Seed Banks & Genetics

[Sudbury Ontario Grower]

I'm wondering how many seed banks actually sell you what they claim to be... I'd really like to buy true genetics with confidence but there's many banks out there that seem to have no information about themselves & it just seems suspect. I also think they buy & re-sell seeds as their own but again there's absolutely no information about that either. You would think that a seed bank would be proud of displaying their gardens & making youtube videos about their unparalleled processes & quality but there's literally none of that. Has anyone ever researched seed banks? Are we all growing believe to be genetics? how do we know for sure?

Does anyone have a seed bank they use with 100% confidence and how are you so sure? Is there a good source of information about the breeder, their history, integrity & legitimacy?

 

[Bobthe420Builder]

Most the sponsors here are very reliable

In my experience, if the breeder isn't discussed at the seedbank your looking at, then it's a crapshoot at best

Research what your looking for and you will find real genetics

 

[Sudbury Ontario Grower]

Most the sponsors here are very reliable

In my experience, if the breeder isn't discussed at the seedbank your looking at, then it's a crapshoot at best

Research what your looking for and you will find real genetics

Research is what i'm trying to do, thats why i'm on here shooting questions. I'm looking for pure as possible land races.

-World of seeds has a ton but i can't find in-depth information on them so i'm not sure they're legit
-SensiSeed has "Afghani #1" which is probably the most trust-worthy...

Any suggestions?

 

[Bobthe420Builder]

Ace has great strains

 

[Kodiak420]

Hey @Sudbury Ontario Grower great question....

I would believe that the countries that have had legal seed
/cannabis production would best bet?
Like Dutch, even us Canada, but more so the Dutch were weed has been legal since the 80's .

I might look for seeds/strains that win in the different cannabis cup competitions, genetics and producers are proven, usually were it can be. Whether they are land races, probably not, maybe odd one

But you are right it is hard to get proper info on the seed producers. I bought within our country this year to try out. There's a lot of good and bad reviews out there about them, they use to be a sponsor here. But not any more.

But lets face it, I doubt there is much of a vetting process for sponsor's except whether their payment goes through or not.

A lot of land races are a thing of the past, so much "war on drugs" tactics across the world for 50 years, seen a lot of counties totally eradicate cannabis, that otherwise would usually grow wild.

Great question tho, I ask my self it at lest once a year when it is time to buy seeds.

 

[Pepperhead]

Seedsman sells landrace
Just google landrace strains and you will find a good couple of articles
These will show the top 25 or so and the links to buy the seed link to seedsman
You will then find out About the breeders that grow and produce the seeds
Cannabiogen and ace seeds run some landrace strains which r sold by seedsman
For a good indica try chitral kush

 

[TurboBucket]

Well most seedbanks after technically operating illegally in one form or another, much less the commercial sized grows that their using to produce seeds. Yes some of it is legal but there's a lot that's not. Even the legal Dutch companies aren't supposed to ship to all the places they do. In the states we can't legally move them from one legal state to another.
It's much safer for them to stay out of the public eye than it is for them to broadcast their inner workings and end up criminally prosecuted for it. The best up to date info on growers sadly comes from social media, it's easier for them to maintain some degree of anonymity while interacting with customers.

The best banks have happy customers that are happy to share that experience with you. I've had very good interactions with @SeedsMan @Dutch Seeds Shop and Dope seeds as well. All of which are forum sponsors and have plenty of happy customers. Ace seeds and green house genetics both so a lot of work traveling the world to collect and preserve actual landrace genetics and heirloom strains.

After enough problems even their sponsorship checks aren't enough for the admin to let them stay around. That's why that three letter company isn't here anymore.


You can worry about the true name or you can buy what looks good from the info you got and grow it out to see. That's the only 100% way to know what you've got. Even then you'll never know if that's exactly what you think it is, well maybe once they make more DNA sequences available we could send samples in for comparison.

 

[Kodiak420]

After enough problems even their sponsorship checks aren't enough for the admin to let them stay around. That's why that three letter company isn't here anymore.

Sure I will take your word for it. And I dont care as to why anyways, I'm a cynic so I have my suspicions.

Living in a country were it is legal now, and seeds have always been legal. We have tons of great seed banks, that have been around for decades.

It's much safer for them to stay out of the public eye than it is for them to broadcast their inner workings and end up criminally prosecuted for it.

Exactly why I also will not order from other countries, no point, and actually illegal . Why temp border agencies..

