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- #721
Yes it was greatwolf. I made that batch in the IP, blending with oil and water then separating the oil and water after straining. It infuses and decarbs fine, but the taste was awful.
Yes it was greatwolf. I made that batch in the IP, blending with oil and water then separating the oil and water after straining. It infuses and decarbs fine, but the taste was awful.
Hi Sue, this makes a lot of sense. And I think it will to you too in just a few minutes. If you'll recall, this has bothered me for a while, but I couldn't explain it. Now I figured it out and can explain it by cooking techniques.
When you typically prepare FHO on the stove top, you are basically sauteeing the leaves in EVOO until all of the water has been driven out and the decarb process has been done to your satisfaction. Yes, I know it is a lower temperature then sautee is done at, but the basic principle is the same.
This does not even come close to what is taking place in the Instant Pot (IP). When you add the additional water and close the lid, we can't see what happens but we can make some educated guesses. We know the oil and water won't mix, they will separate. We know the plant material, being made up of mostly water, will enter the water layer. When the water starts to boil, this agitation will further remove oil from the plant material.
[Don't believe me? Chop up a couple of fan leaves, mix with oil, put in a pot of boiling water and see what happens. ]
So in the IP method you are using, you are boiling the material vs the sautee-like method you use on the stove top. This is why you and I got drastically different results: I'm using dry material mixed with oil, separated from the water used to pressurized the IP (mine are in canning jars with the lids loosely on).
What might work is the following:
Place cannabis oil mix in a metal bowl.
Place a heat safe jar/ glass/ can in the middle of the bowl.
Forming foil in the shape of a shallow cone (pointing into the jar), tightly cover the bowl.
Since we're trying to remove water in an extremely humid environment (pressure cooker), we need to set up a water condensing/ collection system, which is what I've tried to describe above. I've no idea of it would work. But I'm sure it would smell and taste better than boiled cannabis buds.
Cheers from the dark side
I can vouch for that. Everyone had to leave the house when I did this to kill botrytis. Boiling water on the bottom and buds above in a steamer pot (lid off in this pic, it was boiled with the lid on):
The smell was was disgusting! Can't even imagine the taste :0
medmanmike
Well-Known Member
[QUOTE=SweetSue;3880947]I went back to the stove-top method. I couldn't stand the smell or taste of the previous batch done in a pressure cooker. Today I harvested a CBD Critical Cure mand tossed her into the stock pot sitting in the oil bath and went old school. 
200 grams of buds and sugar leaves in 250 ml of EVOO, reduced to an indistinguishable mash?
Hi Sue, a couple of questions for you and a recommendation.
1. Your "formula" for FHO - 200 g bud to 250 ml I get. Dried bud would be ¼ or 50g, correct? Does the amount of oil remain the same?
2. What is the current thinking/practice regarding a two-hour vs eight-hour vs a 36-hour oil? There seems to be movement to less time in a low heat oven. Obviously, decarbing the material needs to be done prior to cooking. But, if decarb is a matter of time and temp: higher temp, shorter time; lower temp, longer time, how long at 140° F would it take to Decarb? Or would it at all?
I only able to press 150 ml of oil from the mash. That 100 ml of infused oil locked in the plant material will be loaded into capsules and dosed like that. It'll extend the harvest and we might squeek through to the next one.
Finally, not sure I've seen this posted, but here is what I use to squeeze out every last drop (well, almost every drop) of oil. I put the mash in silkscreen (or cheesecloth) wrapped in a ball. This is a very heavy duty juicer - cast aluminum, and though at 70 I don't have the strength I once had, I can really crank on this and get most of the oil back. Unfortunately, this was gifted to us and I'm not sure where it came from. A specialty shop, I believe. Couldn't find this one on "the river", but they do have a stainless one for $20+.
200 grams of buds and sugar leaves in 250 ml of EVOO, reduced to an indistinguishable mash?
Hi Sue, a couple of questions for you and a recommendation.
