Nute or Light Problem?

[Knowmadic]

Strain - Cheese (Indoors)
Soil - Just Natural Organic Potting Mix (NPK = 6-9-6 & 0.048% slow release of Nitrogen)
Temp - 81-82F Average, 86F Max, 63F Low
Humidity - 43-46% Average, 62% Max, 34% Min
Water Schedule - Approximately every 4-5 days
Light Schedule - 18-6 (~3-3.5 weeks old)
-Apollo GL60LED (180w(90w actual) & 6 Band: 430nm, 475nm, 620nm, 630nm, 660nm & 730nm)
- Approximately 21" above the tops of the plants

I have absolutely no clue what is happening to these two seedlings. The tips appear to be black and then that darkness slowly spread and turned a weird black / purple. Some leaves however turned brown / black and were crispy. Both plants appear extremely weak and are leaning over. This started on the lower leaves and the newer leaves look the best. Stem is purple from the cotyledons up. My current guess is nitrification due to the slow release in the soil..


They were growing fantastically for the first 2.5 weeks then around 3 slowed down and over last 5 days things have turned disastrous and I predict imminent death. I originally thought it might be light burn, although I didn't think it should be, so I moved the light 4" away making the total distance 25". My next thought and what I believe to likely be the culprit is the soil.. I chose the cheapest I could find because this was just for fun however I think that might have come back to bite me in the ass. Any and all help would be appreciated.


Seedling #1 -

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Seedling #2 -

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[TanR]

Hi Knowmadic,

Welcome to the 420 Magazine community of members!

I confess this is something of a guess, but I think you are correct that it is the soil. I'm curious why they did so well the first couple of weeks, but I've seen something similar happen to bedding plants in my yard if I push the pine bark back too close to the stems. Your soil looks to be very heavy on the bark and that is what leads to my suspicion of your soil.

I hope you won't take this as an insulting question, but your containers do have holes in them - correct?

Be well and happy growing!

 

[Major PITA]

That soil looks odd. I've never used it.
My guess is, it was over watered until it drowned. Either that or the soil is...terrible. I don't like any nutrients in the starting soil mix.

 

[Knowmadic]

Hi Knowmadic,

Welcome to the 420 Magazine community of members!

I confess this is something of a guess, but I think you are correct that it is the soil. I'm curious why they did so well the first couple of weeks, but I've seen something similar happen to bedding plants in my yard if I push the pine bark back too close to the stems. Your soil looks to be very heavy on the bark and that is what leads to my suspicion of your soil.

I hope you won't take this as an insulting question, but your containers do have holes in them - correct?

Be well and happy growing!

No offense at all, I came here for help after all! Yes, both containers have holes in the bottom with a layer of perlite on the bottom so it doesn't pool. My confusion also stems from the initial flourishing and then the sudden death. That is why I tried adjusting the light.. Everything is pointing to this soil being kinda terrible and the time release probably was the nail in the coffin.

That soil looks odd. I've never used it.
My guess is, it was over watered until it drowned. Either that or the soil is...terrible. I don't like any nutrients in the starting soil mix.

You're most likely correct. I think it is a mixture of the water retention of the soil, coupled with the slow nutrient release. First 2 inches appear dry while lower half seems to still be retaining water. Would you see these plants are pretty much goners?

In the past I've used FFOF with great success, I just decided to be cheap with these since they were bag seed. One other question that I had was why are there tiny little gnats buzzing around? Not many, maybe 3-4, but this happened with the FFOF as well. What are these and are they of any concern?


EDIT: Just checked out the perlite I used and it's Miracle Gro, meaning it has nutes.. in the perlite.. with a NPK of .07-.07-.07, could this be a problem?

 

[Major PITA]

It depends on what the gnats really are. AFAIK, gnats are not a big deal. On the other hand, root aphids, or other pests, are a BIG deal.
The nutrients could be the problem, but if the bottom of the soil is staying moist, that is a problem, too.
Most time released nutrients are very heat sensitive. Your cups are small and the temperatures to the high side. It could be those time released nute's were released way too fast. Dunno.

 

[Knowmadic]

It depends on what the gnats really are. AFAIK, gnats are not a big deal. On the other hand, root aphids, or other pests, are a BIG deal.
The nutrients could be the problem, but if the bottom of the soil is staying moist, that is a problem, too.
Most time released nutrients are very heat sensitive. Your cups are small and the temperatures to the high side. It could be those time released nute's were released way too fast. Dunno.

They appear to be fungus gnats after further research. Easy to get rid of. I currently just flushed this new bag of perlite 3 times and am baking in the oven to dry off / burn the time release nutes. Got my real seeds here now so will be mixing 25% perlite with 75% FFOF. Hopefully the soil was the problem not the light or anything else.

 

[Major PITA]

They appear to be fungus gnats after further research. Easy to get rid of. I currently just flushed this new bag of perlite 3 times and am baking in the oven to dry off / burn the time release nutes. Got my real seeds here now so will be mixing 25% perlite with 75% FFOF. Hopefully the soil was the problem not the light or anything else.

i don't think it is light related.
You might start seeds in something w/o the fertilizer and up-pot to FFOF after the initial two week germination/seedling phase.

 

[Knowmadic]

i don't think it is light related.
You might start seeds in something w/o the fertilizer and up-pot to FFOF after the initial two week germination/seedling phase.

I'm using a space bucket and most people seem to just plant straight into the bucket, it has worked well in the past. These two seedlings were in solo cups, not the standard space bucket. I might try cutting the cup in half to match the level of soil in the bucket and then transplant that way.