Dubnation's - Indoor/Outdoor - Winter Grow Journal - 2016/2017

[dubnation]

Also for all the organic growers out there... I am trying to be fully organic and noticed that there is some non-plant ingredient: Silicon Dioxide in this supplement. My Hydro guy is also organic and mentioned banana peels (like AngryBird uses) but it may take too long to effect the girls and plus these were free samples he wanted me to try out.

I will however in the future prepare better for this so it's all natural.

 

[bobrown14]

.... Please have a look folks and let me know if this could also possibly be a Cal-Mag issue?

For those following my grow, I haven't added any nutes other than EWC & Guano for top dress and light Pro Tekt and SuperThrive. Water is pH'd so not a problem there. RH is still around 60%.

Temps did get higher last few days so a combo of heat stress and light burn?




In the case if it is a nutrient deficiency, what are your thoughts about organic Cal-Mag treatment? Dolomite Lime for the Mag? Eggshells for Cal?

Hi there Dubnation... BB here ... pulling up a chair now and checking in.

Looking good all the little ones. Ok so you're growing a weed literally. At the early stages the only thing that can go wrong is you overthinking everything. It's all good ... just relax and this is going to be fun ... try not to make it "work". Later on you will have work to do but right now ... just let the girls do there thing. They know what to do without our help.

I thought I read back a few pages you were going to NOT use chemical fertilizers. You can grow top shelf cannabis without all the money spent on salt water. This is a good thing for you and you will love it later, trust me.

On the CalMag thing... not needed in veg unless your soil is complete crap. I don't use it ever so if you ask me I will tell you to not waste your money. You have worm castings .. that has everything the plants need to get you all the way to flower and beyond.

Add dolomite (fine grain version) to the soil at mix time..basically all it will do is buffer the soil PH as it takes a long time to break down for plant usage. There are better sources of calcium for sure. Oyster shell flour is one, calcium carbonate is a another granite dust is a must have for soil building...

Whenever I feel like my ladies need a little boost I do a kelp meal and worm casting tea.. let it sit in a bucket for a day or so - stir when you feel like it (or aerate) water in FTW.

Yeah so best advice I can give you at this point is to just keep a close eye out for pests, don't over think have fun letting the girls do there thing.

For example: We went away on vacation out of the country for 38 days of a 60 day flower cycle ... left when the buds were tiny, came home to a room full of big bodacious buddage. I don't even need to water (automated), the ONLY thing I have to do is stake up the side branches cause they break when they get too heavy.

To be fair though, the first week we go away (not my first time doing this) I stress a bit.. then just say to myself; let mother nature take care of the girls I'll be fine! hahaha .... then puff. Problem solved!


Edit after reading more of thread:

Please stop "flushing" - the Pseudo "science" behind that deal is just so far from anything scientific that it's laughable ...

Flushing is not for soil it's for HYDRO.. in hydro grow they flush the all water system of nutrients to '"clean" the system... it does nothing but drown the roots in a soil grow. A very fast way to kill your plants is over watering. Pretty much the only way to kill your plants.

 

[AngryBird]

Also for all the organic growers out there... I am trying to be fully organic and noticed that there is some non-plant ingredient: Silicon Dioxide in this supplement. My Hydro guy is also organic and mentioned banana peels (like AngryBird uses) but it may take too long to effect the girls and plus these were free samples he wanted me to try out.

I will however in the future prepare better for this so it's all natural.

I have a few ways to add banana peel/ banana..

Dried ( in oven on low for quick help)
and then in blender..
Dried banana peel has up to 40+% K in it.

Also.. you can use banana peel.. wash and cut up in slices.. place in jam jar wih water all the way up..close jar and leave it for 10 days.
It is 1 tbs per 2 liters of water... add to feeding or spray your ladies

 

[dubnation]

Hi there Dubnation... BB here ... pulling up a chair now and checking in.

Looking good all the little ones. Ok so you're growing a weed literally. At the early stages the only thing that can go wrong is you overthinking everything. It's all good ... just relax and this is going to be fun ... try not to make it "work". Later on you will have work to do but right now ... just let the girls do there thing. They know what to do without our help.

