Something is wrong

[Jungle Joseph]

Hi there fellow growers. Something is going on with my plant and I thought the best thing to do is ask the professionals before I make it worse, so here I am. It's been getting progressively worse for the last week.

I have one plant, in a 100ltr / 30 gallon fabric pot and the substrate is living organic soil. I have top dressed with dry amendments suitable for veg, and I'm watering every few days with around 5ltrs of water, sometimes more, but not too much. I've also added guano (nitrogen type) to the water sometimes. I've also used worm castings throughout. I pH the liquid going in to around 5.5-6.5
She's been vegging for around 90 days (going for a record ) and I've done a fair amount of high stress training.
Light is XS1500 Pro, and a non sponsored 140w Bar led. XS1500 is directly over the plant, it was at 20cm to the closest tip, now it's 25cm. Light is on 75%. Bar led is over an auto and it's running at 100%, so the extra light from the bar is more incidental than direct.
I prefer to use organic ingredients where possible, but I also understand that isn't always the best approach when trying to remedy a problem, so I'm open to suggestions.

Hopefully I've included enough information.

Thanks.

 

[Fenderbender]

She's starving for nutrients? as that looks like she's scrambling for all kinds of macro & micro nutrients & elements.

 

[Jungle Joseph]

Maybe some superthrive for a start?
I'll need to reconsider the dry amendments I'm using as well.
Thanks.

 

[Fenderbender]

I think you need calmag and some metals..
organically? eggshells epsom salt & seaweed?
but yeah wait for some leafreaders to chime in

 

[Azimuth]

How are your temps? The cupping on the leaves suggest heat may be an issue. Or too close to the lights.

 

[Gee64]

It looks to me like light stress. What is the PPFD at the top of the plants?

 

[stinker]

Light is XS1500 Pro, and a non sponsored 140w Bar led. XS1500 is directly over the plant, it was at 20cm to the closest tip, now it's 25cm. Light is on 75%.

I would turn the light up and feed more. Is the xs1500 pro150w? That's a good sized, full plant.

 

[Jungle Joseph]

Okay so the light was over the top intense. Over 1500ppfd. I didn't even check and I've got the app... I've just started using this new Bar led, it's got a lot of red in it. I'm growing an auto at the same time as I'm vegging, it's almost done. I've got the new led blasting the auto and didn't even think about it what a rookie mistake. I thought the auto had a deficiency as well and the whole time ive been frying my poor plants
I've raised the light to help the spread, I've dropped the xs1500 to 50% and raised the Bar led and dropped that one to 50% as well.
Ppfd is now around 500 give or take 100 in the middle and edges.

 

[Jungle Joseph]

How are your temps? The cupping on the leaves suggest heat may be an issue. Or too close to the lights.

Temperature around 25ish degrees C most of the time.
When it gets over 28c the extractor fan goes to 100%, only happens rarely.
The light was 10" away. Pretty sure that was too close.

 

[Jungle Joseph]

I would turn the light up and feed more. Is the xs1500 pro150w? That's a good sized, full plant.

Yeah that's right stinker, 150w. I think I'll definitely feed more, but I'm going to try moving the light further away for a better spread, and drop the ppfd for now and see what happens over the next few days.

 

[Fenderbender]

That might have been a bit much.. but the entire plant looks affected... and well the one next to it kinda looks like she's got yellow leaves and green veins as well so I'm not thinking it's just the light.

 

[Gee64]

Okay so the light was over the top intense. Over 1500ppfd. I didn't even check and I've got the app... I've just started using this new Bar led, it's got a lot of red in it. I'm growing an auto at the same time as I'm vegging, it's almost done. I've got the new led blasting the auto and didn't even think about it what a rookie mistake. I thought the auto had a deficiency as well and the whole time ive been frying my poor plants
I've raised the light to help the spread, I've dropped the xs1500 to 50% and raised the Bar led and dropped that one to 50% as well.
Ppfd is now around 500 give or take 100 in the middle and edges.

I only grow photo period sativas, so I can't speak for autos or Indicas, but when my PPFD goes over 900-950 in flower I always see stress starting. Veg requires less light than that. I find 450-500 is a really happy zone.

