Washington State's Marijuana Initiative: Would You Vote For It?

[420 Warrior]

Washington's I-502 is creating a maelstrom of conflict within some fringes of the cannabis community.

The measure would legalize possession of one ounce of marijuana by adults 21+, available at state-licensed stores. It doesn't allow for home grow. It doesn't change the medical marijuana law.

However, it also contains a new per se DUID provision that would make anyone guilty if they're tested at above 5ng/mL of active THC in blood. That's a level indicative of impairment and recent use for most tokers, but not a few tokers who use with great regularity. Cops would still have to meet the same strict standard they do now for taking a driver's blood.

So... would you, if you lived in Washington, vote for it, knowing that while you're ending 16,000 criminal arrests for cannabis, you're subjecting a few people to DUID convictions they'll get while not impaired? Or would you vote against it, knowing that the next shot at a legalization vote may be years away? (It was 28 years between California's last two attempts, six years between Colorado's.)

Would you vote for it, ending the unscientific, unnecessary, and unjust arrest of tens of thousands for marijuana possession? Or would you vote against it to prevent an unscientific, unnecessary, and unjust conviction of hundreds of unimpaired drivers?

Does "the good of the many outweigh the needs of the few?" Or is the protection of even one innocent driver more important than ending low-level marijuana arrests? Does the right to cannabis outrank the privilege of driving?

It's a tough question and not an easy one to answer. Dedicated activists I've known my whole career disagree on this. I am in support, because when it comes down to the bottom line, politics is war by civil means, and I cannot give aid and comfort to the enemy. I cannot cast a vote knowing I'm voting with the Drug Czar, the cops, the private prison industry, the black market weed dealers, and the Mexican Drug Gangs.

News Hawk - 420 Warrior 420 MAGAZINE
Location: Washington State
Source: Opposing Views
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Website: www.opposingviews.com

 

[budbro]

Vote for it, pass it, repeal the blood testing.

 

[CANNAJAH420]

Or Vote for it then try and raise the standards for being impaired and make proper amendments asap. I say, I would vote yes.

 

[Alaskan1]

I will be voting no,

 

[darth420]

Vote for it. We have to draw the line somewhere. The same argument could be made for people who drink. Some could probably safely drive over the limit, but we have to draw a line where it is safe for most people. I'm in Texas . . . this Washington law looks fantastic to me!

 

[budbro]

I will be voting no,

Is there any other initiative to vote for? Or are you happy the way it is now?

 

[420 Warrior]

Vote for it. We have to draw the line somewhere. The same argument could be made for people who drink. Some could probably safely drive over the limit, but we have to draw a line where it is safe for most people. I'm in Texas . . . this Washington law looks fantastic to me!

I feel you there, I'm from Georgia! ANYTHING to do with legalizing Marijuana looks fantastic to me!

 

[Jd4]

Everything was pretty well said till I see this little issue they wrote in there which I think it was just a mistake they did. Why would test the THC in Blood for tokers......please correct me if Im wrong but I do not remember something familiar to this for tobacco or am I wrong?

I mean it makes sense for liquor...1, because if you drink to much you can die from intoxication. 2, it goes with the laws for driving under the influence. However for something like cannabis that you cant even overdose...why would you limit it the thc content in the blood? makes absolutly no sense at all and again its going againts our freedom of intaking something to our bodies. Its our bodies and we choose what we put in or not and how much of it.

So to those who say yes to this, dont. Why you giving in so easily? its not just a matter of just legalizing it and just be happy with that. Would you like it it was legalized but limited to only carry and comsume only 1 gram? Sounds stupid right? well because it is.

Its like saying yeah you can have my car but im not giving you my keys...lol. Just because you want that damn car doesnt mean you will say yes I want that car but then again whats it worth if you cant have the keys to drive it?

Am I been clear to everyone here that wants this? Im serious...We already know the war on drugs is a lost war. Pointless. It is not something we have to give in return just because we want it to be over and legalized. Yes, sure legalized it and control it. Im not a big fan of that because well, that just another topic and my personal beliefs on that. I think we shouldnt be limit on things and this world is center around money..and i dont belive in that which again is another topic.

 

[Lurch Farmer]

I feel you there, I'm from Georgia! ANYTHING to do with legalizing Marijuana looks fantastic to me!

I feel ya . I am in New York. dea and us marshals came knocking on my door.
the bastereds

 

[Peter Boyle]

The driving part may be acceptable and I would probably vote for it. But my BIG issue is not being able to grow at home. Half the tokers want to be able to grow their own at home. So I guess that if the law passes those who want to grow have to get MMJ cards.