I thought I read back a few pages you were going to NOT use chemical fertilizers. You can grow top shelf cannabis without all the money spent on salt water. This is a good thing for you and you will love it later, trust me.

On the CalMag thing... not needed in veg unless your soil is complete crap. I don't use it ever so if you ask me I will tell you to not waste your money. You have worm castings .. that has everything the plants need to get you all the way to flower and beyond.

Add dolomite (fine grain version) to the soil at mix time..basically all it will do is buffer the soil PH as it takes a long time to break down for plant usage. There are better sources of calcium for sure. Oyster shell flour is one, calcium carbonate is a another granite dust is a must have for soil building...

Whenever I feel like my ladies need a little boost I do a kelp meal and worm casting tea.. let it sit in a bucket for a day or so - stir when you feel like it (or aerate) water in FTW.

Yeah so best advice I can give you at this point is to just keep a close eye out for pests, don't over think have fun letting the girls do there thing.

For example: We went away on vacation out of the country for 38 days of a 60 day flower cycle ... left when the buds were tiny, came home to a room full of big bodacious buddage. I don't even need to water (automated), the ONLY thing I have to do is stake up the side branches cause they break when they get too heavy.

To be fair though, the first week we go away (not my first time doing this) I stress a bit.. then just say to myself; let mother nature take care of the girls I'll be fine! hahaha .... then puff. Problem solved!


Edit after reading more of thread:

Please stop "flushing" - the Pseudo "science" behind that deal is just so far from anything scientific that it's laughable ...

Flushing is not for soil it's for HYDRO.. in hydro grow they flush the all water system of nutrients to '"clean" the system... it does nothing but drown the roots in a soil grow. A very fast way to kill your plants is over watering. Pretty much the only way to kill your plants.

OMG Bob! I have to confess, YOU were one of the growers that I've secretly had hope would drop by my journal! And here you are! I'm blushing like a school girl. = ) Thanks SO MUCH for the drop in! I actually have been sharing with EVERYONE about Grow Kashi (yet I haven't tired it myself), but with the amazing journal you have and experience with organics, my friends are all putting that in their shopping list.

OK, so back to your suggestions. It's amazing, I HAVE ALL THE INGREDIENTS you mentioned. I even had oysters drying off and will powderize soon. But what I did was the following these last few days:

Foliar Spray:
Pro Tekt (I was advised against the new Europonics and stick with what's known)

ACT:
Brewed exactly what you mentioned: Kelp Meal + EWC and I added BSM and Azos (beneficial bacteria since I was going to water with this upon transplant)

I transplanted today at Day 32 from 1-gal to 3-gal pots. Here are my steps:

Prepped the new containers and dusted the bottoms with Azos:

ACT brewed for 36 hours:

Transplant table:

Root ball: (My buddy says they should be 4x more dense... so I transplanted a little early)

In their new pots:

The one that just keeps snapping!

Because I didn't want to stress them during 3rd and 4th week of veg, letting them grow has proven difficult to mainline. Not only have I split her main stem, but then today when trying to tie down the two mains, one of them snapped. So, I guess it's going to be a supercrop technique from here on out for her. LOL.

I've been really busy with my company, taking care of wife and trying to get my bearing around football for fantasy. I wish I could post and chat more here! I think once this week goes by, I should have more time.

Please please please provide guidance, thoughts, suggestions. Much LOVE to the crew!

 

[dubnation]

Oh, also I do have a question:

As my tent is getting way too crowded, I'm thinking of sending 3 of my 9 girls out into the backyard for natural light cycle and to begin their flip. This way, I will only have 6 of them in 3-gal pots and can do heavier training as I need the space to mainline/manifold.

The 3 girls are still in 1-gal pots as I will let their root mass continue to develop since it doesn't seem to be root bound. If I let these girls go 1 more week, it will be around 40 days in veg.

Is that mature enough in your options to send outside to begin the flip?

I will transplant them into 5-gal fabric pots to finish (instead of 10-gal) because their roots won't grow that much more once the flip starts right? Roots grow during Veg and upon flip it's the above soil that really grows right? I have 10-gal pots too but I also want to be water conscience.

