LED Grow - Is Cal + Mag really needed?

[IndyRacerNick]

I was speaking with another member on their journal earlier today. They said they just received their Cal + Mag nutrients. Someone then chimed in saying it is pretty much mandatory to use Cal + Mag when using LED lights.

I have been reading for months before I started my grow and I don't know how I missed this one but I had NO clue I was going to need this nutrient system. I then did some reading and seems to be more of a hydroponics thing or coco rather than soil.

I rather not spend any more money if I dont have to, but I will fill you in on what I have happening in my room

2 Plants in 5 gallon buckets
Soil Based (Fox Farms Ocean Forest Potting Mix)
240W LED Mars Hydro Reflector

Nutrient system that I will be using is Advanced Nutrients pH Perfect (Micro, Grow, Bloom)

You can also check out my grow journal (URL in my signature) to get a better idea of what I have happening.

I don't feel it is necessary where FFOF soil has a bunch of nutrients added, but who am I to say, this is my 1st grow.

Any tips or help would be awesome!

Again, check out my journal in the URL to get more details on setup if it helps answer this question.

Thanks!

 

[Scientific]

it is pretty much mandatory to use Cal + Mag when using LED lights.

I cannot think of any reason why Ca / Mg supplementation would be more or less important under different light sources. That sounds like utter voodoo.

seems to be more of a hydroponics thing or coco rather than soil.

If you are using reverse osmosis water, which is mineral free, or if you live in an area like I do where the water is so soft as to be essentially mineral-free (28 PPM), it is my understanding that it is a good idea to supplement hydroponic nutrients with extra Ca and Mg. I do.

Soil Based (Fox Farms Ocean Forest Potting Mix)
Nutrient system that I will be using is Advanced Nutrients pH Perfect (Micro, Grow, Bloom)

So premium soil with premium fertilizer. I'm not a soil grower, but I would think that those two alone would be enough. If your local water contributes some minerals (i.e. your water is not super soft like mine), that is likely a third source of Ca and Mg and I would expect you would be tripley covered.

My guess is that you will be just fine without supplementing Ca & Mg. Soil growing gurus, what say you?

 

[IndyRacerNick]

I cannot think of any reason why Ca / Mg supplementation would be more or less important under different light sources. That sounds like utter voodoo.



If you are using reverse osmosis water, which is mineral free, or if you live in an area like I do where the water is so soft as to be essentially mineral free (28 PPM), it is my understanding that it is a good idea to supplement hydroponic nutrients with extra Ca and Mg. I do.



So premium soil with premium fertilizer. I'm not a soil grower, but I would think that those two alone would be enough. If your local water contributes some minerals (i.e. your water is not super soft like mine), that is likely a third source of Ca and Mg and I would expect you would be tripley covered.

Soil growing gurus, what say you?

If you search you will see the Calmag and LED lights as I was talking about.

Anyways...the Water I have is the best drinking water you can find, one of the best in my Country, and I still don't use that. I buy 4L jugs of ozonated water that I use, runs me like 0.50 per 4L bottle, distilled purified and left to sit 48+ hours before use and has a pH level of 6.3-6.6

I decided to take the easy way out...I called Advanced Nutrients about 20 minutes ago, I told them the story. With the soil I have and the 3 part pH perfect feedings I will be giving in a few weeks they said I will NOT need to use any calmag ferts. This is coming from a company who also sells Calmag, but if using their 3 part advanced nutrient pH perfect technology I will not need to add any Calmag, and they said where I am using Fox Farms Ocean Forest that it will be enough to provide proper nutes until I am ready to start feeding my autos.

Thanks for the reply, still interesting topic why its suggested to use Calmag for LED grows, never heard it before and was giving me a headache from reading all day, now I gotta get high to get rid of that headache!

Thanks Scientific

 

[Giorkos1]

So just to make it sure,
In case we are using LEDs, we don't have to provide cl-mg unless needed.

 

[Giorkos1]

Right?

