Five Little Widows Under LED, G-R-O-W-I-N-G

Addo

Well-Known Member
Hello Everyone,

I will be attempting a grow while utilizing a soilless medium, and nutrients designed to work in such circumstances. The widows will be grown under a 450W LED, in a room with a constant temperature of 70 degrees, with a res of 70 degrees or below. Currently, the widows are about to enter week two of Veg but its important to note that I started week one at the first developed true leaves. My solution consists of an A&B complex for both veg and flower cycles, root stimulant, silica, and root rot defense.

A brief recaps is as follow

Germination Week 1:

Popped five WW seeds via cup of water, transplanted to plugs, didn't sow deep enough and had to remove helmets. All five are developing roots and are somewhat uniform in stature. Will transplant to 15 gallon custom bins when space becomes an issue, two to a bin and one solo.

Res will sit between 5.2 and 5.8 ph, room temp is a constant 70 degrees, and res temp is roughly 69 degrees. It's been a few years since I've grown vegetables or smoked for that matter. I figured I'd grow for the pleasure while I get my vegetable game down.
I plan on low stress training, Fimming, defoliating, and cloning. The goal is to have a somewhat uniform canopy, as few problems as possible, and trichomes a good deal into amber before harvest.

Finally, a second grow will hopefully follow part way through taking the lessons learned and applying them for better results. Wish me luck and enjoy.

6/16 - Currently the seedling stage is progressing without an issue, two of the five seeds now have a single root protruding from the bottom of their net cup. I have yet to change the nutrient solution and I likely wont until the vegetative state and or issues appear. I figure with the aeration and constant movement of the water it will be good for a few weeks.

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Germination Week 2:

Solution with water pump to circulate, and 18lpm air pump to breathe like a fish.... in water....
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Tap root development, and a stable res the stuff of dreams
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Green Goodies
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Veg week 1:

6/25 - Further development, roots somewhat stained due to solution but everything is in order
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6/27 - Top down of lights on, development is noticeable when observing the new growth or general fan leaf size, also I rotated some to accommodate for the growth

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6/28
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6/29 - Last day together with old res
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6/30 - Separated with the most vigorous (2) on one side and the smelliest (3) on the other with new res @ 5.2PH
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7/1 - Widows responded nicely to res change which happens to be a different brand of nutrients, PH is roughly 5.6 and holding in both tanks.
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Week 2 Day 2 -

Currently the solution sits between 5.1 and 5.3 PH for both tubs, with an equal EC of 1.6, and roughly 18oz of water diminished. The Widows range in height from 5" to 6 1/2", and all have three sets of nodes. The three smaller widows have an internode spacing of 1/2", and the larger ones have a spacing of 1". The light intensity is roughly 600 umol's which the ladies are handling well and may contribute to their squatness. This likely won't change until the flowering period. As I am not really in a hurry since this is more of a hobby than anything, I may wait until sex is revealed to switch to 12/12. I did this before with a critical super silver haze and enjoyed the results. One final note, 3/4 of each stem is as thick as the base which isn't saying much; but with the small space between internodes and the stiffness my options to LST are minimal at best at this time.

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Some white roots which are consistent in both buckets
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Started some basic training on one of the ladies, after 11 weeks they will be ready for AIT (Advanced Individual Training 11B), small joke for fortunate to understand, hello brothers and sisters.

So, I've been dipping into European Grow Journals and practices pre-Brexit, and Dutch Grow Journals and website, as well as the trove of information from specific (OG) seed banks regarding their products and best practices. Not the ones simply trying to appeal to stoners, but seed banks with almost land race genetics, and prize-winning stable genetics. A difference between US and the others appears to be that were impatient but also possess innovativeness. Where a lot of us start HST at around week three and possibly top to the first set of nodes; the European's recommend waiting for roughly 11 inches in height and up to five nodes. Essentially the top will occur above the fifth node, and all lower growth would be left untouched apart from defoliation. The thought process is the plant is more mature and can bounce back faster, while not experiencing too much stress without the ability to recover.

