Strange plant

P

Phytoplankton

Well-Known Member
Member of the Month
May 2023
So I've got a nice indoor grow going, six different strains. Everyone is very happy, except one plant, it's a Chemdawg. Can't figure out what the issue is. They are all in the same FFOF soil (amended with 15% perlite and a cup of DE per pot),RH runs between 45% and 60%, same nutes, same light, at this time my PH is broken, got another on order, but all the other plants look fine. Temps around 75-80, Here's the Chemdawg, it's very light green and has a little chlorosis. Anyone want to hazard a guess? Maybe it's just a pheno, but, the mild chlorosis?
IMG_0386.jpg

Here are a couple of the others, they look great:
IMG_0388.jpg
 
Keffka said:
I agree that it may just be hungrier.. the purple veining with chlorosis says Mag to me but it could just be genetics alongside a hungrier plant
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I considered mag, but my water is loaded with Ca and Mg (about 450 ppm’s) and I feed micronutrients too. The plants are about 5-6 weeks old.
 
Phytoplankton said:
I considered mag, but my water is loaded with Ca and Mg (about 450 ppm’s) and I feed micronutrients too. The plants are about 5-6 weeks old.
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At those levels you should be more than fine.

Can you snap a few pictures from different angles and one with the whole group?

Is it possible you’ve got a lockout? How often are you giving them 450 ppm?
 
Phytoplankton said:
I considered mag, but my water is loaded with Ca and Mg (about 450 ppm’s) and I feed micronutrients too. The plants are about 5-6 weeks old.
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What's the ratio of cal to mag?
 
Phytoplankton said:
Anyone want to hazard a guess?
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I grew a Chemdawg photo outside back in 2020,- it started out pale green, and
pretty much stayed that way till the end. You may just have a pale green pheno?

It did ok, despite the paleness- the bud leaves came in a bit darker green, but everything else stayed pale green...
Chemdawg.jpeg
 
Phytoplankton said:
Here's the Chemdawg, it's very light green and has a little chlorosis. Anyone want to hazard a guess? Maybe it's just a pheno, but, the mild chlorosis?
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It could be the plant. I have had some of my clones pick up the same sort of situation with the leaf color. In the end, by harvest time, it had corrected itself.

Why one clone develops like that while other cuttings taken from the same plant at the same time and growing in the same batch of soil do not? No idea.

It is really surprising how much those purple lights will keep us from seeing the true colors. Does the leaf color look the same in white light or sunlight?
 
SmokingWings said:
It could be the plant. I have had some of my clones pick up the same sort of situation with the leaf color. In the end, by harvest time, it had corrected itself.

Why one clone develops like that while other cuttings taken from the same plant at the same time and growing in the same batch of soil do not? No idea.

It is really surprising how much those purple lights will keep us from seeing the true colors. Does the leaf color look the same in white light or sunlight?
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Yeah, I'm begining to think it's "just the plant" I have a combo of some old Bestva 2000 veg/grow lights around the edge and a big 500W HLG in the middle. The one in question is mostly under the HLG, but so are a couple of the others, and they're fine (but different strains). I did a little more research on Chemdawg, and they say they are a little picky about R/H and PH. My R/H could be a little higher.

Keffka said:
How often are you giving them 450 ppm?
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450 PPM dissolved solids is right out of the tap, before micros or nutes. It's mostly Calcium, Magnesium and Manganese, with lesser amounts of Boron. This water is actually much better than what came out of the old well, the old source averaged 1500-1700 ppm's. A couple times I measured it at over 2500 ppm's, but it never bothered the plants. It was very high in CA, Mg, Mn, and Boron, Copper, Iron, with some Arsenic thrown in for good measure. I always wanted to try coco or hydro, but it's just not an option unless I install an R/O system, which I really don't want.
 
Phytoplankton said:
Yeah, I'm begining to think it's "just the plant" I have a combo of some old Bestva 2000 veg/grow lights around the edge and a big 500W HLG in the middle. The one in question is mostly under the HLG, but so are a couple of the others, and they're fine (but different strains). I did a little more research on Chemdawg, and they say they are a little picky about R/H and PH. My R/H could be a little higher.


