Help for a 1st timer with no ideas

[Dravis85]

I've been lurking and reading alot on these forums, but I haven't seen a situation quite like mine to compare with, so I figure to ask.

My problem is that I am getting extremely slow or no growth. I started my seeds Jan 1st and it took them a week to germinate. When the taproot popped out, I moved them from papaer towels to Jiffy Peat Pellets. I was told these are PH balanced. I watered the pellets with brita filtered tap water. I keep the pellets inside one of those mini greenhouses to keep the humidity up. I used a heating mat to keep them at 75-90 degrees F. I had been turning my 400w HPS on and off (mostly to test temperature changes) and keeping a CFL next to it on constantly. Since my temp tests proved the space was going to overheat with the HPS (90+ air temp during the day), I bult a 6 socket light box which I have 6, 23 watt (100w equivalent), 5000k CFLs in. I have not been turning this on until today when i was able to correctly hang it. I have tried to keep the water level about the same, with brita water. I know the sprouts aren't really drinking it, but I had read that it was necessary to keep humidity up and I don't think the water on the sides of the green house count as humidity. Anyway, it is the 20th and I still have not gotten a sprout out of the pellet.

I just dont know whats wrong. Are my seeds dead?

 

[Fuzzy Duck]

Sounds abit complex with all that, what ever...

Now theres an old saying 1000s of years old called K.I.S aka keep it simple, romans used it, they had a bigger stick than most others & it worked ! simple ah.

Fuzzy abides by this rule, whilst breaking or bending any others i see fit, because i can !

Anyway time for some ancient hippy knowledge, i shaved a lot of heads for this, should hear em scream No not my dreads... took years to grow - Lol


To save meh an extensive amount of time waffling on about stuff i don't really know what i'm talking about, you can READ this link - How to Grow Marijuana Everything You Need to Know all you need to know about MJ

Oh ye that water stuff on the inside of propegator (can't even spell it) thats humidity related - hope it helps.

 

[Fuzzy Duck]

Oh ye 5000k CFL, ye right best to read up about light spectrum its more PAR/NM related.

What ya really want for veg is 6400k or 6500k (Blue) for flowering 2700k pushing 2000k (orange to red)

 

[Dravis85]

Maybe my explanation makes it sound more complicated than it is. I am certainly not trying to "make the most weight of dankest stuff per $$." I just want to see if I can make it grow. Other than making it a hydro-grow it is no more than I have seen other first timers with, but maybe I'll take my hydro junk out and go soil. It would gertainly give me more room. But this is all moot if it won't sprout.

I had read all those articles in this forum, and quite a few others from other sites and the general conclusion was 5000k should work, 6000k works better, 6500k works best. And of course I have the big ol' HPS/MH to try out if I can figure out how to keep my temps from going 90-100.

Thanks for the advice though...

 

[1970s Grower]

You will be fine with 5000K CFLs. I would not be concerned about that. I have had bad luck with peat pelets and peat pots. FWIW

 

[Fuzzy Duck]

Ok, please excuss my waffle.

5000k is more green spectrum & sadly plants don't use much of that, green and yellow spectrum is more visable to humen eye, than of use to a plant ! even tho it will produce a limited amount of the other ends of spectrum.

Soil growing is more forgiving to the first time grower as it has a natural buffering effect for PH, slightly slower in growth so they say.

Hydro well that needs constant work with PH/EC checks ect flushing of reserva every 10 odd days & what not !


Seedlings need to soak up 200% to 300% of their own weight in moisture before germination.

I use root roit plugs for germination in a propagator (plastic thing not heated) using my 125w maxibright CFL 2 inchs above propagator roof as an ambient heat source, this normal warms area insde to 28c & humidity at 90% plus. Germination can take any where between 24 hours to 2 weeks.

Seedlings best germination ratio is 24c plus to max of 28c they prefer high humidity of 70% plus, seedling stage may last 1 week to 4 weeks.

Vegging temps 23c to 28c is good and considored the norm, humidity 50% to 70% is fine & dandy, vegging can last 2 weeks to 2 months

Flowering, well lower temps can be a bonus on some strains not all, its another story tho... humidity should be kept between 30% to 50% higher humidity can induce bud rot, flowering stage can last depending on strain ? 6 weeks to 3 months.

This is a general guide & each strain is different to what it can tolarate temp/humidity wise, further research will show similar results with in my own perameters.

 

[Dravis85]

Thanks for all the info. I was wondering about the pellets being bad myself. Maybe rockwool is the better way to go. I am thinking I might have moved the germed seeds too quickly as well. I am going to start a few more seeds and grab a rockwool slab to put them in. I think I'll give them a couple more days with the towels before I move them to the cubes, and into a mini-ghouse. I might try a soil grow using Ocan Forest Soil, but changing everything isn't the best option right now. Until I can confirm that doing hydro is just not going to work...

 

[Fuzzy Duck]

Advice on temps.

1. Air cooled reflector, ducting & 100m fan should be fine.
2. Suitable ventilation should be considored passive & external.
3. Suitable light/bulb to size of tent will effect temps.


I use a passive intake system, basically a tent with a open vent - its winter & central heating is on this can effect tent temperatures.

Tent size 3 by 3 foot or 90cm by 90 cm, 400w Hps avarage lights on temps are 26c to 28c thats with central heating ON
Every C of temp counts to internal tent temps on a passive system!

I use a small 125mm extraction fan external/5m of ducting, well its out of room as best as i can get it with out drilling large holes in walls etc to keep temps reasonable.

Night time/lights off temps rarely drop 17c/18c central heating helps keeps this in check.


