Decoding The Holy Grail: Terpene & Cannabinoid Retention: Decarb to Extraction

Naturally, she went to the door when he magnetic stirrer hotplate came. LMAO. I need to get smarter about this and make sure a box comes for her on the same day as my toys. lol
 
Re: Decoding The Holy Grail: Terpene & Cannabinoid Retention - Decarb to Extraction

Kicknitup1 said:
Naturally, she went to the door when he magnetic stirrer hotplate came. LMAO. I need to get smarter about this and make sure a box comes for her on the same day as my toys. lol
Click to expand...
Or...
At least have an alternative use lined up for her, to explain why you ordered it.

This will automatically stir your gravy for you. What? You don't like it? Okay, I'll figure out what you do with it...

And go off in a sulk.

Just a thought.
 
I thought this was a unique problem I was experiencing. I'll hear her sing out in an irritated voice "What the hell have you bought now!?!?" And I know the UPS truck is coming down the driveway. I started having my supplies delivered to my daughter's address next door. That worked for a while but now she's put some kind of tattle tale app on her phone that's linked to my credit card and it starts going "BEEP BEEP BEEP" every time I make a charge now. Holy crap now what!?
 
I worked construction and maintenance for Ma Bell. About half the crew had bikes. One of the guys on the crew bought everything it took to build a great one without telling his wife. He had it all shipped to the company yard. The problem was, the ups driver knew where he lived an decided to do him a favor and deliver it to his house.
 
I've had that happen too. I was then in double trouble; caught ordering something that didn't go through the proper financial approval protocol AND caught trying to hide it!
 
Damn, with these stories it makes me really happy I'm growing for my wife!
 
dynamo1 said:
:thumb:you get a free pass, how was the tie?:Namaste:
Click to expand...

Everyone was damn impressed with how well I clean up :)

[Dynamo is referencing my post today in my current thread about needing to dress up for work for the first time in over a decade!]
 
Re: Decoding The Holy Grail: Terpene & Cannabinoid Retention - Decarb to Extraction

greatwolf said:
or...
At least have an alternative use lined up for her, to explain why you ordered it.

This will automatically stir your gravy for you. What? You don't like it? Okay, i'll figure out what you do with it...

And go off in a sulk.

Just a thought.
Click to expand...

lmao
 
Bucudinkydow said:
I thought this was a unique problem I was experiencing. I'll hear her sing out in an irritated voice "What the hell have you bought now!?!?" And I know the UPS truck is coming down the driveway. I started having my supplies delivered to my daughter's address next door. That worked for a while but now she's put some kind of tattle tale app on her phone that's linked to my credit card and it starts going "BEEP BEEP BEEP" every time I make a charge now. Holy crap now what!?
Click to expand...

I know "The Voice". And that's exactly what she says! Hey, I tried for a moment -in my head- to justify the stirrer, but it was too much of a stretch. Ok, not even close.
 
Back to business. If the 20 mg/ml # is the max for ethanol, then when reducing down, I guess as it hits the limit the oil begins to precipitate back out. Those of you who have played with this, is there a visual cue as to when you must stop reducing? ....unless you want it back to CCO.
 
Kickn, I wish I could help you with the answer to that but in my humid conditions I've always gotten water separation toward the end and if you're using 150 proof you will definitely experience the same thing. Since ethanol evaporates much faster than water, the 25% water content of 150 proof is going to become the prominent element as you get closer to the end of extraction. Your best bet is to go ahead and do a complete evaporation and then add ethanol back to the cco to obtain the concentration you desire. I've always been able to obtain total evaporation in 12-24 hours without heat, just a small fan blowing over an open container. A friend in a less humid area reaches total evaporation in only about 6 hours using this method.

Again, I'm not totally sure of the saturation point, but this method would give you a good opportunity for experimentation. Just add the ethanol back to the cco in small increments at a time until you get good dissolution.

Good luck.
 
Last night I was watching some snippets of some seminars presented at a recent cannabis cup event. They were comparing pros and cons of different extraction methods. A graph was presented comparing the efficiency of terpene retention using ethanol extraction as compared to co2 extraction. To my surprise, the retention level varies greatly depending upon the terpene. Their were about 8 different terpenes on the graph. Extraction of limonenes and pinenes were almost complete using ethanol extraction while others showed better extraction rates using co2 methods. (In hind site I wish I had of taken a screen shot so that I could share more complete details but alas!) just another inconsistency to add to the puzzle.

Edit: after re-viewing the graph neither method shows a great amount of terpene retention but obviously some are more reactive to to one or the other of the extraction processes.
 
BCDD,

Can you find any correlation with what you were watching to these charts? Also note the boiling points of the acids.

