We Are Past The Frost Warnings or The Lady Finally Sang The Last Song

[SmokingWings]

I noticed a lot of msg threads in September and October where someone was concerned about a warning of an overnight frost. My feelings were that most people had never paid attention to the frost warnings and the coming winter weather before this year. Now that they were growing for the first time they had concerns.

Basics: This is my stealth grow. Michigan has legal recreational growing but we do not have a privacy fence so our backyard can be viewed by the general public on two side. I went stealth to reduce the possibility of some kids seeing the plants. Also reduce the chance of someone thinking that they should let the city know or something similar. Two plants on the patio hidden from view but if I went to the cyclone fence and looked I could see what was being used to hide them. We are in southeast Michigan or the Detroit Metro area so it is a heat island. We rarely get frost here on the first 2 or 3 warnings. The plants in the stealth grow are from some 5-6 year old Papaya seeds someone gave me.

The TV and radio weather segments had warning of frost overnight for the 18th of October. It was expected to be in the upper 30s in our corner of Macomb County. Here are plants #1 and #2 and I called them
Doorwall and Window.

"Window" does have some problem being as well hidden as "Doorwall" but by this time the stretch was over.

Here is what they looked like on the other side of the Wall of Herbs and Flowers.

 

[HugePeckerhead]

Man oh man would i love to grow outside. Pennsylvania needs to get their shit together.

 

[SmokingWings]

On the 25th and 26th there was another frost scare. I looked at a detailed prediction for those nights and noticed that the temps for our area were expected to be in the mid 30s and winds were to be about 5 or 6 mph. Very hard for frost to form if it is only about 34 degrees F and a slight breeze. Needs almost dead calm for frost, even on those dead of winter cold nights in the teens. The breeze keeps the moisture in the air from freezing on surfaces.

Here are the plants on the afternoon of the 28th, two days after a couple of cool nights. They look healthy with a bit of late season yellow in the larger fan leaves. Photos are in the same order of "Doorwall" and "Window".


And now the view from the side.





Not sure of the reason but the buds or flowers on "Doorwall" seemed to develop more trichomes.



Be back in a day or so with some of the November photos.

 

[BigD13]

How many hours direct sunlight do they get each day?

 

[SmokingWings]

How many hours direct sunlight do they get each day?

Not enough.

In June & July there is direct in the morning for a little while and again in the evening for approx 3-4 hours. There is a large Maple tree shading the patio so those longer summer days mean the sun is still to the north of the east-west line so the area gets some shade from the house and the eaves. The patio is still pretty bright with light making it through the leaves. I have had only one plant, something called a Gazania that did not grow well in that area as compared to some other Gazania I have had growing in other parts of the front or back yard.

After the beginning of August the amount of direct sun starts going up noticeably. Direct morning sun will be a couple of hours and afternoon sun is easily 4+ hours and going up every day.

The whole idea was to do a stealth grow with the conditions I had. That way other growers can see that it is possible to do something outside with limited resources, in this case not having a wide open area that gets direct sun most of the day. In the fall when I saw the msgs from new growers worried about the frost warnings I though that I could push the plants to the very end and document some of what I saw happening.

 

[Bush Doctor 77]

When I grew outdoors back East, I noticed that MJ and Goldenrod have close the same ability to handle a light frost. Cool weather seems to stimulate flowering in both.

 

[Blew Hiller]

12F here this morning and Michigan is right in the path of these "Arctic pushes"

 

[Bush Doctor 77]

12F here this morning and Michigan is right in the path of these "Arctic pushes"

We had 6F a few days ago, but it was 60F yesterday.

 

[SmokingWings]

12F here this morning and Michigan is right in the path of these "Arctic pushes"

The temps will be going up through the Sunday before Thanksgiving just not as warm as is usual for this time of November.

But, the Lady finished singing and the opera is over for this year as far as an outdoor grow. The only thing I can do with the warmer temps is wait for the snow to melt so I can clean up the leaves and finish prepping my garden beds for the spring thaw.

 

[Greenlizard]

Good thread. I especially like the comment you made about how frost usually only forms when there is no breeze and the air is calm. This is absolutely true. I know this from our local farmers. Actually one of our local vineyards has a massive homemade fan out in the middle of the field. It's huge lol. Apparently the farmer adapted this technology from his home in the UK. They say towards the end of the season if there is a frost warning before he has cropped out he turns it on (gas powered) and leaves it run for the night. It creates a breeze across most of the field and frost doesn't form on his grapes. Pretty cool! If I start growing outside I have decided I would use this idea as well if it came down to it. A household fan blowing across a few outdoor plants should do just fine.
Here is a photo of a very similar setup to what I am referring to.

 

[SmokingWings]

And on those nights when there is a frost warning it will rarely form if the sky is cloudy, especially if it is cloudy in the hour or so before sunrise. Even dead of winter nights the frost will hardly ever form on car windows if it is cloudy.

Still have some photos to go through to do a timeline but neither of my patio plants were affected when the frost finally hit up against the house wall.

It creates a breeze across most of the field and frost doesn't form on his grapes.

Unless he is planning on making a specialty wine. Can't remember but I think the call it "ice wine" because it is made from grapes that have been hit hard by frost and even freezing conditions before being picked.

 

[Bush Doctor 77]

Running a sprinkler will help prevent frost damage.

 

[Greenlizard]

And on those nights when there is a frost warning it will rarely form if the sky is cloudy, especially if it is cloudy in the hour or so before sunrise. Even dead of winter nights the frost will hardly ever form on car windows if it is cloudy.

Still have some photos to go through to do a timeline but neither of my patio plants were affected when the frost finally hit up against the house wall.