Nothing is perfect so any legalization would be a step in the right direction.

 

[budbro]

I agree, anything is better than what we have now. I'm not sure if I would continue to grow if I could go to the store and get a oz of GDP for twenty bucks though. With it legalized, prices will plummet.

 

[Metal420]

Im in Oregon and i say whatever gets us closer to legalization is cool in my book

 

[dikweed]

This is an employment scam for lawyers, courts, rehab and the rest of the system.
"But some medical-marijuana patients have recently come out opposing I-502. As we reported when I-502 was filed in June, the measure backed by prosecutors and public-health leaders is the most cogent, competent effort in US history to legalize, tax, and regulate marijuana. Certain medical pot activists, however, are complaining that I-502 doesn't allow people to grow pot at home (only buy it in stores), that it only allows adults to buy and possess one ounce of pot (patients could still have up to 24 ounces, but they say the one-ounce limit is too restrictive), and that a DUI provision is so toxic that the entire measure should be rejected. They've even launched a website called Patients Against I-502.

Edward Agazarm, one of the initiative's loudest critics promoting the aforementioned website, sent an email the other day with a subject line declaring that I-502 was "rape by cops w/guns and the ACLU."

"Rape"?

The "rape"—according to Agazarm—is that I-502 sets a per se cut-off for stoned driving. It would penalize drivers with 5 nanograms of THC per milliliter of blood with a gross misdemeanor. "That level is NOT supported by science and would subject patients to highly-invasive blood testing, unnecessary confinement and a criminal conviction that will haunt them for life," the activists' website says. They're right that the science is minimal and some people could exceed that limit if they are regular medical-marijuana users. "
Effort to Oppose the I-502 Legalization Campaign Led By... Medical-Marijuana Patients? | Slog

 

[Trommy]

I absolutely would support this bill. I think we need to vote yes for sensible bills that make Cannabis mainstream. The blood levels will be argued in court and it will force change in that way and as another commenter said be repealed.
Not supporting the bill will mean a few things. It will send a message to the rest of the states that people are not open to legalizing Cannabis. Prohibition will continue and the prohibitionists will stick a feather in their cap and say the people of Washington have rejected legalized Cannabis. People will continue to be arrested, jailed and fined for using something that is relatively safe and much less harmful than any alternative.
As a medical user myself I could just say, well I don't have anything to worry about and not support it. However politicians like to threaten the mmj laws to get more votes. They also like to threaten dispensaries and any type of distribution that patients have access to. We constantly see this in mmj states.
If Cannabis is legal and accepted the constant threats will go away and the prohibitionists will dry up because they have lost. You don't see many alcohol prohibitionist left, even though it is a much more dangerous substance. Not to mention the cartels going away much as the bootleggers and gangsters from the days of prohibition have.
This is a big step towards realizing the dream of Cannabis being completely legal in this world. Even if you don't think it is perfect it always takes that first unsteady step to begin the great journey.

 

[4/20/08]

I will be voting for this initiative

I don't like the DUI limit I self medicate for Add but I got my card for IBS

I drive better after taking a small dose and I repeat small

but I may be over there limit

also where do they take this blood
do they take me into custody then to a hospital for a sample taken by a nurse
by that time I would be completely sober and strait

so what is the use

If the cop tries to take blood from me I will flatly refuse
they are neither qualified or trained to do this type of test
so they won't be doing it on me

as for the paticeants like me nothing will change
at least that is the way I read the full text of this initiative

I think this is a step in the right direction but our fight will be far from over

I give it a

4/20/08 but you can call me 4

 

[Weed420]

I will be voting no. This intitiative was drafted with the help of a couple of the larger dispensaries in the state to try and corner the market on cannabis for a while. This intiative moves us backwards by not allowing patients to grow there own medicine and the dui section is absolutely intolerable. 5ng?lol 50ng is the state and federal standard for showing positive on a drug test. 5ng will put about 98% of the patients using cannabis in jail. Then guess what? They'll be forced to enter a drug abuse program which they will also have to pay for.
Absolutely not. This is a terrible intiative for cannabis patients. Might be good for none patients but we should make sure the patients are taken care of too.

 

[budbro]

Imho, if you are driving so poorly under the influence of any substance, be it alcohol, THC, or precription drugs, as to cause an accident or god forbid, kill someone, or deemed probable to cause an accident, then you should be held accountable under the DUI laws of your state and be removed from the road until you are able to drive safely again. It's one thing to support legalization, it is completely another to think that we should not be held accountable for our actions when we are behind the wheel of a three thousand pound killing machine. The DUI law is already in effect in Washington, for a good reason, the only thing this initiative does is to set a standard for testing. You still have to first, give them probable cause to have you arrested.