These are sorted by Boiling point.
Terpene
FormulaWhat EverClassMolecular Weight g/molBoiling point C
cis-NerolidolC15H26OSesqui222.372070.00
B-OcimeneC10H16Mono136.2400100.00
THCA Tetrahydrocannabinolic Acid C22H30O4358.4733105.00
B-CaryophylleneC15H24Sesqi204.3570119.00
CBCA Cannabichromenic acidC22H30O4358.2144120.00
CBDA Cannabidiolic Acid C22H30O4358.2144120.00
B-farneseneC15H24Sesqui204.3511124.00
a-farneseneC15H24Sesqui204.3511125.00
B-pineneC10H16Mono136.2380155.50
a-PineneC10H16Mono136.1252156.00
D9-Tetrahydrocannabinol (THC) C21H30O2314.2246157.00
CampheneC10H16Mono136.2340159.00
SabineneC10H16BbicyclicMono136.2300164.50
B-MyrceneC10H16Mono136.1252168.00
3-CareneC10H16BicyclicMono168.50
a-PhellandreneC10H16CyclicMono136.2380175.00
D-LimoneneC10H16Mono136.1252176.00
EucalyptolC10H18O154.2530176.00
p-CymeneC10H14Alkylbenzene134.2220177.00
CBD Cannabidiol C21H30O2314.2246180.00
TerpinoleneC10H16Mono136.2340185.00
CBN CannabinolC21H26O2310.1933185.00
FenchoneC10H16OBicyclicMono152.2370193.50
LinaloolC10H18O154.1358198.00
HumuleneC15H24Sesqui204.1878198.00
Phytol 1C20H40ODi296.5310204.00
Phytol 2C20H40ODi296.5310204.00
CamphorC10H16152.2370209.00
MentholC10H20O156.2690212.00
BorneolC10H18OBicyclicMono154.2530213.00
IsoborneolC19H18O154.2530213.00
a-TerpineolC10H18OMono154.2500217.00
THCV Tetrahydrocannabivarin C19H26O2286.415220.00
CBC Cannabichromene C21H30O2314.2246220.00
PulegoneC10H16O152.2370224.00
NerolC10H18OMono154.2530224.50
CitronellolC10H20OMono156.2700225.00
GeraniolC10H18O154.2500230.00
CaryophylleneC15H24BycyclicSesqui204.1878255.50
Caryophyllene OxideC15H24OMono220.3505257.00
CedrolC15H26O222.3700273.00
trans-NerolidolC10h26Sesqui222.3600275.00
ValenceneC15H24204.3570123
FencholC10H18OMono154.2530201
trans-B- OcimeneC10H16Mono136.2300
a-TerpineneC10H16Mono136.2380
endo-BorneolC10H18O152.2334
IsopulegolC10H18O154.2530
Sabinene HydrateC10H18O154.2530
Geranyl AcetateC12H20O2Mono196.2860
a-CedreneC15H24Sesqui204.3570
AromadendreneC15H24204.3570
a-BisabololC15H26O222.3720
GuaiolC15H26OSesqui222.3720
CBDV Cannabidivarin C19H26O2286.4150
CBG Cannabigerol C21H32O2314.2246
D8-THCC21H30O2314.4617
CBNAC22H31O4359.4800
CBGA
C22H32O4360.4871
CBL Cannabicyclol
CBLA Cannabicyclolic acid
%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%