Unless he is planning on making a specialty wine. Can't remember but I think the call it "ice wine" because it is made from grapes that have been hit hard by frost and even freezing conditions before being picked.

Yes, you are right. It is called "Ice Wine". We love it but it's pricey. Extra sweet!
I believe that when they let the frost hit the grapes it changes the sugars resulting in extra sweet fruit.

 

[Greenlizard]

Running a sprinkler will help prevent frost damage.

That's actually the type of frost prevention I'm used to seeing. I grew up on Prince Edward Island and it's 50% farming, and 50% Fishing. Some farmers would spray the crops prior to a drop in temp as a preventative measure.
Also from my travels to Florida I was informed by a local that they actually spray a wax on the oranges to keep them safe from frost when they get a drop in temperature.

 

[bobrown14]

12F here this morning and Michigan is right in the path of these "Arctic pushes"

Was looking at the GOES satellite - there's a huge polar vortex popped up Tuesday overnight. Makes those hurricanes in the Atlantic basin look like a thunderstorm. It's freaking huge and coming our way.

We got 6" snow upstate NY yesterday and its 13F last night and

killing frost was like 3 weeks ago. It happened pretty fast this year.

 

[Emeraldo]

Love this topic: It combines stealth needs for outdoor growing with the issue of what to do to take the edge off a sudden bite of frost. A useful discussion for growers of late-flowering sativas.

... It happened pretty fast this year.

Amen. I didn't see a frost warning, but I checked the local weather every day this season. In the last week of October, we started a sudden decline from temps in the high 60s F down into the mid- and lower 30s. The temperatures have been consistently hovering between 30 and 40 F ever since. It happens every year at some point, but some years are kinder and gentler and more gradual than others and this year was neither kind nor gentle.

I guess a fan moving the air to prevent frost is a good short-term immediate solution. For the night of a predicted frost, you need to take the edge off the biting cold. But what if you need to keep the plant alive and flowering for several more weeks? Is there a solution other than bringing her into a warmer space? Preventing frost is an immediate goal, not a long-term one for the last month of flowering.

The Arjan's Haze #1 (known to be a late-flowering strain) was already completely enclosed in a glass greenhouse on November 2 (she had been grown "outdoors" in a 3-sided plastic lean-to since mid-May wiith 9 hours of direct sun all summer long). But since the steep drop in early November, even the glass greenhouse offers no warmth on overcast days. So I installed a heater in the greenhouse for her and she is doing pretty well, even when it freezes outside it is in the mid-60s F inside. On sunny days the temperature in there rises suddenly into the low- and even mid-80s F and I try to reduce the temperature inside to a more late-flowering-friendly level around 70 F.

As seen below, AH#1 obviously needs to flower as long as she can into November. The first 2 photos, taken November 1, show she had, finally, started flowering (as late as October 1 she had no pistils). But wow what a long ways to go still.

Here the first two photos taken November 1:

IMG_1312.jpeg

• Emeraldo
• Nov 2, 2019

Arjan's Haze #1 on Nov 1

IMG_1311.jpeg

• Emeraldo
• Nov 2, 2019

Arjan's Haze #1 on Nov 1

This close-up was taken yesterday.

IMG_1380.jpeg

• Emeraldo
• Nov 16, 2019

So hey, late-flowering sativa-growers, please give me your experience: Do I have any hope of her getting ripe within 10 days or so? Has she "entered the window" in your experience? How much longer do you think she needs? Not exactly looking forward to the electric bill, but after all the effort of growing her all summer I am not giving up until I can at least sample a ripe bud of Arjan's Haze #1.

Cheers and thanks!

Emeraldo

 

[SmokingWings]

Since the 28th of October we have had daytime highs running in the mid 40s for the most part and nights are dropping down to the mid 30s. The photos below were taken the 5th of November. We can see that the Coleus in the front of the plant benches blocking the view of the doorwall are not doing well with the continuous cool or cold weather even though there has been no real frost. Other flowering annuals were dying off except for the Geraniums and the Wax Begonias. There were still some small bees, wasps and other pollinators showing up for the flowers, especially the little blue ones on the Rosemary.

Important thing is that there is no signs of distress or anything to be concerned about on the two plants hidden from public view by the plant benches. A little loss of green coloring in the leaves but by now they have been in flowering since mid August or 12 weeks. A few more leaves are definitely turning yellow and several more have fallen off. IOW, nothing to panic about.



And now the plants.....

 

[Emeraldo]

Sorry, I didn't catch it, but did you say what stage of flowering your plants are/were in just now? Were they in the last weeks of flowering?

 

[Emeraldo]

... A little loss of green coloring in the leaves but by now they have been in flowering since mid August or 12 weeks. A few more leaves are definitely turning yellow and several more have fallen off. IOW, nothing to panic about.

And now the plants.....

Ok, so I missed that part. There it is. So 12 weeks is a nice long flowering. Has the cold made the resin increase noticeably?

 

[SmokingWings]

Sorry, I didn't catch it, but did you say what stage of flowering your plants are/were in just now? Were they in the last weeks of flowering?

The plants are supposed to be Papaya and started throwing pistils between the 5th and 15th of August. These plants seemed slower than some that I experimented with last year since those were Blue Dream which started between the 5th and 10th. For all practical purposes these two plants were pretty much ready for harvesting around the 15th - 20th of October.

I noticed that a lot of new growers are new to not only to growing marijuana but growing plants in general. Some of them have never before had to pay attention to the changes in weather and what happens to plants in the fall. They have not had to know that the first frost will only kill the leaves on very tender annual and perennial. The first frosts are usually not killing frosts since some tender plants will survive and start growing new leaves.