 

[IndyRacerNick]

So just to make it sure,
In case we are using LEDs, we don't have to provide cl-mg unless needed.

It would be based off of how you are growing and what you are feeding.

I am seeing more cl-mg needed when growing with coco. When growing with a rich soil like I am using you wont need it for the first few weeks. Then if you are feeding nutrients after the first few weeks (Like the Advanced Nutrients pH perfect that I am using) you won't need it either.

I guess it all comes down to what medium you are growing in and what you plan on feeding your plants later

 

[Scientific]

If you search you will see the Calmag and LED lights as I was talking about.

I think it's voodoo coming out of fear/misunderstanding of a new technology. I call bullshit. I'm reminded of reading how in the early days of electricity people thought that if you didn't keep a light bulb in an empty socket, electricity could leak out.

the Water I have is the best drinking water you can find, one of the best in my Country, and I still don't use that. I buy 4L jugs of ozonated water that I use, runs me like 0.50 per 4L bottle, distilled purified and left to sit 48+ hours before use

I think you're wasting your time and your money, but you have lots of company, and if it makes you feel better, go for it!

I decided to take the easy way out...I called Advanced Nutrients

Smart! I'm glad you got guidance from the source (and that they agreed with my assessment, of course).

Happy growing!

 

[Giorkos1]

It would be based off of how you are growing and what you are feeding.

I am seeing more cl-mg needed when growing with coco. When growing with a rich soil like I am using you wont need it for the first few weeks. Then if you are feeding nutrients after the first few weeks (Like the Advanced Nutrients pH perfect that I am using) you won't need it either.

I guess it all comes down to what medium you are growing in and what you plan on feeding your plants later

That's pretty much all i am using.
If you think i can add something to improve the quality and yield of my weed then please say so I don't have this "knowledge" yet so I could use a tip

 

[Scientific]

I am seeing more cl-mg needed when growing with coco.

You need to supply EVERYTHING with coco coir. It is essentially just a sponge. It doesn't provide significant amounts of nutrients.

 

[IndyRacerNick]

I think you're wasting your time and your money, but you have lots of company, and if it makes you feel better, go for it!

My normal tap water is pH at 7.7 after it is sitting for 24 hours and distilled. The reason I went the other way was I did not want to have to purchase PH UP/DOWN for the sake of a couple weeks before I start feeding and it auto adjusts.

Soil is pH at 6.3-6.8 upon delivery

What would you suggest..just use normal tap water?

I did a test with my water and when it was showing 7.7pH i added 1.5 Tbsp of Vinegar to the water, mixed it and it went down to 6.3 - 6.5, tested again after 48 hours and was still in same range. I figured where it was ozonated it was better...it sounded cooler than tap water haha

I got no problems using tap water, figured ozonated was good...live and learn i guess...

 

[Scientific]

I don't have this "knowledge" yet so I could use a tip

I think one of the best tips is that fertilizer / hydroponic nutrient suppliers realize that there are a lot of people out there who are willing to spend a lot of money out of fear of missing something and desire to optimize their grows. Being for-profit entities, more and more companies are coming out with more and more products with great marketing and high prices.

General Hydroponics now has about a dozen products, but people do just fine with just their basic three Flora products (plus, to return to our subject here, CALiMAGic for folks like me who have really low mineral levels in their water).

 

[Giorkos1]

I think one of the best tips is that fertilizer / hydroponic nutrient suppliers realize that there are a lot of people out there who are willing to spend a lot of money out of fear of missing something and desire to optimize their grows. Being for-profit entities, more and more companies are coming out with more and more products with great marketing and high prices.

General Hydroponics now has about a dozen products, but people do just fine with just their basic three Flora products (plus, to return to our subject here, CALiMAGic for folks like me who have really low mineral levels in their water).

Well, i am not trying to make profit from it, i do it for me and my friends we though that we were spending a lot of money on buying weed all the time, so we figured it would be better to have our own!