While I agree to some measure, I think if were measuring maturity it should be based on staggered node placement so its universal. And apart from total control, I would rather FIM than top especially on these absurdly squat ladies who definitely favor Indica dominance. I feel that topping would just shut them down or stunt their progress and possible yield. Additionally, I read that if FIM'ing is done correctly and with the Devils own luck, you could end up with four tops instead of 2 with considerably less stress and recovery time.

I would like to know if anyone has any comments on the issue, I've done both, but I don't think I've had this clean of a run before. Heat has always played an issue, as well as my understanding of the amount of air required to oxygenate the root system. My one concern is my leaves, I've been dabbling with the dimming function and trying to dial in the amount of light they want, somewhere around 500 PPFD or 600 umol/m2 which amount to roughly 39 DLI. I notice that my leaves while vigorous and as large as a hand able to palm a basketball, one or two appear somewhat crinkly. Not as in they are dry or brittle to the touch, but just aesthetically. I have zero nutrient burn or things such as claws, noodle white roots, and vigorous growth, maybe just low temps or genetics?

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07/05 - Some training and claws

Training is going well, some of the lower growth has responded fantastically. I have noticed that two of my ladies are developing a claw on newer growth. The thing about it is I top of my res every day at the end if it needs it, lately 24oz a day per bucket is what they're drinking. My EC due to additive's with zero res water at the start was around 1.7, currently its about 1.1 so it has diluted considerably. The only thing that I changed was getting my res temps from 75 to between 64 and 70; and adjusting the light which I suspect is the problem. I made the mistake of not trusting my vendors ppfd ratings. I may have stressed the plant out with light intensity by being ignorant. My leaves are not absurdly green and the pictures do not do the fan leaves justice, they're massive and very wide.
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Internode Spacing on roughly three of the five ladies, the others are twice are more stretchy
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07/06

Houston, we have a problem, I defoliated the lower initial fan leaves and after observing them in a different light; I realized that they were very dark, and I have an excess of nitrogen. This would explain the stunt in growth. However, the deficiency just started, and the EC has gone down while the PH and water level have been adjusted daily. An easy fix to be sure but time wasted, and I must wait 48 hours for my res to stabilize prior to a new bath. I can only assume that nitrogen is somehow concentrating because the plants are using other nutrients in mass. My solution is to simply cut the nutrient strength and see how they respond, while removing any unnecessary additives.

So, one thing of note is the first two pictures are taken within the grow lights influence, the last is taken in a different room.
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Week 3 day 3

So the ladies are thriving however, there's some root rot on the upper portion of some of the roots. I re inspected some of my buckets and noticed light leak which has been taken care of. Over 95% of the roots and new growth which actually reside in the water are healthy and white. This was also caused by some water pumps I use to circulate the solution a few days before a res change. Something wasn't sterilized properly and caused my res to foul up. I took a gamble and introduced some beneficial bacteria to combat the issue and it appears to be in check. The two plants that are affected seem somewhat wilted but I'm going to see if they improve. Finally, some of the ladies are forming calyx so I assume the more vigorous of the batch with start showing sex soon.

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Nice start and your plants are looking good. I try to keep my DWC res from 5.5-6.5pH, optimized at 5.8. 5.2 may be a bit low. Good luck getting rid of the root rot.
 
Nice start and your plants are looking good. I try to keep my DWC res from 5.5-6.5pH, optimized at 5.8. 5.2 may be a bit low. Good luck getting rid of the root rot.

To be honest, I've been somewhat fighting a stable res on the more vigorous ladies. This will all change when they get up potted per say and swim in 7 gallon tubs. I was just taking a gamble and following the manufacturers advice which was to set the ph at 5.2, which would allow it to sway up to about 6.2 and back down over the course of two weeks. That being said, it's not accounting for topping off with RO which is likely my problem. I agree with you though and I try to maintain around 5.8 ph. Thank you for the help and insight.
 
A little drift is not a bad thing (IMHO). But it's a logarithmic scale - so a full number drop (for example) actually means that a thing has become 10X more acidic.

I do not recall whether you're relatively new at DWC, or hydroponics in general. Therefore, these might be things you already have. If not...