In veg you want the roots to fill out before the canopy does. Also if you insist on running the light right at the max you need to really understand and apply VPD properly or you will get bit sooner or later.

Too much light mimics starvations because the leaves literally photosynthesize faster than the roots can handle the inputs.

Good on you for asking for help.

Hopefully she recovers and the new growth greens up.

 

[Jungle Joseph]

Just wanted to add, the reason I had the light as close as it was, is because the strain I'm growing is Purple Ghost Candy. This strain is very 'stretchy' and I'm trying to keep her low, and train her wide, while I veg her for as long as possible... it's a difficult task. As soon as the auto is done I can concentrate my setup on this one plant and flip to flower. A lesson learnt. I should have been concerned with the original plant and not tried to grow an auto at the same time.

 

[Fenderbender]

You can keep it close just dim it to appropriate levels, although best maybe to pull back for now and relax them a bit.

 

[Jungle Joseph]

That might have been a bit much.. but the entire plant looks affected... and well the one next to it kinda looks like she's got yellow leaves and green veins as well so I'm not thinking it's just the light.

Yeah I think it is a combination of too much light and hungry plants. I'm looking for something right now that I can feed with until the end of this grow. After that I'll start out with fresh soil.

 

[Gee64]

Start with adjusting the light and watch the new growth. It will take a couple or 3 nodes to grow the damage out, but if it returns to health then your soil is good.

One step at a time will give you a clearer path.

 

[Jungle Joseph]

I only grow photo period sativas, so I can't speak for autos or Indicas, but when my PPFD goes over 900-950 in flower I always see stress starting. Veg requires less light than that. I find 450-500 is a really happy zone.

In veg you want the roots to fill out before the canopy does. Also if you insist on running the light right at the max you need to really understand and apply VPD properly or you will get bit sooner or later.

Too much light mimics starvations because the leaves literally photosynthesize faster than the roots can handle the inputs.

Good on you for asking for help.

Hopefully she recovers and the new growth greens up.

Thanks G, it's awesome that I can ask for support and plenty of people are ready to help. That's why I love 420 magazine.
I'm trying to run before I can walk...

 

[Gee64]

Just wanted to add, the reason I had the light as close as it was, is because the strain I'm growing is Purple Ghost Candy. This strain is very 'stretchy' and I'm trying to keep her low, and train her wide, while I veg her for as long as possible... it's a difficult task. As soon as the auto is done I can concentrate my setup on this one plant and flip to flower. A lesson learnt. I should have been concerned with the original plant and not tried to grow an auto at the same time.

lololol Sativa Syndrome. Too tall plants Welcome to my nightmare. Here is how I have overcome it (somewhat).

Start with training in a manifold/mainline technique. The 3 or 4 toppings cause 3 or 4 4-day stalls, so that buys you time while the roots still grow, and after you sprout go straight to flower soil on your 1st uppotting.

Veg soil promotes foliage and height, flower soil does too but really promotes exudates which grow excellent roots. The plant uses energy on roots so the canopy and height slow down.

Sativas from seed are very challenging and from what I have seen PGC acts very sativa-like.

Keeping humidity at 60% and above will slow the veg cycle too. Just have a good canopy fan blowing gently over the canopy and a 2nd stationary fan on the floor circulating underneath if mold and mildew effects your region.

 

[Jungle Joseph]

Start with adjusting the light and watch the new growth. It will take a couple or 3 nodes to grow the damage out, but if it returns to health then your soil is good.

One step at a time will give you a clearer path.

Yeah I'm pretty sure it's the light, but you're right about one thing at a time. I still think she's a bit hungry but we'll start with the light.

 

[Gee64]

Yeah I'm pretty sure it's the light, but you're right about one thing at a time. I still think she's a bit hungry but we'll start with the light.

Just remember, too much light mimics starvation. I would start with that. It could be soil too but a 30 gallon pot rarely runs empty.

The plant is damaged so science has value now, turn it into a learning experience for the next grow.

Patience is key. Get the light correct and see what she tells you next.

If you grow it out to the point that all these leaves get covered by a nice new green canopy she will still flower beautifully, and you get to learn along the way.

Mistakes are opportunities to a lifetime of better grows