Honestly, need the space but I don't want to pre-maturely let them out. The 3 I let out are just to experiment with the weather as well as this winter journal is my prep for the big grow next year.

Thanks!!!!

 

[dubnation]

I've noticed some new spots on leaves! I thought the ACT with kelp would help but it's only been 36 hours. I really hoped I stemmed the K deficiency. I'm sure they will adjust to the new soil too (subsoil's supersoil recipe).

HOWEVER to be extra safe, I've started to soak Kelp and Alfalfa Meal and will use that as foliar spray. The only draw back is that it needs to sit a couple of days to 7 days?! Is this really the case?

I know that top dressing will take time and it's not time to water yet anyway. I may go ahead and spray at 2 days of soak. I know to leave the cap of the bottle uncovered and shake well at least once a day. Any other advice on foliar spray to get nutes quickly to the girls?

Thanks! Happy Growing!

 

[dubnation]

Hi folks!

It's been busy but I haven't neglected the grow. I had 9 total in the tent but after transplant into 3-gal pots, I really didn't have room to train.

So I moved 3 of the non-topped 1-gal girls into my washer/dryer room under my original T5HO 2-bulb set. These three will go out to flower in the backyard on time (~ 60 day veg). I will transplant them into 3-gal pots at the end of the week.

Now I have 6 in 3-gal pots in my 2x4ft tent. Just barely enough room to train them. Since they all grew in their own way, I have a few various training techniques. A few are 4-way LST, others are mainlined. The snapped one is in the far back right, just taking up too much space. She may be sent out early too (and also may be a male):

The pic was taken day 33 so it may be early to tell, but anyone know for sure?


I decided to get some side by side, day by day comparison for easier reading:

Day 33:

Day 34:

Day 35:

I also got a little worried about the possibility of losing quite a few to males, so I popped two feminized Kush seeds into jiffy pellets and hope they sprout. I'll start a new journal if they are successful, they are OG Kush and Currant Kush. Will be a Winter Kush Sister grow journal.

Have a great day all!

 

[dubnation]

If that one is indeed a male, I look forward to taking him out of the tent so I can have 5 total.

That way I can train them down even more and lower my light finally. As a noob, that really was a bad idea to try too many different methods. Distance of light is so important, I understand better now, bc some of the girls are stretching like crazy. I need the nodes closer in order to properly mainline. Live and learn.

 

[bobrown14]

I've noticed some new spots on leaves! I thought the ACT with kelp would help but it's only been 36 hours. I really hoped I stemmed the K deficiency. I'm sure they will adjust to the new soil too (subsoil's supersoil recipe).

HOWEVER to be extra safe, I've started to soak Kelp and Alfalfa Meal and will use that as foliar spray. The only draw back is that it needs to sit a couple of days to 7 days?! Is this really the case?

I know that top dressing will take time and it's not time to water yet anyway. I may go ahead and spray at 2 days of soak. I know to leave the cap of the bottle uncovered and shake well at least once a day. Any other advice on foliar spray to get nutes quickly to the girls?

Thanks! Happy Growing!

Hey there Dub ... all your girls look perfect to me.. You will get leaves that have holes and spots and so forth. What you really need to watch out for is the underside of the leaves for pests.

The pests that cause us issues are REALLY tiny almost not visible. So look for pests really that's the only possible show stopper. You do this long enough and you will get them specially out doors.

If/when you bring any of the plants from out side indoors you need to be on top of them for pests.

Suggest starting an IPM routine.. you can add in amendments to the IPM as needed wanted ... a little goes a long way so just be conservative and you will figure out what works for you.

IPM (2x a week) :
Monterey Insect Spray (organic) 1-2 tbs / gal
Pro-tekt - 1 tsp / gal
Fulpower 1-2 tbs/ gal

Add all that to 1 gal RO water and spray till its gone.

I pretty much ALWAYS add in some pure Coconut water 1/4 cup and some Aloe. Mix in some fresh or get some pure juice at the organic food store near you.

This IPM you should do 2x a week every week all the way down the stretch and can even do it the day before harvest...not needed but you can.

For more room - veg less time. Don't top once the plants are older than say 3 weeks.. they spread out and take up a lot of room.

