hey hey, I was reading luckiestman13's grow journal and was inspired by it and my brain to respond. it got so long winded that I decicded to start a new thread with my response instead, out of respect for another growers journal. hence the title "unplugged" from his journal basically. lol
here's what I've got so far leaching from my brain having read the debate going on his journal.
love the light debate going on here. it piques a few thoughts in my head. as in the last 2 months, I have run a nanocube 1000w hps, just bought a sunsystems lec 315 light, and a week later or so I won the potm giving me the mars II 1200w led.
now, that being listed.
lumen output, I don't have a meter so I cant say officially, but definitely the hps or mh win by far.
heat in room. this is the part that really interested me here. from what I have found so far with all 3.
one tower fan oscillating in the 4x8 tent.
6" maxfan and filter exhausting.
lightrail lightmover added.
1k hps or mh was the easiest to work with as far as heat output. I do have a vented hood, but once I added the light mover it was disconnected with very little discernible difference in temps. would prefer it on for peace of mind but it didn't hurt me. my 1k was running about 6 inches over the very happy tops.
sunsystems lec 315, runs hotter than advertised definitely. the light output looks great in a 4 foot wide tent. so on the mover, I am confident it would do well as to footprint. but the heat output is very close to that of the 1k hps/mh. love the lower wattage, as I could run 3 of them in place of the one 1k. that was a major factor in buying it as a test. I have lack of power issues here.
mars II 1200 w at about 16" from the tops is hard to keep below 86 degrees. I fear a problem with this light. definitely will need to run my ac for this one. ac is in wall in room 2 feet from the tent. works very well for maintaining temps in the tent. but I have already needed to turn it on this year, whereas in the past, using 1k hps/mh, I did not need it til june. so, the led is using ac plus tower fan plus exhaust fan. where 1k hid did not yet this time last year or the year before.
im not a pro. at all.
what I say just comes from what I have seen or done.
what do I know of led's making it taste better? nothing. but it sure does look pretty lol. does that mean anything? no. I haven't finished anything with it yet, so there is no results from it. won't be either likely. the strain I am growing now is new to me as is the fact that it is an auto fem. so nothing to compare to. I can say it is quite blinding running both growth and bloom on it lol.
I believe from what I have done so far in testing these 2 new lights, that I would have a much easier time dealing with the heat output of my 1k light than either the lec 315 or the 1200w led.
running cost? in my setup, 4x8 tent, 6" maxfan exhaust, tower fan keeping it moving, light mover, ac(very small unit) as needed.
from seeing the light output of the lec 315, I believe would be the cheapest to run. may or may not produce as heavy, but with the lower draw I could add one more still, but less wattage than my 1k hid, and less than a hundred watts more than the led uses.
led, no clue as to how it will produce either, but I have seen others grows and am impressed. but thinking about that, everyone seems very quick to supplement with side lighting or even more top lighting. so with that in mind, is there a dollar saving using led's? I don't see it. are they cooler? absolutely not. at 18" in the first 24 hours, the tops were at 95 degrees, so on went the ac unit. not acceptable. don't know how it will work at the high of summer. this cooked new seedlings of my autos, I lost the first 4 plants of my current grow. (journal coming soon) and with needing the ac so soon, the cost is likely over that of using the 1k hid.
1k hid. easy to use. easy to cool. I run it 6" from the tops in my setup with no issue without the cooltube hooked up. with it I love it even more. cost is much higher than the lec 315. 3x plus the cost. i'm going to say equal to or less than the led considering the ac unit needs of that. not to say I wouldn't be using the ac with hid. I would, but not as soon. so that says led is more needy of it.
so, the light output award goes to 1k hid. the cost award goes to lec 315. I guess the pretty award goes to led.
what it boils down to I guess, is what matters most to each individual grower. not so much their reason for growing, as their beliefs of what works best for them. we all want as large a harvest as we can get from our setups. commercial, hobbyist, med grower, doesn't matter what title you give yourself. we want more!!! its called human nature. some want better and are willing to forfeit quantity for quality. as they see it. but they still want as much as they can get, hence adding all the extra lights to led which supposedly produces superior bud. the extra lights are not for better bud, they are for more bud. sorry, denser does not always equal better. it does always equal more.
the next thought for the calculator laden ocd grower.
everyone talks about grams per watt. that's all fine n good. but it is faulted.
it should be grams per kwh used. aaahhhhhh see, now that also hit my brain reading luckiestmans' journal. the debate there was also leaning towards the gr/w discussion.
all of those calculations are for naught if you push an extra 4 months in veg to attain a monster.
hence the need for a calculation of ACTUAL used kwh's.
with an actual kwh usage added up for all of the equiptment, one could then go to their power bill and get the cost per kwh and come up with an actual cost of the grow.
ie: I could say, hey man I grew 3 pounds of primo stuff under one 400 watt hid it was freakin awesome dude!!!
that's an extreme version of the brag I get it. but you know what I mean. but at that 3.36 g/w is awesome!!
what other wattage was used though?
fans? how many what wattage and how many hours do they each run?
lights? again how many what wattage how many hours?
ac units?
chillers?
timers? yes they do use power.
any pumps, air or water?
do you have a well? theres another pump being used for the grow.
trimmers if used?
auxillary lighting? such as trimming lights, general room lighting that wouldn't be used for anything else?
hot water for cleaning? from res's to measuring devices it all uses power.
extra heaters if needed in the winter?
it all adds up. so the real question if someone wants to compare should be: how many grams per kwh used did I get?
holy crap this has spun out of control. it was half written as a reply, so I am glad I moved it.
mods: delete if you feel it holds no merit for discussion.
it can go a lot farther if one wants to calculate actual cost per gram of your awesome stuff.
but I digress. it was supposed to be about lighting and power, and so far it is.
like it, hate it, I don't care. because I care.
unforgiven
here's what I've got so far leaching from my brain having read the debate going on his journal.
love the light debate going on here. it piques a few thoughts in my head. as in the last 2 months, I have run a nanocube 1000w hps, just bought a sunsystems lec 315 light, and a week later or so I won the potm giving me the mars II 1200w led.
now, that being listed.
lumen output, I don't have a meter so I cant say officially, but definitely the hps or mh win by far.
heat in room. this is the part that really interested me here. from what I have found so far with all 3.
one tower fan oscillating in the 4x8 tent.
