Frustrated

[Italixxx]

I bought ten white widow seeds, germed 5 at once, soaked them overnight in a glass of water, and after 24 hours placed them in the factory holes, approx .5 inch deep, in presoaked ph'd rockwool cubes. 3 of them popped and goose necked so hard trying to break the surface, the sprouts quickly died as the cot leaves shrivelled up into nothing. I had them in a humidity dome, in a dark warm closet as I read the seeds liked it somewhere warm and dark. So that sucked. I decided to germ the other 5 same way, soaked em, planted em, this time I made my own holes and made sure they were only 1/4 inch deep, and this time i soaked the cubes in a quarter strength nute solution. Quarter strength being one quarter of what they recommend for seedlings and cuttings. Fox farm trio nutes. This time once again 3 popped and broke the surface. Great! Little cot leaves opened up and this time I had the seedlings under a 1000w mh dimmed to 600w. They grew tall quick it seemed, and spindly. Right now is day 8 and the 3 that actually sprouted are 1.5 - 2 inches tall. The two fan leaves on two of the sprouts are pointing way off to the same side and are in no way perpendicular to the cot leaves. But they look green and good I guess? The one had a tap root come out the bottom of the cube and it lasted that way for about a day and a half lookin healthy until the part of it that stuck out of the cube shrivelled up and turned thin. I've been watering with that same 1/4 strength solution, and I'm just worried that I'm doing something stupid. This is my first attempt at growing, I've invested so much money into this, and it's not going to break me if I have to order another ten seeds, but it's just so frustrating to think how difficult this can be, with so many factors contributing to who even knows what may or may not be anything to worry about. I've done some pretty intensive research but I feel if I spend any more time reading and searching for answers unsucessfuly I might add, that I am just going to snap. Lol. I need some one to get me through the seedling stage. Much love to the ones that have the patience to deal with my misinformed ignorance.

 

[Dave Groomer]

You really shouldn't be using any nutes at all yet. I would use just PH balanced water. Are they going in soil or hydro? Also, how far is your light from the seedlings? You don't want to burn them.

 

[Major PITA]

Pictures?
Seedlings do not like dark. Seeds and roots like dark, but the plant needs light immediately upon breaking through the surface.
Spindly seedlings usually mean the light source is too far away. You have a difficult balancing act using such a big light for brand new seedlings. Too far and they stretch. Too close and you fry the little buggers. I stick with CFL, T5's or T8's for really little ones. Roots will air prune automatically, so if the tap root went all the way through the cube and hit air, it will dry up quickly. What do you plan to grow them in? Brand new seedlings do not take well to any nutrients.

 

[Italixxx]

I got a rdwc set up waiting for em if they ever get big enough. Yeah I heard the seeds have all the nutrition the seedlings needs to last the first bit, but I've read to soak the cubes in weak solution so they are there, cuz the rockwool is nutritionless. But I mean I only tried that because of how bad the first ones failed with no nutes. I thought I'd try it a little differently to see if it made a difference

 

[Strykr]

I wanna help, but I have a hard time keeping focus on a wall of text like that.

Have you thought about just germinating in soil and going that route? Maybe I'm just lucky but
I have never had a seed not germinate and live. These seeds being bag seeds at first and then Barneys.

 

[Italixxx]

Ok this is all good to know, it is a delicate balancing act for sure! I have a grow tent set up and it's all ready for everything but I mean, when I had the light on em, it was like a foot off the seedlings maybe a little more, and they still got tall. I'll post some pictures when I get hom here in about 20 minutes

 

[Strykr]

A lot of stuff got posted while I was typing that out so I see you are going hydro, kinda voids what I was saying. Carry on

 

[Italixxx]

So how do you guys germ your beans? Cuz really, 6 out of ten ain't so good. I was looking for more like 10 out of 10 even if some turn out to be weak, I'd rather have options than have only 3 to choose from. And for some reason the picture uploading thing on this site is retarded

 

[Italixxx]

 

[Dave Groomer]

Well, I am a dirt farmer. I put my seeds in a damp paper towel, inside a ziplock bag in my drawer. After 12-72 hour the seeds will have popped and have a tap root. I place that (tap root down) about 1/2" deep in a 8oz foam coffee cup. I put holes in the bottom of the cup for drainage. With in 2-3 days the plants are popping above the soil. I would consider using some CFLs to start. Just a thought.

 

[Major PITA]

I do soil grows. Soak seed for about 12 hours and drop into soil 1/2" deep. Water moderately. So far 100% germination with seedings up in 4 to 7 days.

Shouldn't those cubes be in their permanent home... or is that it?

 

[Italixxx]

Well I don't know when exactly to transplant them, I don't know maybe I will transplant them to see what happens

 

[Rifleman]

I germinate the seeds, place them in a rapid rooter plug and then straight to my dwc buckets media. They begin their seedling life in their permanent home.

Oh yeah, to

 

[Strykr]

I soak mine in a shot glass for 24 hours or until they sink, place them in moist paper towels and then put that in between 2 plates with one flipped over.

So far I have done this with roughly 12 seeds I think and all have germinates into healthy plants. Have you considered just doing a dirt grow to get the basics?