450 PPM dissolved solids is right out of the tap, before micros or nutes. It's mostly Calcium, Magnesium and Manganese, with lesser amounts of Boron. This water is actually much better than what came out of the old well, the old source averaged 1500-1700 ppm's. A couple times I measured it at over 2500 ppm's, but it never bothered the plants. It was very high in CA, Mg, Mn, and Boron, Copper, Iron, with some Arsenic thrown in for good measure. I always wanted to try coco or hydro, but it's just not an option unless I install an R/O system, which I really don't want.
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Alright so if everything else is the same(ish) and everyone else is doing alright, you’re likely just looking at a pheno.. As the others have said, your issue looks like the kind that will correct over time.

I would just be on the lookout for signs of a lockout (the chlorosis prevents me from telling you everything is fine no worries). If you think you’re in trouble flush it with distilled water. Honestly though it sounds like you’re all over it and have a handle on the situation.

@SmokingWings makes a good point about your light. My light constantly makes my plants look lighter than they are, it also makes my images that I take look washed out a lot. You could try just moving it into natural light or your kitchen table and seeing what it looks like to you there. I have to do this in early Veg to confirm N some times.
 
Looks like she's sensitive to too much light intensity and pH fluctuations. Move her to a corner (lower light levels) to recover. She may also have a stunted root system.
 
I vote pheno. Now the question is... is the phenotypic difference due to a genetic disposition regarding specific nutrient "processing" inside the plant, or is it simply a "normal" pale coloring? You could try top dressing with some kelp meal, to provide more iron.
 
cbdhemp808 said:
You could try top dressing with some kelp meal, to provide more iron.
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Kelp is also a great source of Potassium which is good for the overall health of the plant.

A bonus would be to mix Kelp Meal into a gallon of water and allow to sit for a half day or so. Then water using that. Shake it up so the pieces of kelp pour out and sit on the surface. And the water carries the water-soluble nutrients into the root zone. My experience is that it is a better and faster option than just top dressing.
 
SmokingWings said:
Kelp is also a great source of Potassium which is good for the overall health of the plant.

A bonus would be to mix Kelp Meal into a gallon of water and allow to sit for a half day or so. Then water using that. Shake it up so the pieces of kelp pour out and sit on the surface. And the water carries the water-soluble nutrients into the root zone. My experience is that it is a better and faster option than just top dressing.
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@Azimuth describes a Jadam version of that, HERE. I still haven't tried it!
 
cbdhemp808 said:
@Azimuth describes a Jadam version of that, HERE. I still haven't tried it!
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There is a description of the method starting with grinding up the Kelp so it is all very small pieces. Then add enough water and mix so it turns into what looks and feels like a thick paste.

Put the paste into jars and store in the coldest part of the fridge. When wanted take a tablespoon or two of the paste and mix into a gallon of water and pour it on.

I went back to the old-fashioned way where the Kelp Meal is mixed in and pour but adapted it a touch by allowing the meal and water to form a tea. Still keeping the top dressing but the Kelp is water logged so the micro-organisms will be able to jump right in and start working on any non-soluble nutrients shortly after it hits the soil surface.

All based on something someone else brought up a year or two ago.
 
Azi is describing using worm castings as the "starter" for microbes working on the kelp meal (already granular) in water, and this "fermentation" takes place at room temp. The liquid concentrate produced is cut 20:1 with pure water.
 
All of those are good methods. Giving it raw after a day or two in water leaves it pretty much in that state and then the microbes have to break it down before the plant can use it. The water based mix makes it easier to penetrate down into the soil vs a dry top dressing.

One advantage of using the microbes up front is that the material is pre-digested by them and the plant can use it sooner, which when you are trying to address a deficiency, the sooner the impact the better.

But, if you're simply doing a periodic top dressing or feeding with them, then the raw form may very well be better, assuming you have enough microbes and large enough pot.
 
Azimuth said:
Giving it raw after a day or two in water leaves it pretty much in that state and then the microbes have to break it down before the plant can use it. The water based mix makes it easier to penetrate down into the soil vs a dry top dressing.
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The Kelp Meal that I am using is from MaxiCrop and has a NPK of 1-0-2. The nitrogen and potassium are already water soluble so getting it wet and suspended in water is the best of all possible worlds. I end up with the speed of a non-organic liquid source while actually having a natural source which can often get the 'organic source' rating. Any leftover organic vegetation material can lay on the soil and the micro-organisms can be happy chewing away at that and releasing any trace or micro minerals or whatever is there.

Azimuth said:
But, if you're simply doing a periodic top dressing or feeding with them, then the raw form may very well be better, assuming you have enough microbes and large enough pot.
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Small pots can be a bump in the road so to speak. Eventually I figured that the microbes were there even in the small pots but the soil moisture levels had to be maintained or the micro-organisms went dormant.
 
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