I run all my plants without topping unless something happened..I topped my first plant in a few years this round cause she grew into the light and burned up her top ... I was away on vacay.

Without topping your yields should be in the 2-3 zip per plant dry weight with hand watering. So do the math always grow more than you think you will need!! You can always give to friends if you have a bountiful harvest, right and it's good karma.

When you do training starting in VEG it prolongs the harvest date cause it prolongs the VEG time. I'm impatient and like to have a room full of flowers going all the time, so I rotate, take cuttings make clones and also pop seeds all going at the same time.

So yeah you're doing AWESOME, I can tell cause your girls are looking mighty happy. Fan leaves point up = you got it going...

Talk with the folks at the hydro store and then research what you were told (or ask here). There's science in this deal and a lot more BS to lighten your wallet. Be skeptical when there's $$ at play.

Cheers and KIG! You're doing AWESOME ... go light with alfalfa teas.. heavy N that can burn young ones.

Edit: that one plant looks like a male.. let it run its course. He/she will show eventually and before trouble is started ... no flowers no seeds so he's going to hide his bits until he senses a female flower in the room. Then it's all bets off, he will show balls the next day after one of the females starts flowering. You will have some time to make sure ... step back away from the pruners!! hahaha

Worms love cannabis! Get a compost pile going if you don't have one already.

 

[dubnation]

Hey there Dub ... all your girls look perfect to me.. You will get leaves that have holes and spots and so forth. What you really need to watch out for is the underside of the leaves for pests.

The pests that cause us issues are REALLY tiny almost not visible. So look for pests really that's the only possible show stopper. You do this long enough and you will get them specially out doors.

If/when you bring any of the plants from out side indoors you need to be on top of them for pests.

Suggest starting an IPM routine.. you can add in amendments to the IPM as needed wanted ... a little goes a long way so just be conservative and you will figure out what works for you.

IPM (2x a week) :
Monterey Insect Spray (organic) 1-2 tbs / gal
Pro-tekt - 1 tsp / gal
Fulpower 1-2 tbs/ gal

Add all that to 1 gal RO water and spray till its gone.

I pretty much ALWAYS add in some pure Coconut water 1/4 cup and some Aloe. Mix in some fresh or get some pure juice at the organic food store near you.

This IPM you should do 2x a week every week all the way down the stretch and can even do it the day before harvest...not needed but you can.

For more room - veg less time. Don't top once the plants are older than say 3 weeks.. they spread out and take up a lot of room.

I run all my plants without topping unless something happened..I topped my first plant in a few years this round cause she grew into the light and burned up her top ... I was away on vacay.

Without topping your yields should be in the 2-3 zip per plant dry weight with hand watering. So do the math always grow more than you think you will need!! You can always give to friends if you have a bountiful harvest, right and it's good karma.

When you do training starting in VEG it prolongs the harvest date cause it prolongs the VEG time. I'm impatient and like to have a room full of flowers going all the time, so I rotate, take cuttings make clones and also pop seeds all going at the same time.

So yeah you're doing AWESOME, I can tell cause your girls are looking mighty happy. Fan leaves point up = you got it going...

Talk with the folks at the hydro store and then research what you were told (or ask here). There's science in this deal and a lot more BS to lighten your wallet. Be skeptical when there's $$ at play.

Cheers and KIG! You're doing AWESOME ... go light with alfalfa teas.. heavy N that can burn young ones.

Edit: that one plant looks like a male.. let it run its course. He/she will show eventually and before trouble is started ... no flowers no seeds so he's going to hide his bits until he senses a female flower in the room. Then it's all bets off, he will show balls the next day after one of the females starts flowering. You will have some time to make sure ... step back away from the pruners!! hahaha

Worms love cannabis! Get a compost pile going if you don't have one already.

SUPER DOPE! Wow, you are in my brain! I was just starting to get on a IPM routine (though a very very simplified one) with just pro tekt + neem oil foliar spray 1x a week. (sprayed on Monday already). But now with your recipe, I'm loving it! Going to put that on my shopping list right away. It's so cool to have you on top of my grow, lol. I'm 100% down with the coconut and aloe! Haven't been writing that but I have been using that with water in between ACT feedings.