1. Your "formula" for FHO - 200 g bud to 250 ml I get. Dried bud would be ¼ or 50g, correct? Does the amount of oil remain the same?
2. What is the current thinking/practice regarding a two-hour vs eight-hour vs a 36-hour oil? There seems to be movement to less time in a low heat oven. Obviously, decarbing the material needs to be done prior to cooking. But, if decarb is a matter of time and temp: higher temp, shorter time; lower temp, longer time, how long at 140° F would it take to Decarb? Or would it at all?
I only able to press 150 ml of oil from the mash. That 100 ml of infused oil locked in the plant material will be loaded into capsules and dosed like that. It'll extend the harvest and we might squeek through to the next one.
Finally, not sure I've seen this posted, but here is what I use to squeeze out every last drop (well, almost every drop) of oil. I put the mash in silkscreen (or cheesecloth) wrapped in a ball. This is a very heavy duty juicer - cast aluminum, and though at 70 I don't have the strength I once had, I can really crank on this and get most of the oil back. Unfortunately, this was gifted to us and I'm not sure where it came from. A specialty shop, I believe. Couldn't find this one on "the river", but they do have a stainless one for $20+.
- Thread starter
- #725
- Thread starter
- #726
[QUOTE=SweetSue;3880947]I went back to the stove-top method. I couldn't stand the smell or taste of the previous batch done in a pressure cooker. Today I harvested a CBD Critical Cure mand tossed her into the stock pot sitting in the oil bath and went old school.
200 grams of buds and sugar leaves in 250 ml of EVOO, reduced to an indistinguishable mash?
Hi Sue, a couple of questions for you and a recommendation.
1. Your "formula" for FHO - 200 g bud to 250 ml I get. Dried bud would be ¼ or 50g, correct? Does the amount of oil remain the same?
2. What is the current thinking/practice regarding a two-hour vs eight-hour vs a 36-hour oil? There seems to be movement to less time in a low heat oven. Obviously, decarbing the material needs to be done prior to cooking. But, if decarb is a matter of time and temp: higher temp, shorter time; lower temp, longer time, how long at 140° F would it take to Decarb? Or would it at all?
I only able to press 150 ml of oil from the mash. That 100 ml of infused oil locked in the plant material will be loaded into capsules and dosed like that. It'll extend the harvest and we might squeek through to the next one.
Finally, not sure I've seen this posted, but here is what I use to squeeze out every last drop (well, almost every drop) of oil. I put the mash in silkscreen (or cheesecloth) wrapped in a ball. This is a very heavy duty juicer - cast aluminum, and though at 70 I don't have the strength I once had, I can really crank on this and get most of the oil back. Unfortunately, this was gifted to us and I'm not sure where it came from. A specialty shop, I believe. Couldn't find this one on "the river", but they do have a stainless one for $20+.
Sorry to take so long to get back to you
I have a squeezer very similar to that. I like yours better. Lol! I use silkscreen silk for straining my oils, I believe it's 125 TPI. On a good day I can recover most all the oil, and I fill capsules with the mash and take them too, so no waste.
When I use dried buds the oil measurements stay the same, and I figure dried buds at 1/4 the weight of wet. Your calculation was spot on.
We don't decarb in advance when making FHO. Decarb is the last step with this method, as it is in the making of CCO. I use the pressure cooker to make my oils with dried bud, so all I need do is break the buds down fine enough that I'm certain I'll get a good extraction, cover in oil, cover the pot-in-pot with foil to keep moisture out of the brewing oil, and go.
I did some hot oil bath testing on the 36-hour oil and we discovered it wasn't decarbing anywhere near complete, even after 36-hours at 170 degrees F. That was about the time I invested in the pressure cooker, and it has made my life so easy I can't believe it.
Using buds dried low and slo I'm getting an oil very close to FHO made at the point of harvest. Made that IP worth every penny to be able to set it up and walk away.