A window or 2 is left open a jar to provide new flow of air to support Co2 requirements for plants most of the time.


Night time/lights off or lights on of temps can be effected by seasonal variations of temps etc summer/winter effecting internal temps.

 

[Dravis85]

Yea, my lighting situation has totally blown up in my face. I had gotten a 400w MH/HPS with a 6" cooltube and reflector to use in my cabinet, but it got too hot. I was originally logging temps of about 10+ambient, but it seems that figure is non-linear. My ambient jumped 5-10 degrees overnight and my cabinet went up about 15 with it. I was cooling with a 166 CFM fan too. Anyway, I got to 90+ readings during my testing so I had to remove it. It is a warm winter for us, and my temps will only go higher as the days progress so I figured to change it out to CFL now rather than burn plants that have actually started growing. I have a tent (portable closet) that I am looking at building and working the MH/HPS light into, but I have to find a place to put it first.

 

[Fuzzy Duck]

oK...

Lights on for me is at R/L (real life night time when temps are lower) so i don't get the day time peak of temperatures, ultimately not leading to higher temps !

When the sun is up in R/L (real life) the temps are higher mid day ! this is when my lights are off

That should give ya an idea...


Air cooled lighting still requires a seperate fan, one for the light & one for the tent as you are still require to draw enough air through the tent & Co2.

 

[Fuzzy Duck]

Well provide the dimensions of your grow area we need width x length is your total grow area.

Some old hippy shit, said on avergae 50w / 5000 lumen averager per square foot... the more the better. I don't believe that, you can if you want...

The more the greater the heat with HPS - e.g you may need a larger fan to deal with it ?

 

[Dravis85]

I am using a 20" deep by 31" wide wardrobe. I don't have roomies or parents to worry about, but I wanted something that could pass with guests. I keep it in my garage. I had the HPS in the very top of it, with the cool tube being cooled with a 7.5 (140 mm) fan. The fan said it was rated 166 cfm. I could touch the tube without burning myself, but the air inside the wardrobe started getting to 90+ temps. The ambient air in the garage was 75-80 degrees in the garage when I got the 90+ temps. I may try to put the HPS back in and leave the doors open, but this seems to defeat the purpose of having it in the wardrobe.

With the HPS out I have a CFL lightbox. The lumen output is about 9900 total.

 

[QueenTokelove]

oK...Lights on for me is at R/L (real life night time when temps are lower) so i don't get the day time peak of temperatures, ultimately not leading to higher temps !When the sun is up in R/L (real life) the temps are higher mid day ! this is when my lights are off that should give ya an idea...

I do the same thing....

 

[QueenTokelove]

Dravis---Are you growing in a tent or a closet? Was just wondering because I am using a closet with a 400w hps with a reflector, no cool tube. I have to leave my closet doors open since I have no fan I can actually put in the closet. I do have a huge fan that I sit directly in front of the closet door. It usually has room temp between 75-80 and humidity around 30-35.

 

[Dravis85]

I am growing inside a wardrobe. Like one of those stealth cabinets, but not prebuilt.

 

[QueenTokelove]

I am growing inside a wardrobe. Like one of those stealth cabinets, but not prebuilt.

Oh ok, not familiar with that term....

 

[Fuzzy Duck]

Once wardrobe is modified & the ducting hanging out of it plus power cabels i don't think it will ever look normal, inless its all hanging out of back panel.

Plus fans make noise some where between 35 to 45 decibel depending on size & brand etc.

Needs to be light tight so some funky flaps inside of wardrobe doors will be required to stop strange light coming from the cracks of the door, might want to considor odour control to.

Mj can be pretty stinky, some strains are known to be low odour whilst growing/blooming.

Oh ye i was toying with the idea of sativa domiment plants for summer grows when higher temps are a problem, sative & indica come from different parts of the world with a degree of different climates. You might find sativa are more tolarent of higher temperature.

You might even find 12/12 from seed, sog style may help as ya got limited head height.

Just some food for thought.

 

[Fuzzy Duck]

Time for some waffle about PH i don't think i mention any mush about this...

Home work for you - Find out Ph of water supply hard or soft, you can use R/O water if you really want.


Soil stuff.

Ideal PH is between 6.2 & 6.8, people use dolomite lime as Ph buffer some times this buffers the soil to ph 7.
Macro & micro nutrients are more aviable between this ph range which means less defeciency problems with MJ.

As mention before soil has natural buffering effect & part of K.I.S

Choose a good quality brand & should have ph written on bag some where, peat based compost are acidic ph 5 aprox.


Hydro stuff

Normally assoicated with nft/ebb 'n' flow/wilma/drip & inert growing mediums.

If propegating in rockwool pre soak cube in 1/4 strength nutrient solution.

Ideal PH for these systems is 5.6 to 6.2

PH up & downs may be required depending on ambient PH of local tap water, a PH/EC pen will be required to take measurements of every solution you prepare & to test nutrient reserva daily for any PH/EC fluctuations to be corrected asap. Fluctuation can be deprimental to plant health on a prolonged basis, the nutrient reserva should be flushed & replaced with fresh nutrients aprox every 7 to 10 days to prevent nutrient locks/defeciencys.


I hope some of this helps & you gain a successful MJ girlie to love 'n' nurtue in the very near future


P.s - keep a journal we love that stuff and pic's to as they paint a 1000 words, very good for problem identifacation & Do Not use Miracle Grow its pants, like really smelly, moldie ones with fungus...


You might want to know what the romans had to do with this, from the first post ? well they conqued the world looking for a bigger a stick... Ye man
In theory bigger stronger sticks support bigger plants yielding bigger buds man.

Thats real history for ya & some thing ya don't learn every day.