It worked really good the first time, i was very satisfied now i am in day 38 of my 2nd grow. I have 2 WW autos and that's all, if you could be a little more specific and tell me if I can add something else to make it better I would really appreciate it

Pic is from day 36

 

[Scientific]

My normal tap water is pH at 7.7 after it is sitting for 24 hours and distilled.

By "distilled," you mean you're boiling it and they using only the condensed steam? That does seem extreme...

What would you suggest..just use normal tap water?

Yup!

Maybe do a simple A/B test just growing something like peppermint (that's cheap, grows fast, and is kinda similar to what we're growing) and compare the results?

Really, unless you have very hard water (visit your municipal utility's water website to see), all you should need to do is to adjust the pH to the right range. (And some would say that even that is more than is needed for a soil grow...)

 

[Scientific]

It worked really good the first time, i was very satisfied now i am in day 38 of my 2nd grow.

You can't argue with results! I'm glad your grows are working well and that you are saving money, to say nothing of the pleasure of doing it yourself and watching these amazing plants go through their fascinating life cycle!

It just kinda bugs me to see the marketing folks capitalizing on people's fears and dreams by selling them a lot of expensive extra stuff with names like "Floralicious" and "KoolBloom" and "Diamond Nectar" (to cite examples from just the General Hydroponics line) that they really don't need.

NPK + micronutrients -- that's all ya needs, and if all else fails, just flang them seeds in the manure pile, add water, and watch a big bush appear!

 

[IndyRacerNick]

You can't argue with results! I'm glad your grows are working well and that you are saving money, to say nothing of the pleasure of doing it yourself and watching these amazing plants go through their fascinating life cycle!

It just kinda bugs me to see the marketing folks capitalizing on people's fears and dreams by selling them a lot of expensive extra stuff with names like "Floralicious" and "KoolBloom" and "Diamond Nectar" (to cite examples from just the General Hydroponics line) that they really don't need.

NPK + micronutrients -- that's all ya needs, and if all else fails, just flang them seeds in the manure pile and watch a big bush appear!

Ok so where I am from we take that word differently at times. Like its shown on my journal I let the water sit for 48+ hours , test ph, adjust then water.

I will fill up water from the tap if that will be better than what I have now.

 

[Scientific]

Ok so where I am from we take that word differently at times. Like its shown on my journal I let the water sit for 48+ hours , test ph, adjust then water.

I will fill up water from the tap if that will be better than what I have now.

The reason that people have traditionally let their water sit is to let the chlorine gas added as a disinfectant by the utility off-gas. A lot of utilities disinfect now with chemicals that don't off-gas like that. Again, if you check with your utility's water website, they will tell you.

Where I live we still have plain old Cl gas injection, but having raised plants and kept fish for years, I have never bothered to let the water sit and have never known it to make a difference.

My point is, a lot of ritual tends to creep into processes like this that really aren't necessary or are out of date. No big deal. But really, shame on these fertilizer companies for the ever expanding line of whacky money wasting products they're coming out with (e.g. "terpene enhancers"--puhLEEZE!)

 

[bunkbudz]

The reason that people have traditionally let their water sit is to let the chlorine gas added as a disinfectant by the utility off-gas. A lot of utilities disinfect now with chemicals that don't off-gas like that. Again, if you check with your utility's water website, they will tell you.

Where I live we still have plain old Cl gas injection, but having raised plants and kept fish for years, I have never bothered to let the water sit and have never known it to make a difference.

My point is, a lot of ritual tends to creep into processes like this that really aren't necessary or are out of date. No big deal. But really, shame on these fertilizer companies for the ever expanding line of whacky money wasting products they're coming out with (e.g. "terpene enhancers"--puhLEEZE!)

Haha welcome to big business and hey wth potheads are gullible .

 

[Agemon]

I have tap water that Ph's at high 7's and sometimes 8's. I was told not to worry about it. I jad a ton of purple stems ans CaliMagic was suggested. Bye bye purple stems.