Heat vs light tradeoff for max yield

corm420

New Member
Hello all!

Ok, so my setup is as follows: i have 5 plants (chiesel) about 4 weeks into flowering. For the veg and the first 2 or 3 weeks of flower i used a 400w MH and HPS respectively. Then i got a 600w system and hooked that up. Grow space is a 1.2m x1.2m x1.8 (or 2m, cant remember lol). Only got a 100 M^3/hr extraction fan, which i know isnt enough for my setup - BUT, with lights on (at night, in winter in ireland), a passive intake duct from an open window with a fan (not inline) right at the end of the ducting (inside the tent) bringing in enough cool air to keep the temps in check, and a dehumidifier to keep the temps slightly up and humidity at 60% at lights off, the temperature range is acceptable with the 600. Hitting about 28-29 C at the canopy (82-84 F) at lights on, (and maybe 25-28 if its windy out) and dropping to about 18-20 C (64-68 F) in the dark.

Now, i hooked up the 400 as well with the MH bulb, for the triple effect of more lumens, more points of light, and more varied spectrum. The temps with both lights on hit about 32 C, slightly less if i leave the tent door open or its windy. I know this is a tad high, but i have the fan blowing cold air from the intake duct and an oscillating fan at the other side of the tent so plenty of air movement.

My quandry is this:
Will the higher temperatures reduce yield more than the extra light would otherwise add to yield?
Is it best to keep it at the lower temp with just the 600? or will the extra 400 give a better yield even though temps are slightly too high? or will the high temps drop yield even though there is more light? There doesnt seem to be any sign of heat stress on the leaves btw.

If it turns out that the higher temps are detrimental enough to reduce yield with the 400 on, what i'l probably do is only have the 400 on for the first few hours of the light cycle and then turn it off, and keep the tent door open! unfortunately i cant afford a better extraction fan at the moment.

I dont want to damage my yield be being greedy with my lighting! any you guys have experience of this type of situation or similar? a lot of you guys are pretty clued up about growing and hopefully you can tell me definitively whether i should stop being a greedy ass, looking for a bigger yield with more light, and just keep the 600 on (with maybe the 400 for a couple hours) OR whether the extra light will overcome any ill effects from the temps?

Thanks in advance!!
Peace.
C
 
For the dimensions of the room you have, one light is enough. You will be risking too much if it gets too hot in there, which will happen very quick if you forget to leave tent open. You can use that metal halide 400w light in your vegetative area and supply steady good clones to your flower area. Good luck friend.
 
It is a fine line...

I don't think i can give any real good answer but a lot more questions for you to ponder over :thumb:


In the short term ye it may increase yield but in a localized area...

2 different sized bulbs in wattage & effective hanging height of each govern by the inverse square law of light effect... diminishing returns over distance etc to light foot print of each that may depend on reflector size tho...


But ye lumens is a load of bull as it is just a light measurement for the human eye only & in general the wrong spectrum of light for plants to use !

What ya need to look at is kelvin...

Once ya look in to things in detail...


If you think your bulb puts out an equal wattage or what ever measurement of light per square foot... ya greatly mistaken !

So the plants on the outer edge of grow area should in theory be lower yield to the ones in the middle or the cross over point of both bulbs used !
 
I would get a larger exhaust fan or if noise is a issue get a 2nd fan like the first one and run its own duct.

I read a paper on commercial fan noise control and they suggested 2 fans over one larger fan as the noise increase can be a little as 2 dbi compared to a single larger fans 10 dbi or more increase.

I want my house to be quiet at night so i went with multiple fans , I am also using a speed control so I can run the fans at 3/4 speed to further reduce the noise.

Got a deal on some 250 CFM fans so I bought a 5 lot of them , so I can add more fan power as I introduce more lights to flower mode.

Only two of them are installed ,currently using 1 of my 3 lights so i am only powering one of the 2 fans. When I add a light I will turn on the 2nd fan , when the 3rd light goes up I will if need be add a 3rd fan.
 
Mr belvedere: Yea, i know i'd be risking it but i am keeping both lights on, with the tent door open, and its been sitting at 28 C the past 2 nights! so as long as im there for lights on i can run the two safely it seems, as long as i make sure to do eerything. if i cant makesure, i'l unplug the 400 ballast at lights off so only the 600 comes on, which will be ok with the door closed. I'm monitoring temp and humidity regularly, and it seems ive got it to good levels - 40% RH and 28-29 C with lights on 60% RH and about 22 C with lights off. I dont have a veg area at the minute or else i would use the MH for that, i plan to in the future but for legal reasons i keep below 10 plants as 10 plants is legally a more serious offence if shit hit the fan, whereas 9 is the lowest category! fuck da police!

Fuzzyduck: it is indeed a fine line.I know that lumens is what we see, and its the PAR values the plant uses. i have the 600 about 16' above the centre line of 4 of the plants, if you imagine them in a square, with the 5th plant in front of those closest to the door. so 2 plants at the back, 2 at the front and one in the middle in front of that, closest to the front of the tent. they interlock with each other a bit so its more square than it seems from the description...(i'l post a picture!), but the 600 is at the back end of the tent (bulb and (euro) reflector is aligned from tent side to tent side rather than door to back wall) almost at the middle of the canopy but slightly towards the back. the 400 is more towards the tent door, but at a 90 degree angle from the 600, lower down, about 14" and vertically angled so the light is facing at about 30 degrees from horizontal towards most of the canopy ie if u put something at the highest point of the flat top of the reflector it would roll down towards the tent door.. I know about the kelvin, my 600 is at 2000K and the 400 is around 6000K. because of the inverse square light, i have tried to keep the canopy relatively level, and i rotate plants daily both round in a circle so that each gets their day of more blue, and also rotate the pots so buds on opposite sides of the plants get the chance to be as close as possible to the bulbs..! I've read from many sources that plants do better with some blue in flowering especially towards the end...but yea i want to give them a good range of colour...but with the most light being at a quite red 2000K! thanks dude

LEDbud: To be honest i dont have any concerns with the noise of the fan where the tent is. I do definitely want to upgrade when i can but now it seems that at least temps are good. Although when i get a fan i'l probably want to get a controllable one.
 
photo_3406.JPG


Damn photo is sideways!! lights cant be seen as theyre raised to take the photo!
 
You can get dual spectrum hps others call em dual arc etc they are just regular HPS same kelvin rate 2050/2100 which have been tweaked to put out a bit more blue spectrum.

Sun Master, Grolux, Lumatek do them, i'm not to up on USA brand names tho but i'm pretty sure you will find a few...


It may save tarting around with 2 different bulbs tho & worth a look into :thumb:
 
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