Flower Mama
Well-Known Member
SweetSue (or anyone else) - Could you advise me if I have the process correct? I harvested 455 grams of fresh flower a few days ago; the plant material went right into Ziploc bags and the freezer because I didn't have LSL until yesterday. Anyway, I'm ready to begin my trial run. Is this the right way to do it?
1. grind the fresh flower with 500 ml olive oil in a stock pot
2. heat in an oil bath. keep at target temp (220 - 230) for 1 hour, stirring frequently to prevent scorching.
3. cool and add liquid sunflower lecithin (is 2 tbsp enough for my batch?)
4. calculate dosage and fill capsules
Thanks in advance!!
1. grind the fresh flower with 500 ml olive oil in a stock pot
2. heat in an oil bath. keep at target temp (220 - 230) for 1 hour, stirring frequently to prevent scorching.
3. cool and add liquid sunflower lecithin (is 2 tbsp enough for my batch?)
4. calculate dosage and fill capsules
Thanks in advance!!
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- #728
Hello Flower Mama, nice to meet you.
The lecithin is good. I use one tablespoon for every cup of oil, and I don’t measure very precisely, to be honest.
Change the cook time to 110 minutes, an hour and 50 minutes, or until you see no more bubbles.
I try to keep the temps around 235 F in the oil mash.
Strain before adding the lecithin.
Looks like you’re in for some fun. May I ask, what chemovar you’ve chosen for your first attempt at this lovely oil, and why you made that choice?
Flower Mama
Well-Known Member
Hello Flower Mama, nice to meet you.
Looks like you’re in for some fun. May I ask, what chemovar you’ve chosen for your first attempt at this lovely oil, and why you made that choice?
Thanks for the warm welcome and for all of the help you’ve given this forum! My strain is called black boss (cross between black domina and g-funk). My next batch will be critical cure - they’ll be ready in a month. I appreciate your help and will report back.
XO!
Flower Mama
Well-Known Member
SweetSue - I have one more question before I start. How large should the inner pot be? Will the oil / flower mixture boil up much (since I’m adding the lecithin after cooking)?
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- #731
There's not the foaming we first experienced since we changed to add lecithin after straining, so you can get away with a pot that fits your mash volume with about a third more space. That way you wouldn't have problems with splash.
I use a small stock pot to keep from making a mess when things start aggressively bubbling, and it's worked well for me for months.
These days though I usually dry the harvest low and slo in the fridge and make my oils in the Instant Pot pressure cooker. It only takes an hour and 50 minutes to both infuse and decarb. I can easily make small batches in a pot-in-pot set-up with my little stainless bowl.
Flower Mama
Well-Known Member
OK, I just finished cleaning up after cooking up a batch of FHO. I'm SO GLAD I didn't lick any of the utensils!! I have an original tCheck tester so added a drop of strained oil and got "over" so ran another test, this time with 1 drop infused oil and 1 drop regular olive oil. The tCheck says 14.7 mg / ml this time (so double the results). Do these results seem accurate? I started out with 455 grams of fresh, frozen flower and 600 ml olive oil. I believe I read somewhere that my strain, Dutch Girl Seeds Black Boss, has approximately 16% thc. I've been growing the same plant for about 2 years now and LOVE it!
Using the calculation someone posted earlier in this thread:
455 grams wet = 113.75 dry
Using an efficiency multiplier of 0.17 we get
.17 x 113.75 = 19.34 x 1000 = 19,337.5 mg / 600 ml oil = 32.22 mg/ml
I haven't tested the oil on myself yet (honestly, I'm a little scared of it!). I'll give it a go tonight.
THANK YOU very much for sharing your technique with the group, SweetSue!
Using the calculation someone posted earlier in this thread:
455 grams wet = 113.75 dry
Using an efficiency multiplier of 0.17 we get
.17 x 113.75 = 19.34 x 1000 = 19,337.5 mg / 600 ml oil = 32.22 mg/ml
I haven't tested the oil on myself yet (honestly, I'm a little scared of it!). I'll give it a go tonight.
