bet that this next wet/dry cycle is going to be quite a bit shorter than 8 days.
Tomorrow I need to take a 3 day trip. My helpers will come in to look over things every day, and I will have them keep up on the spraying of the SNS 203. I sprayed again last night, after 3 days from the first application, and I did not note one living critter in my quick inspection while I sprayed. The first application apparently has killed the crawling generation that was out there, and now with this next application we go after those just hatching out. I will keep doing the every 3 day sprayings until it is clear that the problem has been eliminated.
Rapid growth up top seems to have slowed a bit, but I bet that resumes after this next full watering, which will happen this evening. I will bet that this next wet/dry cycle is going to be quite a bit shorter than 8 days.
Damn, great color. And very interesting shape to those leaves. I dig these girls. Pretty plants. And very dense growth with what appears to be killer tight nodes. Why do you get bugs indoors as you seem to? I can't imagine needed SNS any number indoors in a tent, short of fungus gnats that came in with the soil I suppose. Is your indoor setup somehow connected to the outdoors to allow them in? Or is this setup you have going not as "bug proof" as a tent? It appears maybe there's an easy entrance point at the bottom on top of what, palettes? To keep them off the ground? Can't really tell in this shot.As of last night, it has been 7 days since the last full watering. Yes, they did get that partial watering a few days ago around the edges, and that seems to be keeping them going. Visually, it can be seen that the outer edges are still the wettest regions in the container, and I can only imagine all the new roots growing out toward that outer ring.
Tomorrow I need to take a 3 day trip. My helpers will come in to look over things every day, and I will have them keep up on the spraying of the SNS 203. I sprayed again last night, after 3 days from the first application, and I did not note one living critter in my quick inspection while I sprayed. The first application apparently has killed the crawling generation that was out there, and now with this next application we go after those just hatching out. I will keep doing the every 3 day sprayings until it is clear that the problem has been eliminated.
Rapid growth up top seems to have slowed a bit, but I bet that resumes after this next full watering, which will happen this evening. I will bet that this next wet/dry cycle is going to be quite a bit shorter than 8 days.
Man, I wish I had helpers. That would rock. And roll.
Enjoy your trip. Be productive.
- Thread starter
- #558
Emilya Green
Well-Known Member
Thanks Jon. As I remember, these produce some beautiful buds too. When I move to flower I will reprise the original LSD journal from years ago, using these very same seeds, and I will be able to compare grow methods from then and now in the same journal. This will also be a comparison of grow spaces because before I was in a finished basement and had a set of problems peculiar to that environment. The bugs I encountered there were different than what I am getting in this house, now in an attic of a refurbished 1940's farmhouse. Imagine all the old timbers and aged wood that is underneath the new metal roof and fancy siding and new windows and doors that this house now sports. I imagine that the bugs I am now dealing with came with the house, and it will be my duty on every grow from now on to be sure to discourage those bugs from coming into the grow rooms. A tent, if I could fit on in there, would offer yet another barrier to the entrance of those bugs but without totally sealing off the attic rooms, I will never get that level of protection. I keep reminding myself that on my first grow in those rooms, I had a tree frog bless my new grow rooms by appearing on my plants... how he got up there, I will never know.
I start out all of the grows on an elevated table, so it is not like they are on the floor. There is access to the outside though, probably under the eves of the house, directly into the attic and this has to be how an occasional wasp gets in. As long as I keep the doors to the attic storage areas closed, this seems to be minimized, as I have had only one this year, and he was drawn right into one of my yellow sticky cards. I should also put a bit smaller mesh on the input fan too... and as time goes on I will continue to make that a more garden friendly space. The other vector is my soil storage. I still need to find a more effective and safe way to store my soil not presently being used, sealed up somehow in the upstairs area. We will figure it out... just takes time and effort.
For now, I don't mind spraying with the @Sierra Natural Science products... I just have to get used to the idea that this is mandatory, and no longer can I wait till I get an infestation... I just have to assume one is on the horizon. SNS 209 and I are getting very chummy these days.
I have a family of helpers who are wanting to learn how I do what I do, so that they can be ready for a job in the cannabis industry as it ramps up in the state of Missouri. They have been learning every aspect of this thing, from how to water to how we train, how to diagnose problems, to how to harvest and cure. They get perks for me being able to count on them, such as a small never empty personal jar for their consumption, and a special discount on the already low cost medical product that we produce. Treat your helpers well, and they will always be there for you.
Wow, cool, thank you for the detailed response! I'd imagine you'd have to find a way to cool down a tent if it's in an attic space? Does it get hot up there in the daytime ever to the point of unmanageability? But wow, how cool, you must have any number of ways to seal things off and generate separate spaces. I yearn for a space like that, albeit on the first floor. I need an anti-attic that's also not a basement, lol!
As usual, I see you have it thought out and planned out. I'd expect nothing less. Nice. Thanks again.
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- #560
Emilya Green
Well-Known Member
I would have to find a taller attic. The middle ceiling in there is 6'6"... most tents are 7'. I gave away several of my tents and decided to make this work. Have I told you about the indoor rain I can produce in the winter time by heating the attic, bringing in moisture, and letting that work against the super cold metal roof just inches away? It was ugly. Without extensive insulation installation, winter grows are not going to be possible in that space. Summer heat is much easier to deal with (no inside rain) and all I need to do is set the house temp to 70 and then fan that cold air into the rooms. Without, it can easily get to 110 in there... with proper airflow management, I can keep it below 85.