Indicas Grow & Experimenting Genetics Part II - Winter Indoor Organic Grow

[Danishoes21]

I have read a few Grow Journals where people supplemented with Reptisun UVB Florescent light bulbs, try searching for reptisun in the advanced search window at the top right of the webpage.

I've looked around and most are dated 2010 and older and weren't really conclusive. The problem is finding how much time and at what height to use the UVB radiation. I will look again on 420 but I have been reading all over even other forums, university papers, private researchers... I am aware that reptisun is probably the cheap least reliable source of UVB light but thats the only one I can afford. They do sell UVB units at 1000$ and up.

Plants grown under LED light panels have a higher requirement for calcium and magnesium. I believe the focused PAR spectrum activates more receptors in the plants than plants grown under High Pressure Sodium lights and causes higher amounts of calcium and magnesium to be used metabolically.

This could be solved by the LED companies, detecting at what wavelength in the 400-700 nm spectrum is responsible for the synthesis of Ca and Mg and tweaking the panels so this particular Wavelength doesn't peak as much as they do right now, causing the plant to intake more of these (and probably other) nutrients from the medium to the point that the grower has to supplement from an outside source (bottle nuts). I think they focused mostly on peaks for maximum intake of N-P-K. I think they have a good spectrum formula to promote thriving growth = more yields, but at the expense of a pattern of deficiencies, and I would add they could now focus on bettering the spectrum formula to maximize THC production, thats another ball game.

Many LED light panels also include Ultra Violet LED's in their designs and usage. Most charts are given in PAR meter readings for LED light panels. The PAR or Photosynthetic Active Radiation only covers from 400-700 nanometers and does not include either the UV or Infra Red wavelengths.

I believe they do have UV light BUT not at the proper wavelength as low as 280nm-320nm that is the exact wavelength of the UVB ray. Correct me if Im wrong the LED spectrum don't go below 370nm because "that is the lowest usable spectrum of "blue" visible light to Cannabis plants"... either way I don't think its SAFE by law for lights in general to go beyond 400nm-700nm or to not filter out almost completely the UV in all its forms (UVA, UVB, UVC being the most toxic). So that said, to add radiation at 280nm-320nm has to identified properly as Hazards and should have all the warning labels etc.

I yet to proof or disproof if in fact UVB supplemented radiation has an improve or increase on THC content. UVB could be responsible restructuring the whole Cannabinoids system in the plant, some sort of mutation...

I really don't know at this point.

 

[Danishoes21]

I have been posting my findings in previous pages...

 

[Danishoes21]

Here is an Update I'm pretty amazed so far. (50 pics)

Since yesterday photoperiod schedule is 13/11. So Im gonna divided the experiment in two, Breading part (includes only the little ones) and Photoperiod manipulation and UVB radiation (this applies to all plants in my grow but focusing results on the Blue Berry oldest plant).

~BREEDING (unknown strains)
Still no sings of sex definition, plants still showing normal growth, vibrant green color on the leaves, some are growing with power and speed the other seems wanky and lacking, nature is gonna decide who wins here. Not much else to report.

With Flash.

~PHOTOPERIOD MANIPULATION AND UVB (blue berry)
This plant is showing some very confusing progress.
* While most of the 5 leaflet leaves are close to dead (presumably senesces or Autumn effect "suicide cells"). They dry out with time and fall off with no yellowish de-coloration, you can see me pulling on some stems and they don't fall off so the plant is still undergoing some nutrient exchange with them. I hand pick out two leaves and Im gonna save them to see if they continue to deteriorate with time (if there is no extent of necrosis I conclude the leaf had no living cells left to further decompose) resulting an absolute DEAD leaf with no nutrient use for the plant, there for discarded naturally by the plant.
* New growth is spotted all over the plant, seems to be coming from the young calyx forming on each individual flower. New leaf growth is mostly 1-3 leaflet leaf, more pale green color (compared to the darker greens the older leaves), and seem to be abundant.
* Developing trichomes spotted all over the new set of leaf growth, from stem to the point of the leaf, they are big enough you could pick them out with precision tweezers.
* Aging pistils (more dry and orange color) seem to fall but there is a constant flow of new Withe moist pistils. Pistils don't define trichome of THC formation, its just an extent of the reproductive system of the plant.
* Main cola doesn't seem to grow upward at a fast rate, compared to the more lower branches that started to grow side branching and seem to be trying to catch up with the rest of the plant.
* Slightly well distribution of the trichomes, certain pictures show the trichomes forming from top to bottom of the plant.
* Very Dense interior part of the plant.
* Distinctive smell (earthy, sweet, fruity)

Pics Inside the Tent

If anyone told me that plant looks sick and ugly, I would not hesitate to agree. But I would also hand out a magnifying glass and tell the person to take a second look. I would add: this plant is starting her 3rd month from seed and she's not supposed to flower yet by rules of photoperiod (12/12). So there is a lot more to see than what one can see at first glance.

Pics Outside the tent (different lighting)

Finish with a thought: I can now say (personal conclusion) that 18/6 maybe the safest most reliable photoperiod to grow some amazing plants while only Vegetative cycle, I think its a little excessive in terms of light cost since natural sunlight only comes up to 15 hours (where I live) and it just gets closer to 12 hours as closer you get to the equator, I would probably vegetate at 16/8 or even 15/9.
And if we were to double this 14/10 light cycle to 28/20 or triple it 42/30... would it double the effects on the plants photosynthesis producing bigger stronger denser and more potent plants??

guess we only have to try and see...

 

[Danishoes21]

I do encourage fellow growers to chip in with ideas theories and observations.