6" maxfan and filter exhausting.
lightrail lightmover added.
1k hps or mh was the easiest to work with as far as heat output. I do have a vented hood, but once I added the light mover it was disconnected with very little discernible difference in temps. would prefer it on for peace of mind but it didn't hurt me. my 1k was running about 6 inches over the very happy tops.
sunsystems lec 315, runs hotter than advertised definitely. the light output looks great in a 4 foot wide tent. so on the mover, I am confident it would do well as to footprint. but the heat output is very close to that of the 1k hps/mh. love the lower wattage, as I could run 3 of them in place of the one 1k. that was a major factor in buying it as a test. I have lack of power issues here.
mars II 1200 w at about 16" from the tops is hard to keep below 86 degrees. I fear a problem with this light. definitely will need to run my ac for this one. ac is in wall in room 2 feet from the tent. works very well for maintaining temps in the tent. but I have already needed to turn it on this year, whereas in the past, using 1k hps/mh, I did not need it til june. so, the led is using ac plus tower fan plus exhaust fan. where 1k hid did not yet this time last year or the year before.
im not a pro. at all.
what I say just comes from what I have seen or done.
what do I know of led's making it taste better? nothing. but it sure does look pretty lol. does that mean anything? no. I haven't finished anything with it yet, so there is no results from it. won't be either likely. the strain I am growing now is new to me as is the fact that it is an auto fem. so nothing to compare to. I can say it is quite blinding running both growth and bloom on it lol.
I believe from what I have done so far in testing these 2 new lights, that I would have a much easier time dealing with the heat output of my 1k light than either the lec 315 or the 1200w led.
running cost? in my setup, 4x8 tent, 6" maxfan exhaust, tower fan keeping it moving, light mover, ac(very small unit) as needed.
from seeing the light output of the lec 315, I believe would be the cheapest to run. may or may not produce as heavy, but with the lower draw I could add one more still, but less wattage than my 1k hid, and less than a hundred watts more than the led uses.
led, no clue as to how it will produce either, but I have seen others grows and am impressed. but thinking about that, everyone seems very quick to supplement with side lighting or even more top lighting. so with that in mind, is there a dollar saving using led's? I don't see it. are they cooler? absolutely not. at 18" in the first 24 hours, the tops were at 95 degrees, so on went the ac unit. not acceptable. don't know how it will work at the high of summer. this cooked new seedlings of my autos, I lost the first 4 plants of my current grow. (journal coming soon) and with needing the ac so soon, the cost is likely over that of using the 1k hid.
1k hid. easy to use. easy to cool. I run it 6" from the tops in my setup with no issue without the cooltube hooked up. with it I love it even more. cost is much higher than the lec 315. 3x plus the cost. i'm going to say equal to or less than the led considering the ac unit needs of that. not to say I wouldn't be using the ac with hid. I would, but not as soon. so that says led is more needy of it.
so, the light output award goes to 1k hid. the cost award goes to lec 315. I guess the pretty award goes to led.
what it boils down to I guess, is what matters most to each individual grower. not so much their reason for growing, as their beliefs of what works best for them. we all want as large a harvest as we can get from our setups. commercial, hobbyist, med grower, doesn't matter what title you give yourself. we want more!!! its called human nature. some want better and are willing to forfeit quantity for quality. as they see it. but they still want as much as they can get, hence adding all the extra lights to led which supposedly produces superior bud. the extra lights are not for better bud, they are for more bud. sorry, denser does not always equal better. it does always equal more.
the next thought for the calculator laden ocd grower.
everyone talks about grams per watt. that's all fine n good. but it is faulted.
it should be grams per kwh used. aaahhhhhh see, now that also hit my brain reading luckiestmans' journal. the debate there was also leaning towards the gr/w discussion.
all of those calculations are for naught if you push an extra 4 months in veg to attain a monster.
hence the need for a calculation of ACTUAL used kwh's.
with an actual kwh usage added up for all of the equiptment, one could then go to their power bill and get the cost per kwh and come up with an actual cost of the grow.
ie: I could say, hey man I grew 3 pounds of primo stuff under one 400 watt hid it was freakin awesome dude!!!
that's an extreme version of the brag I get it. but you know what I mean. but at that 3.36 g/w is awesome!!
what other wattage was used though?
fans? how many what wattage and how many hours do they each run?
lights? again how many what wattage how many hours?
ac units?
chillers?
timers? yes they do use power.
any pumps, air or water?
do you have a well? theres another pump being used for the grow.
trimmers if used?
auxillary lighting? such as trimming lights, general room lighting that wouldn't be used for anything else?
hot water for cleaning? from res's to measuring devices it all uses power.
extra heaters if needed in the winter?
it all adds up. so the real question if someone wants to compare should be: how many grams per kwh used did I get?
holy crap this has spun out of control. it was half written as a reply, so I am glad I moved it.
mods: delete if you feel it holds no merit for discussion.
it can go a lot farther if one wants to calculate actual cost per gram of your awesome stuff.
but I digress. it was supposed to be about lighting and power, and so far it is.
like it, hate it, I don't care. because I care.
unforgiven
Einstein's paid quackery pales in contrast to real scientists like Tesla