The best up to date info on growers sadly comes from social media, it's easier for them to maintain some degree of anonymity while interacting with customers.

Beyond description horrible why to do business, especially illegal one like you said. Not to mention thousands of other security issues with that.


But back to @Sudbury Ontario Grower comments/questions

I'm wondering how many seed banks actually sell you what they claim to be

Still a good question.


And you hit on the head

You can worry about the true name or you can buy what looks good from the info you got and grow it out to see. That's the only 100% way to know what you've got. Even then you'll never know if that's exactly what you think it is, well maybe once they make more DNA sequences available we could send samples in for comparison

 

[Jackalope]

Seed banks only need to take care of shipping and costumer service! They are not responsible for what breeders are claiming. Unless they sell their own seeds. Then they are responsible for their claims on those seeds only.

It is the breeders that need to stand by their claims. Very few do and will. You have to do lots of testing to see which companies are for real. Since legalization tons of new breeders have popped up making those choices harder.

In the end. Most strains out there are F-1 hybrids where lots can happen. F-1 hybrids from 2 non-stable strains are going to have a wider window of what can happen.

 

[TorturedSoul]

Does anyone have a seed bank they use with 100% confidence and how are you so sure?

I trust Sensi Seeds, Serious Seeds, and Mr. Nice Seeds. And whichever seed seller offers them in their original sealed packaging, lol. I figure Ace Seeds is okay, too. Others, more or less. I have been treated well by (in no particular order) the sellers The Vault, Gorilla Seeds, Seedsman, Attitude, and a couple that no longer exist.

I tend to look at such things as flowering times, yield per unit of area, etc. as "in theory" / optimistic. If, for no other reason, because there are many factors at play in regards to them. I prefer to see lab test results - if at all possible, images of the actual reports. But even then, I assume that the breeder didn't just grab one random bud and pay for one test. I don't look at those lab results as being theoretical maximums like the other stuff (hey, you might end up producing something even stronger), but I definitely figure that "YMMV" applies.

I prefer the original breeder's strain over another's version / copy / imitation / knockoff / seeds produced from selfing one of the plants grown from a pack of the original breeder's seeds / etc.

I like breeders that have a small "stable" of strains (or at least relatively so), and who only produce new ones occasionally, with time passing between releases. Anyone can take two strains and do a little pollen-chucking. And end up with thousands of seeds for not much more than the cost of the two parents. Why pay someone $20/seed - or even $2/seed for doing so, lol? If/when a breeder grows out many plants, selects multiple sets (and combinations) of parents - because how do you know that all the potential qualities are directly observable? - and uses them to produce many seeds, growing them out, testing the bud, measuring the yield, observing everything that's observable, et cetera. Rinse/lather/repeat, as they say, until the breeder ends up with something that's at least relatively stable. Isn't "all over the map," so to speak and, if it has multiple phenotypes, they're at least known and there's some idea about the frequency of each. Etc. THAT'S worth money, IMHO. Which is one of the reasons I'll mentally shake my head when someone complains that a pack of seeds sells for $136.50 or whatever. Another reason being that the pack is capable of producing thousands of clones, thousands of seeds, and a whole lot of bud, if the gardener so desires.

I shy away from businesses that offer 100 different "house brand" strains, especially if/when that's all they sell. I ended up turning down paid work for one of them last year. The guy privately told me that they self plants of other breeders' strains and that's how they produce all their seeds. Also told me that, if there was something I wanted that they weren't already producing, to let him know and he'd have it in a few months. Try that kind of thing in just about any other industry and you'd probably go to jail, or at least get sued.

Other than that, do a lot of web-searches and reading. I read - I think it was some time last year - about a business that was caught trying to convince people to... well, the phrase "make inaccurate statements" comes to mind. I think it was on that autoflowering forum, but can't swear to it. If a business will be dishonest in that way, then I'm not going to trust its strain descriptions (or the reviews on its website). One thing I hate about Amazon (the business, not the river) is that it's full of people selling garbage - all of which seems to have mostly great reviews. Once in a while, if your search skills are good and you do a lot of reading, you'll discover that someone pays - often with more junk products - reviewers to write good reviews. If Bezos got fined a few million dollars and had to spend a month in prison for every bit of fraud that he facilitates via his magical money tree website, the SOB wouldn't be anywhere near as wealthy as he is - and he'd die in lockup. About the only real good in that man is that he really annoys the Big Orange Head, IMHO.