AKGramma's Perpetual Grow

[AKgramma]

Lots to think about. I assumed Frilly Lady was Sativa-heavy, so switched nutes accordingly, later than the BBLs, which have been finishing in 8 weeks. All my ladies got the same bloom nutes, but the different strains reacted differently. BBL did the best and did not claw.

I am not one to flood my ladies with nutes, either. Maybe 1/2 gallon of diluted nutes per mature plant per week. As they came to late flower, I stopped the veg nutes altogether except for occasional feedings of Molasses and Epsom salts (my water is high in Calcium), with a tiny bit of Superthrive.

I switched to Earth Juice Bloom too late for Frilly Lady, but the OGKs have some more finishing up to do. Still, the one OGK in soil looks a whole lot better than those in the perlite. All three are in Hempy pots, however. When I was trimming the clawed leaves off the OGKs in perlite, I noticed that they were soft and limp, like they were overwatered. I thought one could not overwater a hempy pot.

Any ideas on this, Tead? You're my Hempy expert here.

So, I seem to be having a number of issues for the Sativa-heavy plants.

Something funny-odd, I had placed the clones in the same bin as Frilly Lady, and just this last week, I saw that their leaves were covered with drops of resin from Frilly Lady. She also dripped all over the edges of the bin she was in.

Well, that is two plants harvested, one in hempy and one in a bin of soil. Going to dump all the used soil in the garden and start over with a different mix, very heavy on the perlite.

 

[TorturedSoul]

Anyway, now I have to decide how to use the Bicardi tincture I brewed up. It is ready to be strained, but I have had no luck making oil out of a tincture. So, what do I do with it? It is way too strong to drink!

Err... Boil some water, when it drops below 180°F set the opened bottle in it, wait for the water to cool to room temperature, remove bottle and set it (still open) on a warm shelf somewhere for a day or so? The alcohol ought to evaporate before the water content does - which would weaken the combined product, I would think.

IDK, I'm just guessing. When I was doing stuff with alcohol and cannabis together, the alcohol got "reduced" until I had a sort of hash oil type substance. I smoked that, lol.

I thought one could not overwater a hempy pot.

I've always felt that, as blanket statements go, that one was exaggerated. I mean... It would (sort of have to) depend on factors such as how high the drain hole was, the medium (/mixture of same), and the usual stuff like the size of the plant, frequency of watering, ambient temperature, and amount of air movement. Speaking of that statement - and medium - I've also heard the same thing about coco coir... but an awful lot of people (including me) have found it to work best for them when a good bit of perlite was mixed in, lol. So... Ya pays yer money, ya takes yer chances . Just too many variables for a general statement to apply to everyone / every grow setup, IMHO.

 

[AKgramma]

Did I ever post a link to (the repost of) the article by Dutch Passion on which conditions (nitrogen vs. potassium, temperature, humidity/moisture, color temperature - and number of hours - of lighting during the crucial third to fourth week of vegetative growth) favor a higher percentage of females (and which conditions favor a higher percentage of males) here in this thread? If not, I would be glad to find the link. My informal testing tends to agree with what the author wrote.

Nope! And this would be a really helpful URL. Please repost it?

 

[TorturedSoul]

It has been (re)posted several times at this forum over the past... IDK, ten or more years? I was actually thinking that I was one of the people that did so, lol, some time around five or six years ago. But... 5,700 posts, it's hard to find a specific one - or even verify whether I did or am misremembering. I did a quick search a while back and found the article reposted as part of someone's blog post with their comments/take on it before and after the actual article's content. But that person's viewpoint may be useful to you as well, lol, so I'll just post a link to his blog entry:
Increasing chances of female plants from standard seeds - Blogs - 420 Magazine ®

The original article stated:

It is important to start these changes at the three-pairs-of-leaves stage and continue for two or three weeks, before reverting to standard conditions.

...instead of giving a specific starting/ending period. That made more sense to me - because it is the state of development of the plant, not the number of days it has been alive, methinks. But I cannot swear that this is the more valid way (as opposed to starting at the nth week of life).

And speaking about validity, I believe that the reason for all of this is... Well, think of herd animals (or chickens, or...). An equal number of males are NOT needed for the furtherance of the species. One rooster can inseminate a large number of cows (err... ). And I'll tell you true, one male cannabis plant in nature (outdoors) can screw up a whole crop of (formerly) sinsemilla I mean can potentially spread pollen a lot farther than the average rooster can spread its sperm, lol. Add to that: It makes more sense, from an evolutionary standpoint, for a male plant to spread its pollen when there are already LOTS of female flowers; ergo it is reasonable to expect more females during the earlier part of the growing season and then see males appear after the females have had a chance to become established. So I would expect to see a higher ratio of females (again, outside, in a natural environment) when planted during the earlier, cooler, moister period of Spring when the daylight hours are still short (albeit increasing) and the color of that light is more blue. And then, later - in late Spring and Summer - when it is hotter, there are more daylight hours, and the light is (relatively) less blue in appearance... more males.