 

[BeemerBill]

 

[BeemerBill]

That blue berry is looking really weird. Knowing it's the only one doing what it's doing show it's probably not environmental. The only thing that is probably different is the soil or what is in the soil. to have leaves, still green, dry out, shrivel up and fall off something has to be causing it. I hope someone will have an answer for you. When I grow indoors I use the GLR for vegging and then the diminishing light schedule for flowering. I have always had good luck. Happy Days danishoes.

 

[Danishoes21]

 

[Danishoes21]

That blue berry is looking really weird. Knowing it's the only one doing what it's doing show it's probably not environmental. The only thing that is probably different is the soil or what is in the soil. to have leaves, still green, dry out, shrivel up and fall off something has to be causing it. I hope someone will have an answer for you. When I grow indoors I use the GLR for vegging and then the diminishing light schedule for flowering. I have always had good luck. Happy Days danishoes.

I know she really does have a funky look but she seems not so bad after all I mean the new growing leaves are more than the ones falling, and I water at the same time the same amounts of water, I mist all the plants, the soil is the same for all the plants, I haven't done anything different I switch then around so they get light from different sides. Im just letting her go at this point and just writing down what I see.

Thanks for always chipping in B

 

[Danishoes21]

When I grow indoors I use the GLR for vegging and then the diminishing light schedule for flowering. I have always had good luck. Happy Days danishoes.

B can you please describe exactly how are the photoperiods when u use GLR and DLS? Thank you

 

[BeemerBill]

The Gas Lantern Routine for Growing Cannabis

 

[Lester Freeman]

I can't say for sure what's causing your problem. But I can say that when you take a plant that has been growing outside for millions of years and take it inside, some weird things are bound to happen

Like you said, it's really not so bad. Especially if there is fresh growth coming out.

Not all specimens can be perfect, my friend.

 

[Danishoes21]

I can't say for sure what's causing your problem. But I can say that when you take a plant that has been growing outside for millions of years and take it inside, some weird things are bound to happen

Like you said, it's really not so bad. Especially if there is fresh growth coming out.

Not all specimens can be perfect, my friend.

Thanks for the input Lester, indeed she is by all means trying to adapt to the rules of the environment, I'm just documenting everything I see, even If It doesn't look good and don't understand it. Perhaps others can use this as an example when they think about whats the ideal photoperiod for veg or flower, the in-between may look something like this...

 

[b.real]

she doesn't look too bad. hopefully you'll get an 8th or so from her. the good news is you have a bunch of healthy sprouts. for vegetative growth 16-18 hours of light is your best bet

 

[Danishoes21]

she doesn't look too bad. hopefully you'll get an 8th or so from her. the good news is you have a bunch of healthy sprouts. for vegetative growth 16-18 hours of light is your best bet

Yup right of the bat first conclusion IDEALY for super healthy growth while VEG is 18 hours of light. The plant has no time to build up flower hormones with 6 hrs of darkness. The more hours of darkness the more the hormone (florigen) builds up sending the plant straight to flower. whats happening on mine is the side effects of hormonal confusion in this plant (I strongly believe it), there is probably such a fine line between the times started with just 4 hrs of difference (14/10) compared to (18/6) huge gap of 12 hrs between so the flowering hormone build up is interrupted before the physical changes in the plant start to occur at (18/6).

Im just trying to put some logic to understand what is happening... My guess is the little ones are gonna start flowering any time soon this month and they might start to get ugly too... Unless they are more Equatorial strains (sativa dominants) so the small changes in photoperiods don't really affect the plant, compared to northern strains (Indica dominant) that do have bigger gaps in their photoperiods...

Im really optimistic that when the timer hits 12/12 things are gonna clear out between them hormones and the plant will just flower with no problems.

 

[Danishoes21]

the key factors I grasp on to:

-started 14/10
-the plant grew 4-5 internodes before showing pistils (5 nodes take around a month and half using my cfls, month and half the plant is mature enough to go to flower)
-photoperiod doesn't change
-the plant is caught up between Veg (constantly pumping new leaves) and flowering (pistils formation, trichomes buildup, no more fan leaves, senesce).

this month is gonna be interesting to see.

 

[KingJohnC]

How far above the canopy are your Compact Florescent Lights?

 

[Danishoes21]

How far above the canopy are your Compact Florescent Lights?

The tent has a total height of 160 cm - a 20cm gap from the big CFLs on very top of the tent - around 30 cm from de pots height from the ground = the distance is 110cm or 43 inches separate the Cannabis plants from main the lights. The 3 smaller Cfls are 20 inches below the main lights.

the lights are:
1x 2700k 200 watt CFL 13500 Lumens 395nm Full Spectrum (SunBlaster)
2x 6400K 400 watt CFL 27000 Lumens Red Spectrum (SunBlaster)
3x 5000K 68 watt CFL 3600 Lumens 348nm Full Spectrum (Bleu Planet)

I guess Avg. 660 watt 44,000 Lumens I've never measured this I just take the companies word for it.

 

[Danishoes21]

A lot of heat builds up because its a lot of light for the small tent I believe, so I have 2 fans running at different heights and a spinning fan blowing fresh ir from the outside I leave the tent 1/4 open at the bottom to allow airflow.

 

[KingJohnC]

I believe that your main Compact Florescent Lights are positioned too high above your plants to effectively illuminate deep enough into the plants, I would lower your main Compact Florescent Lights. Lumen is a scale of brightness and does not add as you believe it does.

https://en.wikipedia.org Lumen

 

[Danishoes21]

I believe that your main Compact Florescent Lights are positioned too high above your plants to effectively illuminate deep enough into the plants, I would lower your main Compact Florescent Lights. Lumen is a scale of brightness and does not add as you believe it does.

https://en.wikipedia.org Lumen

I gotta start asking why, why would you recommend to lower the lights? Based on what? and how is it going to improve the actual state of the plants? I would appreciate if you could elaborate more on this.

Thank you KingJ