There are some highly useful reference materials here. In no particular order: There are some element deficiency/toxicity pictorial threads, that show and describe the symptoms of each for the various macro and micronutrients. There is a chart that shows at what pH range each is available in a hydronic embodiment. There is a chart showing the various combinations of rising/falling EC, pH, and water (er... not "rising" water level, of course), and what each combination is indicative of. And there is a circular one called Mulder's chart, which shows how certain elements interact in an antagonistic or synergistic manner (IOW, an excess of one element will tend to interfere with the plant's ability to use another element, or cause it to not seem to require a much of one). Together, they can be a great help in understand what is going on, in spotting issues, and understanding what is causing them. Which can mean the difference between quickly correcting an issue - and merely trying to deal with a symptom, and possibly causing one or more additional issues instead of solving the original problem.

If you are interested in one or more of these things, but cannot find them after searching, mention it, and I or someone else will see if we can locate it. I'm using my cell phone at the moment, and it's... not a very good device for that. Or even reading/posting threads. But my laptop quickly overheats when it's hot in here :( . Less so when I boot linux than when using Microsoft's OS, but that's not currently installed, and the live USB linux setup I've got doesn't actually have my credentials on it (awaiting the next version, to ensure a couple more years of support workout having to upgrade or install again later, lol). The flash drive setup is sufficient for me to play Slash'em on, so it's good enough for now ;).
 
I think this is the chart that Tortured Soul mentioned.

Yes, that's one of them. Those charts - and more - are actually now available in a single thread. Someone mentioned to the staff, a while back, that it would be helpful to copy the charts that @Rifleman has posted into their own thread, and make it a sticky. (I think it might have been me, LMAO, but I cannot remember for sure, because... burnt and battered :rolleyes: ). Whoever did the actual work, kind of ran with the idea and added a couple more. So... here is the thread, for easy reference and/or printing:

Hmm... I saw it just last night... Oh, yeah, now I remember. I... think? Yep - see:


Doggone it, that's not it - but it's also useful ;). I'll try again:


THAT'S it. Well worth printing out and keeping near the garden, IMHO.
 
Week 3 / Day 6 / Veg

A kind of meh update on week three day six of our little widow fairy tale. I decided to upgrade the root living quarters of some of the ladies. The two most vigorous will continue to be bunked together, while the two that experienced root rot will share the same bath. Finally, the champ will reside at the top all alone, the pillar of cellular evolution like all champs should.

New Naming Convention / Description:

Solo Plant = Champ

Was in with the root rot group, wasn't affected, found a fight promoter and moved into a studio apartment. Just took a beating from defoliation, but like Mike Tyson said in the Bible, 'If you strike me down, I will become more powerful than you can possibly imagine.'

2 Vigorous = Kardashians

Everything you would expect, Lucious curves, uniform stature, vigorous growth, cosmetic surgery (silica), and photoshopped to hell.

2 Root Rot Subject 0 = Duck Dynasty

As the name suggests, their no stranger to getting dirty, but under all that camo and beard is one thing that they all have in common. Their filthy rich in material wealth (white roots)

Next, I am working with two, fourteen-gallon tubs which are currently filled up to seven and settling. Both tubs have independent air stones, and a five hundred gallon per hour water pump circulating the liquid, while a one-gallon frozen bottle of water keeps the temps down to a crisp 63 degrees. My reasoning is water levels and EC values are dropping too quickly with three gallons. Each started around 1.5 EC with additives, and as of two days ago with numerous RO water top offs. The Kardashians apparently used all of the nute's and water on photoshopping to keep up appearances. Champ was down to about .5 EC, down but not out just waiting for the bell to ring like any good warrior. Duck dynasty ran out of beard shampoo and was droopy for a day or two but bounced back.

Kardashians -

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Root mass is roughly the size of a one-gallon container such as the PH up in the background
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Champ-

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Multiple rat tale thick tap roots because of steroid use
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Duck Dynasty-

Before chop
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Roots with visible damage near the net cup, recovered and are translucent. Notice that they are holding root hands, were in this together, duck calls or bust!

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After Defoliation-

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Finally, a small leaf comparison noting the reduction of nutrient strength and the more acceptable shade of green produced along with excellent growth. With a before and after of the tent on defol day.

Upper left, .2 EC res at close of week, bottom left .5 EC at close, middle right single leaf I froze for this purpose is from last week, extremely dark in comparison. Not game changing but small progress.
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Before-
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After-
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