Plus, even after the female cannabis plants' flowers have been fertilized, it takes some time for those flowers to produce seeds (and for the seeds to mature to the point at which they would be viable if planted). As the clock has continued ticking (lol), it also makes sense to me that the male plant should then grow/mature quickly (and grow taller as well, to help facilitate the spreading of its pollen). And that is what typically seems to happen.

But I'm just rambling as per usual....

 

[TorturedSoul]

After typing the above, I remembered a recent post by someone. It was about... well, praising a certain seedbank, because he had good luck with their products and had tried a competitor previously - and got all males. It is, of course, possible that the competitor's products were of poor quality. But he posted a picture of one of the plants (grown outdoors) and I remember thinking - and posting - that it hadn't grown as much as I would have expected for the stated age. I know when my yard gets enough rain, I can mow it twice in a week and it still looks unkempt - but when we have a nice (for someone who considers hobbling along pushing a mower over uneven ground in inhumane temperatures to be a form of punishment) period of little to no rain, the growth slows to a manageable level and mowing once a week is fine. IOW, I wondered if the plants had received less water than optimum and if, perhaps, it was hot there. Such conditions would "encourage" a higher percentage of males....

 

[Tead]

I was looking at Osmocote at the nursery last week and wondered if it would work....I use MG and jobes

I am new to all this...remember that when I give my limited advice

OsmocotePlus works great for Canna. Creative folk even find ways to use it in hydroponic grows. It does have one interesting twerk.... it's a touch temperature sensitive and will provide a higher nutrient level at higher temperatures.
Dynamite is another slow release nutrient that works well with Canna.

 

[Tead]

It is way too strong to drink!

Amateur!

 

[Tead]

I thought one could not overwater a hempy pot.

Ya know... I always try to qualify those words by saying 'perlite only' when I use them. Perhaps I missed that.
You're mix is way way different than mine. It differs in many, many ways that affect water uptake, nutrient distribution, and most notably, general moisture and oxygen levels in the root zone.

I believe you might need to slow you feeding/watering cycle and try to let the medium dry more between.

 

[Tead]

So... Ya pays yer money, ya takes yer chances . Just too many variables for a general statement to apply to everyone / every grow setup, IMHO.

Say... that would appear to be some nice home grown wisdom there!

 

[Lilred]

I have been using this for my plants since transplant.

Most are in preflower or flowering. I found this at the nursery. They were all planted with blood and bone meal.

I am new to all this...remember that when I give my limited advice

 

[AKgramma]

Ya know... I always try to qualify those words by saying 'perlite only' when I use them. Perhaps I missed that.
You're mix is way way different than mine. It differs in many, many ways that affect water uptake, nutrient distribution, and most notably, general moisture and oxygen levels in the root zone.

I believe you might need to slow you feeding/watering cycle and try to let the medium dry more between.

The two OGKs with clawed leaves were in hempy pots with a mixture of 20 - 25% vermiculite and the rest coarse Perlite. That is not a huge departure from your instructions on how to grow this way. Except I still haven't gotten the feeding-watering part down. I keep reverting back to 50 years of soil growing experience with flowers and vegetable gardens. So, you are right, Tead.

I think hempy pots would be unsuitable with any amount of soil, since the soil would tend to migrate down to the reservoir and create a nasty swamp. But I will come away from this experiment with a much lighter soil mix, 60% Perlite, 25% vermiculite, and the rest Black Gold potting soil (the good stuff, not the garden quality).

Yeah, yeah, I know this means I'm backsliding and going to Hell.

Now, not to put hempy growers down. I chalk this up to my unfamiliarity with a hydro system. I don't think I ever gave them a thorough flush, so that the reservoir got a complete flushing. The thought of hauling 6 hempys to the shower and then hauling them back to the grow area led me to give them less, rather than more, clean water. Hauling water and pots around is physically impossible for me now.

Looks like it was MY turn to ramble..... just sorting my thoughts before I up-pot the next crop.

 

[AKgramma]

OsmocotePlus works great for Canna. Creative folk even find ways to use it in hydroponic grows. It does have one interesting twerk.... it's a touch temperature sensitive and will provide a higher nutrient level at higher temperatures.
Dynamite is another slow release nutrient that works well with Canna.