 

[Italixxx]

It started out that way believe me, but the more I researched the more I started to lean towards a hydro set up, I knew there would be growing pains but Im also learning that I have no intuition for this just yet. I have considered a soil grow and now I'm starting to consider it again. There so many things to consider when doing hydro, all I kept reading about was how easy it is once you get your conditions dialled in, but it's starting to seem like a rather expensive process. I've almost gone too far to turn around. Lol kinda sad. Honestly the seedlings are looking alright, I mean they haven't wilted yet, it's only been 8 days. Maybe I'm selling it short. I'll keep an eye on em see how they do over the next few days. If they die then I will seriously consider changing my approach, and it'll be back to the drawing board. For shits I'll attach a photo of my system.

 

[Faic]

NOoooo Stick with hydro. You've done the leg work and got the kit, now hit your numbers.

Seriously, don't let this put you off hydro. I started in soil, and ended in hydro (I did pull two plants through a complete soil grow). If you think this is rough mentally. You have no clue how much more mystical and frustrating soil can be. pH issues coupled with the ensuring deficiencies is rediculous in soil vs hydro.

"Dialing in" was best described by someone before as, "You learn how to grow with your first sucessful grow. Everything after is dialing that in.". In other words, you never really stop dialing in your grow I think. Things just make more sense, if your grow went ok. A new grower can successfully grow an auto making mistakes that would ruin a photo plant, so 'nothing is simple or easy, it just becomes clearer'.

As far as germing, I dislike the notion of rockwool personally. I don't care if they eat them to show they're safe. Most do like Rifleman from what I've seen and germ to rw or rr and right into the hydroton. When I switched, I had a plant in dirt and no plugs or anything. I just gently rinsed the roots off, placed em in the hydroton (soaked for like a week till they all sank) and off they went. They get half strength nutes since the water is void of anything for the first week. The bubbling keeps the already saturated hydroton damp, and by the next res change the roots have hit the water and from there it's full strength to harvest.

I run CFL's but germing I have them under a single 23w cfl for a week in a 8oz cup. Seed or clone. From there, it's rinising the roots and into the bucket, because it's worked for me so far. I did a transplant from soil to hydro a week before flowering, and she's taken it all in stride and is right with her roommate. I'm sure someone would point out I've stunted them and added a day or week, but it's on my terms and she's happy.

 

[thebudking]

That is how I germinate seeds. Leave the plastic on your rockwool, fill your try 1/2 way with pearlite, that will force the roots out the bottom and protect them from the light, that is why your tap root died. I use clonex solution and calmag for nutes. The temp in your germination area will play a big part plus humidity. A dome will help alot. Since you have taken the plastic off of the rockwool already, make sure the cubes are buried at least 1/2 way in the perlite. Follow my video and you will have great success, I get 95 to 100% germination.....rambling on...
I shouldn't smoke and give advice...lol

 

[OlderGrower]

Welcome to the 420 community

I see you have been told by a couple people already so this will be old news but ditch the HID and use a CFL about 4 to 6 inches away from the seedling. Once it gets 3 to 4 sets of true leaves put the HID back on her. Your success rate will be way greater then trying to fine that fine line with 600 watts of HID. It is a seedling, that light is like taking a semi tractor and trailer to go grocery shopping, yes it can be done by why would you want to?
Just my 2 cents

 

[mokel]

heya,
welcome to

nearly 2 month ago i was nearly in the same situation, after watching videos, reading a lot of stuff i decided to go full in with my first grow doing hydro and nothing soil based, gather every bit of experience i can for the next grows and have as much fun as possible doing so.
thanks to this great community i managed to keep my single plant alive and healthy this far ... and even if i had the same doubts like you, i'm glad that i sticked to my decision.

i'm not sure but from what i learned i can imagine that your rockwool got to alkaline without any nutes to buffer the ph. but now with some nutes, it has a little buffer to keep it stable longer so the plant could develop better.
furthermore, when my plant was as big as yours are now, i already had them under a 600w mh bulb for vegging (with digital ballast, so i could tune it down to 300w) in my aquafarm from the start, so the recirculating solution kept the ph down in the rockwool and it couldn't go out of bounds unnoticed anymore, before i added a little amount of phed water on daily base to keep the RW cube stable ....
at first i thought that maybe was a mistake as she then had very much space for her roots to establish, but on the other hand, i think that's one of the benefits of hydro and on second thought and more experience i think my next plants will go into the aquafarm as soon as possible as well

this picture was made the day i planted her in her final pot, i think she was even a little bit smaller then yours by that time, but her first root already pocked out of the bottom of the RW cube ....

i'd love to help you with everything i learned so far and as you can see, everyone else here does as well

 

[Walrus]

Strange that they grew spindly with a 600w mh only 12 inch away is the bulb really old??

I only have a 400w mh and due to heat had it around 18-20" inch from my seedlings and they didn't stretch in the slightest.

I'm only a beginner but never had issues germinating just by putting the seeds on damp toilet paper in a plastic tub in a drawer, not exactly hi tech but it works for me so far with > 90% germination rate.