THANK YOU very much for sharing your technique with the group, SweetSue!
JustMeds
Well-Known Member
What dose are you testing tonight? Give us the report.
If that is her formula with your numbers subbed in, should be spot on. I will bet that formula has been checked by a good many.
If that is her formula with your numbers subbed in, should be spot on. I will bet that formula has been checked by a good many.
Flower Mama
Well-Known Member
I’m starting pretty low at 1/4 ml because it’s no fun to take too much. I’m feeling relaxed, but not buzzed.
I was able to recover 350 ml of the 600 ml olive oil I started with so decided to try adding water to the leftover plant matter and reheating it on the stove. After cooling in the fridge for a few hours, I was able to get another 125 ml. That is the first time I’ve ever attempted that, so I’m very pleased with my first try at FHO. I suspect I lost quite a bit because I transferred the oil to different containers a few times. I don’t have an immersion blender (yet!) so used a Ninja to break up the frozen flower before transferring it to the saucepan along with the olive oil.
I was able to recover 350 ml of the 600 ml olive oil I started with so decided to try adding water to the leftover plant matter and reheating it on the stove. After cooling in the fridge for a few hours, I was able to get another 125 ml. That is the first time I’ve ever attempted that, so I’m very pleased with my first try at FHO. I suspect I lost quite a bit because I transferred the oil to different containers a few times. I don’t have an immersion blender (yet!) so used a Ninja to break up the frozen flower before transferring it to the saucepan along with the olive oil.
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- #735
Well done!
I struggle to get the rest out of the plant material. Lately I've been considering adding a little olive oil to the leftover mash to make it easier to pull up in a syringe to fill capsules and take it like that. I've had times when I got only 50% back. Some plants suck up and hold onto the olive oil, and I personallydon't like the quality of what comes back after adding water. I realize I use it in capsules, but when I don't use water the oil I make is tasty to me, so I press out what I can and freeze the mash until I figure out what I want to do with it.
Flower Mama
Well-Known Member
Thanks SweetSue! I really enjoyed trying something new and with your help, succeeding! When I tried some of the oil last night, I took it straight and it tasted pleasant-ish, and while the small amount I took didn't get me high,, it did help me sleep - really well. I'll up the dose tonight to maybe .4 or .5 ml and see where that takes me. If I wanted to start micro-dosing, .25 ml is perfect.
Flower Mama
Well-Known Member
I have a question about the FHO I made and my Tcheck classic. Does anyone know if the Tcheck tests for THC only or THC and THCA? I’ve taken a half ml dose twice and it just doesn’t feel that potent and seems to take a long tome to “kick in.”
Flower Mama
Well-Known Member
I emailed tCheck support with my question and received a reply within an hour -- on a Saturday evening! How's that for excellent support? I'll definitely be purchasing the tCheck2 once they have it in stock.
"The original device actually gives you an aggregate number of all the cannabinoids found in the sample. So when you get that result is a combination of THC, thca, CBD, CBD a CBG, CBN, Etc."
So... My guess is I didn't decarb long enough. Can I put the mason jar of oil in the oven to decarb longer? Thanks in advance for any advice!
"The original device actually gives you an aggregate number of all the cannabinoids found in the sample. So when you get that result is a combination of THC, thca, CBD, CBD a CBG, CBN, Etc."
So... My guess is I didn't decarb long enough. Can I put the mason jar of oil in the oven to decarb longer? Thanks in advance for any advice!
BigBearNTexas
Well-Known Member
You should be able to decarb I’m the oven until you don’t get any bubbles. What temperature are you thinking of setting your oven?
Flower Mama
Well-Known Member
Thanks for your reply BigBearNTexas - I appreciate your help!
I would start at 240 F and check with my quick read digital thermometer. If the oil isn’t high enough, I’ll increase the oven temperature. I think the target temp for the oil is 235 F, correct? Once decarb is done bubbling will stop and the oil temp will shoot up rapidly. Am I on the right track?