I may be mis-guided, but won't slow-release pellets remain in the soil into the flower period, when a different NPK formula is called for? I've seen slow-release pellets remain in the soil well beyond a growing cycle.

 

[Tead]

Yeah, yeah, I know this means I'm backsliding and going to Hell.

Happy to hold your hand along the journey!

I may be mis-guided, but won't slow-release pellets remain in the soil into the flower period, when a different NPK formula is called for? I've seen slow-release pellets remain in the soil well beyond a growing cycle.

I feel you have the right thought... but the situation reversed. The Os+ seems more suited to the bloom cycle and IMHO does actually perform a slight bit better in bloom than veg. One could, and I have in the past, supplemented with small amounts of traditional hydroponic nutes. I used 1/2tsp of Grow nutes on all my waterings of the last Os+ grow I did... this coincided with my clone mix, so it was easy.

One can't really do a final flush without somehow removing and replacing the medium. Easy in a re-circ hydro system, but near impossible in a hempy pot.

Not sayin Osmocote+ or Dynamite are optimal for growing... just that they work... and they work pretty well. They are mighty appealing to a lazy gardener tho and I'm afraid I've succumb to their charms.

 

[TorturedSoul]

Amateur!

I believe that drinking (alcohol) is one of those things that it is best not to attain professional-level proficiency at. (Source reference: I attained that state - 11th dan red belt - and look where I am at now.)

Say... that would appear to be some nice home grown wisdom there!

Hey, there's nothing wrong with a little homegrown, lol. <COUGH> Typing that reminds me of a time way back in school (assume for the sake of the guidelines that I was the world's oldest HS student, and so were my so-called peers), I'd walk in and a bunch of people would pester me to "share a little of that homegrown." Someone heard and asked, "Why get excited over homegrown?" - the question was met with lots of derisive laughter from everyone else . That caused him to receive a new nickname, but I cannot seem to remember what it was (me, everyone just called "Party" - I couldn't say why :rolleyes3 ).

I still haven't gotten the feeding-watering part down.

Err... Water when the plants are thirsty, lol? (When they just begin to droop, or when you lift a pot and think, "Wow, that sure is light - there must not be any water in it.") Feed when they get hungry? (Just begin to show signs of a deficiency, or when growth slows to a crawl for no (other) apparent reason. And keep records (perhaps electronic or paper notes with photos for reference) so that, in successive grows with clones from the same mother under the same or greater light intensity, you can try feeding just a little bit more - or more often - to see if this promotes better/faster growth/budding, the same rate, or else causes burned leaves and/or other issues). But I cannot say that I have always followed my own advice . (Maybe things would have turned out better... ?)

I think hempy pots would be unsuitable with any amount of soil

I would imagine so, lol. "Hempy" is hand-watered passive (no mechanical aeration devices) hydroponics. Soil is... soil. Hydroponics growers feed the plants' roots. Soil growers "feed the soil" (IOW, do things to improve the soil as a viable life... sphere... thingie, and feed the microorganisms that live there, which in turn feed the plants' roots). Hydroponics growers prefer an average pH of 5.8. Soil growers prefer an average pH of 6.5.

More specifically in regards to hempies... It is my understanding that the point is to provide both a wet-zone and a dry(+/-) zone. The part below the hole is where the roots can access water/nutrients and the part above it is where they can access O₂. But I suppose this gets blurred a bit, depending on the medium used. Something like coco coir seems to provide a great deal of "wicking" action, so one might see water/nutrients above the hole (and I think coco coir can to do interesting things if allowed to dry out completely?). I'm not the world's biggest fan of coco, TBH, but I have a big brick of it, lol, and will continue to use it to alter the characteristics of a (100%) perlite medium, since my vermiculite got contaminated in/after a flood and I fear it may have mold spores in it. Lots of folks use it - and some of them have very good results - but I wonder if they have bothered to experiment by mixing it with perlite in different ratios. I suppose it depends on their watering/etc. habits (and willingness to change same) and other conditions, though.

Hauling water and pots around is physically impossible for me now.

Hey, don't you have grandkids, lol? Tell one of them to run a water line and a drain line into your grow area. IIRC, you live in a trailer, so assuming it doesn't sit directly on the ground that someone can just crawl underneath it. A utility sink (or some kind of "utility shower" that I've seen before in janitorial closets for filling/cleaning those big yellow mop buckets might be ideal - but an old bucket/tub could be made to work as a catch for the drain. Or... I almost forgot you live up there with the abominable snowmen, polar bears, and wooly mammoths . Do you have to have all your water lines up in the walls to prevent freezes?