As far as growing your own, not sure why that is a big deal if you understand the economics? I don't know of a single person that grows their own tobacco, it's simply cost prohibitive when prohibition does not exist. I guess if it's your hobby, it would matter.

 

[takeiteasy]

I need someone to clear something up for me. I am a med. patient in Washington. Under the current law I am allowed to grow for myself. The op says that the new law doesn't change the current mmj laws. Then it also says that the new law doesn't allow for home growing. Those seem to be contradictory statements. One statement says the mmj laws don't change yet the other statement says that there no home growing under the new law. Which is it? My bottom line question is: does the new law make it illegal for an mmj patient in the state of Washington to grow his own pot at home?

 

[takeiteasy]

One other point. One person mentioned that they would not grow and they would buy it if the state was selling it for $20 an oz. If anyone thinks a state agency would sell pot for $20 an oz. they are kidding themselves. Multiply that $20 by at least ten and you will probably be close to the asking price. If the state is selling it for $200 an oz. then I'm growing it myself for $20 an oz.
The problem with state run monopolies is that their businesses are always run as revenue streams and when they need more money for other programs they always jack up the prices, other wise known as taxes, in order to fund their other pet projects. The price keeps going up and up and up and regulations keep piling on. Oh and one other thing. They enforce their laws to protect their monopolies with ferocity. If they want to decriminalize mj that's great. If they want decriminalize it so they can have a monopoly on the substance, which is the case here, then you will be regret they day you gave them that authority. Doesn't anyone see what's going on here? The state of Washington has enforced mj laws for many years. Now that their other revenue streams are failing, SUDDENLY, mj is fine. AS LONG AS THEY CONTROL IT! If they are getting all the money from mj, and they are also the only one who is allowed to sell it or produce it, which is called a monopoly, then it's legal. This is a classic government controlled money grab. As usual people roll over when government wants to take away their freedoms as long as government throws them a little bone. People become beggars and lose their dignity:"Oh please Mr. government man sell me some mj. Pretty please. I know I could grow it myself and have some pride and dignity in doing that but I''l gladly give up that and I'll come crawling to you and pay whatever you say as long as you don't bother me. Whatever you say Mr. government man. Yes sir. Yes sir. Whatever you say sir." Just make sure you lower your head and speak softly as you say these things.
Also keep in mind that if the state wants to get into the med. mj trade, and they will because the money available there is just too good for them to pass up, they will regulate the hell out of it and anyone currently involved in that trade now, will be eliminated.
Government control of mj should be the last thing anyone wants. Has anyone paid attention to what government has done the last 50 years? What in the world has given anyone any confidence that they will do any better with mj? For me the only thing I want from government is total decriminalization. I want government COMPLETELY out of mj.
People will think that this partial decriminalization is a step in the right direction. I'm telling you it is a step towards fiercely tight governmental control and towards even more harsh enforcement. You will regret the day you hand over mj to government.
For those of you who haven't figured out how government in the US works here is a quote from Helen Keller that sums it up perfectly:“The few own the many because they possess the means of livelihood of all ... The country is governed for the richest, for the corporations, the bankers, the land speculators, and for the exploiters of labor. The majority of mankind are working people. So long as their fair demands - the ownership and control of their livelihoods - are set at naught, we can have neither men's rights nor women's rights. The majority of mankind is ground down by industrial oppression in order that the small remnant may live in ease.”
― Helen Keller

 

[budbro]

One other point. One person mentioned that they would not grow and they would buy it if the state was selling it for $20 an oz. If anyone thinks a state agency would sell pot for $20 an oz. they are kidding themselves. Multiply that $20 by at least ten and you will probably be close to the asking price. If the state is selling it for $200 an oz. then I'm growing it myself for $20 an oz.
The problem with state run monopolies is that their businesses are always run as revenue streams and when they need more money for other programs they always jack up the prices, other wise known as taxes, in order to fund their other pet projects. The price keeps going up and up and up and regulations keep piling on.

Another reason why everyone should go read the initiative and NOT believe everything you read.
I-502 DOES NOT create a state agency, a state businesses or anything else that will sell marijuana, therefore will not control the price of marijuana. They will only regulate and tax it as they do with thousand of other products available for sale in Washington.

Perfect example, go out and try to home brew a six pack of beer and then compare your total costs to a six pack that is controlled, taxed and regulated from a liquor store. You'll figure out the economics of scale real fast, if you didn't get it before.