Speaking of shopping list, I just talked to my hydro guy and he was all in on the Gro Kashi, spent a lot of time researching and believes in the theory but couldn't find any organic certifications. Do you know if they will be doing that?

I definitely don't need all this between my wife and I so we will continue to gift it to our friends, we host a lot of parties throughout the year. I hope to be able to medicate all my close friends with specific strains in the future (think small first, baby steps... gotta get some CBD strains up in here!)

Thanks also for the advice about the alfalfa tea. I think I may have used too much so I'm definitely going to dilute before spray. I will wait it out the full 5 days before doing so, but the spots have stopped to grow.

Your grow is looking amazing! KIG!

 

[dubnation]

Worms love cannabis! Get a compost pile going if you don't have one already.

I have a simple one going now which is just a grass trim compost. My gardener dumps his trim from the neighborhood onto my pile every week. I haven't been able to harvest it yet because I just started 3 weeks ago, lol.

HOWEVER! I am getting ready (after my next trip abroad) to start a vermicompost. I am really looking forward to those red wigglers!

Getting all set up for the outdoor season next year!

 

[Heirloom]

Potassium followed by silica are the two most under used nutrients. The plant really likes K. Flowering boosters should have 2-3 times k over p imho. Its the ratio I feed mine with.

BB14 stepped in with his IPM. A good one. I've been having extra problems with moths/worms this year. A capped pvc tube, drilled with a bunch of holes and filled of moth balls or snake repellant might help keep moths at bay, and thus the worms.

 

[AngryBird]

HI dub
The ladies look super lovely
If you still have probs with spots on leaves post a picture.
Outdoor grow has other challenges..more bugs etc.
I have a lot of recipes with essential oils for pest control.

 

[dubnation]

Thank you my jedi masters Heirloom and AngryBird!

I definitely went under on the K for the early nutes however I believe my super soil (which is 1/3 of the 3 gal pots) should be good enough once their roots hit it. Until then, my batch of ACT is ready! Feeding them today and the kelp/alfalfa foliar spray will be ready by Sunday!

Essential oils? My wife LOVES essential oils! I'm jumping on your link in a bit.

My girls have never been outside (other than to transplant). They will be vegging indoors and then will be sent outdoors for the flip till harvest.

Have a great day ya'll!

 

[AngryBird]

Thank you my jedi masters Heirloom and AngryBird!

I definitely went under on the K for the early nutes however I believe my super soil (which is 1/3 of the 3 gal pots) should be good enough once their roots hit it. Until then, my batch of ACT is ready! Feeding them today and the kelp/alfalfa foliar spray will be ready by Sunday!

Essential oils? My wife LOVES essential oils! I'm jumping on your link in a bit.

My girls have never been outside (other than to transplant). They will be vegging indoors and then will be sent outdoors for the flip till harvest.

Have a great day ya'll!

Make sure your wife will check out a new thread from SweetSue and myself.. I will let you know when it is ready

 

[bobrown14]

Hey there Dub.. I'll link the ingredients for for the IPM for you. If you can source them local great do it keep the money local. F all that Glabal Market BS ... its just shuffling money from one place to the next not setting up community.

Anywho.. little soap box there sorry.

OK on your IPM - 2X a week no exceptions.

The pests have a life cycle, 1x a week wont break the life cycle of many garden pests. You will have repeat infestations = plants will divert energy growing flowers to fighting off pests (Pro-tect helps the plant with that). This is very important. Why I'm mentioning it.

Plan on pests when the weather is really hot.. You're in Cali I think so hot weather comes and goes. Pests eggs lay dormant and then hatch at specific temps, usually when its hot for a spell.

If you're in Nor-Cal make friends with the wine peeps and ask them about soil building/compost .. they REALLY like flowers thats how they get grapes. Same for us, flowers get buds! FTW

Links and where I get my IPM gear:

Ful-power ... you can use this a lot. I usually spray on AND water in. 1-2 tbs spray and water in.