Looks like it was MY turn to ramble.[/quote]

Mine's bigger than yours. Oh, wait... I'm not seven any more.

The Os+

That Osmocote Plus thread discussed those things, and would undoubtedly be a very beneficial read to anyone who is interested in time-release fertilizers in general (and that one specifically). But I let it "get away from me" even before I left for ~three years, and I simply haven't had time to read the thing in all its 1,259 post glory. But I seem to recall a post from this year near the end of it where you mentioned that you've used Osmocote Plus to good effect in your hempy pots. Would you mind giving a summary of your method (composition of medium, size of container, amount of fertilizer used, how much - and how often - do you supplement with additional nutrients (and I realize this must vary by strain, so...), et cetera? Assuming that AKgramma does not mind, of course. I'm really not thrilled with the thought of helping to enrich the Scotts Miracle Gro monster (might as well start shopping at WalMart, FFS). Nonetheless, I've been thinking about trying to get some of the stuff at some point and using it in a few smallish (possibly even 2-liter bottles or less) hempies, a couple soil buckets (probably FoxFarms Happy Frog, Ocean Forrest, or a mixture of the two depending on what portion of both is still available in my buddy's storage area where the remaining odds & ends from my paranoid sanitizing event occurred three years ago, and cut with perlite regardless of what soil I end up using), or both. And I might try to use some for fruit/vegetable plants outside Mom's house next year IF she is still kicking and IF she feels up to watering it at least occasionally. Or you could just tell me to go read the thread, I guess...

 

[AKgramma]

I went to Earth Juice's website and copied their charts down to my hard drive. They have an easy two-parter all the way up to advanced Hydro, with additives and all kinds of stuff.

Personally I prefer the concentrated liquid nutes to slow-release. I have added worm casting and powdered eggshells to the soil, however. Earth Juice has an impressive list of trace nutes n their original formula, as well as the NPK.

Also a shout out to the folks who sell the Mars 300 on Amazon. Each time I've ordered a unit, it has arrived within 5 days from ordering, and it comes via UPS, so right to the door. They have two outlets in the USA, one in California. This last order, I bought two. So that makes 4 total. These 2 will go in the unit where the OGKs are in flower. Since they are only 6 weeks in, the LEDs should have some effect of bud production.

I'm going to consolidate all the ladies in flower into the larger unit and shut down Unit 1, to save on the electrical bill.

 

[AKgramma]

TS: I know a whole lot more about plumbing than my grandkids. Trailers have the flexible tubing, and this is what I used to retrofit my cabin up North from dry to wet. But converting a bedroom into another wet room is not something I want to do here. Plus, I have already converted my new hempys into standard pots, so I won't be hauling waste water out.

Where the winter temps get really cold, we use a lot of insulation wherever the pipes leave the walls, underneath the houses. In fact, it is standard practice to wrap heat tapes around all water pipes not enclosed in walls.

 

[Tead]

I believe that drinking (alcohol) is one of those things that it is best not to attain professional-level proficiency at.

I attained that status at about the point where my drinking had hit a fifth of Jim Beam every day. I fail now to even imagine how I ever functioned that way. Ugly.
Nowadays I just hang back and chuckle at the amateurs. We have plenty of fodder for this activity locally.

I'm really not thrilled with the thought of helping to enrich the Scotts Miracle Gro monster (might as well start shopping at WalMart, FFS).

Me either. Dynamite is going to be my next slow nute purchase for exactly that reason.... tho I've not done research to see if they are Actually Scotts or not.

Assuming that AKgramma does not mind, of course.

I'll join you in that assumption and blather on.

Would you mind giving a summary of your method (composition of medium, size of container, amount of fertilizer used, how much - and how often - do you supplement with additional nutrients (and I realize this must vary by strain, so...), et cetera?

Only if you promise to garden naked once in your life. I've decided everyone should at least try it once. Don't do it during a mite infestation!

So, I can't say that I have a handle on the best dosing or placement. I'm at the point in my experimentation with it where I'm trying various options and tweaking various variables.
My last finished run with it was in a 3.5g container with 60grams of Osmocote+ distributed evenly thru the perlite.
Fed normally with 1/2tsp DynaGro Grow, 1/2tsp CaliMagic, occasional drops of Superthrived PH'd to ~6.0.

Where the winter temps get really cold, we use a lot of insulation wherever the pipes leave the walls

My home is elevated on brick piers about 4 feet off the ground. As you can imagine, this makes plumbing and electrical super-easy to get to. We insulate our pipes as well, but for different reasons. Our pipes will sweat and drip water into puddles that will then attract the termites. Our insulation is mainly a pest control measure.