By molecular weight
Terpene
FormulaWhat EverClassMolecular Weight g/molBoiling point C
p-CymeneC10H14Alkylbenzene134.2220177.00
a-PineneC10H16Mono136.1252156.00
B-MyrceneC10H16Mono136.1252168.00
D-LimoneneC10H16Mono136.1252176.00
SabineneC10H16BbicyclicMono136.2300164.50
trans-B- OcimeneC10H16Mono136.2300
CampheneC10H16Mono136.2340159.00
TerpinoleneC10H16Mono136.2340185.00
B-pineneC10H16Mono136.2380155.50
a-PhellandreneC10H16CyclicMono136.2380175.00
a-TerpineneC10H16Mono136.2380
B-OcimeneC10H16Mono136.2400100.00
endo-BorneolC10H18O152.2334
FenchoneC10H16OBicyclicMono152.2370193.50
CamphorC10H16152.2370209.00
PulegoneC10H16O152.2370224.00
LinaloolC10H18O154.1358198.00
a-TerpineolC10H18OMono154.2500217.00
GeraniolC10H18O154.2500230.00
EucalyptolC10H18O154.2530176.00
BorneolC10H18OBicyclicMono154.2530213.00
IsoborneolC19H18O154.2530213.00
NerolC10H18OMono154.2530224.50
FencholC10H18OMono154.2530201
IsopulegolC10H18O154.2530
Sabinene HydrateC10H18O154.2530
MentholC10H20O156.2690212.00
CitronellolC10H20OMono156.2700225.00
Geranyl AcetateC12H20O2Mono196.2860
HumuleneC15H24Sesqui204.1878198.00
CaryophylleneC15H24BycyclicSesqui204.1878255.50
B-farneseneC15H24Sesqui204.3511124.00
a-farneseneC15H24Sesqui204.3511125.00
B-CaryophylleneC15H24Sesqi204.3570119.00
ValenceneC15H24204.3570123
a-CedreneC15H24Sesqui204.3570
AromadendreneC15H24204.3570
Caryophyllene OxideC15H24OMono220.3505257.00
trans-NerolidolC10h26Sesqui222.3600275.00
CedrolC15H26O222.3700273.00
cis-NerolidolC15H26OSesqui222.372070.00
a-BisabololC15H26O222.3720
GuaiolC15H26OSesqui222.3720
THCV TetrahydrocannabivarinC19H26O2286.415220.00
CBDV CannabidivarinC19H26O2286.4150
Phytol 1C20H40ODi296.5310204.00
Phytol 2C20H40ODi296.5310204.00
CBN CannabinolC21H26O2310.1933185.00
D9-Tetrahydrocannabinol (THC)C21H30O2314.2246157.00
CBD CannabidiolC21H30O2314.2246180.00
CBC CannabichromeneC21H30O2314.2246220.00
CBG CannabigerolC21H32O2314.2246
D8-THCC21H30O2314.4617
CBCA Cannabichromenic acidC22H30O4358.2144120.00
CBDA Cannabidiolic AcidC22H30O4358.2144120.00
THCA Tetrahydrocannabinolic AcidC22H30O4358.4733105.00
CBNAC22H31O4359.4800
CBGAC22H32O4360.4871
3-Carene
C10H16BicyclicMono168.50
CBL Cannabicyclol
CBLA Cannabicyclolic acid
N1
Y-TerpinoleneC10H16Mono
 
My bad. It was actually an Emerald Cup seminar presented by Jahan Marcu (I think). The green represents ethanol extraction while the red is the results of co2 extraction. The numbers to the right represent % of extraction. Neither appear to be impressive, do they?

IMG_02582.PNG


After rewatching a portion of the video, it appears the percentage on the right represents the abundance of the individual terpene but the percentage ratio is unspecified. A little confusing. Am I going to get my hand spanked if I post a link?

Emerald Conference: Comparing Extraction Techniques for Cannabinoids and Terpenes | Application Notes | Analytical Cannabis
 

Thunderstruck oil caps test
The extraction was diluted 100 to 1 with coconut oil and lecithin. That would make the extractions' cannabinoid content 71.3% before diluting. Terpenes will account for some or the remainder.

At 71% cannabinionds, I need to revise my guesstomate down some for the percent extracted from the buds.

I never know



SteepHill-Chris_Special-cannabinoids.jpg


 
Kicknitup1 said:
I know "The Voice". And that's exactly what she says! Hey, I tried for a moment -in my head- to justify the stirrer, but it was too much of a stretch. Ok, not even close.
Click to expand...

It's a hobby. :laughtwo: That's how I justified all my early expenditures. It's a hobby, and I always allotted every member in the family hobby money. Why not myself? Lol! Keep in mind I live alone now. I no longer have to justify anything.
 
AKgramma said:
This forum is getting so far over my head, I'm going to have to unsub, so my old brain don't break. I'm subbed toa whole ot of other journals, so I'm not going anywhere.

:Namaste:
Click to expand...

Yeah this!
I've been thinking, maybe this thread is a candidate for a good summary post every now and then - perhaps even a couple; one technical and one less technical for those of us that are interested but don't have the technical capacity to decipher the reports... just a thought.

:Namaste:
 

Similar threads

Oldbear
All About Terpene Supplements: Holy Grail Thread Spin-off
2 3 4 5 6
Replies
108
Views
14K
Kicknitup1
K
Romulus
Decarb
Replies
4
Views
3K
Dave Groomer
Dave Groomer
N
Extract with no decarb?
Replies
2
Views
580
Narsbars
N
ACS Laboratory
Ensuring CBD Quality: The Significance of Lab Testing for Hemp Products
Replies
2
Views
370
JoeDaddy77
JoeDaddy77
The General
For Colorado Cannabis Testing Labs, These Are High Times
Replies
0
Views
3K
The General
The General
Back
Top Bottom