BioAg Ful-Power Plant Nutrient, 1 quart

Pro-tekt - little goes a long way - 1 tps/gal water

Dyna-Gro Pro-tekt Tek-008 0-0-3 Silicon Supplement, 8-Ounce

Monterrey - spinosad ... Critter Crusher (but not mites) <-- tip on Mites

Monterey Garden Insect Spray with Spinosad Concentrate 32oz

VVV Why yer there shopping this is good VVVV

VAM - sprinkle on roots at transplant

BioAg Ful-Power Plant Nutrient, 1 quart

 

[dubnation]

Maui Wowie saved the night!

It's been a long week and not going to get any easier before I travel out of country. Was very stressed and wound up. Went to a friends with wife and what started off slow... Kicked off with Maui Wowie we were laughing, singing, dancing and going strong.


I'm leaving the country for 12 days soon. Those will be weeks 7-8 of veg where I expect them to grow significantly. With mainline and 4-way LST set and ready, I hope it pays off in the days of absence.

My friends will only water and keep humidity tank up. Adjust lights when needed.

Pray for me...

 

[dubnation]

Hey there Dub.. I'll link the ingredients for for the IPM for you. If you can source them local great do it keep the money local. F all that Glabal Market BS ... its just shuffling money from one place to the next not setting up community.

Anywho.. little soap box there sorry.


OK on your IPM - 2X a week no exceptions.

The pests have a life cycle, 1x a week wont break the life cycle of many garden pests. You will have repeat infestations = plants will divert energy growing flowers to fighting off pests (Pro-tect helps the plant with that). This is very important. Why I'm mentioning it.

Plan on pests when the weather is really hot.. You're in Cali I think so hot weather comes and goes. Pests eggs lay dormant and then hatch at specific temps, usually when its hot for a spell.

If you're in Nor-Cal make friends with the wine peeps and ask them about soil building/compost .. they REALLY like flowers thats how they get grapes. Same for us, flowers get buds! FTW

Links and where I get my IPM gear:


Ful-power ... you can use this a lot. I usually spray on AND water in. 1-2 tbs spray and water in.

BioAg Ful-Power Plant Nutrient, 1 quart

Pro-tekt - little goes a long way - 1 tps/gal water

Dyna-Gro Pro-tekt Tek-008 0-0-3 Silicon Supplement, 8-Ounce

Monterrey - spinosad ... Critter Crusher (but not mites) <-- tip on Mites

Monterey Garden Insect Spray with Spinosad Concentrate 32oz

VVV Why yer there shopping this is good VVVV

VAM - sprinkle on roots at transplant

I'm all about local! Thanks BB! SERIOUSLY. You're my hero... (fade in Mariah... lol).

Will be getting these all put together right after my upcoming trip. (It's going to be 12 days, and I'm freaking out! But I know I shouldn't. I've trained the girls, gave them good soil, lots of love...)

 

[dubnation]

Day 41

It's been the longest 3 days since my last post. Quick update: I've promised wife that we would go on our trip soon, but between crazy work schedules, I wasn't able to book anything until the last minute. So! I'm leaving for 12 days this Friday. I am freaking out a bit, but I know that at the end of the day, growing should be a fun experience, so I'm letting go! A buddy will come by just to water with plain water and check to ensure lights aren't too close. Gosh, 12 days, I hope to be shocked (in a good way) upon my return.

So here's my set up now due to tent space limitations:

5 x in 3-gal pots in tent with 24/0 lights

3 x in 3-gal pots in washer room with 24/0 lights (my super weak 2-bulb T5s, lol). These girls have never been trained and are growing like mini Christmas trees. (Sorry no pictures)

1 x in 3-gal pot outside in backyard (the one that I believe is the confirmed male). S/He will be induced to flower by nature or not while I'm away.

Did some light defoil:

Still have some very copper/rust like colors on the leaves (no it's not rust mold, but it's isolated):

I did do the BB recommended Alfalfa/Kelp Meal foliar spray. In fact, did it for the last 3 days. It's finished now. Smells HORRIBLE though!


And here I think I may have another male... the ball sacks are too small to tell:

Well folks, not sure if I'll have time to post before I leave in 3 days, so if not, see ya'll in about 15 days or so! Happy growing and namaste!

 

[MagicJim]

I'm sure all will be ok when you return.