The elevated home configuration can really lead to some significant frozen pipe issues on the extremely rare heavy freeze, but it sure does work out well all around for 99.999999% of the time.

 

[AKgramma]

Sweet Sue mentioned in her Journal that she is going to try a rosin press to extract good stuff from some of her buds. After doing a bit or research, I learned I could do this simply and cheaply with a flat iron and parchment paper.

The BBL is so full of resin, that I should get a good amount of extract from it.

None of the instructions, however, said how to store the product. I guess they assume one is going to smoke it right away. Do any of you know how to store it till needed, and how long t can be stored for?

 

[AKgramma]

Err... Boil some water, when it drops below 180°F set the opened bottle in it, wait for the water to cool to room temperature, remove bottle and set it (still open) on a warm shelf somewhere for a day or so? The alcohol ought to evaporate before the water content does - which would weaken the combined product, I would think.

IDK, I'm just guessing. When I was doing stuff with alcohol and cannabis together, the alcohol got "reduced" until I had a sort of hash oil type substance. I smoked that, lol.

I finally had success at making oil!

I used my small crockpot to evaporate down my Bicardi-bud tincture. On low, the crockpot heats up to 150F, and the alcohol evaporates very quickly.

My OGK bud powder must be VERY good, because I ended up with a LOT of oil, a big ole glob, about a teaspoonful from, 500 ml Bicardi 151 and 1 oz of bud powder. It took me hours to work the goo off the knife tips I was using to scrape the bottom and sides of the crockpot and trying to get it to fall into a very small black glass jar I acquired from somewhere.

I also purchased a Conair temp-adjustable, wide-bladed hair straightener and some parchment paper to try my hand at rosin production. That will have to wait till tomorrow, as it was a very long process to make the oil. I am really excited about pressing my very sticky BBL buds! I have to try tomorrow, not later, because the buds are drying in the paper bags, and they are supposed to have a bit of moisture in them for best extraction.

I guess I can dose the hash with a toothpick, rubbing it on the gums. For now, just licking my fingers of stray hash should give me an idea what to expect.

 

[AKgramma]

This morning I consolidated my 2 flower areas into one 3 x 3 ft shelving unit and shut down unit #1. I'm saving over 690 watts ( a dozen 23W CFLs, 2 Mars 300's, 2 fans) by shutting it down. Since the lights were on only 12 hours a day, but the fans were on 24/7, I can roughly calculate a savings of 350 Watts per day, which is 10.5 KW per month. Over time, that will be a chunk of change, and make for a cooler grow room.

In the 3 x 3, the two Mars 300's at 132 Watts per, eliminated six 23w CFLs, but I still like some (8) CFLs in there above and below to get full coverage. If I were to lollipop them, I would not need the lower lights. But I like getting those extra buds!

Just to demonstrate how configuration gives you more usable space, in a 2 ft x 4 ft shelving unit, I could only get 4 hempys and one soil bin (which takes up the space of 2 hempys) to fit. In the 3 x 3, I have room for 7 hempys (3 gallon trash bins) and one soil bin . One more square foot, and the unit being square, rather than rectangular, means less wasted space. Replacing the last soil bin at harvest with 2 trash bins, will give me room for 9 3gallon bins.

Enough math for now.

The mystery babies haven't shown any preflowers yet, and, as someone reported, it may take 6 weeks for them to show. They are still in their solo cups, so should stay small until I know what to do with them. They're easy to tuck into the existing pots with the big girls.

I did feed all the plants (including the babies) in bloom with Earth Juice bloom + epsom salts + molasses + superthrive once I settled them all into the 3 x 3. One gallon gave all of them a dose. I watered them to runoff first, THEN added the nutes, so there would be no hot spots in the medium.

There are only 2 clones and 9 flowering hedge rooted cuttings in veg right now, oh, and a BBL in reveg mode, I left about 2 dozen small flowers and sugar leaves on her to see if I have any luck revegging. She's tucked in the corner, where the light is subdued, and I give her only water. I don't think the flowering hedge cuttings (I forgot what they are) are going to mature enough to make a rapid switch to hibernation, so I will need to grow them indoors till next June 1st.

My first attempts at pressing gave me nice flat buds, but no rosin. And yes, I tried different temps, water drops, and two different strains. So I'll lay that aside for now. Had real good luck with the BIcardi-OGK bud tincture, tho. I got 1.72g from an ounce of bud brewed for a month in 500 ml Bicardi 151. This is the first time I got it right. Gotta start with good stuff.